Author Topic: Is DR Sandra Lean a credible source?  (Read 62122 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline Parky41

Re: Is DR Sandra Lean a credible source?
« Reply #225 on: May 17, 2021, 04:28:39 PM »
Credible source? - Of what exactly? For the Mitchells for that is the basis of all is it not? - Ms Lean holds the defence case files, she has never had access to everything. She has simply taken what DF put together and added to it. This has never been the true story of the murder of Jodi Jones, not in the slightest. Where Ms Lean makes claim to "examine the truth buried in those case files" - absolute nonsense. "disclosing for the first time, evidence of manipulating witnesses, forensic failings, crime scene contamination, dishonesty and more" "with reference to all the evidence"

Where to start? - "with reference to all the evidence" - Nope, Ms Lean has never had all of the evidence. As Faithlilly pointed out but in the wrong context. It was 10 mnths before LM was arrested. Not because there was little evidence, but because they were building up a case with an abundance of evidence. We know this trial went on for 9 weeks, it did not do so, on the basis of flimsy evidence. We know this was a circumstantial case - there was no DNA that could connect LM directly to this girls murder. The police were not simply letting a killer walk the streets, they were making sure that they got this right so that this killer did not continue to walk the streets. And not by manipulating witnesses nor this ridiculous suggestion that the wrong forensic tests were requested.

On this basis, of the amount of evidence gathered - we know that the case is led with only a fraction of what had been obtained. How long does one imagine it would have went on for - if every single piece of evidence was used. We know the intricate details alone of this claimed alibi. That there had never been this relaxed dinner event - That is was the gaping holes in this that brought about the evidence led. Of coercion between this mother and son. Ultimately that LM had not been at home. And of CM - that she was capable, quite easily of lying bare faced on this stand. There was never simply the word of the tattoo parlour staff - that booking and confirmation was shown from their records, The name used, clearly written. The mockery brought of this by Ms Lean and co - the ridiculous notion that they would used the ID of a man in his 50's - no mockery however that this man was a family friend. Not some random name plucked out a hat - by the staff in this shop. Something they could not have possibly known, far less enter it into their records, for what reason? - to frame LM for a silly tattoo? The Jury needed to see that this mother would lie easily and readily for her son. Of the knife, of not only allowing her son to have more, but this ridiculous claim she had hidden it from him? this skunting knife, exactly like the one still missing. That she claimed this professional search team had missed it, in a bag beside the dogs dinner. - After running their fingers through this. - Not on your life, they were hoping this purchase in itself would not be noticed where they not? That they would be able to produce - thee missing knife. As with the Jacket. That original army item, too heavy and big to burn in this tiny burner. And she knew this how? - she knew it as it was exactly the jacket he had, and exactly the type replaced by originality was it not? - and it is that very mockery, that play on words that is used to distract away from the reality. That same mockery we see from the innocence campaigners, over and over. Of AB and the span of a gnat - nope, AB had an amazing memory. Of Ms Lean, and her suggestion that the police MAY have put the idea of a pocket in her mind? - surprised they didn't put the idea of the Deftone logo there also, eh?

Of this buried evidence - ridiculous claim. The only thing that is being buried is the Mitchells testimony. The lies in their abundance. And the manipulation of all and everything to shore it over with these far fetched tales. The search party is paramount to what Ms Lean does. That she should blatantly push out that wrongful claim - that they all agreed with LM that his dog led them to Jodi - No they did not. Not once. The evidence has always been clear around this - and if Ms Lean can bend this so far out of shape - then we know what she is capable of across the board, don't we? She has never produced one single area of these witness statements - that could state anything other,  than that upon approaching this V, whilst walking down this path - that LM entered this woodland. They have never stated that they had all walked passed this with LM - And what people are left with - that blindly put trust in this woman having all of the evidence - is this search trio lied, therefore they must be covering something up. For these are the very things that people are saying. Exactly what Ms Lean wants them to think. - it does not pay to think of LM, of those ten minutes and so forth. It pays to think only of this dog. Not where they were from any statement claims - just the dog. Which is completely irrelevant to anything.

All she produces are snip bits from multiple areas of statements - then goes to extraordinary lengths to make claim that they must have been in harmony with LM's, as she does with pretty much everything? -  And it can not be any clearer. To where LM said he was, this 40ft passed this V parallel to where Jodi lay. And he needed to be here, to add any validity in the slightest of what he always claimed - that his dog found Jodi. No it did not. This search trio had never once used those words, far less agree or being in harmony with him to where he stated they were. She has taken what this trio said, of every piece of information, solely on this dog as proof they agreed with LM - That is how twisted it is. And as the police do, do - they would ask for clarification on the basis of LM's claims and the contrast in their statements. And, of what exactly it was this dog was doing as they came to this V. Was LM leading his dog or the dog leading LM? - It was LM leading his dog - directly to the V. Not a foot passed it. Every single piece of their account from that very first - always stated clearly - upon coming to this break in the wall. It has never been after passing it, of this dog then reacting some way down. For they do give sound reasoning from those very first accounts. Of the dog pulling - to the V. Of the dog jumping - at the V. And of the lead being handed to AW. And of LM going over. And of him walking down to his left. - Remember the Gino spot here - of LM simply shining his torch around. This search party simply pausing for a moment - to see if he was Just going to do the same? For they had no notion in the slightest that this dog was reacting to Jodi - utter nonsense. They were waiting to see what LM was going to do, waiting on him. That is why they saw which way he went, by height and by torchlight.

And if people think it is acceptable - to then have to got to these extraordinary lengths to try and add weight to LM's evidence, rather than simply producing, from those very first statements of all - Where exactly it was, they had said, they all walked some distance passed, that LM had returned to this V, that they also returned for them to make any ref of anything of this V . And I have highlighted this with Faithlilly. And we know she added extras on, when attempting to tie the search trio in with LM returning to this V - It did not happen. Four people, only one from the off, made any claim of the dog alerting to Jodi, and that was LM. And we know that everything else has to be tied in with this. The abundance of other evidence that backed to the hilt, of LM going directly to this V break, and directly in the direction Jodi lay. And we know he had only walked a couple of steps and stopped, waiting a few seconds before shouting he had found something - For as JaJ and SK ran back that 10 -15ft - LM was yet again on the other side of this V. To where they had been shouted back to. - And I will ask again Faithlilly - where the members of this search party taken to the path - to go over their account?

And we know why Ms Lean has to do this - we know she has to twist and use all she can - to distract away from LM, but she is being both disrespectful, not only to Jodi's family, to the truth, - but to Jodi herself. Is she not? - For she has never produced anything of any worth in the slightest to back up these wild claims, that the search trio where with LM some 40ft passed this V break. For it does have to be taken in its entirety. What the dog was doing at this V, whilst approaching it, on the way down this path - is completely irrelevant to LM's claims. For he was lying was he not? They had not walked this distance down at all, and they have never stated that they did. And they most definitely had not stated - that the dog led us/them to Jodi. It has only ever been LM who made these claims. - And of Ms Lean repeating them for him. And I know I am repeating this yet again - for I feel it is morally wrong, to use others, to paint them as liars whilst attempting to scrape together some evidence for LM, to cover those gaping holes in his testimony. These futile excuses are running out - of not being able to divulge witness statements - they certainly seem to be getting divulged to a lot of people when suits?

Show us those statements, show us clearly what each and every member of that search party said. All and everything of what LM claimed. Every single piece of his statements - for he can give permission for this. They are his. They should already have been included as should have CM and Shanes.

