Author Topic: The less talked about sighting on N’battle Rd by M O’Sullivan & D Hamilton...  (Read 34568 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline Nicholas

The problem I have with Parky41’s theory is Luke being able to surreptitiously get back in the house without being seen — even if he was using the erskbank (sp?) river path route. I had a look on google earth and, contrary to what Parky41 said, this isn’t a route directly to Luke’s front door and nor would it take 2 mins to reach his house once he emerged from the woodland area; it would be more like 5-10 minutes (even when running). Furthermore, even though he would be off the main road, I doubt Luke would not have been seen by his neighbours or someone in the adjacent houses from the adjacent streets in that housing scheme where he lived at the time.

I suppose there’s the possibility that Luke could’ve hid the parka jacket somewhere (away from the locus — perhaps somewhere west at the erskbank river path after the F & W sighting) and went back later that night between 2130-2230 and collected it or collected it in the next couple of days before the FLO was appointed and then disposed of it by whatever means. The reason I say disposed of the jacket after the f & w sighting is because MO & DH & boys who knew Luke all said he was wearing a bomber jacket and not a parka when they all saw him on Newbattle Road rd between 1745 and 1815.

Btw, who said that Luke was looking ‘cleaner than normal’ during 1900 hrs and 2130 that fateful night? Parky41 said this in one of his posts.

Sandra Lean had those timing at 5.45pm ‘and again some 10 minutes later’ - making it 5.55pm

⬇️

Luke was positively identified, by some school boys who knew him, sitting on a wall at the end of his street in Newbattle, at approximately 5.45pm, and again some ten minutes later

(Source: ‘No Smoke’ p.85)
« Last Edit: May 08, 2021, 11:24:19 PM by Nicholas »
Who wants to take on this great massive lie?” Writer Martin Preib on the tsunami of innocence fraud sweeping our nation

Offline faithlilly

The problem I have with Parky41’s theory is Luke being able to surreptitiously get back in the house without being seen — even if he was using the erskbank (sp?) river path route. I had a look on google earth and, contrary to what Parky41 said, this isn’t a route directly to Luke’s front door and nor would it take 2 mins to reach his house once he emerged from the woodland area; it would be more like 5-10 minutes (even when running). Furthermore, even though he would be off the main road, I doubt Luke would not have been seen by his neighbours or someone in the adjacent houses from the adjacent streets in that housing scheme where he lived at the time.

I suppose there’s the possibility that Luke could’ve hid the parka jacket somewhere (away from the locus — perhaps somewhere west at the erskbank river path after the F & W sighting) and went back later that night between 2130-2230 and collected it or collected it in the next couple of days before the FLO was appointed and then disposed of it by whatever means. The reason I say disposed of the jacket after the f & w sighting is because MO & DH & boys who knew Luke all said he was wearing a bomber jacket and not a parka when they all saw him on Newbattle Road rd between 1745 and 1815.

Btw, who said that Luke was looking ‘cleaner than normal’ during 1900 hrs and 2130 that fateful night? Parky41 said this in one of his posts.

It’s funny you bring Luke’s route back to his house up. I was just looking at google earth myself tonight and as you say although the woodland may have concealed Luke some of the way he would have to have broken cover at some point to get to his house which is surrounded by other houses.

As to the RW and LF sighting, neither in their statements claimed categorically that the youth had a parka on, the jacket was simply green and the same length as a parka. Further if Luke knew that the parka might incriminate him why did he stand, nonchalantly, at a gate by a busy road with it on for the whole world to see? Which raises yet another question..why didn’t anyone but RW and LF report seeing him, on that busy road at one of it’s busiest times?

The only time I’ve heard the ‘cleaner than normal’ claim is from Parky. I believe he/she thinks Luke washed himself after the murder but got dirty mucking about with his mates in the Abbey. This, I believe, explains why there was dirt found on his body and in his hair when he was forensically examined. Of course he could make his hair dirty again but it was also greasy. I wonder how he managed that in less than 8 hours?
Brietta posted on 10/04/2022 “But whether or not that is the reason behind the delay I am certain that Brueckner's trial is going to take place.”

Let’s count the months, shall we?

Offline Nicholas

It’s funny you bring Luke’s route back to his house up. I was just looking at google earth myself tonight and as you say although the woodland may have concealed Luke some of the way he would have to have broken cover at some point to get to his house which is surrounded by other houses.

