Author Topic: Was the NHS Protected at the Cost of Lives in Care Homes ?  (Read 1249 times)

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Offline faithlilly

https://uk.reuters.com/article/uk-health-coronavirus-britain-elderly-sp/special-report-in-shielding-its-hospitals-from-covid-19-britain-left-many-of-the-weakest-exposed-idUKKBN22H2EI

Why were hundreds, if not thousands, of elderly people, many who had tested positive for coronavirus, sent back to from hospital to their care homes to infect their fellow residents and carers ?Why when we were supposed to be protecting our elderly was the virus allowed to run amok through our care home system ? Was this what Cummings meant when he said while talking about herd immunity that ‘so what if a few old people die’ ?
« Last Edit: May 07, 2020, 06:59:29 PM by Faithlilly »

Offline Davel

Re: Was the NHS Protected at the Cost of Lives in Care Homes ?
« Reply #1 on: May 07, 2020, 08:51:44 PM »
https://uk.reuters.com/article/uk-health-coronavirus-britain-elderly-sp/special-report-in-shielding-its-hospitals-from-covid-19-britain-left-many-of-the-weakest-exposed-idUKKBN22H2EI

Why were hundreds, if not thousands, of elderly people, many who had tested positive for coronavirus, sent back to from hospital to their care homes to infect their fellow residents and carers ?Why when we were supposed to be protecting our elderly was the virus allowed to run amok through our care home system ? Was this what Cummings meant when he said while talking about herd immunity that ‘so what if a few old people die’ ?

The decision to discharge a patient from hospital is taken by doctors... There was more than enough capacity to cope with covid patients..

Offline Vertigo Swirl

Re: Was the NHS Protected at the Cost of Lives in Care Homes ?
« Reply #2 on: May 07, 2020, 09:20:56 PM »
On the Madeleine forum if you quoted an unnamed source in the MSM you’d be sneered at and ridiculed. On this part of the forum however it seems unnamed sources in the media are good to go.
Mare's eat oat's and doe's eat oat's and little lamb's eat ivy.

Offline mrswah

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Re: Was the NHS Protected at the Cost of Lives in Care Homes ?
« Reply #3 on: May 07, 2020, 09:51:23 PM »
https://uk.reuters.com/article/uk-health-coronavirus-britain-elderly-sp/special-report-in-shielding-its-hospitals-from-covid-19-britain-left-many-of-the-weakest-exposed-idUKKBN22H2EI

Why were hundreds, if not thousands, of elderly people, many who had tested positive for coronavirus, sent back to from hospital to their care homes to infect their fellow residents and carers ?Why when we were supposed to be protecting our elderly was the virus allowed to run amok through our care home system ? Was this what Cummings meant when he said while talking about herd immunity that ‘so what if a few old people die’ ?

I'm a cynic, I'm afraid.  I don't believe the primary aim was ever to protect the elderly or those already "vulnerable".  They have been told to stay at home (and care homes are "home" for many), so that they wouldn't overwhelm the NHS, ie use hospital beds and resources.

The NHS has been under-resourced and/or badly managed (I'm not sure which) for many years, and it would not have been able to cope with hundreds of very frail/elderly/sick patients. That wouldn't have looked too good for our government!

As for Dominic Cummings, I don't really believe he's that wicked.

Offline faithlilly

Re: Was the NHS Protected at the Cost of Lives in Care Homes ?
« Reply #4 on: May 08, 2020, 12:50:44 AM »
The decision to discharge a patient from hospital is taken by doctors... There was more than enough capacity to cope with covid patients..

They didn’t know that at the time. I think it is beyond dispute that elderly patients who had tested positive were sent back to care homes....care homes that had, at first and now, limited access to PPE and tests. I have several friends who work in care homes and each tell similar stories. One was terrified to go back to work after her holidays because she felt so vulnerable due to inadequate protection.

Offline faithlilly

Re: Was the NHS Protected at the Cost of Lives in Care Homes ?
« Reply #5 on: May 08, 2020, 12:52:49 AM »
I'm a cynic, I'm afraid.  I don't believe the primary aim was ever to protect the elderly or those already "vulnerable".  They have been told to stay at home (and care homes are "home" for many), so that they wouldn't overwhelm the NHS, ie use hospital beds and resources.

The NHS has been under-resourced and/or badly managed (I'm not sure which) for many years, and it would not have been able to cope with hundreds of very frail/elderly/sick patients. That wouldn't have looked too good for our government!

As for Dominic Cummings, I don't really believe he's that wicked.

