Author Topic: Eleven years on, has Maddie been given up for dead?  (Read 3861 times)

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Offline Vertigo Swirl

Re: Eleven years on, has Maddie been given up for dead?
« Reply #30 on: May 23, 2018, 03:53:15 PM »
What rank is Mark Rowley?  Is that higher or lower than DCI Wall?  When he refers to ďweĒ in his interview, is that the royal we, or could he be referring to the team that are working together on Operation Grange?  Is it usual for a small team of police officers working toghether as a team to be pursuing completely different suspects and theories?

Offline Faithlilly

Re: Eleven years on, has Maddie been given up for dead?
« Reply #31 on: May 23, 2018, 04:14:57 PM »
Hang on, YOU introduced what Rowley said, now youíre asking a question to which you already know the answer, deflection!

We interpret what Rowley said differently so is there any need for further discussion or indeed deflection?

Now Redwood fronted all the OG updates up to his retirement from the case and that the DCI in charge of a case informs the public of its progress seems the norm. So why havenít we heard from DCI Wall ? Itís a perfectly acceptable question.
Moral Guilt
Detractors of the work of our British Police in bringing criminals to justice generally ignore the important distinction between moral proof and legal evidence of guilt. In not a few cases that are popularly classed with 'unsolved mysteries of crime,' the offender is known, but evidence is wanting. If, for example, in- a recent murder case of special notoriety and interest,* certain human remains had not been found in a cellar, a great crime would have been catalogued among `Police failures'; and yet, even without the evidence which sent the murderer to the gallows, the moral proof of his guilt would have been full and clear.
Robert Anderson

Offline Vertigo Swirl

Re: Eleven years on, has Maddie been given up for dead?
« Reply #32 on: May 23, 2018, 04:18:41 PM »
We interpret what Rowley said differently so is there any need for further discussion or indeed deflection?

Now Redwood fronted all the OG updates up to his retirement from the case and that the DCI in charge of a case informs the public of its progress seems the norm. So why havenít we heard from DCI Wall ? Itís a perfectly acceptable question.
And one you never tire of asking even though you know itís unanswerable - do you really think Rowley and her are completely at odds about this investigation?  Or that when he says the parents definitely arenít under investigation that means they definitely are?  Seriously??

Offline Faithlilly

Re: Eleven years on, has Maddie been given up for dead?
« Reply #33 on: May 23, 2018, 05:10:19 PM »
And one you never tire of asking even though you know itís unanswerable - do you really think Rowley and her are completely at odds about this investigation?  Or that when he says the parents definitely arenít under investigation that means they definitely are?  Seriously??

If the parents had been under investigation do you think we would have been told?
Moral Guilt
Detractors of the work of our British Police in bringing criminals to justice generally ignore the important distinction between moral proof and legal evidence of guilt. In not a few cases that are popularly classed with 'unsolved mysteries of crime,' the offender is known, but evidence is wanting. If, for example, in- a recent murder case of special notoriety and interest,* certain human remains had not been found in a cellar, a great crime would have been catalogued among `Police failures'; and yet, even without the evidence which sent the murderer to the gallows, the moral proof of his guilt would have been full and clear.
Robert Anderson

Offline pathfinder73

Re: Eleven years on, has Maddie been given up for dead?
« Reply #34 on: May 23, 2018, 05:55:23 PM »
Point of note, you cannot abduct a deceased person.

That doesn't matter at this stage. However she left that apartment she has been abducted.

"In terms of Andy using the word abduction, she was not old enough to set off and start her own life.
However she left that apartment, she has been abducted." MR

« Last Edit: May 23, 2018, 06:01:42 PM by pathfinder73 »
Smithman carrying a child in his arms checked his watch after passing the Smith family and the time was 10:03. Both are still unidentified 10 years later.

Online Angelo222

Re: Eleven years on, has Maddie been given up for dead?
« Reply #35 on: May 23, 2018, 06:06:11 PM »
Nope ... you are wrong.

There was a substantial reward for information leading to Madeleine's safe return on the table ten days after Madeleine disappeared.

