Author Topic: TV Programmes made after Vincent Tabak's conviction for murder.  (Read 2703 times)

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Offline mrswah

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Re: TV Programmes made after Vincent Tabak's conviction for murder.
« Reply #15 on: May 30, 2017, 09:51:15 AM »
"Murder at Christmas"  continued.

Mr and Mrs Yeates, DCI Phil Jones,  Ann Reddrop and Christopher Jefferies were interviewed for this programme. So was Rebecca Scott, Joanna's friend, DCI Joe Goff,  a neighbour of the Tabak family, and a Dutch journalist who followed the case.

Joanna is presented  as a "beautiful and talented" young lady who was interested in sports, and who had been in a relationship with  her"great boyfriend" Greg for two years.

Contrary to what we have been led to believe in other reports, Greg was worried when Jo did not respond to his calls.

My comment:  this is probably not true. We have heard time and time again that Jo did not always answer her phone, and Greg would not have waited so long before contacting the police and Jo's parents, had he been worried from the outset.

Mrs Yeates says that she looked over walls, and banged on the boots of cars, just in case Jo had been abducted and was trapped inside one.  Mr Yeates speaks of two pairs of footprints going diagonally across the lawn, and then he notices Vincent and Tanja, so assumed that the footprints were theirs. Apparently, Tanja asked if she could do anything to help, while Vincent stood back and said nothing.

Offline mrswah

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Re: TV Programmes made after Vincent Tabak's conviction for murder.
« Reply #16 on: May 30, 2017, 10:04:11 AM »
"Murder at Christmas" continued.

Unlike the other documentaries, this one tells us a fair amount about Vincent's background.

He came from a small, quiet, traditional town in the South of Holland, is the youngest of four children, seems "normal" but "a little bit introvert".  He goes to Eindhoven to study, and proves to be an exceptionally able student, gaining a PhD.  Like his fellow students, he spends most of his time in front of a computer" designing stuff".  His family describe him as shy, steady and calm. whereas his colleagues describe him as outgoing.  The Dutch journalist describes him as a "geek", who spends little time with people but a lot of time in front of a computer screen-----as do other students in the same field of study.  He is systematic and methodical.

Chris Jefferies describes Vincent as "civilised and courteous, the ideal tenant." He also speaks very warmly of Jo and Greg, who, apparently, were the first people to apply when CJ advertised the flat for rent. They were looking to set up home together, and CJ was very happy to help them do that.

Offline mrswah

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Re: TV Programmes made after Vincent Tabak's conviction for murder.
« Reply #17 on: May 30, 2017, 10:15:21 AM »
"Murder at Christmas" continued

CJ was the secretary of the Management Company for 44 Canynge Road, and , in this capacity, had a copy of every tenant's keys. He handed these over to the police early on in the investigation. After arriving home at around 9pm on Friday 17th December, he spent the rest of the evening alone, reading.

VT arrived home from work, ate a pizza and drank a beer, then went on his computer to look at pornography:  it is violent porn, that shows the degrading of women.  He has an "online life obsessed with violent sex".

When Jo's parents arrived in Bristol, one thing they did was visit VT and TM's flat to see whether or not they knew anything regarding Jo's whereabouts.  She seemed helpful, but he stepped back.

He was organised, calm and rational.  He convinced everyone that he didn't know Jo, and knew nothing about her disappearance. He even walked a fellow guest home from a party during the following week, as she was afraid of walking home alone.

My comment:    perhaps this was genuine, and he was telling the truth! (But, then I would say that, wouldn't I).

Vincent and Tanja left Bristol for Cambridge on the evening of 23rd December, and left Cambridge fro Holland on the 28th, travelling through the Channel Tunnel.

Offline mrswah

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Re: TV Programmes made after Vincent Tabak's conviction for murder.
« Reply #18 on: May 30, 2017, 10:23:46 AM »
"Murder at Christmas" continued

Jo's body was discovered at 8.45am on Christmas Day. 

Mr Yeates says that Jo had not been sexually attacked.

There were no broken windows, or any sign of a break in, so the police concluded that Jo must have let someone in:  the killer had to be someone she either knew or recognised.

CJ knew Joanna was alone for the weekend, and he had a key to her flat, so he was arrested, and his car searched for evidence.

At 10am on the day of CJ's arrest, Vincent and Tanja telephoned the police from Holland and said that the landlord's car had changed position overnight (17th-18th December).

DCI Jones states that a team was sent to Holland to interview VT as a witness.

He was reluctant to give a DNA sample, and this was relayed back to the police in England.

They found a DNA match and then planned to arrest him (why didn't they arrest him straight away, in that case?).
« Last Edit: June 12, 2017, 08:25:21 PM by John »

Offline mrswah

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Re: TV Programmes made after Vincent Tabak's conviction for murder.
« Reply #19 on: May 30, 2017, 10:30:33 AM »
Murder at Christmas---continued.

