Author Topic: Is DR Sandra Lean a credible source?  (Read 62128 times)

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Offline Brietta

Re: Is DR Sandra Lean a credible source?
« Reply #405 on: June 08, 2021, 11:02:23 AM »
I agree, and I do my own research too.

I do the best I can using as far as possible independent or corroborated information.  It is difficult to get beyond the all pervading presence of Sandra Lean who must be regarded as a biased source.
"All I'm going to say is that we've conducted a very serious investigation and there's no indication that Madeleine McCann's parents are connected to her disappearance. On the other hand, we have a lot of evidence pointing out that Christian killed her," Wolter told the "Friday at 9"....

Offline Paranoid Android

Re: Is DR Sandra Lean a credible source?
« Reply #406 on: June 08, 2021, 12:00:32 PM »
You strike me as someone with quite a strong moral compass but fail to condemn categorically threats of violence against anyone as I have. How do we square that?

it would be naive, and lazy, to think that Dr Lean’s judgement isn’t coloured by her closeness to the Mitchell family, of course it is.

However it would also be naive, and lazy,  to assume that the police, or the press, were fair and impartial in their treatment of Luke.

That's very easy to square - I would condemn all threats of violence.

That's an interesting admission re Dr Lean.

As I've said before, the cops made loads of mistakes, and the press are s..m - it's possible to look at the press, and recognise that they can't be trusted or believed - jurors would have been instructed to ignore that, and they should have.

Dr Lean probably 'knows' as much as most people, but you've admitted that she's biased, and there are other people on her side of the case whose motives are questionable - I won't name names.

Tell you one person who knows more than Dr Lean - CM, and I don't think she can be trusted.

SM also knows more than Dr Lean - he wouldn't give his brother an alibi, and he and CM no longer speak - did the recent documentary mention that?

Offline faithlilly

Re: Is DR Sandra Lean a credible source?
« Reply #407 on: June 08, 2021, 12:29:06 PM »
That's very easy to square - I would condemn all threats of violence.

That's an interesting admission re Dr Lean.

As I've said before, the cops made loads of mistakes, and the press are s..m - it's possible to look at the press, and recognise that they can't be trusted or believed - jurors would have been instructed to ignore that, and they should have.

Dr Lean probably 'knows' as much as most people, but you've admitted that she's biased, and there are other people on her side of the case whose motives are questionable - I won't name names.

Tell you one person who knows more than Dr Lean - CM, and I don't think she can be trusted.

SM also knows more than Dr Lean - he wouldn't give his brother an alibi, and he and CM no longer speak - did the recent documentary mention that?

Glad to hear it.

Not interesting, simple logic. For me too many people have a dog in this fight, on both sides.

And yes, Dr Lean has access to more information than most of the public. You might question how she uses that information but that doesn’t change that fact.

You don’t need to trust her. Do your own research.

You complain about Dr Lean posting unsubstantiated gossip yet here you are doing the same. Can’t you see the hypocrisy in that? SM may not talk to CM but it could be due to any number of reasons which have nothing to do with Jodi’s murder. As to SM not giving his brother an alibi we all know that it isn’t quite as simple as that. SM forgot fixing his friend’s car just days after he had done it which proves his memory wasn’t great. Why do with assume that he’d remember whether his brother was home with any greater clarity?


« Last Edit: June 08, 2021, 12:35:10 PM by faithlilly »
Brietta posted on 10/04/2022 “But whether or not that is the reason behind the delay I am certain that Brueckner's trial is going to take place.”

Let’s count the months, shall we?

Offline Paranoid Android

Re: Is DR Sandra Lean a credible source?
« Reply #408 on: June 08, 2021, 12:47:27 PM »
Glad to hear it.

Not interesting, simple logic. For me too many people have a dog in this fight, on both sides.

And yes, Dr Lean has access to more information than most of the public. You might question how she uses that information but that doesn’t change that fact.

You don’t need to trust her. Do your own research.