As to the RW and LF sighting, neither in their statements claimed categorically that the youth had a parka on, the jacket was simply green and the same length as a parka. Further if Luke knew that the parka might incriminate him why did he stand, nonchalantly, at a gate by a busy road with it on for the whole world to see? Which raises yet another question..why didn’t anyone but RW and LF report seeing him, on that busy road at one of it’s busiest times?


Was Parky being sarky
Who wants to take on this great massive lie?” Writer Martin Preib on the tsunami of innocence fraud sweeping our nation

Offline William Wallace

Jodi Jones's horrible death was not invented to sell newspapers.  Nor was the police investigation into her death which resulted in the emergence of a prime suspect or the subsequent trial by jury invented to sell newspapers.

There are indeed one or two posters here intent on "forcing their own agenda down other people's throats" - I suggest you give consideration to that observation and analyse your posts before pressing the 'post' button not after.

I don't have an agenda. I have merely exposed gaping holes in the case against Mitchell. I even created a thread with 12 points needing explained by people who persist in saying he did it. I'm still waiting on credible explanations after about 2 weeks. Why would that be? Answer - there are no credible explanations for any of the 12. The fairy stories about Manson and clothes being burnt were fed to the media by the Police. Those stories were printed to sell newspapers even although there was no proof they were true. Did the media ask the Police what proof they had? They probably did, but received none but printed it anyway. So yes, those fairy stories WERE printed to sell newspapers.
« Last Edit: May 08, 2021, 11:49:12 PM by William Wallace »

Offline Nicholas

I have merely exposed gaping holes in the case against Mitchell.

Post the full trial transcripts of the case against Mitchell - all 42 days worth - and then we can all be the judge as to whether or not there are ‘gaping holes”
Who wants to take on this great massive lie?” Writer Martin Preib on the tsunami of innocence fraud sweeping our nation

Offline Nicholas

I don't have an agenda. I have merely exposed gaping holes in the case against Mitchell. I even created a thread with 12 points needing explained by people who persist in saying he did it. I'm still waiting on credible explanations after about 2 weeks. Why would that be? Answer - there are no credible explanations for any of the 12. The fairy stories about Manson and clothes being burnt were fed to the media by the Police. Those stories were printed to sell newspapers even although there was no proof they were true. Did the media ask the Police what proof they had? They probably did, but received none but printed it anyway. So yes, those fairy stories WERE printed to sell newspapers.

The police made it clear it wasn’t a ritualistic murder

July 2003
DETECTIVES today ruled out a link with Satanism or black magic in the hunt for the killer of murdered schoolgirl Jodi Jones. https://www.scotsman.com/news/jodi-murder-police-rule-out-ritual-killing-2508436

That was possibly after they consulted with Richard Hoskins

According to Richard Hoskins, Craig Dobbie consulted with him in order to help him understand why Luke Mitchell murdered [Name removed].

"Whilst working at Bath Spa University, Richard Hoskins was called upon by the Metropolitan Police Service to work as an expert witness in the Torso in the Thames case.[2] He has since been called as an expert witness in over a hundred criminal cases, including numerous high-profile murders, such as those of Victoria Climbié,[4] Jodi Jones and the Eric Bikubi and Magalie Bamu case.[5][6][7][8] Hoskins has been called upon to provide commentary on these cases and the related field by numerous press organisations.[9][10][11][12][13] He is an expert on African religions.[14][15][16][17][18][19][20] He is the only registered multi-cultural expert on the UK national police SOCA database.[2][21][22][23] https://ipfs.io/ipfs/QmXoypizjW3WknFiJnKLwHCnL72vedxjQkDDP1mXWo6uco/wiki/Richard_Hoskins.html

He claims to have been profoundly affected by the [Name removed]'s case
https://books.google.co.uk/books?id=DyyAmjhB-koC&pg=PT207&lpg=PT207&dq=richard+hoskins+jodi+jones+murder&source=bl&ots=hsAyk5XLGi&sig=Hvf223lApZ2GelCI_ezF_sbyWaw&hl=en&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwiA6ZSLw87dAhVBCuwKHVG1DWkQ6AEwAnoECAkQAQ#v=onepage&q=richard%20hoskins%20jodi%20jones%20murder&f=false
« Last Edit: May 09, 2021, 12:00:52 AM by Nicholas »
Who wants to take on this great massive lie?” Writer Martin Preib on the tsunami of innocence fraud sweeping our nation

Offline William Wallace

Post the full trial transcripts of the case against Mitchell - all 42 days worth - and then we can all be the judge as to whether or not there are ‘gaping holes”

It's not my job to post them, but as you say, if someone did.... "then we can all judge".  Until someone does, we are stuck with those that say he did it and those who will pick gaping holes in the case against him.

