THE ALIBI.

[faithlilly]

I think he either had the bomber Jacket on underneath the parka, hid the parka in the woodland between 1740-1800 (i.e. between the f&w sighting & the pushbike boys trio sighting or the mo&dh sighting). I think, before he left to meet Jodi, he looked at the overcast weather and put the parka on top of the bomber just in case it rained (this could also explain why the parka looked, according to AB, bulging at the pocket). If this was the case, he may have started panicking whilst on the N’battle rd, as the parka was probably slightly blood-stained (not heavily blood-stained, not enough blood for passers-by to notice), but he couldn’t take any chances because there were still traces of blood on it. He knew at that point he had to get rid of it (and he knew also that someone might have seen him over on Easthouses with it on — two wrongs don’t make a right; very incriminating for him and he knew it). Ideally, Luke would have been hoping no one had seen him at that time on the N’battle rd, but they did, so he had to act cool and unflustered (casually hanging onto the gate, but he was looking angry and peeved underneath his hair, not making eye contact with people in the passing cars, instead staring at the ground). So, what he did next was one of two possibilities: he either started panicking and hid the jacket somewhere in the woodland at the Eskbank river, cleaned up slightly there at the river (and, no, it’s not ridiculous to suggest this, as Luke was the outdoor David Crockett type and had already been exposed to camping, hunting, the cadets, survival, etc, at an early age). Or else he went home very quickly, just after 1740 (just after the F & W sighting), gave Corrine the parka to destroy, and then was back on the N’battle rd for 1800 (for the pushbike trio’s two sightings, the couple sighting (mo & DH) and the Scottish executive employee sighting). Luke also knew that people seeing him in the bomber jacket on the N’battle rd would work in his favour, especially as it was not bloodstained and he had worn it to school that day, and, more importantly, it would throw a spanner in the works in terms of eyewitness evidence (I believe Luke was already thinking about this and wanted to be seen at this point with it on — this was the start of the alibi being set in motion).

Regardless of what happened to the parka (and he did own a parka before the 30.06.03 ... a teacher, friends and school friends all testified to this in court), I think he definitely went home between 1830-1930, before he met up with his mates in the abbey. I think he told his mum all of what happened, took a shower and changed all his clothes and footwear (though, I am surprised no neighbours saw him going home at this time, even if he did go home via the Eskbank river route ... perhaps he got lucky, and of course the Mitchell house was well covered at the front with plants, bushes, trees and climbing ivy). Remember, Luke said he was on the N’battle rd for about 2 hours waiting on Jodi, and yet there was not one single solitary sighting of him on this road between 1830-1930. Very peculiar, especially as this was during the height of summer and at a time when the road would have been particularly busy with traffic, walkers and joggers. Also significant was the words of one of his mates who said that Luke was more kempt than normal that evening (anyone have the article containing this mate’s account? I read it a few months back, but haven’t been able to find it again).

So, basically, Luke hid twice on the N’battle rd. Firstly just after 1740 until 1800. And secondly between 1830-1930. He got rid of that parka after the f&w sighting (he knew, though trying to act cool on the gate, he was panicking and looking at the ground, looking pissed off and angry and therefore also looking suspicious; he knew this, was aware of looking suspicious, so had to dispose of this slightly blood-stained jacket, not only because it contained incriminating dna evidence, but also to nullify eyewitness evidence; changing jackets or appearing with another jacket on soon after the f&w sighting would be an effective way to achieve this. Notice how, despite it being the height of summer and a particularly busy road at a time when the volume of traffic would’ve been heavy, there was not one sighting of Luke. It’s very strange, imo.

Teachers, friends and school friends all testified in court? Do you have a cite?

[faithlilly]

I don't remember the cite now but whether they were read out or not, CM didn't deny that LM had a parka. She said she wasn't aware he had a parka.

Any newspaper report will do. The parka was one of the main planks of the prosecution case so the witness testimony to Luke owning such a garment must have been widely reported.

[rulesapply]

Any newspaper report will do. The parka was one of the main planks of the prosecution case so the witness testimony to Luke owning such a garment must have been widely reported.

