Author Topic: List of things to check when I get to Praia da Luz  (Read 4487 times)

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Offline Davel

Re: List of things to check when I get to Praia da Luz
« Reply #15 on: February 02, 2018, 09:55:29 PM »
Not according to Eleanor.

I think the activities that were organised appealed to the mccanns....
UNLESS OTHERWISE STATED ALL POSTS ARE MY OPINION

Online ShiningInLuz

Re: List of things to check when I get to Praia da Luz
« Reply #16 on: February 02, 2018, 10:13:27 PM »
It never was much of a place in comparison to other resorts on The Algarve.
Presumably then you think the McCanns choice was poor and that they should not have thought Luz family friendly enough or safe enough to leave the patio doors unlocked?
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Offline Davel

Re: List of things to check when I get to Praia da Luz
« Reply #17 on: February 02, 2018, 10:21:04 PM »
Presumably then you think the McCanns choice was poor and that they should not have thought Luz family friendly enough or safe enough to leave the patio doors unlocked?

Thats exactly what the mccanns thought...but you would know that if you have  followed the case
UNLESS OTHERWISE STATED ALL POSTS ARE MY OPINION

Online ShiningInLuz

Re: List of things to check when I get to Praia da Luz
« Reply #18 on: February 03, 2018, 02:25:52 AM »
If Robbity ever makes it out to Luz, I will be happy to show him the bits that count, both in 2007 and 2018.
« Last Edit: February 03, 2018, 10:40:15 PM by John »
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Online John

Re: List of things to check when I get to Praia da Luz
« Reply #19 on: February 03, 2018, 10:54:33 PM »
Add posts of things you would liked checked if you had the opportunity to go to PdL.

1.  Define the cul-de-sac that Russell O'Brien talks about.

2.  The height of the garden walls?

3. Can the garden walls be climbed over, by adults or by kids?

4  Visibility at 9:00, 9:15 and 10:00 PM on the 3rd of May.  (lux meter required)

5. distance of side gate to footpath of the top road.

6. How is the Tapas reception secured at night?  Can the access card always open it?

7.  How is the door at the secondary reception held open?

8. Measure the dimensions of the kids bedroom window.

9.  I want to know if the units had air conditioning.

10. I want to see how noisy the front door is compared to the sliding door.

11.  I want to see how effective the public patio of block 6 would be for viewing apartment 5A (Sadie's theory).

12.  Has the back garden of the most westerly apartment got a gate thru onto the alleyway?

13  Madeleine in an excited moment running off  she somehow got into the back garden of the most westerly apartment. - follow the likely route she took

14.  Stand in the recess along the roadside wall and sense whether it is a suitable temporary hiding place.

15.  Walk the distance between the Tapas and the 24 hour reception, and time the walk.

16.  Find the short cut to the 24 hour reception and time the walk.

17.  Know where the Kids club was.

18.  Know where the night creche was situated

19.  Know where the Toddlers creche was.

20.  Understand the pattern of searches the Tapas 7 made immediately after Kate's alarm.

21.  Do the walk from apartment 5A front door to passageway between Blocks 4 and 5, down alleyway and down to reception door at 9:45 PM at night. (imagine being Madeleine)

22.  Attend a Sunday service at the local church in PdL (Church of Nossa Senhora da Luz).

23.  Would the curtains at the patio door self close behind a 4 year old?

24.  I want SiL to show me where the blood was found along the foot path  500 meters or so away.

25. Can the front door be slammed shut?

26.  Purchase an Italian style rim lock of the type in the apartment

27.  Can it be modified?

28. From where Kate was standing when Kate opened the door after it slammed shut,  From that standing  position how much of Madeleine's bed could she possibly see?

73 left to list.

I think you have to be realistic Rob.  Access to 5a will probably be impossible and in any event things have changed in the last ten years.  We know where all the creche's were located so I cannot understand you including this in your list?  I think you need to weed out the items which will be impossible to achieve as well as those which have already been determined.
« Last Edit: February 03, 2018, 10:58:11 PM by John »
A malicious prosecution for a crime which never existed. John Lamberton exposes malfeasance by public officials.
Check out my website >   http://johnlamberton.webs.com/index.htm?no_redirect=true     The truth never changes with the passage of time.

