Have we learnt anything from the Maddie case?

[jassi]

What temperature is that?  are you talking 4 degrees C or -1 degrees C?  What temperature are morgues run at?
Wikipedia "Types of cold chambers[edit]
There are two types of mortuary cold chambers:

Positive temperature
Bodies are kept between 2 °C (36 °F) and 4 °C (39 °F). While this is usually used for keeping bodies for up to several weeks, it does not prevent decomposition, which continues at a slower rate than at room temperature.[3]

Negative temperature
Bodies are kept at between −10 °C (14 °F) and −50 °C (−58 °F). Usually used at forensic institutes, particularly when a body has not been identified. At these temperatures the body is completely frozen and decomposition is very much reduced." 
Amaral talked of the body being moved 5 weeks later.  Sounds like that would be difficult in a fridge.
It was more than 20 days before they hired the Renault.  When would the move be done?  From where to where?

And then you've got all the eyes of the world on the McCanns in the early days so could they really do that and not be noticed?

Why should this be a problem? It's not as if there would be any reason to preserve a body intact, particularly if the last thing you actually wanted was a post mortem.

[Robittybob1]

Why should this be a problem? It's not as if there would be any reason to preserve a body intact, particularly if the last thing you actually wanted was a post mortem.

What; you think there are no problems!
The first problem is when was Madeleine dismembered?  and who did that? , where was it done?  Packaging another problem. cleaning up another problem. where is this fridge? 

[jassi]

What; you think there are no problems!
The first problem is when was Madeleine dismembered?  and who did that? , where was it done?  Packaging another problem. cleaning up another problem. where is this fridge?

Where do you get dismembering from?
Small body can be fitted into a normal  sized fridge if shelves removed.

[Robittybob1]

Where do you get dismembering from?
Small body can be fitted into a normal  sized fridge if shelves removed.

I misunderstood your comment "It's not as if there would be any reason to preserve a body intact".  If it wasn't "intact" I thought you were implying it was dismembered.

[jassi]

I misunderstood your comment "It's not as if there would be any reason to preserve a body intact".  If it wasn't "intact" I thought you were implying it was dismembered.

No, I meant decomposing.
For body stored in small place, see - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Death_of_Gareth_Williams

Funnily enough, a sports bag was involved.

[G-Unit]

What temperature is that?  are you talking 4 degrees C or -1 degrees C?  What temperature are morgues run at?
Wikipedia "Types of cold chambers[edit]
There are two types of mortuary cold chambers:

Positive temperature
Bodies are kept between 2 °C (36 °F) and 4 °C (39 °F). While this is usually used for keeping bodies for up to several weeks, it does not prevent decomposition, which continues at a slower rate than at room temperature.[3]

Negative temperature
Bodies are kept at between −10 °C (14 °F) and −50 °C (−58 °F). Usually used at forensic institutes, particularly when a body has not been identified. At these temperatures the body is completely frozen and decomposition is very much reduced." 
Amaral talked of the body being moved 5 weeks later.  Sounds like that would be difficult in a fridge.
It was more than 20 days before they hired the Renault.  When would the move be done?  From where to where?

And then you've got all the eyes of the world on the McCanns in the early days so could they really do that and not be noticed?

Is there evidence that Madeleine's body was ever in the car? According to the CSI dog there was blood in the boot and on the key fob. According to the FSS there wasn't sufficient evidence to say the blood was Madeleine's.

Sandy Cameron had a hire car from at least 12th May, but we have no details of that car or who drove it. Perhaps because details didn't come out until the rog interviews.

Sandy Cameron was also there and possessed a hire car, but it was not the Renault Scenic that Gerry and Kate rented during the third week that I stayed with them in Portugal
http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/L-R-MCQUEEN.htm

[Carana]

Fencesitting isn’t a problem, I would be very wary of anyone who was completely one way or the other.

Full disclosure: I came off my fence once I'd gone through a long list of questions that I had and waded through the files to find answers.

The result of that is, no, now I don't see any plausible scenario from A-Z involving the parents.

I listened to both sides, but I wanted to come to my own conclusions.

[Brietta]

Interview with Goncalo Amaral

With the residues that were found inside the car, the little girl had to have been transported inside it.

How can you state that?

Due to the type of fluid, we policemen, experts, say that the cadaver was frozen or preserved in the cold and when placed into the car boot, with the heat at that time [of the year], part of the ice melted. On a curb, for example, something fell from the trunk’s right side, above the wheel. It may be said that this is speculation, but it’s the only way to explain what happened there. GA


The really distressing thing about that statement in my opinion is that it was made by the senior officer in charge of Madeleine's investigation.  Hardly a professional or even accurate opinion.

