Have we learnt anything from the Maddie case?

[Brietta]

There is no cadaverine in pus.

True there are several of the volatile compounds found in cadaver odour which are also found in pus but no cadaverine and without it Eddie would not have alerted.

Quite simply ... you are wrong.

Ever almost gagged when someone with severe halitosis has breathed on you?  The cause of the smell is very simple ...
 All About Bad Breath (Porphyromonas Gingivalis)
FACTS: Many people believe that bad breath, or halitosis, is caused by gas rising up from the stomach – particularly after eating onions or spicy foods. In fact, most cases are caused by microbes such as Porphyromonas gingivalis!

Between three and four hundred types of microbes typically call the human mouth home. Most are harmless. But a few produce “volatile sulfur compounds.” These compounds, such as hydrogen sulfide – which smells like rotting eggs – give bad breath its characteristic odor. (Other oral bacterial by-products include cadaverine and putrescine, which are typical of rotting corpses and rotting meat!)

VSC-producing bacteria are generally present in inoffensive quantities. However, as oxygen levels in areas of the mouth are reduced – behind layers of plaque or food, for instance – these anaerobic bacteria thrive. Furthermore, as VSC-levels increase, the pH of the mouth is reduced, which creates the sour, metallic taste experienced by halitosis sufferers!

So what can you do about Porphyromonas gingivalis? Brush and floss, of course. Oh, and avoid onions and spicy foods: they’re very high in sulfur content.
https://www.giantmicrobes.com/uk/products/badbreath.html


Infection can occur anywhere in the human body and if the result produces pus the stink of putrefaction can in many cases be overpowering.
Nothing more so than if you are unfortunate enough to have tooth abscess which requires draining whether human or animal ... of course Eddie would react to one though not t'other.  But the same chemical compounds make up both.


Why do abscesses smell so bad?


     ****    ****    ****    ****    ****    ****
This multiplication of organisms and the cellular destruction also forms a cocktail of some unpleasant chemicals. The exact mix depends on the organisms. Gasses such as ammonia, methane and sulphur dioxide (think rotten eggs) may be produced. Two other compounds are largely responsible for the foul odour of putrefying flesh. The delightfully named putrescine and cadaverine, are produced by the breakdown of amino acids in the tissue.

But what is the point of all this stink? To us the smell is disgusting and we are repelled by it. We instinctively avoid anything that creates such odours helping to protect us from exposure to infectious agents.
http://howanimalswork.blogspot.co.uk/2011/04/what-makes-eye-colour.html

[Brietta]

Why not?

Maybe they should have checked if anyone present at the inspection in the apartment suffered from halitosis ... in my opinion the resulting scent of cadaverine and putrescine would do it for Eddie each and every time ;)

I really just thought pus was nasty green or yellow smelly stuff that oozed from a wound or even a pimply teenager's acne ... who would have thought there was so much science attached.

[Mr Gray]

Eddie/Keela have been used by SY with positive results according to that report. Quite an eye-opener!

how many times has eddie found any evidence that has been used in court....i think there is quite a lot of hype about his history which is not reflected in his CV   supplied by grime

[pathfinder73]

The alerts are police intelligence to investigate further e.g. new forensics, new leads searching wasteland for body etc. Eddie alerted in the Prout case which confirmed to the police that Kate was deceased. Eddie wasn't used in court. He has been used in court Bob Rose case, Harron, Parker etc.

[faithlilly]

Quite simply ... you are wrong.

Ever almost gagged when someone with severe halitosis has breathed on you?  The cause of the smell is very simple ...
 All About Bad Breath (Porphyromonas Gingivalis)
FACTS: Many people believe that bad breath, or halitosis, is caused by gas rising up from the stomach – particularly after eating onions or spicy foods. In fact, most cases are caused by microbes such as Porphyromonas gingivalis!

Between three and four hundred types of microbes typically call the human mouth home. Most are harmless. But a few produce “volatile sulfur compounds.” These compounds, such as hydrogen sulfide – which smells like rotting eggs – give bad breath its characteristic odor. (Other oral bacterial by-products include cadaverine and putrescine, which are typical of rotting corpses and rotting meat!)

