Author Topic: Who was the mystery couple?  (Read 14254 times)

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Offline G-Unit

Re: Who was the mystery couple?
« Reply #30 on: May 27, 2017, 09:50:06 AM »
The Wilkins/O'Donnell table was booked for 7:30. According to her husband Gerry and his friend arrived at 8:15 and they chatted about childcare, jobs and where Kate was (putting the kids to bed) until around 8:30. Then the call came that their son was crying;

My partner left first and I followed shortly afterwards. The amount of time I spent with Jerry was about fifteen (15) to twenty (20) minutes we remained in the restaurant. By the time we left, Jerry was with about seven other people. I picked up my daughter from the creche and then returned to the apartment.
http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/JEREMY-WILKINS.htm

I think Bridget was mistaken about the food arriving just as she received the call from the creche. Was it really an hour before they got any? If she returned to the restaurant as she says, it would have been at 8:50 because she says it was a twenty minute walk to the night creche;

The other option was the babysitting service at the kiddie club, which was a 10-minute walk from the apartment
https://www.theguardian.com/uk/2007/dec/14/ukcrime.madeleinemccann

No mention of an unfinished meal in Jez's statement, or of Bridget returning to the restaurant with their son who 'kept crying' in the restaurant as Bridget put it.


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Offline Robittybob1

Re: Who was the mystery couple?
« Reply #31 on: May 27, 2017, 10:17:11 AM »
In that article Bridget just about confirms it was Rachael who contacts the media.  "The next morning, we made our way to breakfast and met one of the Doctors, the one who had come round in the night. His young daughter looked up at us from her pushchair. There was no news. They had called Sky television - they didn't know what else to do. He turned away and I could see he was going to weep."

It also confirms a closer connection between Jez and Bridget with Matt and Rachael, greater than what Matt cared to admit in his rogatory.
"4078 'What about in the evenings when you were going back to check on Grace, do you recall some of the other people around''
Reply 'No, there'd be rarely, rarely anybody about, maybe an occasional one person. Erm, tut, was he, was it the chap, whose name I can't remember, he had a child who was willing to be part of, or was being suggested for the interview, Jeremy, Jeremy or somebody''
 
00.43.49 4078 'Yeah'.
Reply 'Who had a child and I think I'd seen him around because I think their child didn't sleep particularly well and he may have been pushing or he might have been collecting from cr'he, but what day or what time, I don't really remember'.
 
4078 'How did you come to know Jeremy''
Reply 'It was a couple that we spoke to while we were on, Jeremy I think I spoke to on the coach, either on the coach or we already said something, you know, something when we were checking in, sort of that'd have been four o'clock in the morning or whenever it was, and there was, so I think I spoke to him on the coach or on the plane on the way over, definitely on the coach or on the plane on the way over, and sort of said hi every now and again, but didn't, erm, you know anything more than that really'.
 
4078 'And did you speak to him during the holiday''
Reply 'Yeah, just on odd occasions'."
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Offline Robittybob1

Re: Who was the mystery couple?
« Reply #32 on: May 27, 2017, 10:52:05 AM »
Do Jez and Bridget mention joining the doctors at the Tapas in their statements?
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Offline Robittybob1

Re: Who was the mystery couple?
« Reply #33 on: May 27, 2017, 11:01:53 AM »
That article is written "Bridget O'Donnell

Friday 14 December 2007 11.54 GMT"  yet the rogatory statement  was on the 08 APRIL 2008  so they should at least mention this meeting with the Tapas group prior to Madeleine going missing in their rogatory statement but I don't think they do.
« Last Edit: May 27, 2017, 11:04:14 AM by Robittybob1 »
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Offline misty

Re: Who was the mystery couple?
« Reply #34 on: May 27, 2017, 01:01:53 PM »
That article is written "Bridget O'Donnell

Friday 14 December 2007 11.54 GMT"  yet the rogatory statement  was on the 08 APRIL 2008  so they should at least mention this meeting with the Tapas group prior to Madeleine going missing in their rogatory statement but I don't think they do.

The rogatory interview was to answer a specific set of further questions set by the PJ.

http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/MCCANNS-WANTED.htm#mw3089


Questions for Jeremy Wilkins:

When did you meet Gerald McCann on Thursday 03 May?

Where exactly were you standing? Did you see where Gerald had been?

Did you see him come out of his apartment?

Did you notice anything unusual?

What did you talk about? Did he mention anything about checking the children?

How long did you speak for? Are you sure about the time?

Did you see anyone else whilst you were talking? If so who and where?

Did you see Jane Tanner?