Offline Robittybob1

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Re: List of things to check when I get to Praia da Luz
« Reply #20 on: February 04, 2018, 12:17:48 AM »
I think you have to be realistic Rob.  Access to 5a will probably be impossible and in any event things have changed in the last ten years.  We know where all the creche's were located so I cannot understand you including this in your list?  I think you need to weed out the items which will be impossible to achieve as well as those which have already been determined.
I'm not ruling out access to 5A until the owner actually tells us that himself.
Creches - I was just wondering how likely it would be that Madeleine tried to walk there herself.  It might only take 10 minutes to tick that one off.
« Last Edit: February 05, 2018, 08:30:06 AM by Robittybob1 »
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Online ShiningInLuz

Re: List of things to check when I get to Praia da Luz
« Reply #21 on: February 04, 2018, 12:59:10 AM »
SIL, you will show him that view that you claim Smithman would have had as he exited The Staff Quarters (SQ), wont you?  The view all the way down Rua d'Escola, past the dog leg junction and down several flights of steps to the Dolphin Restaurant.

The view that you claim, in your blog, convinced you that Smithman was a bonafide father with his child, because you say that if he was a baddie, he wouldn't have started the walk down if he saw people coming up the road

BTW,
Did you factor into your thoughts that a baddie would have tried to keep in the dark rather than the light.    To do that he had to slink along the front of the Staff quarters because of the street lamp approx 20 metres opposite.  From the SQ itself he had absolutely no view down to see anyone coming up due to the next building jutting out

To have any chance of seeing down to the Dolphin as you claim, because of this and the dog leg in the roads, Smithman had to cross across to the lampost opposite the Staff Quarters.  This was almost 20 metres in the wrong direction.

Now if Smithman was exiting the S.Q, and up to no good, would he head straight for the lamp, or would he slink down in the dark?  Once started on his route he had the shock of seeing some old fogies coming up, but carried on, IMO, hoping that no-one would remember him.


Please remember that the positions that we all know that the groups of the Smith family were stationed, were not the positions that they were in at the start of Tannermans walk from the SQ.  They were all moving and most probably both Martin and Aoifes group were out of sight on the steps when Tannerman set out.

This is just a theory and i have worked it out from GE.

Please check it out Rob.

Am in a rush.  Not back today.  Use GE and chew it over pls.
I presume you mean Smithman, not Tannerman, but I have left your quote unaltered.

I would be happy to show anyone the the view from Travessa das Escadinhas to Rua da Escola Primária and vice versa.  I have already done one such check on a Luz Tour, trying hard to emulate the Smithman sighting.

I presume by staff quarters you mean Pedras Brancas.

If I have given the impression that one can see from Pedras Brancas to the foot of Travessa das Escadinhas, then desculpe.  I have never checked that out.  The gradient flattens out around Pedras Brancas, so the truth of the matter is that I suspect it is unlikely, but I just don't know.

I am of the opinion one can see from well before where Peter Smith passed Smithman, to the corner at Fernando´s/the Dolphin.  Anne Guedes has commented on my blog that she has visited Luz and she thinks otherwise.

The crucial point for me is that Smithman could see the Smiths coming, had ample places to hide, yet chose to walk past the group.

Sadie, if you want to discuss the Smithman sighting further, please bump a Smithman thread, and I will be most happy to engage in further conversation.  Otherwise, I fear we are diverting Robbity's thread.
Portelas installed. Plus Gonçalo!  And F1!  And the World Cup!

Offline misty

Re: List of things to check when I get to Praia da Luz
« Reply #22 on: February 04, 2018, 01:20:05 AM »
@Robittybob

5A is owned by an English lady, not a man.

http://www.ocean-country.com/property-for-sale/apartment-lagos-praia-da-luz/51   (Ground floor apartment at
 far west end of Block 4)

http://www.ocean-country.com/property-for-sale/apartment-lagos-praia-da-luz/235 (2nd floor apartment in Block 5? with air con)

Some apartments seem to have air con, others don't.

Some photos here of pathways around Blocks 4 & 5
http://miscarriageofjustice.co/index.php?topic=6520.0


There is a gate in the side wall of 5F (ground floor far west) into the alley/pathway separating Blocks 4 & 5 but I can't locate it right now.

Online ShiningInLuz

Re: List of things to check when I get to Praia da Luz
« Reply #23 on: February 04, 2018, 01:40:12 AM »
I think you have to be realistic Rob.  Access to 5a will probably be impossible and in any event things have changed in the last ten years.  We know where all the creche's were located so I cannot understand you including this in your list?  I think you need to weed out the items which will be impossible to achieve as well as those which have already been determined.
I think Rob should go the opposite way and try to get his wish-list above 100 items.