As with the recordings, as with Mr Kelly's statement as with those phone records - none of this is buried. Ms Lean is an author writing a book. POA at one point. Unlike the SCCRC - Ms Lean has never been entitled to access everything. The defence team were entitled, they chose what they wanted to use, they did their precognitions - nothing was buried. Ms Lean wants this independent review to have access to everything? - which in itself tells us clearly, that she has written a hell of lot, made a lot of assumptions and damming reports - when never having had access to everything in the first instance.

Of those botched forensics - really. This woman who knows absolutely nothing of forensics. Who we know sought no expert advice. That she wrote this book prior to even discovering the female elements of DNA in semen. And of all those "no reportable results" with this "we will never know" "as we do not know what was being tested for!" The person of interest, the jacket, the knife, the shoes with blood on them. It was a big knife by the way, we must not forget to include that part. - All tested, no reportable results - It was not Jodi Jones blood. It was not connected to this girls murder. There is none of this we will never know. Of RG of his DNA - we will never know, as was his DNA tested against the DNA from this murder! - Well one must wonder therefore how JaF flagged up? - because it is stored in a data base, that is why. - Which tells us yet again that CD was correct, there was nothing, no profiles attributing this murder to being that of a stranger, of An another. Of these hairs cut at either end? - She thinks the killer may have done this accidently - Ms Lean thinks a hell of a lot - she however can not back up most of these thoughts - can she. She consistently speaks for LM and his mother, adding all her explanations and maybe this or maybe that - It should be straight from the horses mouth.

Credible - what can be credible about someone writing a complete defence case for a convicted murderer - whom we know, without a shadow of a doubt, done noting but lie? - Credible to speak for a compulsive liar?

Offline faithlilly

Re: Is DR Sandra Lean a credible source?
« Reply #226 on: May 17, 2021, 10:21:42 PM »
Credible source? - Of what exactly? For the Mitchells for that is the basis of all is it not? - Ms Lean holds the defence case files, she has never had access to everything. She has simply taken what DF put together and added to it. This has never been the true story of the murder of Jodi Jones, not in the slightest. Where Ms Lean makes claim to "examine the truth buried in those case files" - absolute nonsense. "disclosing for the first time, evidence of manipulating witnesses, forensic failings, crime scene contamination, dishonesty and more" "with reference to all the evidence"

Where to start? - "with reference to all the evidence" - Nope, Ms Lean has never had all of the evidence. As Faithlilly pointed out but in the wrong context. It was 10 mnths before LM was arrested. Not because there was little evidence, but because they were building up a case with an abundance of evidence. We know this trial went on for 9 weeks, it did not do so, on the basis of flimsy evidence. We know this was a circumstantial case - there was no DNA that could connect LM directly to this girls murder. The police were not simply letting a killer walk the streets, they were making sure that they got this right so that this killer did not continue to walk the streets. And not by manipulating witnesses nor this ridiculous suggestion that the wrong forensic tests were requested.


Yes...where to start? Best probably to highlight your silence with regards to your access to witness statements and court testimony. Spoke volumes...of course.

10 months until Luke was arrested and charged...building up a case with an abundance of evidence in that 10 months? Is that really true? How does it fit in with a L&B media spokesman saying at the end of August that they had all the evidence that they were likely to get or that a report detailing that evidence was sent to the PF in September?  Of course the PF, strangely, failed to appreciate this ‘abundance of evidence’ the police had and refused permission to charge Luke. However perhaps with the adage ‘God loves a trier’ in mind L&B had another shot at submitting a report to the PF in November. Four and a half months later the PF finally granted permission and Luke was charged. What evidence was gathered from September to April is unclear. We know that several detectives had a jolly over to Quantico to talk to the FBI about constructing a profile of Jodi’s killer...a profile that was not used by the prosecution so I think it is safe to say that it didn’t put Luke in the frame.

So, it could quite rightly be said that the police didn’t simply let a killer walk the streets for 10 months....they had no choice. The report submitted to the PF, twice, had so little merit that permission was refused to charge Luke. It really was out of their hands.


On this basis, of the amount of evidence gathered - we know that the case is led with only a fraction of what had been obtained. How long does one imagine it would have went on for - if every single piece of evidence was used. We know the intricate details alone of this claimed alibi. That there had never been this relaxed dinner event - That is was the gaping holes in this that brought about the evidence led. Of coercion between this mother and son. Ultimately that LM had not been at home. And of CM - that she was capable, quite easily of lying bare faced on this stand. There was never simply the word of the tattoo parlour staff - that booking and confirmation was shown from their records, The name used, clearly written. The mockery brought of this by Ms Lean and co - the ridiculous notion that they would used the ID of a man in his 50's - no mockery however that this man was a family friend. Not some random name plucked out a hat - by the staff in this shop. Something they could not have possibly known, far less enter it into their records, for what reason? - to frame LM for a silly tattoo? The Jury needed to see that this mother would lie easily and readily for her son. Of the knife, of not only allowing her son to have more, but this ridiculous claim she had hidden it from him? this skunting knife, exactly like the one still missing. That she claimed this professional search team had missed it, in a bag beside the dogs dinner. - After running their fingers through this. - Not on your life, they were hoping this purchase in itself would not be noticed where they not? That they would be able to produce - thee missing knife. As with the Jacket. That original army item, too heavy and big to burn in this tiny burner. And she knew this how? - she knew it as it was exactly the jacket he had, and exactly the type replaced by originality was it not? - and it is that very mockery, that play on words that is used to distract away from the reality. That same mockery we see from the innocence campaigners, over and over. Of AB and the span of a gnat - nope, AB had an amazing memory. Of Ms Lean, and her suggestion that the police MAY have put the idea of a pocket in her mind? - surprised they didn't put the idea of the Deftone logo there also, eh?

Professional search team? They always but always find all the evidence, don’t they? Like poor Tia Sharp, left to rot in her own attic when, just feet away, a professional search team, allegedly, searched her house within a inch of it’s life? And the jacket...the one that wasn’t mentioned until August. The jacket that was rained upon on that dreich, overcast day that you constantly insist on. Wet but not wet enough to burn sufficiently that not a microscopic fibre remained to say that the garment had ever existed.

And AB....I believe every word she said in her first statement and second statements. Recollections precise and clear, tied to verifiable events. No need to doubt her attention span.....but you did, or at least that’s the theory you put forward for those crucial but unexplained missing 45 minutes. Memory of a gnat....no quite the opposite.


Of this buried evidence - ridiculous claim. The only thing that is being buried is the Mitchells testimony. The lies in their abundance. And the manipulation of all and everything to shore it over with these far fetched tales. The search party is paramount to what Ms Lean does. That she should blatantly push out that wrongful claim - that they all agreed with LM that his dog led them to Jodi - No they did not. Not once. The evidence has always been clear around this - and if Ms Lean can bend this so far out of shape - then we know what she is capable of across the board, don't we? She has never produced one single area of these witness statements - that could state anything other,  than that upon approaching this V, whilst walking down this path - that LM entered this woodland. They have never stated that they had all walked passed this with LM - And what people are left with - that blindly put trust in this woman having all of the evidence - is this search trio lied, therefore they must be covering something up. For these are the very things that people are saying. Exactly what Ms Lean wants them to think. - it does not pay to think of LM, of those ten minutes and so forth. It pays to think only of this dog. Not where they were from any statement claims - just the dog. Which is completely irrelevant to anything.