You complain about Dr Lean posting unsubstantiated gossip yet here you are doing the same. Can’t you see the hypocrisy in that? SM may not talk to CM but it could be due to any number of reasons which have nothing to do with Jodi’s murder. As to SM not giving his brother an alibi we all know that it isn’t quite as simple as that. SM forgot fixing his friend’s car just days after he had done it which proves his memory wasn’t great. Why do with assume that he’d remember whether his brother was home with any greater clarity?

When have I complained about Dr Lean posting unsubstantiated gossip? Do you mean her digs at the Jones family?

Did the recent documentary mention that SM wouldn't give his brother an alibi, and he and CM no longer speak?

Offline faithlilly

Re: Is DR Sandra Lean a credible source?
« Reply #409 on: June 08, 2021, 05:17:29 PM »
When have I complained about Dr Lean posting unsubstantiated gossip? Do you mean her digs at the Jones family?

Did the recent documentary mention that SM wouldn't give his brother an alibi, and he and CM no longer speak?

I’m not going too get into the you said this and she said that kind of debate. I’m far too grown up and this is far too serious a subject for that kind of futile discussion.

And you know what? I’m not even going to ask you to prove your unsubstantiated claim about Corrine and Shane’s relationship because one, it’s none of our business and two it makes no difference to whether Luke is guilty or not.

Brietta posted on 10/04/2022 “But whether or not that is the reason behind the delay I am certain that Brueckner's trial is going to take place.”

Let’s count the months, shall we?

Offline Paranoid Android

Re: Is DR Sandra Lean a credible source?
« Reply #410 on: June 08, 2021, 11:47:57 PM »
Blimey!

Offline TruthSeeker2003

Re: Is DR Sandra Lean a credible source?
« Reply #411 on: June 09, 2021, 02:34:04 AM »
You really are a conundrum PA.

You strike me as someone with quite a strong moral compass but fail to condemn categorically threats of violence against anyone as I have. How do we square that?

Dr Lean has, more than anyone, made public information on the case but it would be naive, and lazy, to think that Dr Lean’s judgement isn’t coloured by her closeness to the Mitchell family, of course it is. However it would also be naive, and lazy,  to assume that the police, or the press, were fair and impartial in their treatment of Luke. For me that means cross referencing every piece of information in the public domain to, hopefully, get close to some semblance of the truth.
Please don’t make the lazy assumption that because I think Luke wasn’t  convicted beyond reasonable doubt that I automatically believe Dr Lean....I don’t...I do my research. Isn’t that what everyone should do?

Aye she's a grifter ask Stephanie Hall!
“I am a Truthseeker, searching for truth” “Make of that what you will”

Offline Nicholas

Re: Is DR Sandra Lean a credible source?
« Reply #412 on: June 09, 2021, 10:08:12 AM »

TBH I’m not sure I would trust the judgement of someone who married a convicted murderer, would you?

Sandra Lean is a grifter and a fraud

She’s calculated, dishonest and ‘clever’ - or at least she thinks she is (As do her followers)

Calculated, dishonest and clever’ were words used to describe convicted murderer Luke Mitchell

[25] The Crown also referred to the appellant's police statements at interview. In particular, in his closing submissions, the Advocate depute referred, at length, to excerpts from an interview on 14 August 2003. It was suggested that the appellant came across as calculating, clever and dishonest. Reference was made to contradictory statements concerning the failure to raise the alarm when the deceased failed to meet the appellant; to lies regarding his use of cannabis and the amount of contact he had had with Kimberley Thomson; and to outbursts which demonstrated the appellant's temper and arrogance. It was also suggested that the appellant's claim that no time had been fixed for meeting with the deceased and his description of his movements on the evening of the murder were incredible and that his assertion that he thought that the deceased had not turned up perhaps because she had been grounded did not make sense, given his prior conversation with Alan Ovens.