From where you were standing, talking to Gerald, was it possible to see the road at the top of the hill - Rua Dr Francisco Gentil?

Could someone have walked across this junction travelling west to east carrying a child without you seeing him?

Offline Robittybob1

Re: Who was the mystery couple?
« Reply #35 on: May 27, 2017, 04:50:08 PM »
I saw another question as well.
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Offline Eleanor

Re: Who was the mystery couple?
« Reply #36 on: May 28, 2017, 11:36:38 AM »

There was No Mystery Couple.  No couple at all.  This just doesn't make sense.

Offline Robittybob1

Re: Who was the mystery couple?
« Reply #37 on: May 28, 2017, 01:34:23 PM »
The rogatory interview was to answer a specific set of further questions set by the PJ.

http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/MCCANNS-WANTED.htm#mw3089


Questions for Jeremy Wilkins:

When did you meet Gerald McCann on Thursday 03 May?

Where exactly were you standing? Did you see where Gerald had been?

Did you see him come out of his apartment?

Did you notice anything unusual?

What did you talk about? Did he mention anything about checking the children?

How long did you speak for? Are you sure about the time?

Did you see anyone else whilst you were talking? If so who and where?

Did you see Jane Tanner?

From where you were standing, talking to Gerald, was it possible to see the road at the top of the hill - Rua Dr Francisco Gentil?

Could someone have walked across this junction travelling west to east carrying a child without you seeing him?

There was another question asked Q. Relative to the encounters between the 29th of April and the 3rd of May;
And they don't mention going to the Tapas and meeting Gerry in the rogatory.
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Offline Robittybob1

Re: Who was the mystery couple?
« Reply #38 on: May 28, 2017, 01:42:06 PM »
It is covered in a previous statement to some degree. "That evening myself and my partner attended the 'Tapas' restaurant which is part of the hotel complex at the swimming pool. We sat down to eat at 7:30 pm. After about forty five (45) minutes Jerry appeared as did one of his friends. I believe it was Russell. They sat at the next table. We naturally engaged in conversation about everyday things. We spoke about childcare. That night my family were using the creche's facility. We found out that the group of families were occupying ground floor flats near the swimming pool and they were leaving the children by themselves in order for them to go to the restaurant in the evenings. They would then go regularly to check the children who would be asleep."
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Offline Innominate

Re: Who was the mystery couple?
« Reply #39 on: May 29, 2017, 05:51:48 PM »
I've just come out of hibernation and read this fascinating thread; it may explain something that has puzzled me.

http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/YVONNE-WARREN-MARTIN.htm

--- snip ---

- During the conversation the mother told her that she did not understand why a couple had abducted her daughter.

 - However, the third individual overheard this conversation and interrupted Ms. Martin and took the McCann couple away from her.
  This same individual came shortly afterwards to tell her that the couple did not want to talk to her any further and did not require her help - an action that appeared quite strange to her.

====

I cannot see any mention of this 'couple' in the statements by the McCanns.

Why not? Why drop any mention of this 'couple' when talking to the Police?

What would Madeline have to say about this couple if we could ask her? Mr and Mrs McCann state that Madeleine asked why they had not come in to see her when she was crying.

Did Madeline say more? Who knows? I'm not sure whether this kind of speculation is permitted.

Offline Eleanor

Re: Who was the mystery couple?
« Reply #40 on: May 29, 2017, 06:01:44 PM »
I've just come out of hibernation and read this fascinating thread; it may explain something that has puzzled me.

http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/YVONNE-WARREN-MARTIN.htm

--- snip ---

- During the conversation the mother told her that she did not understand why a couple had abducted her daughter.

 - However, the third individual overheard this conversation and interrupted Ms. Martin and took the McCann couple away from her.
  This same individual came shortly afterwards to tell her that the couple did not want to talk to her any further and did not require her help - an action that appeared quite strange to her.

====

I cannot see any mention of this 'couple' in the statements by the McCanns.

Why not? Why drop any mention of this 'couple' when talking to the Police?

What would Madeline have to say about this couple if we could ask her? Mr and Mrs McCann state that Madeleine asked why they had not come in to see her when she was crying.

Did Madeline say more? Who knows? I'm not sure whether this kind of speculation is permitted.

Your "Speculation" is grossly misrepresented.  There was no mention of a couple by Kate McCann.

Yvonne Martin then sent an anonymous letter to The PJ, which was hardly the act of a Professional.

Offline Brietta

Re: Who was the mystery couple?
« Reply #41 on: May 29, 2017, 06:33:36 PM »
I've just come out of hibernation and read this fascinating thread; it may explain something that has puzzled me.

http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/YVONNE-WARREN-MARTIN.htm

--- snip ---

- During the conversation the mother told her that she did not understand why a couple had abducted her daughter.