Snip
A multi-million pound reward for information leading to the safe return of Madeleine McCann, the British girl who went missing in Portugal 10 days ago, was offered yesterday by a group of leading business figures as her parents spoke of the devastation wreaked by her abduction.
The entrepreneur Sir Richard Branson, the impresario Bill Kenwright and retail tycoon Sir Philip Green were revealed as backers of a £1.5m reward announced by the News of the World newspaper. It means the total reward now on offer stands at a record £2.6m after a businessman and a family friend pledged a total of £1.1m last week.
https://www.theguardian.com/uk/2007/may/13/ameliahill.jamiedoward

That's a completely different matter Brietta, I was taking about the derisory police reward which by the way no longer exists.  Why don't the McCanns put the entire Fund up as a reward for Maddie's return?  Put their money where their mouth is in other words. Or is it a case as I suspect that they have got used to having this magic Fund at their discretion?
« Last Edit: May 23, 2018, 06:08:59 PM by Angelo222 »
De troothe has the annoying habit of coming to the surface just when you least expect it!!

Je ne regrette rien!!

Offline barrier

Re: Eleven years on, has Maddie been given up for dead?
« Reply #36 on: May 23, 2018, 08:46:42 PM »
What rank is Mark Rowley?  Is that higher or lower than DCI Wall?  When he refers to ďweĒ in his interview, is that the royal we, or could he be referring to the team that are working together on Operation Grange?  Is it usual for a small team of police officers working toghether as a team to be pursuing completely different suspects and theories?

Rowley was an assistant commissioner to the MET,Wall is a DCI.
Ah,but I may as well try and catch the wind.

Offline Vertigo Swirl

Re: Eleven years on, has Maddie been given up for dead?
« Reply #37 on: May 23, 2018, 11:16:49 PM »
Rowley was an assistant commissioner to the MET,Wall is a DCI.
which rank is higher?

Online Davel

Re: Eleven years on, has Maddie been given up for dead?
« Reply #38 on: May 24, 2018, 10:03:45 AM »
At least we know that according to the evidence SY believe abduction is possible... Which some posters cannot accept
UNLESS OTHERWISE STATED ALL POSTS ARE MY OPINION

Offline Faithlilly

Re: Eleven years on, has Maddie been given up for dead?
« Reply #39 on: May 24, 2018, 10:28:02 AM »
How do you account for the fact that every known word and action since Redwoodís statement supports the premise that  he Met are treating Madeleineís disappearance as a criminal act by a stranger?

Does it ? How so ?

Apart from any question to Rowley etc whoís answers were guarded what words and actions has there been ?

A search of the mound seemingly for a body......does that prove OG are looking for an abductor ?
Questioning of suspected burglars........do we know what they were made arguidos for ? Perhaps they were questioned to ascertain what they saw that night but may implicate themselves in a criminal offence while doing so.  Likewise the other witnesses. We simply donít know why they were questioned.
The inclusion of the CPS into the mix would suggest that it is a British citizen who is in OG sights.

Moral Guilt
Detractors of the work of our British Police in bringing criminals to justice generally ignore the important distinction between moral proof and legal evidence of guilt. In not a few cases that are popularly classed with 'unsolved mysteries of crime,' the offender is known, but evidence is wanting. If, for example, in- a recent murder case of special notoriety and interest,* certain human remains had not been found in a cellar, a great crime would have been catalogued among `Police failures'; and yet, even without the evidence which sent the murderer to the gallows, the moral proof of his guilt would have been full and clear.
Robert Anderson

Offline Miss Taken Identity

Re: Eleven years on, has Maddie been given up for dead?
« Reply #40 on: May 24, 2018, 10:31:14 AM »
At least we know that according to the evidence SY believe abduction is possible... Which some posters cannot accept

I think you will find some posters have not said it is not 'not possible, they,as do I claim it never happened the way we are told, and we just do not believe their version
...and all things are 'possible', including parental involvement as was suspected by the PJ.
'Never underestimate the power of stupid people'... George Carlin

Offline Vertigo Swirl

Re: Eleven years on, has Maddie been given up for dead?
« Reply #41 on: May 24, 2018, 10:34:55 AM »
Does it ? How so ?