We all make errors of judgement and some convicted murderers innocence fraud can be convincing - especially if they’ve been ‘wrongly convicted’ - as Simon Hall was

Sandra Lean’s omissions in particular  - especially of her choice to not publish the SCCRC statement of reasons or Corinne and Luke Mitchell’s police witness statements is another example of her dishonesty

She is also a promoter of innocence fraud - Stephanie Hall is not!

Who writes this stuff? ⬇️ and when will Sandra Lean explain what she means by ‘factual innocence’ also referred to in her ‘thesis’ ‘HIDDEN IN PLAIN VIEW:
The impact of popular beliefs and perceptions, held as factual knowledge about the Criminal Justice System, on incidences of wrongful accusation and conviction.’

About the author (2018)
‘Dr Sandra Lean is an author and criminologist who has worked for 15 years with individuals and families claiming wrongful conviction and factual innocence. As well as writing books about miscarriage of justice, Dr Lean also assists with case reviews aiming to secure applications to the Court of Appeal or the Criminal Cases Review Commissions in the UK and helps produce podcasts, articles and website content highlighting individual cases.
https://books.google.co.uk/books/about/Innocents_Betrayed.html?id=b5AJvQEACAAJ&source=kp_book_description&redir_esc=y

Why was Sandra Lean’s 6 part podcast on killer Matthew Hamlen removed from the WWW?

Sandra Lean
I’d never have believed that simply telling the truth could be twisted so far out of recognition


⬆️ another example of her calculated and dishonest character ⬆️

http://miscarriageofjustice.co/index.php?topic=66.msg639580#msg639580
« Last Edit: June 09, 2021, 10:48:32 AM by Nicholas »
Who wants to take on this great massive lie?” Writer Martin Preib on the tsunami of innocence fraud sweeping our nation

Offline Nicholas

Re: Is DR Sandra Lean a credible source?
« Reply #413 on: June 09, 2021, 10:52:06 AM »

TBH I’m not sure I would trust the judgement of someone who married a convicted murderer, would you?

⬇️ and when will Sandra Lean explain what she means by ‘factual innocence’ also referred to in her ‘thesis’ ‘HIDDEN IN PLAIN VIEW:
The impact of popular beliefs and perceptions, held as factual knowledge about the Criminal Justice System, on incidences of wrongful accusation and conviction.’

Maybe you can explain Stephanie Hall’s ‘beliefs and perceptions, held as factual knowledge about the Criminal Justice System, on incidences of wrongful accusation and conviction‘ compared to Sandra Leans ?

And where can we read about Sandra Lean’s theories on those killers who con, or attempt to con, the criminal justice system - alongside the general public - like Simon Hall attempted to do ?
« Last Edit: June 09, 2021, 11:03:00 AM by Nicholas »
Who wants to take on this great massive lie?” Writer Martin Preib on the tsunami of innocence fraud sweeping our nation

Offline Nicholas

Re: Is DR Sandra Lean a credible source?
« Reply #414 on: June 09, 2021, 11:13:11 AM »

TBH I’m not sure I would trust the judgement of someone who married a convicted murderer, would you?

Sandra Lean also states,

One tiny grain of truth submerged in a deluge of half truths and outright lies - there’s no way to counter that...’

Here for context
https://m.facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=10221492945085639&id=1011563515

Sandra I view you as a promoter of innocence fraud.

What happened to your podcast on Matthew Hamlen?
‘Long Road to Justice’ ?

http://jeremybamberforum.co.uk/index.php/topic,551.msg448049.html#msg448049

One tiny grain of truth submerged in a deluge of half truths and outright lies - there’s no way to counter that’

It’s ‘countered’ as INNOCENCE FRAUD

‘Half truths’ & ‘outright lies’ - like the boys moped being seen propped up against the V

http://miscarriageofjustice.co/index.php?topic=12080.msg653301#msg653301

What was the name of the person who made these claims and was their evidence ever tested in court?