Did you see the news today? Jenny Johnson, Russell Bishop’s former girlfriend, convicted of perverting the course of justice....she denied a blue sweatshirt belonged to Bishop. Have you ever wondered why, with so much evidence of false testimony thrown at the Mitchells, that the charges of perverting the course of justice were dropped....and out of the earshot of the jury?

Charges are dropped because there is no evidence to sustain them and if there was no evidence to sustain the charges there is no evidence that Luke wasn’t at home at the time Jodi was, allegedly, murdered. That is merely common sense.


All she produces are snip bits from multiple areas of statements - then goes to extraordinary lengths to make claim that they must have been in harmony with LM's, as she does with pretty much everything? -  And it can not be any clearer. To where LM said he was, this 40ft passed this V parallel to where Jodi lay. And he needed to be here, to add any validity in the slightest of what he always claimed - that his dog found Jodi. No it did not. This search trio had never once used those words, far less agree or being in harmony with him to where he stated they were. She has taken what this trio said, of every piece of information, solely on this dog as proof they agreed with LM - That is how twisted it is. And as the police do, do - they would ask for clarification on the basis of LM's claims and the contrast in their statements. And, of what exactly it was this dog was doing as they came to this V. Was LM leading his dog or the dog leading LM? - It was LM leading his dog - directly to the V. Not a foot passed it. Every single piece of their account from that very first - always stated clearly - upon coming to this break in the wall. It has never been after passing it, of this dog then reacting some way down. For they do give sound reasoning from those very first accounts. Of the dog pulling - to the V. Of the dog jumping - at the V. And of the lead being handed to AW. And of LM going over. And of him walking down to his left. - Remember the Gino spot here - of LM simply shining his torch around. This search party simply pausing for a moment - to see if he was Just going to do the same? For they had no notion in the slightest that this dog was reacting to Jodi - utter nonsense. They were waiting to see what LM was going to do, waiting on him. That is why they saw which way he went, by height and by torchlight.

You a have absolutely no evidence of any of the above. Your knowledge comes from the media and forums....you have admitted that. You simply cherrypick that which supports you narrative, nothing more, nothing less.

And if people think it is acceptable - to then have to got to these extraordinary lengths to try and add weight to LM's evidence, rather than simply producing, from those very first statements of all - Where exactly it was, they had said, they all walked some distance passed, that LM had returned to this V, that they also returned for them to make any ref of anything of this V . And I have highlighted this with Faithlilly. And we know she added extras on, when attempting to tie the search trio in with LM returning to this V - It did not happen. Four people, only one from the off, made any claim of the dog alerting to Jodi, and that was LM. And we know that everything else has to be tied in with this. The abundance of other evidence that backed to the hilt, of LM going directly to this V break, and directly in the direction Jodi lay. And we know he had only walked a couple of steps and stopped, waiting a few seconds before shouting he had found something - For as JaJ and SK ran back that 10 -15ft - LM was yet again on the other side of this V. To where they had been shouted back to. - And I will ask again Faithlilly - where the members of this search party taken to the path - to go over their account?

And we know why Ms Lean has to do this - we know she has to twist and use all she can - to distract away from LM, but she is being both disrespectful, not only to Jodi's family, to the truth, - but to Jodi herself. Is she not? - For she has never produced anything of any worth in the slightest to back up these wild claims, that the search trio where with LM some 40ft passed this V break. For it does have to be taken in its entirety. What the dog was doing at this V, whilst approaching it, on the way down this path - is completely irrelevant to LM's claims. For he was lying was he not? They had not walked this distance down at all, and they have never stated that they did. And they most definitely had not stated - that the dog led us/them to Jodi. It has only ever been LM who made these claims. - And of Ms Lean repeating them for him. And I know I am repeating this yet again - for I feel it is morally wrong, to use others, to paint them as liars whilst attempting to scrape together some evidence for LM, to cover those gaping holes in his testimony. These futile excuses are running out - of not being able to divulge witness statements - they certainly seem to be getting divulged to a lot of people when suits?

Show us those statements, show us clearly what each and every member of that search party said. All and everything of what LM claimed. Every single piece of his statements - for he can give permission for this. They are his. They should already have been included as should have CM and Shanes.

Yes please do. You allude to knowledge which is not in the public domain. We know Dr Lean has those first statements...you, not so much. Prove me wrong.

As with the recordings, as with Mr Kelly's statement as with those phone records - none of this is buried. Ms Lean is an author writing a book. POA at one point. Unlike the SCCRC - Ms Lean has never been entitled to access everything. The defence team were entitled, they chose what they wanted to use, they did their precognitions - nothing was buried. Ms Lean wants this independent review to have access to everything? - which in itself tells us clearly, that she has written a hell of lot, made a lot of assumptions and damming reports - when never having had access to everything in the first instance.

Of those botched forensics - really. This woman who knows absolutely nothing of forensics. Who we know sought no expert advice. That she wrote this book prior to even discovering the female elements of DNA in semen. And of all those "no reportable results" with this "we will never know" "as we do not know what was being tested for!" The person of interest, the jacket, the knife, the shoes with blood on them. It was a big knife by the way, we must not forget to include that part. - All tested, no reportable results - It was not Jodi Jones blood. It was not connected to this girls murder. There is none of this we will never know. Of RG of his DNA - we will never know, as was his DNA tested against the DNA from this murder! - Well one must wonder therefore how JaF flagged up? - because it is stored in a data base, that is why. - Which tells us yet again that CD was correct, there was nothing, no profiles attributing this murder to being that of a stranger, of An another. Of these hairs cut at either end? - She thinks the killer may have done this accidently - Ms Lean thinks a hell of a lot - she however can not back up most of these thoughts - can she. She consistently speaks for LM and his mother, adding all her explanations and maybe this or maybe that - It should be straight from the horses mouth.

Credible - what can be credible about someone writing a complete defence case for a convicted murderer - whom we know, without a shadow of a doubt, done noting but lie? - Credible to speak for a compulsive liar?
Brietta posted on 10/04/2022 “But whether or not that is the reason behind the delay I am certain that Brueckner's trial is going to take place.”

Let’s count the months, shall we?

Offline Nicholas

Re: Is DR Sandra Lean a credible source?
« Reply #227 on: May 18, 2021, 09:26:57 AM »
Heroin flooded Edinburgh after Islamic Revolution leaving piles of bodies and sparking crime-spree

https://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/news/scottish-news/how-1979-islamic-revolution-brought-24121902

Narcos Scotland: The Glasgow Ice Cream Wars of the 80s sparked a mass murder that shocked the nation

After his death Joe Steele said crime boss Tam McGraw had ordered the hit on the Doyle family and knew who started the blaze – but he would never tell.

https://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/news/scottish-news/narcos-scotland-glasgow-ice-cream-24129341.amp#click=https://t.co/LaPDPWR60N
« Last Edit: May 18, 2021, 10:35:40 AM by Nicholas »
Who wants to take on this great massive lie?” Writer Martin Preib on the tsunami of innocence fraud sweeping our nation

Offline Nicholas

Re: Is DR Sandra Lean a credible source?
« Reply #228 on: May 18, 2021, 09:27:49 AM »
Credible source? - Of what exactly? For the Mitchells for that is the basis of all is it not? - Ms Lean holds the defence case files, she has never had access to everything. She has simply taken what DF put together and added to it. This has never been the true story of the murder of Jodi Jones, not in the slightest. Where Ms Lean makes claim to "examine the truth buried in those case files" - absolute nonsense. "disclosing for the first time, evidence of manipulating witnesses, forensic failings, crime scene contamination, dishonesty and more" "with reference to all the evidence"

Where to start? - "with reference to all the evidence" - Nope, Ms Lean has never had all of the evidence. As Faithlilly pointed out but in the wrong context. It was 10 mnths before LM was arrested. Not because there was little evidence, but because they were building up a case with an abundance of evidence. We know this trial went on for 9 weeks, it did not do so, on the basis of flimsy evidence. We know this was a circumstantial case - there was no DNA that could connect LM directly to this girls murder. The police were not simply letting a killer walk the streets, they were making sure that they got this right so that this killer did not continue to walk the streets. And not by manipulating witnesses nor this ridiculous suggestion that the wrong forensic tests were requested.