No. Not 3 days after Jodi's murder and the police weren't interested in the new parka. They were looking for the old one. The parka that disappeared.

[Mr Apples]

I believe that's all very possible or someone helped him. Two witnesses said in court that the male wearing a green bomber jacket on Newbattle Road was definitely not LM so who could the male in the green bomber jacket have been at that point in time? Then, LM shows up wearing a green bomber jacket. Positively identified.

The reason why they said it definitely wasn’t Luke in the green bomber jacket, imo, was because Luke had changed considerably by the time the trial came around. He looked like a completely different person by the time the trial came around (owed to puberty and stress; Luke was obviously still growing and developing at that age, and of course the stress of the whole ordeal obviously contributed to his change of appearance .... he also had a lot longer hair at trial and it was in a ponytail). The 3 guys on the pushbikes who knew Luke positively identified him on the N’battle rd wearing the green bomber jacket. They also identified him at court. AB said she was as sure as she could be that it was Luke she saw  on Easthouses path, but she too, like the couple mo & dh, couldn’t identify him at court. Like I said, Luke had drastically changed in appearance between June ‘03 & the end of ‘04.

[faithlilly]

I think he either had the bomber Jacket on underneath the parka, hid the parka in the woodland between 1740-1800 (i.e. between the f&w sighting & the pushbike boys trio sighting or the mo&dh sighting). I think, before he left to meet Jodi, he looked at the overcast weather and put the parka on top of the bomber just in case it rained (this could also explain why the parka looked, according to AB, bulging at the pocket). If this was the case, he may have started panicking whilst on the N’battle rd, as the parka was probably slightly blood-stained (not heavily blood-stained, not enough blood for passers-by to notice), but he couldn’t take any chances because there were still traces of blood on it. He knew at that point he had to get rid of it (and he knew also that someone might have seen him over on Easthouses with it on — two wrongs don’t make a right; very incriminating for him and he knew it). Ideally, Luke would have been hoping no one had seen him at that time on the N’battle rd, but they did, so he had to act cool and unflustered (casually hanging onto the gate, but he was looking angry and peeved underneath his hair, not making eye contact with people in the passing cars, instead staring at the ground). So, what he did next was one of two possibilities: he either started panicking and hid the jacket somewhere in the woodland at the Eskbank river, cleaned up slightly there at the river (and, no, it’s not ridiculous to suggest this, as Luke was the outdoor David Crockett type and had already been exposed to camping, hunting, the cadets, survival, etc, at an early age). Or else he went home very quickly, just after 1740 (just after the F & W sighting), gave Corrine the parka to destroy, and then was back on the N’battle rd for 1800 (for the pushbike trio’s two sightings, the couple sighting (mo & DH) and the Scottish executive employee sighting). Luke also knew that people seeing him in the bomber jacket on the N’battle rd would work in his favour, especially as it was not bloodstained and he had worn it to school that day, and, more importantly, it would throw a spanner in the works in terms of eyewitness evidence (I believe Luke was already thinking about this and wanted to be seen at this point with it on — this was the start of the alibi being set in motion).

Regardless of what happened to the parka (and he did own a parka before the 30.06.03 ... a teacher, friends and school friends all testified to this in court), I think he definitely went home between 1830-1930, before he met up with his mates in the abbey. I think he told his mum all of what happened, took a shower and changed all his clothes and footwear (though, I am surprised no neighbours saw him going home at this time, even if he did go home via the Eskbank river route ... perhaps he got lucky, and of course the Mitchell house was well covered at the front with plants, bushes, trees and climbing ivy). Remember, Luke said he was on the N’battle rd for about 2 hours waiting on Jodi, and yet there was not one single solitary sighting of him on this road between 1830-1930. Very peculiar, especially as this was during the height of summer and at a time when the road would have been particularly busy with traffic, walkers and joggers. Also significant was the words of one of his mates who said that Luke was more kempt than normal that evening (anyone have the article containing this mate’s account? I read it a few months back, but haven’t been able to find it again).