« Last Edit: June 09, 2021, 11:41:13 AM by Nicholas »
Who wants to take on this great massive lie?” Writer Martin Preib on the tsunami of innocence fraud sweeping our nation

Offline Parky41

Re: Is DR Sandra Lean a credible source?
« Reply #415 on: June 09, 2021, 12:14:13 PM »
Quote
"looking for criminality in everything" - and this lion with the gazelle. How fitting.



As an investigation does - and exactly why LM is in Jail. Where everyone holds a question mark above them in those first days of a murder. Of anyone close to the victim. Bash on with your simple ten minutes lapse in CM memory. - It does not change the truth. And SM did not give his first statement days after, giving time for any memory lapse. And when his memory was given to him, he remembered the impossible. Of having a conversation with his mother when she arrived home at her "usual" time. And those exact reasons set upon solid foundations - for that suspicion. - the exact reason why Ms Lean had him (SM) down as suffering from PTSD upon discovering Jodi was dead. - somewhat rich to say the lease. However. Those clear reasons for suspicion, of knowing the whole thing was concocted, of striving to give an alibi. Of every detail of that 40mins from five past five until a qtr to six. Of multiple changes in statements. - Can you remember the TV programme Luke claimed to be watching which went up in smoke also, once he had to have been out the door by 5.30pm. - I'm sure it will come back to you. However:

Just to clarify a couple of things to clear up some misunderstandings being branded out - as always down to that jumble of misinformation from one's leader. There was no bike seen at the V - it is physically impossible. There was CCTV footage of both boys, JF and GD. Together. There were other witnesses least not the ones who saw them arriving home at 5.30pm. They were on RDP onto LP for less than 20mins. Every male connected to the deceased or near to the locus had DNA samples taken. Both JF and GD could be eliminated from any partials or otherwise found at the crime scene. There can be no similar DNA - neither JF nor GD were genetically connected to Jodi. They were neither cousin nor second cousins. He could not have cut his hair to look like his cousin. - Not cousins.

That potential sighting of a male walking along Easthouse's Road was a false trail. It did end after the ID of of him and the guy on Morris Road - This man had been on Easthouse's Road but it was not the 30th of June. The person who made claim to further ID this male carrying this girls coffin, was not ignored. He had already been ID and eliminated - it was not that day. Furthermore the people carrying this girls coffin were staff from the funeral directors. - We do not need much common sense to realise people are being led down the garden path - common sense tells us one thing clearly. If there had been a positive sighting of Jodi Jones around 5pm on the 30th of June, heading in the direction of AB's sighting - it would have been used. And to remember one clear fact in all of this - Ms Lean does not hold everything. These are nonsense claims of things being buried and so forth - they simply had no merit in being kept in those defence files. DF knew everything around these possible sightings as did the Crown and onto the SCCRC.

And we know without a shadow of doubt the reasons why JF is highlighted above GD. For that simple basis of the simplicity of him. After DF had questioned him about the possibility of  being that potential suspect that AB had witnessed, reasons as to why he had cut his hair - "i dunno". AD asked him "if you were here then you could not have been there, is that correct?" - his reply "I dunno" - which tells us everything we need to know about JF. And as stated, tells us exactly why he is picked on.

And of Faithlilly in whichever role suits the moment? - These nonsense claims that there was the same if not more circumstantial evidence against JF - as above. That whilst LM could not be eliminated from those multiple DNA samples, that law of averages - these lads could. And these nonsense claims of failing to keep an appointment that evening. - That will be that gazelle and looking for criminality in everything - Where was JF and GD - there were two of them remember.These lads had went about their evening. In the company of different people. Why was LM not at cadets? Why did LM say he had went up to borrow a torch off SM when he was up town. Travelling around 8 miles to fuel up a car when there were multiple stations close at hand? - What did JF say about the bike at the railings, the yellow one? This nonsense yet again that these lads were not investigated? - They were investigated to the max. They had to to be. - Exactly for the purpose of elimination and precisely for any cross reference of evidence upon the stand.