On this basis, of the amount of evidence gathered - we know that the case is led with only a fraction of what had been obtained. How long does one imagine it would have went on for - if every single piece of evidence was used. We know the intricate details alone of this claimed alibi. That there had never been this relaxed dinner event - That is was the gaping holes in this that brought about the evidence led. Of coercion between this mother and son. Ultimately that LM had not been at home. And of CM - that she was capable, quite easily of lying bare faced on this stand. There was never simply the word of the tattoo parlour staff - that booking and confirmation was shown from their records, The name used, clearly written. The mockery brought of this by Ms Lean and co - the ridiculous notion that they would used the ID of a man in his 50's - no mockery however that this man was a family friend. Not some random name plucked out a hat - by the staff in this shop. Something they could not have possibly known, far less enter it into their records, for what reason? - to frame LM for a silly tattoo? The Jury needed to see that this mother would lie easily and readily for her son. Of the knife, of not only allowing her son to have more, but this ridiculous claim she had hidden it from him? this skunting knife, exactly like the one still missing. That she claimed this professional search team had missed it, in a bag beside the dogs dinner. - After running their fingers through this. - Not on your life, they were hoping this purchase in itself would not be noticed where they not? That they would be able to produce - thee missing knife. As with the Jacket. That original army item, too heavy and big to burn in this tiny burner. And she knew this how? - she knew it as it was exactly the jacket he had, and exactly the type replaced by originality was it not? - and it is that very mockery, that play on words that is used to distract away from the reality. That same mockery we see from the innocence campaigners, over and over. Of AB and the span of a gnat - nope, AB had an amazing memory. Of Ms Lean, and her suggestion that the police MAY have put the idea of a pocket in her mind? - surprised they didn't put the idea of the Deftone logo there also, eh?

Of this buried evidence - ridiculous claim. The only thing that is being buried is the Mitchells testimony. The lies in their abundance. And the manipulation of all and everything to shore it over with these far fetched tales. The search party is paramount to what Ms Lean does. That she should blatantly push out that wrongful claim - that they all agreed with LM that his dog led them to Jodi - No they did not. Not once. The evidence has always been clear around this - and if Ms Lean can bend this so far out of shape - then we know what she is capable of across the board, don't we? She has never produced one single area of these witness statements - that could state anything other,  than that upon approaching this V, whilst walking down this path - that LM entered this woodland. They have never stated that they had all walked passed this with LM - And what people are left with - that blindly put trust in this woman having all of the evidence - is this search trio lied, therefore they must be covering something up. For these are the very things that people are saying. Exactly what Ms Lean wants them to think. - it does not pay to think of LM, of those ten minutes and so forth. It pays to think only of this dog. Not where they were from any statement claims - just the dog. Which is completely irrelevant to anything.

All she produces are snip bits from multiple areas of statements - then goes to extraordinary lengths to make claim that they must have been in harmony with LM's, as she does with pretty much everything? -  And it can not be any clearer. To where LM said he was, this 40ft passed this V parallel to where Jodi lay. And he needed to be here, to add any validity in the slightest of what he always claimed - that his dog found Jodi. No it did not. This search trio had never once used those words, far less agree or being in harmony with him to where he stated they were. She has taken what this trio said, of every piece of information, solely on this dog as proof they agreed with LM - That is how twisted it is. And as the police do, do - they would ask for clarification on the basis of LM's claims and the contrast in their statements. And, of what exactly it was this dog was doing as they came to this V. Was LM leading his dog or the dog leading LM? - It was LM leading his dog - directly to the V. Not a foot passed it. Every single piece of their account from that very first - always stated clearly - upon coming to this break in the wall. It has never been after passing it, of this dog then reacting some way down. For they do give sound reasoning from those very first accounts. Of the dog pulling - to the V. Of the dog jumping - at the V. And of the lead being handed to AW. And of LM going over. And of him walking down to his left. - Remember the Gino spot here - of LM simply shining his torch around. This search party simply pausing for a moment - to see if he was Just going to do the same? For they had no notion in the slightest that this dog was reacting to Jodi - utter nonsense. They were waiting to see what LM was going to do, waiting on him. That is why they saw which way he went, by height and by torchlight.

And if people think it is acceptable - to then have to got to these extraordinary lengths to try and add weight to LM's evidence, rather than simply producing, from those very first statements of all - Where exactly it was, they had said, they all walked some distance passed, that LM had returned to this V, that they also returned for them to make any ref of anything of this V . And I have highlighted this with Faithlilly. And we know she added extras on, when attempting to tie the search trio in with LM returning to this V - It did not happen. Four people, only one from the off, made any claim of the dog alerting to Jodi, and that was LM. And we know that everything else has to be tied in with this. The abundance of other evidence that backed to the hilt, of LM going directly to this V break, and directly in the direction Jodi lay. And we know he had only walked a couple of steps and stopped, waiting a few seconds before shouting he had found something - For as JaJ and SK ran back that 10 -15ft - LM was yet again on the other side of this V. To where they had been shouted back to. - And I will ask again Faithlilly - where the members of this search party taken to the path - to go over their account?

And we know why Ms Lean has to do this - we know she has to twist and use all she can - to distract away from LM, but she is being both disrespectful, not only to Jodi's family, to the truth, - but to Jodi herself. Is she not? - For she has never produced anything of any worth in the slightest to back up these wild claims, that the search trio where with LM some 40ft passed this V break. For it does have to be taken in its entirety. What the dog was doing at this V, whilst approaching it, on the way down this path - is completely irrelevant to LM's claims. For he was lying was he not? They had not walked this distance down at all, and they have never stated that they did. And they most definitely had not stated - that the dog led us/them to Jodi. It has only ever been LM who made these claims. - And of Ms Lean repeating them for him. And I know I am repeating this yet again - for I feel it is morally wrong, to use others, to paint them as liars whilst attempting to scrape together some evidence for LM, to cover those gaping holes in his testimony. These futile excuses are running out - of not being able to divulge witness statements - they certainly seem to be getting divulged to a lot of people when suits?

Show us those statements, show us clearly what each and every member of that search party said. All and everything of what LM claimed. Every single piece of his statements - for he can give permission for this. They are his. They should already have been included as should have CM and Shanes.

As with the recordings, as with Mr Kelly's statement as with those phone records - none of this is buried. Ms Lean is an author writing a book. POA at one point. Unlike the SCCRC - Ms Lean has never been entitled to access everything. The defence team were entitled, they chose what they wanted to use, they did their precognitions - nothing was buried. Ms Lean wants this independent review to have access to everything? - which in itself tells us clearly, that she has written a hell of lot, made a lot of assumptions and damming reports - when never having had access to everything in the first instance.