So, basically, Luke hid twice on the N’battle rd. Firstly just after 1740 until 1800. And secondly between 1830-1930. He got rid of that parka after the f&w sighting (he knew, though trying to act cool on the gate, he was panicking and looking at the ground, looking pissed off and angry and therefore also looking suspicious; he knew this, was aware of looking suspicious, so had to dispose of this slightly blood-stained jacket, not only because it contained incriminating dna evidence, but also to nullify eyewitness evidence; changing jackets or appearing with another jacket on soon after the f&w sighting would be an effective way to achieve this. Notice how, despite it being the height of summer and a particularly busy road at a time when the volume of traffic would’ve been heavy, there was not one sighting of Luke. It’s very strange, imo.

Yet there is not a scintilla of evidence for any of the above and I’m afraid that’s the only thing that matters.

With the greatest respect your posts always read as if you are trying to manufacture evidence to justify your faith in the guilty verdict rather than actually going where the actual evidence leads.

[Mr Apples]

I think he either had the bomber Jacket on underneath the parka, hid the parka in the woodland between 1740-1800 (i.e. between the f&w sighting & the pushbike boys trio sighting or the mo&dh sighting). I think, before he left to meet Jodi, he looked at the overcast weather and put the parka on top of the bomber just in case it rained (this could also explain why the parka looked, according to AB, bulging at the pocket). If this was the case, he may have started panicking whilst on the N’battle rd, as the parka was probably slightly blood-stained (not heavily blood-stained, not enough blood for passers-by to notice), but he couldn’t take any chances because there were still traces of blood on it. He knew at that point he had to get rid of it (and he knew also that someone might have seen him over on Easthouses with it on — two wrongs don’t make a right; very incriminating for him and he knew it). Ideally, Luke would have been hoping no one had seen him at that time on the N’battle rd, but they did, so he had to act cool and unflustered (casually hanging onto the gate, but he was looking angry and peeved underneath his hair, not making eye contact with people in the passing cars, instead staring at the ground). So, what he did next was one of two possibilities: he either started panicking and hid the jacket somewhere in the woodland at the Eskbank river, cleaned up slightly there at the river (and, no, it’s not ridiculous to suggest this, as Luke was the outdoor David Crockett type and had already been exposed to camping, hunting, the cadets, survival, etc, at an early age). Or else he went home very quickly, just after 1740 (just after the F & W sighting), gave Corrine the parka to destroy, and then was back on the N’battle rd for 1800 (for the pushbike trio’s two sightings, the couple sighting (mo & DH) and the Scottish executive employee sighting). Luke also knew that people seeing him in the bomber jacket on the N’battle rd would work in his favour, especially as it was not bloodstained and he had worn it to school that day, and, more importantly, it would throw a spanner in the works in terms of eyewitness evidence (I believe Luke was already thinking about this and wanted to be seen at this point with it on — this was the start of the alibi being set in motion).

Regardless of what happened to the parka (and he did own a parka before the 30.06.03 ... a teacher, friends and school friends all testified to this in court), I think he definitely went home between 1830-1930, before he met up with his mates in the abbey. I think he told his mum all of what happened, took a shower and changed all his clothes and footwear (though, I am surprised no neighbours saw him going home at this time, even if he did go home via the Eskbank river route ... perhaps he got lucky, and of course the Mitchell house was well covered at the front with plants, bushes, trees and climbing ivy). Remember, Luke said he was on the N’battle rd for about 2 hours waiting on Jodi, and yet there was not one single solitary sighting of him on this road between 1830-1930. Very peculiar, especially as this was during the height of summer and at a time when the road would have been particularly busy with traffic, walkers and joggers. Also significant was the words of one of his mates who said that Luke was more kempt than normal that evening (anyone have the article containing this mate’s account? I read it a few months back, but haven’t been able to find it again).