There are bits on his wish-list that do not need a visit to Luz.

There are bits on his wish-list that I can do without anyone visiting.

There are bits on his wish-list that need to be experienced first hand.

There are bits on my wish-list that I hope to squeeze in this year.  I want to go to the working mens club in Portelas to ask a few questions.  I also want to talk to Paulo R, Ricardo R and Carlos d S, and Vitor d S.  Maybe Sergey as well.

The example you have picked is an eye-opener.  The McCanns short route to Madeleine's creche is a nightmare.  There is a slightly longer route that is much safer.  And one by the main roads.  One would need to try all 3 routes to form an opinion of what was going on.

If you can squeeze a couple of days into a Luz visit, please let me know and I will be happy to walk my legs off.

As Robbity has explained, I have lots lined up in 2018.  In particular, 4 May (note 4, not 3) will be spent with my family.
Portelas installed. Plus Gonçalo!  And F1!  And the World Cup!

Offline Robittybob1

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Re: List of things to check when I get to Praia da Luz
« Reply #24 on: February 04, 2018, 03:14:08 AM »
@Robittybob

5A is owned by an English lady, not a man.

http://www.ocean-country.com/property-for-sale/apartment-lagos-praia-da-luz/51   (Ground floor apartment at
 far west end of Block 4)

http://www.ocean-country.com/property-for-sale/apartment-lagos-praia-da-luz/235 (2nd floor apartment in Block 5? with air con)

Some apartments seem to have air con, others don't.

Some photos here of pathways around Blocks 4 & 5
http://miscarriageofjustice.co/index.php?topic=6520.0


There is a gate in the side wall of 5F (ground floor far west) into the alley/pathway separating Blocks 4 & 5 but I can't locate it right now.
http://www.ocean-country.com/property-for-sale/apartment-lagos-praia-da-luz/51   (Ground floor apartment at
 far west end of Block 4)  is virtually a mirror image  structurally of 5A and it is for sale  so at a pinch I could ask for a viewing  and examine how the doors work etc.
« Last Edit: February 04, 2018, 05:35:17 AM by Robittybob1 »
What are you doing to find Madeleine?
https://www.youcaring.com/madeleinemccann-1080869

Offline Davel

Re: List of things to check when I get to Praia da Luz
« Reply #25 on: February 04, 2018, 08:40:15 AM »
The most important question for me is how difficult is it to open the patio doors. Ive stayed in aprtments where they have been quite stiff and a 3 to 4 yr old would not have been able to open them
UNLESS OTHERWISE STATED ALL POSTS ARE MY OPINION

Offline barrier

Re: List of things to check when I get to Praia da Luz
« Reply #26 on: February 04, 2018, 09:46:28 AM »
The most important question for me is how difficult is it to open the patio doors. Ive stayed in aprtments where they have been quite stiff and a 3 to 4 yr old would not have been able to open them

Eleven years on would hardly be a realistic comparison would it.
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Offline Robittybob1

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Re: List of things to check when I get to Praia da Luz
« Reply #27 on: February 04, 2018, 10:10:36 AM »
The most important question for me is how difficult is it to open the patio doors. Ive stayed in aprtments where they have been quite stiff and a 3 to 4 yr old would not have been able to open them
I was thinking you could measure that in terms of force with a spring balance.
What are you doing to find Madeleine?
https://www.youcaring.com/madeleinemccann-1080869

Offline Angelo222

Re: List of things to check when I get to Praia da Luz
« Reply #28 on: February 04, 2018, 03:54:52 PM »
The most important question for me is how difficult is it to open the patio doors. Ive stayed in aprtments where they have been quite stiff and a 3 to 4 yr old would not have been able to open them

Did the McCanns ever say the patio door was stiff?  I don't recall them doing so.
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Online John

Re: List of things to check when I get to Praia da Luz
« Reply #29 on: February 04, 2018, 11:38:12 PM »
I have reinstated Robs original YouCaring thread since there was some discussion following the decision by YouCaring to terminated the account.  Those posts have now been moved.

http://miscarriageofjustice.co/index.php?topic=9095.msg443879#msg443879
A malicious prosecution for a crime which never existed. John Lamberton exposes malfeasance by public officials.
Check out my website >   http://johnlamberton.webs.com/index.htm?no_redirect=true     The truth never changes with the passage of time.