Offline William Wallace

The police made it clear it wasn’t a ritualistic murder

They did, but who fed the media with stories that Mitchell was a Satanist and a fan of Manson? They did.

Offline Paranoid Android

I have merely exposed gaping holes in the case against Mitchell.

No you haven't - you listed 12 points that everyone already knew about.

Offline Nicholas

They did, but who fed the media with stories that Mitchell was a Satanist and a fan of Manson? They did.

Maybe it was some of the same people who are now campaigning for his release?
Who wants to take on this great massive lie?” Writer Martin Preib on the tsunami of innocence fraud sweeping our nation

Offline Nicholas

The police made it clear it wasn’t a ritualistic murder

July 2003
DETECTIVES today ruled out a link with Satanism or black magic in the hunt for the killer of murdered schoolgirl Jodi Jones. https://www.scotsman.com/news/jodi-murder-police-rule-out-ritual-killing-2508436

That was possibly after they consulted with Richard Hoskins

Richard Hoskins stated,

The Jodi Jones case affected me profoundly and I began to think about turning away from this wrenching line of work altogether’

Who wants to take on this great massive lie?” Writer Martin Preib on the tsunami of innocence fraud sweeping our nation

Offline Nicholas

Sandra Lean states,

‘Luke was positively identified, by some school boys who knew him, sitting on a wall at the end of his street in Newbattle, at approximately 5.45pm, and again some ten minutes later

(Source: ‘No Smoke’ p.85)

Corrine Mitchell - April 2010
oh dear! You have no intentions of reading "No Smoke"........what is your problem with Sandra Lean....every single one of your posts slate her.
She didn't write a novel....Everything in the book is from documents,statements, court hearings etc.etc.


Corrine Mitchell - April 2010
"No smoke"....well I'm not reading the same reviews as you then!The reviews I read were excellent and complimentary. It also comes recommended by the c.c.r.c.!......cant get much higher than that then!


Sandra received an e~mail from a female saying the c.c.r.c. had recommended her book and could she get a copy.

https://www.tapatalk.com/groups/shirleymckie/luke-mitchell-postings-now-archived-see-new-thread-t398-s250.html
« Last Edit: May 09, 2021, 01:08:20 AM by Nicholas »
Who wants to take on this great massive lie?” Writer Martin Preib on the tsunami of innocence fraud sweeping our nation

Offline Nicholas

Corrine Mitchell - April 2010
oh dear! You have no intentions of reading "No Smoke"........what is your problem with Sandra Lean....every single one of your posts slate her.
She didn't write a novel....Everything in the book is from documents,statements, court hearings etc.etc.


Corrine Mitchell - April 2010
"No smoke"....well I'm not reading the same reviews as you then!The reviews I read were excellent and complimentary. It also comes recommended by the c.c.r.c.!......cant get much higher than that then!


Sandra received an e~mail from a female saying the c.c.r.c. had recommended her book and could she get a copy.

https://www.tapatalk.com/groups/shirleymckie/luke-mitchell-postings-now-archived-see-new-thread-t398-s250.html

Stephen T Manning stated (https://www.ipetitions.com/petition/free-innocent-prisoner-stephen-manning)

Hi Folks - as the publisher of Ms Sandra Lean's book - 'No Smoke: The Shocking Truth About British Justice' - I thought I should help clarify a couple of points of possible misinformation here.

I wish to make it clear that I do not wish to cause any offence, nor am I qualified to comment on the intricacies of any of the seven cases covered in Ms Lean's book, but I do think the following facts need to be stated for the record.