So, basically, Luke hid twice on the N’battle rd. Firstly just after 1740 until 1800. And secondly between 1830-1930. He got rid of that parka after the f&w sighting (he knew, though trying to act cool on the gate, he was panicking and looking at the ground, looking pissed off and angry and therefore also looking suspicious; he knew this, was aware of looking suspicious, so had to dispose of this slightly blood-stained jacket, not only because it contained incriminating dna evidence, but also to nullify eyewitness evidence; changing jackets or appearing with another jacket on soon after the f&w sighting would be an effective way to achieve this. Notice how, despite it being the height of summer and a particularly busy road at a time when the volume of traffic would’ve been heavy, despite Luke saying he was on this road between 1730-1930, there was not one sighting of Luke between 1740-1800 and 1830-1930. It’s very strange, imo.

[faithlilly]

No. Not 3 days after Jodi's murder and the police weren't interested in the new parka. They were looking for the old one. The parka that disappeared.

But the prosecution were so where is the reports of the witness testimony of those who saw Luke wearing the parka before the murder?

It does strike me that it would have been rather foolish for Luke to deny that he owned a parka if he had worn it as often as we are lead to believe not least to school. Surely if he was as cunning as some believe he would have known how suspicious that that looked?

[faithlilly]

The reason why they said it definitely wasn’t Luke in the green bomber jacket, imo, was because Luke had changed considerably by the time the trial came around. He looked like a completely different person by the time the trial came around (owed to puberty and stress; Luke was obviously still growing and developing at that age, and of course the stress of the whole ordeal obviously contributed to his change of appearance .... he also had a lot longer hair at trial and it was in a ponytail). The 3 guys on the pushbikes who knew Luke positively identified him on the N’battle rd wearing the green bomber jacket. They also identified him at court. AB said she was as sure as she could be that it was Luke she saw  on Easthouses path, but she too, like the couple mo & dh, couldn’t identify him at court. Like I said, Luke had drastically changed in appearance between June ‘03 & the end of ‘04.

He looked completely different yet RW and her passenger managed, without any hesitation, to point him out in court. Who does that work then?

[rulesapply]

The reason why they said it definitely wasn’t Luke in the green bomber jacket, imo, was because Luke had changed considerably by the time the trial came around. He looked like a completely different person by the time the trial came around (owed to puberty and stress; Luke was obviously still growing and developing at that age, and of course the stress of the whole ordeal obviously contributed to his change of appearance .... he also had a lot longer hair at trial and it was in a ponytail). The 3 guys on the pushbikes who knew Luke positively identified him on the N’battle rd wearing the green bomber jacket. They also identified him at court. AB said she was as sure as she could be that it was Luke she saw  on Easthouses path, but she too, like the couple mo & dh, couldn’t identify him at court. Like I said, Luke had drastically changed in appearance between June ‘03 & the end of ‘04.

You may well be right. Luke's physical development is the reason I think Andrina Bryson said in court, when asked if she recognised the male at the path, I can't say. I do believe LM had help though whoever that may have come from.

[faithlilly]

You may well be right. Luke's physical development is the reason I think Andrina Bryson said in court, when asked if she recognised the male at the path, I can't say. I do believe LM had help though whoever that may have come from.

Yet RW and her passenger managed to identify him. Surely he couldn’t have changed that much?

[rulesapply]

He looked completely different yet RW and her passenger managed, without any hesitation, to point him out in court. Who does that work then?

How do the perceptions of any individuals work? Are you suggesting that because one person couldn't positively point LM out that no one else should have been able to?

[rulesapply]

Yet RW and her passenger managed to identify him. Surely he couldn’t have changed that much?

Yet, SL has often argued that the two ladies in the car saw someone else and not LM.

[faithlilly]

How do the perceptions of any individuals work? Are you suggesting that because one person couldn't positively point LM out that no one else should have been able to?

I’m pointing out that two people who claimed that they had seen Luke on the night of the 30th managed to identify Luke in court so he must still have been recognisable as the youth that they saw. It’s not about perceptions but visual recognition.

[faithlilly]

Yet, SL has often argued that the two ladies in the car saw someone else and not LM.

But you don’t believe that so the question still remains.

[rulesapply]

I’m pointing out that two people who claimed that they had seen Luke on the night of the 30th managed to identify Luke in court so he must still have been recognisable as the youth that they saw. It’s not about perceptions but visual recognition.

What's the difference? Because two people who didn't know him but still recognised him, others should be able to too? People don't work like that.