And of elimination - Ms Lean does not actually know when they were eliminated, what she does do is go by information gathered. It was the boys whom were telling people they had been eliminated - and it is partly to do with this, that she tells us yet again, reason as to why [Name removed] was not happy with THEM. Not just JF but both of them.  - Therefore this touting out that these boys had been eliminated within 12? days of this murder, came from their mouths. Not the police - as we know that the police, do not go around telling people, if they would have been eliminated or not. 

So that garden path - No bike at the V and no boys in the woods. On these paths for less than 20mins. Witnessed. Yes, we hear continuously about JF - he was with GD, they were part of two people on this path. JF is picked on like that lion with it's gazelle - to claw away at the remains of anything one can try to use - to distract away from LM. - As always, Faithlilly you do a startling job of describing your very actions to a T along with Ms Lean?

As Nicholas pointed out - that vital element of that feel of a witness when taken that information first hand. And of that vital necessity of doing precognitions. For both the Crown and the defence. To go over those very statements with the people who had given them - face to face. And whilst Faithlilly may say - about it being naive, to not realise that Ms Lean would naturally have been influenced by the Mitchells - she was not, for even a second - meaning she was wrong, in anything.  - was she? For she puts complete trust and recites it all, and speaks in that remarkable mirror likeness of her?
 
Whatever role, from whatever ego/person - That strength in numbers? - Does not give strength to the nonsense being pushed out. These sticks and stones against others. - The blemishes on their characters. - This constant "what about them" - Does not change the evidence that convicted LM.  That compete naivety - Of having to declare LM in theory innocent. To brush him to the side. - To then look for that criminality in all else. That complete mess in the way it is pushed out - that leaves most of the followers, scratching their heads - trying to piece these suspects together, to solve this 'who done it'.  To the point of empowering some into a frenzy - making statements such as this from MR "admit it, you and your b/f killed you sister .... you evil b........s"

And back to this - influenced by the Mitchells - And that New York journalist, the rights he was given to tell the story, exactly how the murderer wanted it told? -When he was professing innocence. - All those crosses to bare? Which one has to ask themselves. - Do the Mitchells hold Jodi responsible for upsetting LM that day? ( A thought not a fact. IMO) Was it her fault that he turned on her? Is it by way of fault of the Jones family, of the truth they told, that complete contradiction to LM's account - Of Jodi getting out earlier. Of this ban on the path. Of this "mucking around up here". Of Jodi getting changed. Of not having something of Jodi's for the dog to scent with. Of LM climbing the wall at the Gino spot. Of LM not going past this V break. Of saying he thought Jodi had been grounded - And onto the "notorious little liar" (CM) for saying Luke had told him "she is not coming out" And onto frequenting this woodland, of knowing of this existence of this V break - Of every single excuse made for LM. That "half a mars bar" situ. Those ridiculous attempt at trying to simplify everything about him - and onto those complete OTT sticks and stones of others.

Of having a knife sharp enough to cut cannabis in the house. Of threatening someone with a knife. Of having large quantities of cannabis. Of selling it on. Of missing appointments. - Every shady dubious nature of these others, these sticks and stones we are being shown - Every one of them completely over taken with that of LM and SM. Of his age that all and sundry want to use as this meek little boy. Of being 14 - Of carrying knives, of using them on others, (Jodi being one, when jabbing her in the leg with it)  of describing the best way to kill someone. Of having more than one knife sharp enough to cut cannabis on person as well as his home. A certain type of knife, a skunting knife. A lockblade. Of having large quantities of cannabis. Of selling it on. Of sticking his middle finger up to every type of authority including his mother. Of being allowed to have underage sex at home. Of smoking/drinking at home. Of being the person Jodi was meeting that day. Of being ID not once but twice at both ends of this path. Of being a compulsive liar. Of leading this girls family straight to her, which only the murderer could have done. In that record breaking time of less than 10mins. Of entering this woodland. NO unfamiliarity, no trepidation - straight to her. Of describing those clothes, that hair fastener and that tree. - They passed a lie detector - so did Ted Bundy.  on more than one occasion. - He was not at home, that alibi they strived to give - completely dissolved back into the hot air from where it came.