Of those botched forensics - really. This woman who knows absolutely nothing of forensics. Who we know sought no expert advice. That she wrote this book prior to even discovering the female elements of DNA in semen. And of all those "no reportable results" with this "we will never know" "as we do not know what was being tested for!" The person of interest, the jacket, the knife, the shoes with blood on them. It was a big knife by the way, we must not forget to include that part. - All tested, no reportable results - It was not Jodi Jones blood. It was not connected to this girls murder. There is none of this we will never know. Of RG of his DNA - we will never know, as was his DNA tested against the DNA from this murder! - Well one must wonder therefore how JaF flagged up? - because it is stored in a data base, that is why. - Which tells us yet again that CD was correct, there was nothing, no profiles attributing this murder to being that of a stranger, of An another. Of these hairs cut at either end? - She thinks the killer may have done this accidently - Ms Lean thinks a hell of a lot - she however can not back up most of these thoughts - can she. She consistently speaks for LM and his mother, adding all her explanations and maybe this or maybe that - It should be straight from the horses mouth.

Credible - what can be credible about someone writing a complete defence case for a convicted murderer - whom we know, without a shadow of a doubt, done noting but lie? - Credible to speak for a compulsive liar?

 8((()*/
Who wants to take on this great massive lie?” Writer Martin Preib on the tsunami of innocence fraud sweeping our nation

Offline Nicholas

Re: Is DR Sandra Lean a credible source?
« Reply #229 on: May 18, 2021, 11:36:23 AM »
Sandra Lean
The local media printed a story about a female relative of a suspect burning clothes in a garden in NEWTONGRANGE the night of the murder (remember, Luke lived in Newbattle - different place). It's that story to which James Matthews referred in the interview and to which Luke responded "That wasn't us." So, at the time, reference to a "female relative burning clothes" wasn't referring to Corinne at all - it was a woman in Newtongrange. However, we now know that there were no other suspects, so all we can now conclude is that the police knew about someone burning clothes in Newtongrange the night of the murder, but didn't consider it to be in any way suspicious. For those who don't know the area, Newtongrange is no further from the path than Newbattle).


The local media didn’t print the fact Luke Mitchell agreed his mother and brother had had a fire that night though did they ⬇️


Para 154 (from CoA judgement)

‘The first of these replies is that at page 17 of the transcript concerning the fire at the log burner in the back garden on 30 June 2003. The appellant agreed that his mother and brother had had a fire. Looking at the questioning to which that reply was given, no unfairness strikes us as being involved. Furthermore, evidence of the existence of such a fire had been laid before the jury from Mr and Mrs Frankland and Mr Ramage
Who wants to take on this great massive lie?” Writer Martin Preib on the tsunami of innocence fraud sweeping our nation

Offline Parky41

Re: Is DR Sandra Lean a credible source?
« Reply #230 on: May 18, 2021, 01:49:47 PM »


And Yet again - one does not need to show the statements from these witnesses, Ms Lean has no power in them - for she herself does not and can not show them all. Uses disclosure as an excuse when it suits, yet uses full extracts multiple other times. Most definitely uses them as some form of power. I have them but can't use 95% of them?? And of these lies by omission that Nicholas has already clearly stated. The search party is a classic example of this. That lie by omission is leaving out what this search party actually said, in those full sentences, whilst approaching this V. Instead, a fraction of truth is used to completely manipulate them, with extraordinary obtuse reasoning. "The search party all agreed with Luke, that the dog led them to Jodi" That blatant manipulative twist - Let's expand this. The search party all agreed with Luke, the dog was at the wall, implying they agreed with Luke in everything, that the dog must have led them to Jodi? See the twist, the lie, the manipulation. Let's expand that into the actual truth. That stark difference and why LM was lying. All of the search party made ref to this dog at the wall. One claimed some 40ft down. Three whilst approaching this V and at the V. Only LM made claim to this dog finding Jodi, some 40ft down. All of the search trio, only stated that when they came to this V. the dog was doing X,Y and Z and LM yet again looked into the woodland. The actual truth is on a completely different parallel to the manipulation used. And even with this, it was shown that LM led his dog to this V whilst approaching - on the way down this path.

This completely false premise is used to add weight to some further blatant misrepresentations. We have already showing that this search party had always stated the truth. There was never this "the search party all agreed with Luke, that the dog led them to Jodi" - Therefore it is completely scrubbed from anything else it may used against. Of these claims of further lies, of this search party claiming they had made calls whilst getting ready and heading to Easthouse's - Ms Lean infers this is lies, as she claims not to have these phone records, thus the implication is, that yet again this search trio were lying. Completely ignores those precognitions and so forth, lies again by omission? Completely ignores why DF did not go down these foolish non sensical routes. DF had absolutely no reason to include calls to Kirsten, attempts to other friends and certainly this ridiculous claim that the aunty must have already been at this path - as again there is no phone record. All this does do is highlight, yet again the massive assumptions made on the most flimsiest of reasoning. - to try and claim that Jodi's family were lying - no they were not.

They stated that clear sequence of events - That they found out Jodi was missing. That they got ready to go look for her, that they were trying friends by way of phoning (which were irrelevant to the defence) That they did head to this path, that JaJ had spoken with LM whilst coming out this complex. That upon reaching this path. That AW wanted to look properly. That LM climbed the wall a the Gino spot, that when they arrived at this V break LM went into the woodland.

What we do know with certainty is the compulsive lies from LM and his mother? That it was not this girls families fault, that LM led them to this path. That it was not their idea nor would have been their intention to search this path - If LM had not claimed Jodi was going to Newbattle, that she failed to turn up there. That whilst they may have hoped she had simply went somewhere else, that the normal thing to do, is to contact friends. That any plans of an extensive search was halted in it's tracks - by the very fact that LM was on that very path. That he is the one that arrived there in an extraordinary short time - Of barely being of this phone with JuJ and he is on this path.

That he did give an account of - speaking with his mother, of going upstairs to ask SM for a torch. Of SM going downstairs to get one for him. And of being on this path less than 7mins later. - And still on this path around 11.20pm.  LM led this girls family straight to her body.

And of those calls to the operator - of LM's flat affect speech. 'well I think we have found something, well I think it is a body, well aye it looks like a body'

To the police - 'do you know where erm is, well if you go there, erm we will shine our torch so you can see us' 

Of SK - of the operator asking him to stop swearing and to calm down. As he was in a right state, was he not - screaming at the operator.

Not in the public domain Faithlilly? - 18yrs is a long time, for things to make their rounds. From every person that crammed that courtroom. And one has to wonder here - Of Ms Lean not attending this trial for 9 weeks? - Of claiming not to have those recordings, yet again makes all of those assumptions based around the black and white of those transcripts? - One is wondering here, just how much of those actual transcripts she holds - they cost a pretty penny do they not - She mentioned at one point on the blue forum of tens of thousands of pounds, needing funds? Does she actually only have the questions that the defence put to the witnesses from  the case DF put together? - how much is actually missing? That we know the SCCRC brought to her attention? We know she only has a fraction of what actually went into that lengthy investigation by the police?

And back to the top - Ms Lean holds no power, by means of having access, to all that she only does actually have. And of using around 5% of which suits. - The more this case gets pushed into the public domain. the more information comes out and spreads around.  Of these claims that CM's car was seen elsewhere at two different locations that evening - brought to light by two people asking her of this last week, in her Q&A time?