 - However, the third individual overheard this conversation and interrupted Ms. Martin and took the McCann couple away from her.
  This same individual came shortly afterwards to tell her that the couple did not want to talk to her any further and did not require her help - an action that appeared quite strange to her.

====

I cannot see any mention of this 'couple' in the statements by the McCanns.

Why not? Why drop any mention of this 'couple' when talking to the Police?

What would Madeline have to say about this couple if we could ask her? Mr and Mrs McCann state that Madeleine asked why they had not come in to see her when she was crying.

Did Madeline say more? Who knows? I'm not sure whether this kind of speculation is permitted.

"The statements given to the PJ today by Yvonne Martin provide a concrete clarification of the reasons for her suspicions, which in my opinion, do not point to any concrete element that could, in any way, make other inquiries directly related to her statements, viable."
http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/YVONNE-WARREN-MARTIN.htm

"All I'm going to say is that we've conducted a very serious investigation and there's no indication that Madeleine McCann's parents are connected to her disappearance. On the other hand, we have a lot of evidence pointing out that Christian killed her," Wolter told the "Friday at 9"....

Offline Innominate

Re: Who was the mystery couple?
« Reply #42 on: May 29, 2017, 07:28:37 PM »
Quote
"The statements given to the PJ today by Yvonne Martin provide a concrete clarification of the reasons for her suspicions, which in my opinion, do not point to any concrete element that could, in any way, make other inquiries directly related to her statements, viable."
http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/YVONNE-WARREN-MARTIN.htm

Yes, but that is in the context of the previous paragraph:

She adds that on one occasion, because it had occurred to her that the parents and the friends could eventually be involved in the child's disappearance, she wrote an anonymous letter to the British police.

I agree there is no reason to suspect the parents of involvement, and I'm positive they were not involved, but that does not mean the statement that Yvonne made is false.

David Payne confirms the interaction happened in his rogatory statement.

David Payne also makes the following statement:

It was a face of someone's child who had been taken and you know and very clearly said she's gone, she's you know, she's gone, you know and there was a disbelief on our face you know ah you know you must be mistaken, what, and then you know just looking at her we just all err left the table, rushed over to her and as we were walking up towards the flat she said err you know they've taken her and it was, you know, and I know there's been a controversy about what was actually said but you know that is very accurately what had been said.

In my view "they've taken her" could be referring to a couple.

Yvonne Martin has clearly testified that Kate McCann told her that a couple had taken the child.

The question is whether that statement to true or false - I do not know the answer to that question.

But if someone has seen a 'couple' enter the apartment then has this couple come forward? Is this couple a figment of someone's imagination? What does 'they've taken her mean'?

Offline Brietta

Re: Who was the mystery couple?
« Reply #43 on: May 29, 2017, 07:41:57 PM »
Yes, but that is in the context of the previous paragraph:

She adds that on one occasion, because it had occurred to her that the parents and the friends could eventually be involved in the child's disappearance, she wrote an anonymous letter to the British police.

I agree there is no reason to suspect the parents of involvement, and I'm positive they were not involved, but that does not mean the statement that Yvonne made is false.

David Payne confirms the interaction happened in his rogatory statement.

David Payne also makes the following statement:

It was a face of someone's child who had been taken and you know and very clearly said she's gone, she's you know, she's gone, you know and there was a disbelief on our face you know ah you know you must be mistaken, what, and then you know just looking at her we just all err left the table, rushed over to her and as we were walking up towards the flat she said err you know they've taken her and it was, you know, and I know there's been a controversy about what was actually said but you know that is very accurately what had been said.

In my view "they've taken her" could be referring to a couple.

Yvonne Martin has clearly testified that Kate McCann told her that a couple had taken the child.

The question is whether that statement to true or false - I do not know the answer to that question.

But if someone has seen a 'couple' enter the apartment then has this couple come forward? Is this couple a figment of someone's imagination? What does 'they've taken her mean'?

The most charitable light I can cast on Yvonne Martin is that she was mistaken from start to finish.
"All I'm going to say is that we've conducted a very serious investigation and there's no indication that Madeleine McCann's parents are connected to her disappearance. On the other hand, we have a lot of evidence pointing out that Christian killed her," Wolter told the "Friday at 9"....

Offline Innominate

Re: Who was the mystery couple?
« Reply #44 on: May 29, 2017, 08:18:33 PM »
Quote
The most charitable light I can cast on Yvonne Martin is that she was mistaken from start to finish.

Fair enough - that is a perfectly valid view of her statement.