Apart from any question to Rowley etc whoís answers were guarded what words and actions has there been ?

A search of the mound seemingly for a body......does that prove OG are looking for an abductor ?
Questioning of suspected burglars........do we know what they were made arguidos for ? Perhaps they were questioned to ascertain what they saw that night but may implicate themselves in a criminal offence while doing so.  Likewise the other witnesses. We simply donít know why they were questioned.
The inclusion of the CPS into the mix would suggest that it is a British citizen who is in OG sights.
Iím afraid you appear to be in denial.  Yes, every utterance by the Met in interviews, every word written on the Op Grange page on the website, every action taken, following up cases of sex abuse in the Algarve, investigating other known sex attackers, Crimewatch,  etc points to the fact that the Met are treating this as a criminal act by a stranger.

Offline kizzy

Re: Eleven years on, has Maddie been given up for dead?
« Reply #42 on: May 24, 2018, 11:13:13 AM »
Nope ... you are wrong.

There was a substantial reward for information leading to Madeleine's safe return on the table ten days after Madeleine disappeared.

Snip
A multi-million pound reward for information leading to the safe return of Madeleine McCann, the British girl who went missing in Portugal 10 days ago, was offered yesterday by a group of leading business figures as her parents spoke of the devastation wreaked by her abduction.
The entrepreneur Sir Richard Branson, the impresario Bill Kenwright and retail tycoon Sir Philip Green were revealed as backers of a £1.5m reward announced by the News of the World newspaper. It means the total reward now on offer stands at a record £2.6m after a businessman and a family friend pledged a total of £1.1m last week.
https://www.theguardian.com/uk/2007/may/13/ameliahill.jamiedoward


Nope ur wrong.





http://miscarriageofjustice.co/index.php?topic=4017.0

The UK CrimeStoppers organisation is currently offering a reward of up to £20,000 for information leading to the identification, arrest and prosecution of the person or persons responsible for the abduction of Madeleine McCann from Praia da Luz.

Surprising isn't it that there is no reward currently in place for the Safe Return Of Madeleine McCann!
POSTS ARE -  MY OWN OPINION

Offline Alice Purjorick

Re: Eleven years on, has Maddie been given up for dead?
« Reply #43 on: May 24, 2018, 12:48:55 PM »
Here we are eleven years on from the night that Madeleine McCann mysteriously disappeared from her parents holiday apartment in Praia da Luz on the Algarve and for once the entire case appears to be waning.  No public statement from her parents this anniversary and nothing of interest from either the Portuguese or English police.  Not even an explanation as to how they managed to spend over eleven million quid allegedly looking for the child and still come up with nothing.

Has the time come to put the case to bed?

As I see it until the Portuguese find, prosecute and convict a perpetrator for a crime against MBM it will remain "open" in Portugal the same way unsolved cases remain "open" in UK.
Unless The Met has evidence of a crime being committed in its bailiwick it will find it hard to justify doing anything the Portuguese aren't[emotional outbursts notwihstanding]. Not least of the reasons being the Met's lack of jurisdiction in Portugal.

Beyond that the press will, imo,view it as: "does this remain a public or human interest story that will sell copy tomorrow".

Until the fate of MBM is determined or until the outcome of the McCann's application to the ECtHR is known what's in it for the MSM ?. Particularly as the Met's spokesman has said they print mostly nonsense on the subject.

Look at the options.
1)Dead
2)Living with a loving caring well heeled family who had her snatched to order.
3)Living off her wits like alot of adolescents the world over.
whatever, the cute little girl with tennis balls that sold stories is long gone.
The thing has /is slowly finishing itself off. imo
« Last Edit: May 24, 2018, 12:51:51 PM by Alice Purjorick »
It's okay to reinvent the wheel, but only when you understand how the current wheel works.

Offline barrier

Re: Eleven years on, has Maddie been given up for dead?
« Reply #44 on: May 24, 2018, 08:33:01 PM »


So back to my opening post, has Maddie been given up for dead?

Well the digs back in 2014 didn't look as if they were looking for a live child,so in all probability yes.
Ah,but I may as well try and catch the wind.