Offline Nicholas

Re: Is DR Sandra Lean a credible source?
« Reply #231 on: May 18, 2021, 02:07:08 PM »
And Yet again - one does not need to show the statements from these witnesses, Ms Lean has no power in them - for she herself does not and can not show them all. Uses disclosure as an excuse when it suits, yet uses full extracts multiple other times. Most definitely uses them as some form of power. I have them but can't use 95% of them?? And of these lies by omission that Nicholas has already clearly stated. The search party is a classic example of this. That lie by omission is leaving out what this search party actually said, in those full sentences, whilst approaching this V. Instead, a fraction of truth is used to completely manipulate them, with extraordinary obtuse reasoning. "The search party all agreed with Luke, that the dog led them to Jodi" That blatant manipulative twist - Let's expand this. The search party all agreed with Luke, the dog was at the wall, implying they agreed with Luke in everything, that the dog must have led them to Jodi? See the twist, the lie, the manipulation. Let's expand that into the actual truth. That stark difference and why LM was lying. All of the search party made ref to this dog at the wall. One claimed some 40ft down. Three whilst approaching this V and at the V. Only LM made claim to this dog finding Jodi, some 40ft down. All of the search trio, only stated that when they came to this V. the dog was doing X,Y and Z and LM yet again looked into the woodland. The actual truth is on a completely different parallel to the manipulation used. And even with this, it was shown that LM led his dog to this V whilst approaching - on the way down this path.

This completely false premise is used to add weight to some further blatant misrepresentations. We have already showing that this search party had always stated the truth. There was never this "the search party all agreed with Luke, that the dog led them to Jodi" - Therefore it is completely scrubbed from anything else it may used against. Of these claims of further lies, of this search party claiming they had made calls whilst getting ready and heading to Easthouse's - Ms Lean infers this is lies, as she claims not to have these phone records, thus the implication is, that yet again this search trio were lying. Completely ignores those precognitions and so forth, lies again by omission? Completely ignores why DF did not go down these foolish non sensical routes. DF had absolutely no reason to include calls to Kirsten, attempts to other friends and certainly this ridiculous claim that the aunty must have already been at this path - as again there is no phone record. All this does do is highlight, yet again the massive assumptions made on the most flimsiest of reasoning. - to try and claim that Jodi's family were lying - no they were not.

They stated that clear sequence of events - That they found out Jodi was missing. That they got ready to go look for her, that they were trying friends by way of phoning (which were irrelevant to the defence) That they did head to this path, that JaJ had spoken with LM whilst coming out this complex. That upon reaching this path. That AW wanted to look properly. That LM climbed the wall a the Gino spot, that when they arrived at this V break LM went into the woodland.

What we do know with certainty is the compulsive lies from LM and his mother? That it was not this girls families fault, that LM led them to this path. That it was not their idea nor would have been their intention to search this path - If LM had not claimed Jodi was going to Newbattle, that she failed to turn up there. That whilst they may have hoped she had simply went somewhere else, that the normal thing to do, is to contact friends. That any plans of an extensive search was halted in it's tracks - by the very fact that LM was on that very path. That he is the one that arrived there in an extraordinary short time - Of barely being of this phone with JuJ and he is on this path.

That he did give an account of - speaking with his mother, of going upstairs to ask SM for a torch. Of SM going downstairs to get one for him. And of being on this path less than 7mins later. - And still on this path around 11.20pm.  LM led this girls family straight to her body.

And of those calls to the operator - of LM's flat affect speech. 'well I think we have found something, well I think it is a body, well aye it looks like a body'

To the police - 'do you know where erm is, well if you go there, erm we will shine our torch so you can see us' 

Of SK - of the operator asking him to stop swearing and to calm down. As he was in a right state, was he not - screaming at the operator.

Not in the public domain Faithlilly? - 18yrs is a long time, for things to make their rounds. From every person that crammed that courtroom. And one has to wonder here - Of Ms Lean not attending this trial for 9 weeks? - Of claiming not to have those recordings, yet again makes all of those assumptions based around the black and white of those transcripts? - One is wondering here, just how much of those actual transcripts she holds - they cost a pretty penny do they not - She mentioned at one point on the blue forum of tens of thousands of pounds, needing funds? Does she actually only have the questions that the defence put to the witnesses from  the case DF put together? - how much is actually missing? That we know the SCCRC brought to her attention? We know she only has a fraction of what actually went into that lengthy investigation by the police?

And back to the top - Ms Lean holds no power, by means of having access, to all that she only does actually have. And of using around 5% of which suits. - The more this case gets pushed into the public domain. the more information comes out and spreads around.  Of these claims that CM's car was seen elsewhere at two different locations that evening - brought to light by two people asking her of this last week, in her Q&A time?

 8((()*/
« Last Edit: May 18, 2021, 02:31:08 PM by Nicholas »
Who wants to take on this great massive lie?” Writer Martin Preib on the tsunami of innocence fraud sweeping our nation

Offline mrswah

  • Senior Moderator
  • Sr. Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2169
  • Total likes: 796
  • Thinking outside the box, as usual-------
Re: Is DR Sandra Lean a credible source?
« Reply #232 on: May 18, 2021, 05:05:38 PM »
And Yet again - one does not need to show the statements from these witnesses, Ms Lean has no power in them - for she herself does not and can not show them all. Uses disclosure as an excuse when it suits, yet uses full extracts multiple other times. Most definitely uses them as some form of power. I have them but can't use 95% of them?? And of these lies by omission that Nicholas has already clearly stated. The search party is a classic example of this. That lie by omission is leaving out what this search party actually said, in those full sentences, whilst approaching this V. Instead, a fraction of truth is used to completely manipulate them, with extraordinary obtuse reasoning. "The search party all agreed with Luke, that the dog led them to Jodi" That blatant manipulative twist - Let's expand this. The search party all agreed with Luke, the dog was at the wall, implying they agreed with Luke in everything, that the dog must have led them to Jodi? See the twist, the lie, the manipulation. Let's expand that into the actual truth. That stark difference and why LM was lying. All of the search party made ref to this dog at the wall. One claimed some 40ft down. Three whilst approaching this V and at the V. Only LM made claim to this dog finding Jodi, some 40ft down. All of the search trio, only stated that when they came to this V. the dog was doing X,Y and Z and LM yet again looked into the woodland. The actual truth is on a completely different parallel to the manipulation used. And even with this, it was shown that LM led his dog to this V whilst approaching - on the way down this path.

This completely false premise is used to add weight to some further blatant misrepresentations. We have already showing that this search party had always stated the truth. There was never this "the search party all agreed with Luke, that the dog led them to Jodi" - Therefore it is completely scrubbed from anything else it may used against. Of these claims of further lies, of this search party claiming they had made calls whilst getting ready and heading to Easthouse's - Ms Lean infers this is lies, as she claims not to have these phone records, thus the implication is, that yet again this search trio were lying. Completely ignores those precognitions and so forth, lies again by omission? Completely ignores why DF did not go down these foolish non sensical routes. DF had absolutely no reason to include calls to Kirsten, attempts to other friends and certainly this ridiculous claim that the aunty must have already been at this path - as again there is no phone record. All this does do is highlight, yet again the massive assumptions made on the most flimsiest of reasoning. - to try and claim that Jodi's family were lying - no they were not.

They stated that clear sequence of events - That they found out Jodi was missing. That they got ready to go look for her, that they were trying friends by way of phoning (which were irrelevant to the defence) That they did head to this path, that JaJ had spoken with LM whilst coming out this complex. That upon reaching this path. That AW wanted to look properly. That LM climbed the wall a the Gino spot, that when they arrived at this V break LM went into the woodland.