People in Holland could not believe it when VT was arrested, and they thought the police must be under a lot of pressure.

VT's family did not understand what was going on, and were pestered by the British media (this kind of thing doesn't happen in Holland). They thought he was innocent.

The family was "fully convinced he had nothing to do with it. They knew him very well."

Once in custody, he made no comment. but he made a written statement, saying that he did not know Jo.

. When told that minute traces of blood had been found on the rubber seal of his car boot, he still made no

comment.

On 8th February, while on remand at Long Lartin prison, he told a chaplain that he was going to plead guilty.

Offline mrswah

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Re: TV Programmes made after Vincent Tabak's conviction for murder.
« Reply #20 on: May 30, 2017, 10:41:23 AM »
Murder at Christmas-----continued.

According to the police, VT was a man with secrets. He liked extreme pornography, and led a secret life, also seeking the company of escorts while working away from home . At 10.30 pm on the 19th December, he was on his computer looking at maps of Longwood Lane.

Ann Reddrop thought it very suspicious that he should go shopping at ASDA in Bedminster, which was a 15 minute drive, when he could have obtained his beer, crisps and rock salt in Clifton.  She thinks it was a deliberate attempt to give himself an alibi, by putting himself underneath a CCTV camera while texting his girlfriend.

My comment:   I would very much like to know whether or not Vincent was actually at home on 19th December at 10.30 pm.

In addition, I cannot see anything strange about someone preferring to visit a large supermarket---I often do so.  Somebody in VT's line of work might be particularly interested. He might even have preferred a certain type of beer that he could not obtain locally----perfectly possible.

I think I have probably written enough -----the documentaries are there on You Tube for people to view----and yes, I suppose I have left out a lot of important stuff!!!!


Offline Leonora

Re: TV Programmes made after Vincent Tabak's conviction for murder.
« Reply #21 on: May 30, 2017, 12:02:28 PM »
Ok, on to the "Judge Rinder" programme, again one episode in a series of true crime documentaries. This was first aired in the summer of 2016. 
...
Joanna had lived, studied and worked in Hampshire before going to Bristol, and studying for her second degree in Landscape Architecture...
She LIVED (grew up) in Hampshire, but Judge Rinder tells us (correctly) that she STUDIED for three years in Chelmsford (which is in Essex) for her FIRST degree.

Her cousin Jacqueline told Judge Rinder that she and Joanna used to read each other's diaries out to each other. They had no secrets. Thus confirming that Joanna was a diarist.

Offline mrswah

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Re: TV Programmes made after Vincent Tabak's conviction for murder.
« Reply #22 on: May 30, 2017, 01:24:47 PM »
She LIVED (grew up) in Hampshire, but Judge Rinder tells us (correctly) that she STUDIED for three years in Chelmsford (which is in Essex) for her FIRST degree.

Her cousin Jacqueline told Judge Rinder that she and Joanna used to read each other's diaries out to each other. They had no secrets. Thus confirming that Joanna was a diarist.

Apologies for the mistake---I dare say I have made others!!


Offline mrswah

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Re: TV Programmes made after Vincent Tabak's conviction for murder.
« Reply #23 on: May 30, 2017, 02:17:49 PM »
Questions and Conclusions from the three Documentaries:

All three documentaries seem anxious to portray Vincent Tabak as a man with a secret life consisting of watching violent pornography and contact with escorts. There is (seemingly ) no other reason why he should murder Jo (or anyone else), so it is implied that sex was the reason:  he moved from spectator to perpetrator. Yet, his "secret life" did not form part of his trial, nor were any escorts ever identified or interviewed by the police.


Following on from this, nobody who appears in any of the documentaries has anything adverse to say about VT. People from Holland are interviewed, but nobody comes forward to say he was anything more than a "geek"!  There is no evidence that he ever "tried it on" with a woman: in fact, it seems that he was in a normal, steady, loving relationship. 

So, no previous "form" and no incidences of sinister behaviour around women. However, nobody murders without a motive, so the porn allegedly found on his computer, and his apparent contact with escorts is used to form the motive.

It is repeatedly affirmed that VT was "smart" and "clever", but this is used not to highlight how good he was at his work, but how good he was at covering up what he had done, staying one step ahead of the investigation, and deceiving /fooling everybody into thinking he was a "goodie" when, in fact, he was a "baddie."

Jo is always depicted as being the life and soul of the party, everybody's friend, very popular and outgoing, in oontrast with VT being something of a "nerd" and an introvert. I am sure that this was true to some extent, but I think it is over-emphasized in the documentaries, so that the public sees the contrast between the victim and her alleged murderer.  People are always more comfortable with those who are friendly and outgoing! Jo being completely "normal" and being killed by somebody who just pretended to be normal, but who was anything but, is just the sort of thing the public is ready to hear!