Firstly, 'No Smoke' (2nd edition) was published by CheckPoint Press under our 'Traditional Contract' terms. This means that the manuscript qualified for publication 'on merit' [for content, theme, and quality of writing]. Ms Lean did NOT pay us anything towards the costs of publication. Therefore, her book cannot be described as either 'self-published' or 'vanity publishing'. (Please see this link for a sample 'look inside' of the book, and judge the quality for yourself).

http://checkpointpress.com/NS28pageSample.pdf

Secondly, although admittedly not our current bestseller, 'No Smoke' not only continues to sell in steady numbers, but has also received many glowing reviews from respectable sources. (Please see link below for some examples).

http://checkpointpress.com/NSNewTitleIn ... eviews.pdf

Thirdly, and given the central theme of 'No Smoke' is to expose the many flaws and weaknesses in the British Justice System, I believe it is somewhat inappropriate to target Ms Lean or her work based on anyone's own (arguably subjective) opinion of any specific case covered in the book. Ms Lean has invested literally years of her life, unpaid, in direct support of many of the victims of these miscarriages of justice, and for that I believe she deserves our respect and admiration.     

Whatever one's views of any specific case covered in the book, the overall message of 'No Smoke' is that many innocent people fall afoul of a highly dysfunctional justice system. Those who have been brought together by such calamities in their own lives, should surely be working together in this cause - and not finding reasons to criticise other activists? I personally believe that 'No Smoke' is a courageous and insightful piece of research that does much to raise general awareness amongst the public - and gives specific support to the seven cases covered in the book. 

Ms Lean has made this her life's work, and is currently working on a doctorate in the area of criminal justice, after gaining which, she will surely be a more powerful advocate for reform. May I respectfully suggest therefore, that it is our support and gratitude we need to be expressing to her - not unhelpful criticisms.

Thank you for allowing me to post this comment here.

I sincerely hope those who have been betrayed by the justice system eventually find some peace in their endeavours..

Kind regards to all

Stephen
CheckPoint Press
'Books With Something To Say'



Corrine Mitchell
to stephen@checkpoint press

WOW! on behalf of Sandra Lean, myself (Luke Mitchells mum) and the rest of the people she has helped with her book......a big THANK YOU xx

........maybe that will make a couple of certain people re~think their comments!!!!!

« Last Edit: May 09, 2021, 01:16:43 AM by Nicholas »
Who wants to take on this great massive lie?” Writer Martin Preib on the tsunami of innocence fraud sweeping our nation

Offline Nicholas

Corrine Mitchell - April 2010
oh dear! You have no intentions of reading "No Smoke"........what is your problem with Sandra Lean....every single one of your posts slate her.
She didn't write a novel....Everything in the book is from documents,statements, court hearings etc.etc.


Corrine Mitchell - April 2010
"No smoke"....well I'm not reading the same reviews as you then!The reviews I read were excellent and complimentary. It also comes recommended by the c.c.r.c.!......cant get much higher than that then!


Sandra received an e~mail from a female saying the c.c.r.c. had recommended her book and could she get a copy.

https://www.tapatalk.com/groups/shirleymckie/luke-mitchell-postings-now-archived-see-new-thread-t398-s250.html

Well I have contacted the CCRC and they do not recommend it.

I asked: "Could you please tell me if CCRC recommends a book named No Smoke by Sandra Lean to its clients?"

The reply was

The answer to your question is no, the Commission does not recommend this book to its applicants.

Justin Hawkins

Head of Communication

Criminal Cases Review Commission

https://www.tapatalk.com/groups/shirleymckie/luke-mitchell-postings-now-archived-see-new-thread-t398-s260.html


Corrine Mitchell
to con
...................maybe it was the Sccrc..........whatever! did you not read the post from checkpoint press.....LET IT GO!



No I will not let out and out lies go.  I will check with the SCCRC also. It is a  gross misrepresentation to tell people something is endorsed by official bodies when it is not.

William (Wullie) Neck
If it helps readers Jigsawman is Sandra Lean, Wonder if she recalls how many people she told this to.
« Last Edit: May 09, 2021, 10:24:40 AM by Nicholas »
Who wants to take on this great massive lie?” Writer Martin Preib on the tsunami of innocence fraud sweeping our nation

Offline William Wallace

Don't you ever stop to wonder why witnesses who have testified under oath are all liars if their testimony fails to agree with your narrative.

There are independent witnesses to the fact that Mitchell owned a parka which was exactly the same as the replacement bought by his mother after Jodi's murder.

At least you have moved on from denial that the log burner was - as witnesses testified - in use the night Jodi was murdered, I suppose that is something.

Testified what? Nobody saw clothes being burnt. There's no proof he owned a a parka. Same as there's no proof of hanging dogs from front doors or being a Satanist. It was all just made up by the Police and drip fed to the media.