What we do know with certainty is the compulsive lies from LM and his mother? That it was not this girls families fault, that LM led them to this path. That it was not their idea nor would have been their intention to search this path - If LM had not claimed Jodi was going to Newbattle, that she failed to turn up there. That whilst they may have hoped she had simply went somewhere else, that the normal thing to do, is to contact friends. That any plans of an extensive search was halted in it's tracks - by the very fact that LM was on that very path. That he is the one that arrived there in an extraordinary short time - Of barely being of this phone with JuJ and he is on this path.

That he did give an account of - speaking with his mother, of going upstairs to ask SM for a torch. Of SM going downstairs to get one for him. And of being on this path less than 7mins later. - And still on this path around 11.20pm.  LM led this girls family straight to her body.

And of those calls to the operator - of LM's flat affect speech. 'well I think we have found something, well I think it is a body, well aye it looks like a body'

To the police - 'do you know where erm is, well if you go there, erm we will shine our torch so you can see us' 

Of SK - of the operator asking him to stop swearing and to calm down. As he was in a right state, was he not - screaming at the operator.

Not in the public domain Faithlilly? - 18yrs is a long time, for things to make their rounds. From every person that crammed that courtroom. And one has to wonder here - Of Ms Lean not attending this trial for 9 weeks? - Of claiming not to have those recordings, yet again makes all of those assumptions based around the black and white of those transcripts? - One is wondering here, just how much of those actual transcripts she holds - they cost a pretty penny do they not - She mentioned at one point on the blue forum of tens of thousands of pounds, needing funds? Does she actually only have the questions that the defence put to the witnesses from  the case DF put together? - how much is actually missing? That we know the SCCRC brought to her attention? We know she only has a fraction of what actually went into that lengthy investigation by the police?

And back to the top - Ms Lean holds no power, by means of having access, to all that she only does actually have. And of using around 5% of which suits. - The more this case gets pushed into the public domain. the more information comes out and spreads around.  Of these claims that CM's car was seen elsewhere at two different locations that evening - brought to light by two people asking her of this last week, in her Q&A time?


Ok, so can you prove to me that the first statements of the "search trio" did NOT agree with Luke's, ie that they NEVER said that the dog played any part in finding Jodi?


Offline Brietta

Re: Is DR Sandra Lean a credible source?
« Reply #233 on: May 18, 2021, 05:25:42 PM »

Ok, so can you prove to me that the first statements of the "search trio" did NOT agree with Luke's, ie that they NEVER said that the dog played any part in finding Jodi?

If that was in their statements to the police and testified to in court ~ I think we have to go along with it.
"All I'm going to say is that we've conducted a very serious investigation and there's no indication that Madeleine McCann's parents are connected to her disappearance. On the other hand, we have a lot of evidence pointing out that Christian killed her," Wolter told the "Friday at 9"....

Offline Parky41

Re: Is DR Sandra Lean a credible source?
« Reply #234 on: May 18, 2021, 05:51:28 PM »

Ok, so can you prove to me that the first statements of the "search trio" did NOT agree with Luke's, ie that they NEVER said that the dog played any part in finding Jodi?

Ms Lean has not produced them. She has shown nothing that tallies with LMS claims. Show us where they say the dog led them to Jodi. Show us where they said they were some distance passed this v. Show us where they said they had all walked passed this v prior to LM going over.? Why do you assume she tries to imply rather than show all four statements?

Offline Parky41

Re: Is DR Sandra Lean a credible source?
« Reply #235 on: May 18, 2021, 06:21:54 PM »
Ms Lean has not produced them. She has shown nothing that tallies with LMS claims. Show us where they say the dog led them to Jodi. Show us where they said they were some distance passed this v. Show us where they said they had all walked passed this v prior to LM going over.? Why do you assume she tries to imply rather than show all four statements?
[/quote

Is it good enough to imply? Is it good enough to say at a V and 40ft past is the same? this girls family had to have said the same as LM .  What the dog did at the V is irrelevant to LMS claims of 40ft passed.
« Last Edit: May 18, 2021, 06:24:29 PM by Parky41 »

Offline faithlilly

Re: Is DR Sandra Lean a credible source?
« Reply #236 on: May 18, 2021, 08:30:58 PM »
Ms Lean has not produced them. She has shown nothing that tallies with LMS claims. Show us where they say the dog led them to Jodi. Show us where they said they were some distance passed this v. Show us where they said they had all walked passed this v prior to LM going over.? Why do you assume she tries to imply rather than show all four statements?

Show us what AW, JaJ and SK said first statements? You must have them to know that they didn’t tally with LM’s.

As they say...time to put up.
« Last Edit: May 18, 2021, 08:47:38 PM by faithlilly »
Brietta posted on 10/04/2022 “But whether or not that is the reason behind the delay I am certain that Brueckner's trial is going to take place.”

Let’s count the months, shall we?

Offline faithlilly

Re: Is DR Sandra Lean a credible source?
« Reply #237 on: May 18, 2021, 08:42:39 PM »
And Yet again - one does not need to show the statements from these witnesses, Ms Lean has no power in them - for she herself does not and can not show them all. Uses disclosure as an excuse when it suits, yet uses full extracts multiple other times. Most definitely uses them as some form of power. I have them but can't use 95% of them?? And of these lies by omission that Nicholas has already clearly stated. The search party is a classic example of this. That lie by omission is leaving out what this search party actually said, in those full sentences, whilst approaching this V. Instead, a fraction of truth is used to completely manipulate them, with extraordinary obtuse reasoning. "The search party all agreed with Luke, that the dog led them to Jodi" That blatant manipulative twist - Let's expand this. The search party all agreed with Luke, the dog was at the wall, implying they agreed with Luke in everything, that the dog must have led them to Jodi? See the twist, the lie, the manipulation. Let's expand that into the actual truth. That stark difference and why LM was lying. All of the search party made ref to this dog at the wall. One claimed some 40ft down. Three whilst approaching this V and at the V. Only LM made claim to this dog finding Jodi, some 40ft down. All of the search trio, only stated that when they came to this V. the dog was doing X,Y and Z and LM yet again looked into the woodland. The actual truth is on a completely different parallel to the manipulation used. And even with this, it was shown that LM led his dog to this V whilst approaching - on the way down this path.

This completely false premise is used to add weight to some further blatant misrepresentations. We have already showing that this search party had always stated the truth. There was never this "the search party all agreed with Luke, that the dog led them to Jodi" - Therefore it is completely scrubbed from anything else it may used against. Of these claims of further lies, of this search party claiming they had made calls whilst getting ready and heading to Easthouse's - Ms Lean infers this is lies, as she claims not to have these phone records, thus the implication is, that yet again this search trio were lying. Completely ignores those precognitions and so forth, lies again by omission? Completely ignores why DF did not go down these foolish non sensical routes. DF had absolutely no reason to include calls to Kirsten, attempts to other friends and certainly this ridiculous claim that the aunty must have already been at this path - as again there is no phone record. All this does do is highlight, yet again the massive assumptions made on the most flimsiest of reasoning. - to try and claim that Jodi's family were lying - no they were not.

They stated that clear sequence of events - That they found out Jodi was missing. That they got ready to go look for her, that they were trying friends by way of phoning (which were irrelevant to the defence) That they did head to this path, that JaJ had spoken with LM whilst coming out this complex. That upon reaching this path. That AW wanted to look properly. That LM climbed the wall a the Gino spot, that when they arrived at this V break LM went into the woodland.