So dig away at these others - try as one might. These others do not even touch the surface of the circumstantial case against LM. We have been shown that DNA does not make a murderer. We have been shown that being close to the scene of crime does not make you responsible for it. - We have been shown without a doubt - that LM was no ordinary 14yr old. From every action that came from himself, his person, his personality - Those who are hidden amongst us?
« Last Edit: June 09, 2021, 12:27:54 PM by Parky41 »

Offline Nicholas

Re: Is DR Sandra Lean a credible source?
« Reply #416 on: June 09, 2021, 01:37:52 PM »
One tiny grain of truth submerged in a deluge of half truths and outright lies - there’s no way to counter that’

It’s ‘countered’ as INNOCENCE FRAUD

‘Half truths’ & ‘outright lies’ - like the boys moped being seen propped up against the V

http://miscarriageofjustice.co/index.php?topic=12080.msg653301#msg653301

What was the name of the person who made these claims and was their evidence ever tested in court?

How does Sandra Lean propose the witness - who’s evidence suggested the moped could be seen propped up at the V in the wall, from the tool hire shop - should be tested?

I’m Sandra Lean. Since 2003, I have studied injustice in the UK. I’ve worked with individuals, families, campaign groups, media personnel, experts, specialists and members of the public, to try to raise awareness of the terrible flaws at the heart of our Justice Systems.
Because it’s such a huge problem, with so many aspects to be addressed, it’s an enormous task to create a central platform where real stories can be told and heard, developments in the CJS can be monitored, new and current information can be found and support for those seeking to have the truth uncovered is available, which is why the aim of Long Road to Justice is to work alongside other groups and organisations with similar aims
.   
https://longroadtojustice.com/about
Who wants to take on this great massive lie?” Writer Martin Preib on the tsunami of innocence fraud sweeping our nation

Offline Nicholas

Re: Is DR Sandra Lean a credible source?
« Reply #417 on: June 09, 2021, 02:07:35 PM »
 
Whatever role, from whatever ego/person - That strength in numbers? - Does not give strength to the nonsense being pushed out.


And no amount of nonsense ‘pushed out’ by channel 5 TV shows, podcasts, videos or James English interviews will make an iota of difference to Luke Mitchell’s murder conviction
Who wants to take on this great massive lie?” Writer Martin Preib on the tsunami of innocence fraud sweeping our nation

Offline Nicholas

Re: Is DR Sandra Lean a credible source?
« Reply #418 on: June 09, 2021, 02:09:03 PM »
And no amount of nonsense ‘pushed out’ by channel 5 TV shows, podcasts, videos or James English interviews will make an iota of difference to Luke Mitchell’s murder conviction

For anyone who did watch the channel 5 TV show

Luke Mitchell claimed this time round to have seen Jodi Jones body

But this isn’t what he said initially - He referred to a pair of legs

From para 30 of May 2008 CoA judgement
He had looked to his left, walked around six paces in that direction and had seen the deceased's legs close to a tree
« Last Edit: June 09, 2021, 02:12:17 PM by Nicholas »
Who wants to take on this great massive lie?” Writer Martin Preib on the tsunami of innocence fraud sweeping our nation

Offline Nicholas

Re: Is DR Sandra Lean a credible source?
« Reply #419 on: June 09, 2021, 02:15:52 PM »


These sticks and stones against others. - The blemishes on their characters. - This constant "what about them" - Does not change the evidence that convicted LM.  That compete naivety - Of having to declare LM in theory innocent. To brush him to the side. - To then look for that criminality in all else.

And all been done before - Simon Hall being one example
Who wants to take on this great massive lie?” Writer Martin Preib on the tsunami of innocence fraud sweeping our nation