Do the sceptics simply misunderstand the evidence

[G-Unit]

I think Gerry's, rather clever comment has gone over the heads of some posters

The fact that the dogs cannot talk and cannot be cross examined is one reason why the, alerts have no evidential value

I don't see what's clever about making a childish comment about dogs which assist the police in finding the bodies of people so their nearest and dearest can have closure. In fact it was incredibly stupid, in my opinion. It suggested that the police forces using these dogs were spending money on training and maintaining handlers and dogs which were only occasionally successful.

[Mr Gray]

I don't see what's clever about making a childish comment about dogs which assist the police in finding the bodies of people so their nearest and dearest can have closure. In fact it was incredibly stupid, in my opinion. It suggested that the police forces using these dogs were spending money on training and maintaining handlers and dogs which were only occasionally successful.

That's, your opinion... As we know the PJ have completely misunderstood  the, alerts hence the proven facts.... When people are misrepresenting things to prove your daughter is dead and that you are responsible... I find Gerry's actions quite reasonable

[Mr Gray]

I don't see what's clever about making a childish comment about dogs which assist the police in finding the bodies of people so their nearest and dearest can have closure. In fact it was incredibly stupid, in my opinion. It suggested that the police forces using these dogs were spending money on training and maintaining handlers and dogs which were only occasionally successful.

Interesting you were critical of ferryman yesterday yet it was ferryman who established that Eddie had only been deployed 37 times, in 5 years..... That's, almost one case, every two months. Eddie hasn't found a fat lot in his career... So occasionally successful seems, quite accurate

[faithlilly]

You singularly overestimate any significance attached to dog indications ... even hypothetical ones.

It would appear you don’t want to answer the question Brietta and can I remind you that it was you who posted that the dogs alerting to Murat’s property would lead to a trial not me. Can you therefore explain your claim please ?

[faithlilly]

Had Madeleine been killed in the apartment during a bungled burglary & her body removed, Eddie's alerts would have been meaningless when considering minimum post-mortem contamination time.

So you think a dead body may have been in 5a but the cadaver dog alert had nothing to do with that body ? Further that the McCanns were unlucky enough to be the only ones to actually have a dead body in there apartment AND  for the cadaver dogs to alert to the scent they were trained to ?

Wouldn’t that be one coincidence too far ?

[Mr Gray]

So you think a dead body may have been in 5a but the cadaver dog alert had nothing to do with that body ? Further that the McCanns were unlucky enough to be the only ones to actually have a dead body in there apartment AND  for the cadaver dogs to alert to the scent they were trained to ?

Wouldn’t that be one coincidence too far ?

There, are no coincidences there
Your last statement is making an assumption that the alert was to cadaver... That has not been confirmed
5a is the only apartment where the digs we're given an extended, amount of time to alert
If maddie had died in the apartment and been removed soon after there would have been no time for the odour to develop

[G-Unit]

That's, your opinion... As we know the PJ have completely misunderstood  the, alerts hence the proven facts.... When people are misrepresenting things to prove your daughter is dead and that you are responsible... I find Gerry's actions quite reasonable

It is indeed my opinion, as I think I made clear. What was gained by making such a flippant comment then? How did it advance the McCann's aims? 

[faithlilly]

There, are no coincidences there
Your last statement is making an assumption that the alert was to cadaver... That has not been confirmed
5a is the only apartment where the digs we're given an extended, amount of time to alert
If maddie had died in the apartment and been removed soon after there would have been no time for the odour to develop

So the cadaver dog alerted to what it was trained to alert to in apartment 5a and only 5a, an apartment that, OG have claimed, may have had a dead body in it and the alert isn’t to that dead body. Do you know how bonkers that sounds ?

Further I’m no dog trainer but I would assume Grime spent more time in 5a than any other apartment because of the dog’s reaction before he even entered the apartment. Even the untrained eye can see the change in his behaviour.

[G-Unit]

Interesting you were critical of ferryman yesterday yet it was ferryman who established that Eddie had only been deployed 37 times, in 5 years..... That's, almost one case, every two months. Eddie hasn't found a fat lot in his career... So occasionally successful seems, quite accurate

Ferryman's argument was based on an FOI request to South Yorkshire police. The answer didn't cover a five year period, it covered a four year period;

"The information supplied therefore relates to his service between 2003 and 2007."

During that time Eddie was used 37 times, mostly outside the SYP area.
http://miscarriageofjustice.co/index.php?topic=8032.315

The other point I would make is whether SYP held all of the records relating to Eddie, or just the ones they had been paid for? 

Anyone doing research should, in my opinion, be careful to present the correct facts. Failing to do that tends to mislead those who later quote their findings.

[Mr Gray]

It is indeed my opinion, as I think I made clear. What was gained by making such a flippant comment then? How did it advance the McCann's aims?

Why does it have to advance any aims... The poor man was upset are his daughter

[Mr Gray]

So the cadaver dog alerted to what it was trained to alert to in apartment 5a and only 5a, an apartment that, OG have claimed, may have had a dead body in it and the alert isn’t to that dead body. Do you know how bonkers that sounds ?

Further I’m no dog trainer but I would assume Grime spent more time in 5a than any other apartment because of the dog’s reaction before he even entered the apartment. Even the untrained eye can see the change in his behaviour.

You do not know what the dog alerted to... Neither dies grime... Now you are reading the digs body language

The bottom lir
No evidential reliability... That's, what counts

[Mr Gray]

Ferryman's argument was based on an FOI request to South Yorkshire police. The answer didn't cover a five year period, it covered a four year period;

"The information supplied therefore relates to his service between 2003 and 2007."

During that time Eddie was used 37 times, mostly outside the SYP area.
http://miscarriageofjustice.co/index.php?topic=8032.315

The other point I would make is whether SYP held all of the records relating to Eddie, or just the ones they had been paid for? 

Anyone doing research should, in my opinion, be careful to present the correct facts. Failing to do that tends to mislead those who later quote their findings.

Check your maths.. 2003,4,5,6,7....is 5 years
Eddies CV. supplied by grime is sparse in results

Eddie was used 37 times and it's clear that includes usage both inside and outside the SYP area

[Alice Purjorick]

You do not know what the dog alerted to... Neither dies grime... Now you are reading the digs body language

The bottom lir
No evidential reliability... That's, what counts

" 'Allo, 'Allo zees ees Night'awk calling"

I'll skip the "It's the tobacco that counts" gag

[faithlilly]

You do not know what the dog alerted to... Neither dies grime... Now you are reading the digs body language

The bottom lir
No evidential reliability... That's, what counts

Even if I couldn’t see how excited Eddie became on entering 5a Grime says his behaviour changes. He also says Eddie alerts to what he is trained to alert to.

TBH if you think that OG would be foolish enough to believe the dog alerts weren’t connected to what may have been a dead child in 5a then there really is no convincing you.

[Mr Gray]

Even if I couldn’t see how excited Eddie became on entering 5a Grime says his behaviour changes. He also says Eddie alerts to what he is trained to alert to.

TBH if you think that OG would be foolish enough to believe the dog alerts weren’t connected to what may have been a dead child in 5a then there really is no convincing you.

He didn't say eddie alerted to what he's trained to in 5a... He said it was possible it was cadaver odour.... Possible.... And also used the word suggestive...

I'm not convinced... Particularly  seeing the alert to CCand the remarks of the PJ...