Do the sceptics simply misunderstand the evidence

[Mr Gray]

It was ACPO which assessed, tested and licensed Eddie.

U.K., A.C.P.O. licensed and accredited cadaver dogs

Licensing is derived from anecdotal cases and is scenario based conducted over a period of a week, twice annually, it is conducted utilising independent A.C.P.O. authorised assessors.
http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/MARTIN_GRIMES.htm

so its anectdotal and not scientific as you claimed

[Vertigo Swirl]

OK then Ace you tell us how it should be done or does your ability extend merely as far as "only asking questions" ? Which if you will pardon my bluntness adds nothing to debate.

It seems to me that your role on this forum is to antagonise and name call.  For this reason I consider your ripostes unworthy of consideration or further reply.

[Robittybob1]

It seems to me that your role on this forum is to antagonise and name call.  For these reasons I consider your ripostes unworthy of consideration or further reply.

It might seem like that at times but I'd say just try and do the things that Alice asks and see where it takes you.

[misty]

It was ACPO which assessed, tested and licensed Eddie.

U.K., A.C.P.O. licensed and accredited cadaver dogs

Licensing is derived from anecdotal cases and is scenario based conducted over a period of a week, twice annually, it is conducted utilising independent A.C.P.O. authorised assessors.
http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/MARTIN_GRIMES.htm

Here is a link to the ACPO dog training manual, implemented in 2011. Page 116 onward deals with Victim Detection Dogs.
https://www.btp.police.uk/PDF/FOI%20Response%201074-16%20-%20Police%20Dogs%20Manual%20of%20Guidance.pdf

From what I have gleaned, the dogs are not tested by an ACPO assessor for their abilities to detect cadaver odour, only actual cadaver deposits.
Presumably, the training of Eddie on elements of cross contamination & remnant scent falls outside the scope of ACPO accreditation.

[G-Unit]

Here is a link to the ACPO dog training manual, implemented in 2011. Page 116 onward deals with Victim Detection Dogs.
https://www.btp.police.uk/PDF/FOI%20Response%201074-16%20-%20Police%20Dogs%20Manual%20of%20Guidance.pdf

From what I have gleaned, the dogs are not tested by an ACPO assessor for their abilities to detect cadaver odour, only actual cadaver deposits.
Presumably, the training of Eddie on elements of cross contamination & remnant scent falls outside the scope of ACPO accreditation.

Grime's dogs had their own unique tests;


They are tested to units of assessment prepared as a stand-alone system as these dogs are unique. Training records are maintained and are available if required.
http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/MARTIN_GRIMES.htm

[misty]

Grime's dogs had their own unique tests;


They are tested to units of assessment prepared as a stand-alone system as these dogs are unique. Training records are maintained and are available if required.
http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/MARTIN_GRIMES.htm

So who formulated & conducted those unique tests which were outside the scope of ACPO?

[slartibartfast]

So who formulated & conducted those unique tests which were outside the scope of ACPO?

You mean the 2011 manual?

[misty]

You mean the 2011 manual?

No, I mean the stand-alone system for the unique dogs, as claimed by Grime in G-Unit's last post.

[slartibartfast]

No, I mean the stand-alone system for the unique dogs, as claimed by Grime in G-Unit's last post.

Before there was a manual.

[Vertigo Swirl]

So which agency conferred upon Eddie the unique title Enhanced Victim Recovery Dog?  And based on what tests, conducted by whom?

[misty]

Before there was a manual.

You mean there was no manual or criteria on which ACPO tested dogs prior to 2011?

[Alice Purjorick]

So which agency conferred upon Eddie the unique title Enhanced Victim Recovery Dog?  And based on what tests, conducted by whom?

One could incline to the view it is unimportant.
Were it not kosher he would potentially be exposed to action under Section 2 of the Fraud Act 2006.
We can be reasonably confident there was no action in that respect unless you have evidence to the contrary.
Or from another angle should there be a court action the judge will make the appropriate decision about Mr Grime's competence and the dogs training.
Either way us internet punters are not part of the equation.

[Vertigo Swirl]

I'm not sure why there is a belief in some quarter that I am here because I believe my views will help shape a future court action.  I'm simply shooting the breeze.  I thought that's what internet discussions were for?  Nor contrary to insinuation above am I implying that Mr Grime is potentially guilty of the crime of fraud, however I do think my questions are relevant to the case and to the discussion at hand.  Should Mr McCann claim to be an Enhanced Heart Surgeon, one might wonder where and how he came by such a prestigious title, or whether it was just him bigging himself up?

[pathfinder73]

He has additionally trained exclusively using human remains in the U.S.A. in association with the F.B.I. The enhanced training of the dog has also involved the use of collection of 'cadaver scent' odor from human corpses using remote technical equipment which does not contact the subject. This method is comparable to the simulation of cross contamination. It does however differ in that the remote scent samples recovery does not involve subject matter and therefore is a 'pure' scent sample.

I have developed the training of the E.V.R.D. to include the screening of scent pads taken from motor vehicles, property or scenes by a Scent Transference Unit. Operational use of the STU is in a developmental and evaluative stage used in conjunction with selective FBI casework.

http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/MARTIN_GRIMES.htm

[misty]

He has additionally trained exclusively using human remains in the U.S.A. in association with the F.B.I. The enhanced training of the dog has also involved the use of collection of 'cadaver scent' odor from human corpses using remote technical equipment which does not contact the subject. This method is comparable to the simulation of cross contamination. It does however differ in that the remote scent samples recovery does not involve subject matter and therefore is a 'pure' scent sample.

I have developed the training of the E.V.R.D. to include the screening of scent pads taken from motor vehicles, property or scenes by a Scent Transference Unit. Operational use of the STU is in a developmental and evaluative stage used in conjunction with selective FBI casework.

http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/MARTIN_GRIMES.htm

How & by whom was Eddie's competence in those additional fields tested & verified?