Author Topic: Do the sceptics simply misunderstand the evidence  (Read 151684 times)

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Offline Robittybob1

Re: Do the sceptics simply misunderstand the evidence
« Reply #1365 on: March 26, 2018, 11:08:44 PM »
This is a very good post Carana.  It takes me to thinking why the parents feel offended at the thought their daughter may have died in the apartment - and dismiss the dogs scent. It just makes no sense at all.
Logic would suggest if she died in the apartment she would be found in the apartment,  So who found her dead in your theory. Was it earlier or Gerry Matt or Kate?
Where was she put and how long had she been dead to allow for a trail of cadaver odour around the apartment?
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Offline Vertigo Swirl

Re: Do the sceptics simply misunderstand the evidence
« Reply #1366 on: March 26, 2018, 11:19:07 PM »
This is a very good post Carana.  It takes me to thinking why the parents feel offended at the thought their daughter may have died in the apartment - and dismiss the dogs scent. It just makes no sense at all.
I think if I was a parent of a missing child I would be offended by the thought that the child may have been murdered in the place where I last saw her.
"You can't reason with the unreasonable".

Offline slartibartfast

Re: Do the sceptics simply misunderstand the evidence
« Reply #1367 on: March 26, 2018, 11:42:05 PM »
I think if I was a parent of a missing child I would be offended by the thought that the child may have been murdered in the place where I last saw her.

Worried yes, offended no.
“Reasoning will never make a Man correct an ill Opinion, which by Reasoning he never acquired”.

Offline Robittybob1

Re: Do the sceptics simply misunderstand the evidence
« Reply #1368 on: March 27, 2018, 12:19:12 AM »
Worried yes, offended no.
Similar thing happened to me that I haven't yet forgotten, my son went to the doctors with a sore hip, the doctor made inquiries as to whether I had abused my son.  I was offended.  Tests were run and he has the same genetic condition I have - reactive arthritis.  I had not kicked him.
So yes it is worrying and offending and very hard to forget. 
Moderation
John has instructed all moderators to take a very strong line with posters who constantly breach the rules of this forum.  This sniping, goading, name calling and other various forms of disruption will cease.

Offline Vertigo Swirl

Re: Do the sceptics simply misunderstand the evidence
« Reply #1369 on: March 27, 2018, 08:17:10 AM »
Worried yes, offended no.
even if the implication was that you must have known?
"You can't reason with the unreasonable".

Offline slartibartfast

Re: Do the sceptics simply misunderstand the evidence
« Reply #1370 on: March 27, 2018, 08:27:03 AM »
even if the implication was that you must have known?

I would know if I were innocent or not. Innocence is a great protection.
“Reasoning will never make a Man correct an ill Opinion, which by Reasoning he never acquired”.

Offline Mr Gray

Re: Do the sceptics simply misunderstand the evidence
« Reply #1371 on: March 27, 2018, 08:28:36 AM »
I would know if I were innocent or not. Innocence is a great protection.
If it was there would be no miscarriages of justice

Offline slartibartfast

Re: Do the sceptics simply misunderstand the evidence
« Reply #1372 on: March 27, 2018, 08:46:57 AM »
If it was there would be no miscarriages of justice

So you think in those miscarriages they should have lied or not cooperated?
“Reasoning will never make a Man correct an ill Opinion, which by Reasoning he never acquired”.

Offline Mr Gray

Re: Do the sceptics simply misunderstand the evidence
« Reply #1373 on: March 27, 2018, 08:55:57 AM »
So you think in those miscarriages they should have lied or not cooperated?
I think they should have not been convicted...

Offline slartibartfast

Re: Do the sceptics simply misunderstand the evidence
« Reply #1374 on: March 27, 2018, 09:30:30 AM »
I think they should have not been convicted...

You are implying that the truth is not a good approach just because there are miscarriages of justice, though you haven’t shown that in those miscarriages of justice the convicted told the truth.
“Reasoning will never make a Man correct an ill Opinion, which by Reasoning he never acquired”.

Offline Mr Gray

Re: Do the sceptics simply misunderstand the evidence
« Reply #1375 on: March 27, 2018, 09:33:25 AM »
You are implying that the truth is not a good approach just because there are miscarriages of justice, though you haven’t shown that in those miscarriages of justice the convicted told the truth.

I'm not implying that, at all... I'm saying as, a fact innocence is not a cast iron protection against a, miscarriage of justice...

Offline slartibartfast

Re: Do the sceptics simply misunderstand the evidence
« Reply #1376 on: March 27, 2018, 09:36:45 AM »
I'm not implying that, at all... I'm saying as, a fact innocence is not a cast iron protection against a, miscarriage of justice...

Given the small number of miscarriages of justice it has to be the best approach.
“Reasoning will never make a Man correct an ill Opinion, which by Reasoning he never acquired”.

Offline Carana

Re: Do the sceptics simply misunderstand the evidence
« Reply #1377 on: March 27, 2018, 09:43:21 AM »
This is a very good post Carana.  It takes me to thinking why the parents feel offended at the thought their daughter may have died in the apartment - and dismiss the dogs scent. It just makes no sense at all.

Was it offensive that she may have died in the flat (however awful that idea must be), or that they were suspected of being involved?


Offline Mr Gray

Re: Do the sceptics simply misunderstand the evidence
« Reply #1378 on: March 27, 2018, 09:50:44 AM »
Given the small number of miscarriages of justice it has to be the best approach.

It certainly is better to be innocent.... Answering questions  in a, hostile environment  may not be

Offline Carana

Re: Do the sceptics simply misunderstand the evidence
« Reply #1379 on: March 27, 2018, 10:08:02 AM »
A few possibilities:

1. She did die in that flat
1.a and Eddie correctly alerted to her cadaver odour.
1.b  She did die in the flat, and Eddie coincidentally alerted to some irrelevant human decomposition scent.

2. She left the flat alive, and Eddie's alerts were to some irrelevant human decomposition scent

The problem I have is that a) no evidence was found, b) quite apart from the forensics people, etc., the flat had been occupied by 4 lots of people, the last lot leaving just one week prior to the dog inspection, and AFAIK there aren't any witness statements from any of them in the PJ files, c) nowhere is it stated clearly exactly what "items he is trained to find" (cf the car video) actually includes or excludes.

Can it be excluded that he sniffed the scent of a bloody sock or plaster left lying around for a while by one of the post-disappearance occupants prior to removal? The PJ did organise interviews from pre-disappearance occupants, but apparently none of the post- ones? Wouldn't it have been logical to do so?

If scent tends to cling to porous materials... The flat was used for holiday rentals. Did anyone think to turn over the mattress?