VSC-producing bacteria are generally present in inoffensive quantities. However, as oxygen levels in areas of the mouth are reduced – behind layers of plaque or food, for instance – these anaerobic bacteria thrive. Furthermore, as VSC-levels increase, the pH of the mouth is reduced, which creates the sour, metallic taste experienced by halitosis sufferers!

So what can you do about Porphyromonas gingivalis? Brush and floss, of course. Oh, and avoid onions and spicy foods: they’re very high in sulfur content.
https://www.giantmicrobes.com/uk/products/badbreath.html


Infection can occur anywhere in the human body and if the result produces pus the stink of putrefaction can in many cases be overpowering.
Nothing more so than if you are unfortunate enough to have tooth abscess which requires draining whether human or animal ... of course Eddie would react to one though not t'other.  But the same chemical compounds make up both.


Why do abscesses smell so bad?


     ****    ****    ****    ****    ****    ****
This multiplication of organisms and the cellular destruction also forms a cocktail of some unpleasant chemicals. The exact mix depends on the organisms. Gasses such as ammonia, methane and sulphur dioxide (think rotten eggs) may be produced. Two other compounds are largely responsible for the foul odour of putrefying flesh. The delightfully named putrescine and cadaverine, are produced by the breakdown of amino acids in the tissue.

But what is the point of all this stink? To us the smell is disgusting and we are repelled by it. We instinctively avoid anything that creates such odours helping to protect us from exposure to infectious agents.
http://howanimalswork.blogspot.co.uk/2011/04/what-makes-eye-colour.html

Not sure what you are trying to prove with that screed Brietta. Trying to compare apple with oranges it seems to me.

[Brietta]

Not sure what you are trying to prove with that screed Brietta. Trying to compare apple with oranges it seems to me.

I have proved that your post denying the presence of cadaverine in pus is wrong.  Therefore had there been a plaster with pus on it in the apartment at any time after the McCann occupancy even when removed there was a fair chance it would have caused Eddie to alert.
That is if you place any credence at all on Eddie's ability to react to substances which are not there.

[slartibartfast]

I have proved that your post denying the presence of cadaverine in pus is wrong.  Therefore had there been a plaster with pus on it in the apartment at any time after the McCann occupancy even when removed there was a fair chance it would have caused Eddie to alert.
That is if you place any credence at all on Eddie's ability to react to substances which are not there.

It doesn’t say that, it says abscess or serious halitosis. If you can provide evidence of that and can demonstrate that those scents alone cause Eddie to alert then you may have a point.

[Carana]

The alerts are police intelligence to investigate further e.g. new forensics, new leads searching wasteland for body etc. Eddie alerted in the Prout case which confirmed to the police that Kate was deceased. Eddie wasn't used in court. He has been used in court Bob Rose case, Harron, Parker etc.

I have no problem at all with gathering intelligence when justified, undercover or not.

However, the whole point seems to be to eliminate someone under justified suspicion, or to provide leads towards evidence of a past or potentially future crime.

In this case, the intelligence doesn't appear to have led anywhere so far, but is being itself taken as evidence.

A similar dog alerted in the home of a relative in the Shannon case. The logical conclusion was that she'd died there or her body had been transported there... which turned out, thankfully, to be totally wrong. She was found alive elsewhere.

[pathfinder73]

This intelligence leads to Smithman.  You will never see Smithman coming forward. He will have to be arrested.

[Mr Gray]

This intelligence leads to Smithman.  You will never see Smithman coming forward. He will have to be arrested.

Have you ever considered you might be on the wrong track

[faithlilly]

I have proved that your post denying the presence of cadaverine in pus is wrong.  Therefore had there been a plaster with pus on it in the apartment at any time after the McCann occupancy even when removed there was a fair chance it would have caused Eddie to alert.
That is if you place any credence at all on Eddie's ability to react to substances which are not there.

Cavaderine is contained in putrefying flesh not in abscesses as you would know if you read your own link properly.