[Carana]

Interview with Goncalo Amaral

With the residues that were found inside the car, the little girl had to have been transported inside it.

How can you state that?

Due to the type of fluid, we policemen, experts, say that the cadaver was frozen or preserved in the cold and when placed into the car boot, with the heat at that time [of the year], part of the ice melted. On a curb, for example, something fell from the trunk’s right side, above the wheel. It may be said that this is speculation, but it’s the only way to explain what happened there. GA


The really distressing thing about that statement in my opinion is that it was made by the senior officer in charge of Madeleine's investigation.  Hardly a professional or even accurate opinion.

I remember a time when I assumed he knew what he was talking about and that therefore that must have been true. It wasn't until I could read the files for myself that I realised what a load of BS that was. I expect that the majority of ladies who knit in front of Dear Julia's pink couch matinée TV show still believe that.

[Robittybob1]

I remember a time when I assumed he knew what he was talking about and that therefore that must have been true. It wasn't until I could read the files for myself that I realised what a load of BS that was. I expect that the majority of ladies who knit in front of Dear Julia's pink couch matinée TV show still believe that.

I took this to be based on some real observation.  "How can you state that?

Due to the type of fluid, we policemen, experts, say that the cadaver was frozen or preserved in the cold and when placed into the car boot, with the heat at that time [of the year], part of the ice melted. On a curb, for example, something fell from the trunk’s right side, above the wheel. It may be said that this is speculation, but it’s the only way to explain what happened there. GA" 

So what I think someone saw was a wet patch on the pavement where the McCann car had been parked previously.  I would have like to see the actual report.  Who saw it?  And what day this happened?  But I have not seen that detail as yet.  Was this where the "5 weeks after" came from?

[sadie]

Is there evidence that Madeleine's body was ever in the car? According to the CSI dog there was blood in the boot and on the key fob. According to the FSS there wasn't sufficient evidence to say the blood was Madeleine's.

Sandy Cameron had a hire car from at least 12th May, but we have no details of that car or who drove it. Perhaps because details didn't come out until the rog interviews.

Sandy Cameron was also there and possessed a hire car, but it was not the Renault Scenic that Gerry and Kate rented during the third week that I stayed with them in Portugal
http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/L-R-MCQUEEN.htm

There was NO EVIDENCE that the blood was Madeleines.  Sufficient is the wrong word IMO.  Did the FSS use the word Sufficient?

[Robittybob1]

There was NO EVIDENCE that the blood was Madeleines.  Sufficient is the wrong word IMO.  Did the FSS use the word Sufficient?

It was not possible to say what the source of the DNA.  They use the term body fluid.  In conclusive but 15 out of the 19 alleles for Madeleine were mixed in the  mixed DNA sample that had at least 3 contributors.   That is a strange result. 

[Carana]

Is there evidence that Madeleine's body was ever in the car? According to the CSI dog there was blood in the boot and on the key fob. According to the FSS there wasn't sufficient evidence to say the blood was Madeleine's.

Sandy Cameron had a hire car from at least 12th May, but we have no details of that car or who drove it. Perhaps because details didn't come out until the rog interviews.

Sandy Cameron was also there and possessed a hire car, but it was not the Renault Scenic that Gerry and Kate rented during the third week that I stayed with them in Portugal
http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/L-R-MCQUEEN.htm

Actually, there was so little DNA that the FSS couldn't say what substance it came from at all. The only reason it's  assumed that it was blood was because Keela alerted and that's all she was trained to detect, assuming that she was indeed always correct.

[Mr Gray]

It was not possible to say what the source of the DNA.  They use the term body fluid.  In conclusive but 15 out of the 19 alleles for Madeleine were mixed in the  mixed DNA sample that had at least 3 contributors.   That is a strange result.

not a strange result at all......what they said was if you took a soup of any three poeple you would probably find the 15 alleles...it is quite possible possible taht the sample had nothing to do with maddie whatsoever

[Mr Gray]

Full disclosure: I came off my fence once I'd gone through a long list of questions that I had and waded through the files to find answers.

The result of that is, no, now I don't see any plausible scenario from A-Z involving the parents.

I listened to both sides, but I wanted to come to my own conclusions.

Interesting....so you have considered all the evidence....and you have an in depth knowledge of it....and now you se no way the parents are involved...That is precisely my stance...sceptics take note