There are various inconsistencies with timings, such as when Jo arrived home, when Vincent looked at his computer, etc . 

Well, that's a start on my comments. Plenty more to say----------------

Offline Leonora

Re: TV Programmes made after Vincent Tabak's conviction for murder.
« Reply #24 on: May 30, 2017, 03:35:48 PM »
Apologies for the mistake---I dare say I have made others!!
No mistake, mrswah - We discussed earlier on this forum whether Joanna had a 2nd degree, and I was sceptical, but here we have it from the horse's mouth that she did. I think it is also interesting that we hear, in "Judge Rinder", for the first time, that Joanna and Greg lived together at the same address only for the last month or two of her life. Since Rebecca Scott told the jury that "she knew it was the real deal when Joanna got her kitten Bernard", we have always got the impression that she and Greg had been living together for a much longer time than that.

Offline mrswah

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Re: TV Programmes made after Vincent Tabak's conviction for murder.
« Reply #25 on: May 30, 2017, 08:36:28 PM »
No mistake, mrswah - We discussed earlier on this forum whether Joanna had a 2nd degree, and I was sceptical, but here we have it from the horse's mouth that she did. I think it is also interesting that we hear, in "Judge Rinder", for the first time, that Joanna and Greg lived together at the same address only for the last month or two of her life. Since Rebecca Scott told the jury that "she knew it was the real deal when Joanna got her kitten Bernard", we have always got the impression that she and Greg had been living together for a much longer time than that.

I was actually surprised to discover that Judge Robert Rinder is actually a real person--I thought he was fictional!!

I have certainly heard that Jo and Greg had previously lived together (although I can't remember where I read/heard it), so it could be true. it seems obvious that not everything in these documentaries is one hundred per cent accurate!

Offline Leonora

Re: TV Programmes made after Vincent Tabak's conviction for murder.
« Reply #26 on: May 31, 2017, 07:22:44 AM »
I was actually surprised to discover that Judge Robert Rinder is actually a real person--I thought he was fictional!!

I have certainly heard that Jo and Greg had previously lived together (although I can't remember where I read/heard it), so it could be true. it seems obvious that not everything in these documentaries is one hundred per cent accurate!
Why not write to him, mrswah, to ask him who first suggested this a case as a topic for his TV series? Since he is a real person, he might be sufficiently concerned about his part in disseminating fake news to want to trace the source back to the complex entity pulling the strings in this case.

Mystery has always surrounded WHERE Joanna lived and where Greg lived before they moved into 44 Canynge Road. Why would Teresa Yeates herself tell us now, 5 years afterwards, that it was their first home together, if it were not true? Have the police told Mr & Mrs Yeates to make peace with Greg?

Offline mrswah

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Re: TV Programmes made after Vincent Tabak's conviction for murder.
« Reply #27 on: May 31, 2017, 07:36:14 AM »
Why not write to him, mrswah, to ask him who first suggested this a case as a topic for his TV series? Since he is a real person, he might be sufficiently concerned about his part in disseminating fake news to want to trace the source back to the complex entity pulling the strings in this case.

Mystery has always surrounded WHERE Joanna lived and where Greg lived before they moved into 44 Canynge Road. Why would Teresa Yeates herself tell us now, 5 years afterwards, that it was their first home together, if it were not true? Have the police told Mr & Mrs Yeates to make peace with Greg?

I don't know that they ever actually fell out with Greg. Mr and Mrs Yeates tend to talk to one of the Bristol papers around Christmas time each year, and in one article, I read that they never hear from Greg and that "he has moved on with his life."

No 44 may well have been their first home together, since the media make all sorts of mistakes in their reporting.

Offline Nine

Re: TV Programmes made after Vincent Tabak's conviction for murder.
« Reply #28 on: May 31, 2017, 08:13:27 AM »
I don't know that they ever actually fell out with Greg. Mr and Mrs Yeates tend to talk to one of the Bristol papers around Christmas time each year, and in one article, I read that they never hear from Greg and that "he has moved on with his life."

No 44 may well have been their first home together, since the media make all sorts of mistakes in their reporting.

I think it was their first home together as a couple... I'm sure Mrs Yeates or said that she first lived in digs, then a shared house...

Offline mrswah

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Re: TV Programmes made after Vincent Tabak's conviction for murder.
« Reply #29 on: May 31, 2017, 03:55:59 PM »
I think it was their first home together as a couple... I'm sure Mrs Yeates or said that she first lived in digs, then a shared house...

Yes, I heard she lived in digs too.