What we do know with certainty is the compulsive lies from LM and his mother? That it was not this girls families fault, that LM led them to this path. That it was not their idea nor would have been their intention to search this path - If LM had not claimed Jodi was going to Newbattle, that she failed to turn up there. That whilst they may have hoped she had simply went somewhere else, that the normal thing to do, is to contact friends. That any plans of an extensive search was halted in it's tracks - by the very fact that LM was on that very path. That he is the one that arrived there in an extraordinary short time - Of barely being of this phone with JuJ and he is on this path.

That he did give an account of - speaking with his mother, of going upstairs to ask SM for a torch. Of SM going downstairs to get one for him. And of being on this path less than 7mins later. - And still on this path around 11.20pm.  LM led this girls family straight to her body.

And of those calls to the operator - of LM's flat affect speech. 'well I think we have found something, well I think it is a body, well aye it looks like a body'

To the police - 'do you know where erm is, well if you go there, erm we will shine our torch so you can see us' 

Of SK - of the operator asking him to stop swearing and to calm down. As he was in a right state, was he not - screaming at the operator.

Not in the public domain Faithlilly? - 18yrs is a long time, for things to make their rounds. From every person that crammed that courtroom. And one has to wonder here - Of Ms Lean not attending this trial for 9 weeks? - Of claiming not to have those recordings, yet again makes all of those assumptions based around the black and white of those transcripts? - One is wondering here, just how much of those actual transcripts she holds - they cost a pretty penny do they not - She mentioned at one point on the blue forum of tens of thousands of pounds, needing funds? Does she actually only have the questions that the defence put to the witnesses from  the case DF put together? - how much is actually missing? That we know the SCCRC brought to her attention? We know she only has a fraction of what actually went into that lengthy investigation by the police?

And back to the top - Ms Lean holds no power, by means of having access, to all that she only does actually have. And of using around 5% of which suits. - The more this case gets pushed into the public domain. the more information comes out and spreads around.  Of these claims that CM's car was seen elsewhere at two different locations that evening - brought to light by two people asking her of this last week, in her Q&A time?

A quote from Isa Blagden but often attributed to Lenin comes to mind.

“If a lie is only printed often enough, it becomes a quasi-truth, and if such a truth is repeated often enough, it becomes an article of belief, a dogma”

BTW the car ‘thing’ is in Dr Lean’s book....no attempt to keep it from the light. The police seem not to have been too concerned about it.
« Last Edit: May 18, 2021, 08:47:12 PM by faithlilly »
Brietta posted on 10/04/2022 “But whether or not that is the reason behind the delay I am certain that Brueckner's trial is going to take place.”

Let’s count the months, shall we?

Offline Paranoid Android

Re: Is DR Sandra Lean a credible source?
« Reply #238 on: May 19, 2021, 12:04:35 PM »
BTW the car ‘thing’ is in Dr Lean’s book....no attempt to keep it from the light. The police seem not to have been too concerned about it.

Wow - let this be our new rationale for considering every point, folks - the police weren't concerned, just as they weren't concerned about MK and all the other stuff.

If we can apply this logic to cover CM's ass, we have to apply it in all cases - it has to work both ways.

The way has been shown.

Offline Parky41

Re: Is DR Sandra Lean a credible source?
« Reply #239 on: May 19, 2021, 01:01:08 PM »

Ok, so can you prove to me that the first statements of the "search trio" did NOT agree with Luke's, ie that they NEVER said that the dog played any part in finding Jodi?

MrSwah. - I do not believe there is anything that could be shown, that would set your mind on a different path. You have already stated, that you hold complete trust in what Ms Lean writes. And that is absolutely fine. I for one, would not attempt in the slightest to sway peoples opinion, on their beliefs and trust of others. I am not set to change peoples minds. I am putting forward what I know of the Crowns case, of information gathered from different sources. You asked me If I could show you, that these first statements gave no indication that this search trio, implied that they agreed with LM, in that his dog had led them to Jodi. You have readily accepted from Ms Lean, all that she implies - that she has not backed this up by way of showing clearly what this search party said. Not produced those statements.  And of other posts I have also made on this. That one would not need to go to extraordinary lengths, when the simplest route would be to show this clearly from those statements. - And that is fine. I can not produce those statements, Ms Lean could show enough, to show clearly that they agreed. That it is my belief  firmly, that by way of omitting crucial areas of statements. that what is being implied is not what has been said or meant, from these witnesses.

You believe that this search trio all said they were some 40t down, that the dog alerted them to where Jodi was. You believe that this search party told the truth, changed their minds and lied. And that in those first statements they obviously both lied and told the truth at the same time? - The truthful part has to be that they were with LM and his dog, some distance passed this V break. The lies they told in those first statements have to be - everything they made reference to at this V. As we know, that this search trio could not have seen the dogs head level with the V, they could not have seen the dog pulling at the V and they could not have seen the lead being handed to AW. So whichever way you look at it - they were lying in those first statements. It being an impossible task to see this V from 40ft down, even 20ft down - more so, that if they carried on walking whilst Luke had returned to this V to go over. And there is no need for Ms Lean to make ref to JaJ's height, for according to her and LM, JaJ was not at this V anyway. - She was at this point some 80ft down from it. For LM had to return around this 40ft and they would have covered around the same distance?

Or do we go down this route, yet again that LM was simply mistaken That he had not walked "not even 20yrds" yet this mistake was clarified when he drew that diagram, parallel to where Jodi lay on the other side. That perhaps he was just enough to the left of this V that gave him cause to walk left? Do we bring him right back to this V? so we can include the search party being truthful to match his account? As Faithlilly tried to do? When she implied they all went back to the V after the dog reacted? All this implying? All this Ms Lean trying to work out, how it could all fit in with LM's account - and is not that the problem? It should be shown, clearly and precisely from those statements. Of course, one has the other option, (lots of them rather than Occams Razor))That Luke simply followed their direction to feel safe? ?

Best stick to what we do believe - I for one believe this search trio were nothing other than truthful. Does one take the word of Jodi's family over this boy who we know, without a shadow of doubt is a compulsive liar - Do we take the word of the police, the witness's over someone who is acting on behalf of this compulsive liar - I know who I choose. More so when one has witnessed this person lying. I first started to study this case, for that very reason. Drawn by those lies, of those claims of seeking 'Truth and Justice' - by way of persuasion, that power of suggestion. And that word play - the mockery of each and every person - who should speak up for the Crown, for our Justice system. Who do get it wrong. There is nothing in this case, to date to show that they did. The more I looked into this case, the finer the details that became known around this investigation and subsequent conviction. And of that question I used as a base, of "why suspicion fell upon Luke Mitchell and why he could not be eliminated"

And I am and have frequently been guilty of what I accuse others of - of word play and mockery. For in some areas, I find it extremely hard to digest, how people could possibly believe that this case was based upon flimsy evidence. That Luke Mitchell was fitted up and of tunnel vision. The evidence speaks for itself. IMO, most of it from the Mitchells themselves. They were the base of the suspicion first and foremost.  And I will not be bullied by others, by means of taking some high and mighty stance. That they somehow are better, more knowledgeable, as in their hands, they claim to have all of the evidence? - They have, in reality a mere fraction of what must have went into this investigation. And using 5% proves nothing, it only highlights just how much is in that missing 95%.

And when I speak of intellect and my mockery of it - you are not included, this is only aimed at those who cried guilty upon tabloid trash and now cry innocence by the very same means used. _ That they are not interested in the slightest in the actual case, for if they were they would not simply take the word of anyone. And when I talk of common sense - it is from that very same angle. That it is only common sense to realise, that if someone is pushing out a complete biased case of defence - then there is naturally a hell of lot more to show this to be wrong - that missing 95%