[Mr Gray]

Quite simply ... you are wrong.

Ever almost gagged when someone with severe halitosis has breathed on you?  The cause of the smell is very simple ...
 All About Bad Breath (Porphyromonas Gingivalis)
FACTS: Many people believe that bad breath, or halitosis, is caused by gas rising up from the stomach – particularly after eating onions or spicy foods. In fact, most cases are caused by microbes such as Porphyromonas gingivalis!

Between three and four hundred types of microbes typically call the human mouth home. Most are harmless. But a few produce “volatile sulfur compounds.” These compounds, such as hydrogen sulfide – which smells like rotting eggs – give bad breath its characteristic odor. (Other oral bacterial by-products include cadaverine and putrescine, which are typical of rotting corpses and rotting meat!)

VSC-producing bacteria are generally present in inoffensive quantities. However, as oxygen levels in areas of the mouth are reduced – behind layers of plaque or food, for instance – these anaerobic bacteria thrive. Furthermore, as VSC-levels increase, the pH of the mouth is reduced, which creates the sour, metallic taste experienced by halitosis sufferers!

So what can you do about Porphyromonas gingivalis? Brush and floss, of course. Oh, and avoid onions and spicy foods: they’re very high in sulfur content.
https://www.giantmicrobes.com/uk/products/badbreath.html


Infection can occur anywhere in the human body and if the result produces pus the stink of putrefaction can in many cases be overpowering.
Nothing more so than if you are unfortunate enough to have tooth abscess which requires draining whether human or animal ... of course Eddie would react to one though not t'other.  But the same chemical compounds make up both.


Why do abscesses smell so bad?


     ****    ****    ****    ****    ****    ****
This multiplication of organisms and the cellular destruction also forms a cocktail of some unpleasant chemicals. The exact mix depends on the organisms. Gasses such as ammonia, methane and sulphur dioxide (think rotten eggs) may be produced. Two other compounds are largely responsible for the foul odour of putrefying flesh. The delightfully named putrescine and cadaverine, are produced by the breakdown of amino acids in the tissue.

But what is the point of all this stink? To us the smell is disgusting and we are repelled by it. We instinctively avoid anything that creates such odours helping to protect us from exposure to infectious agents.
http://howanimalswork.blogspot.co.uk/2011/04/what-makes-eye-colour.html

another one

Cadaverine as a putative component of oral malodor.
Goldberg S1, Kozlovsky A, Gordon D, Gelernter I, Sintov A, Rosenberg M.
Author information
Abstract
Whereas previous studies have shown correlations between volatile sulphur compounds (VSC) and bad breath levels, it is probable that other compounds found in the oral cavity may contribute to oral malodor. In the present investigation, the possibility that diamines (cadaverine and putrescine) are associated with oral malodor parameters was assessed. Saliva samples from 52 subjects were analyzed for cadaverine and putrescine by HPLC

so cadaverine and putrescine are found in some saliva

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/8046106

[pathfinder73]

Have you ever considered you might be on the wrong track

No but I've tested other theories. There's only one.

I still want to know if Mary Smith said "Oh is she asleep?"

If so, most revealing.

[Mr Gray]

No but I've tested other theories. There's only one.

I still want to know if Mary Smith said "Oh is she asleep?"

If so, most revealing.

do you think the dogs prove maddie died in the apartment

[faithlilly]

another one

Cadaverine as a putative component of oral malodor.
Goldberg S1, Kozlovsky A, Gordon D, Gelernter I, Sintov A, Rosenberg M.
Author information
Abstract
Whereas previous studies have shown correlations between volatile sulphur compounds (VSC) and bad breath levels, it is probable that other compounds found in the oral cavity may contribute to oral malodor. In the present investigation, the possibility that diamines (cadaverine and putrescine) are associated with oral malodor parameters was assessed. Saliva samples from 52 subjects were analyzed for cadaverine and putrescine by HPLC

so cadaverine and putrescine are found in some saliva

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/8046106

Saliva may be but not pus.