I think he’d see it as pragmatic rather than wicked.

Offline Brietta

Re: Was the NHS Protected at the Cost of Lives in Care Homes ?
« Reply #6 on: May 08, 2020, 02:08:48 PM »
I'm a cynic, I'm afraid.  I don't believe the primary aim was ever to protect the elderly or those already "vulnerable".  They have been told to stay at home (and care homes are "home" for many), so that they wouldn't overwhelm the NHS, ie use hospital beds and resources.

The NHS has been under-resourced and/or badly managed (I'm not sure which) for many years, and it would not have been able to cope with hundreds of very frail/elderly/sick patients. That wouldn't have looked too good for our government!

As for Dominic Cummings, I don't really believe he's that wicked.

Don't you think it rather odd that we are even mentioning an unelected political 'adviser' Dominic Cummings as a player in the same breath as the infected elderly and vulnerable dispatched from hospital to care homes where uninfected elderly and vulnerable reside.

Not forgetting that no provision was made to provide protective clothing for carers who in many instances had little or no training in dealing with what happens in a pandemic.

Smacks to me as akin to biological warfare against the elderly which flies in the face of any pretence of us being a caring and nurturing society.

When this is over, I await the inquest (if any) into this particular situation with interest.
The remit of Operation Grange is to investigate ...  "(as if the abduction occurred in the UK)"

Offline faithlilly

Re: Was the NHS Protected at the Cost of Lives in Care Homes ?
« Reply #7 on: May 08, 2020, 02:22:27 PM »
Don't you think it rather odd that we are even mentioning an unelected political 'adviser' Dominic Cummings as a player in the same breath as the infected elderly and vulnerable dispatched from hospital to care homes where uninfected elderly and vulnerable reside.

Not forgetting that no provision was made to provide protective clothing for carers who in many instances had little or no training in dealing with what happens in a pandemic.

Smacks to me as akin to biological warfare against the elderly which flies in the face of any pretence of us being a caring and nurturing society.

When this is over, I await the inquest (if any) into this particular situation with interest.

And the fact that Cummings is involved in SAGE is equally troubling considering his past history.

Offline mrswah

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Re: Was the NHS Protected at the Cost of Lives in Care Homes ?
« Reply #8 on: May 08, 2020, 02:30:21 PM »
Don't you think it rather odd that we are even mentioning an unelected political 'adviser' Dominic Cummings as a player in the same breath as the infected elderly and vulnerable dispatched from hospital to care homes where uninfected elderly and vulnerable reside.

Not forgetting that no provision was made to provide protective clothing for carers who in many instances had little or no training in dealing with what happens in a pandemic.

Smacks to me as akin to biological warfare against the elderly which flies in the face of any pretence of us being a caring and nurturing society.

When this is over, I await the inquest (if any) into this particular situation with interest.


The carers who are "outside the NHS" have been treated appallingly, IMO, and they don't even get paid very much. Yet, those I have seen interviewed in the media seem absolutely  dedicated to the people they look after.

I take a very dim view of the fact that all those patients were kicked out of hospital in the first place, but this isn't a new phenomenon. The NHS always wants to get people out of hospital as soon as possible, often before they have recovered sufficiently. It's not only elderly people either. These days, you need to be in danger of dying before you can get a hospital bed-----IMO.

What is happening in many care homes is appalling, but I feel even sorrier for elderly people who live alone in their own homes, and who rely on carers who might or might not turn up.

Dominic Cummings has far too much influence------again, my opinion, and I don't like it. However, I wont go as far as to say he wants elderly people to die. As far as I know, there is no actual evidence that he said it--------or is there?


Offline G-Unit

Re: Was the NHS Protected at the Cost of Lives in Care Homes ?
« Reply #9 on: May 08, 2020, 10:57:37 PM »
Care homes are private commercial businesses so it was up to the owners to keep their residents and staff safe, surely?
No-one here believes the parents were directly involved in MM's disappearance because belief without evidence is useless.

Offline mrswah

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Re: Was the NHS Protected at the Cost of Lives in Care Homes ?
« Reply #10 on: May 08, 2020, 11:20:52 PM »
Care homes are private commercial businesses so it was up to the owners to keep their residents and staff safe, surely?

You have a point there, and I have heard this argument put forward before. After all, they charge enough.

Are all care homes private businesses, do you know?

Offline faithlilly

Re: Was the NHS Protected at the Cost of Lives in Care Homes ?
« Reply #11 on: May 08, 2020, 11:44:27 PM »
Care homes are private commercial businesses so it was up to the owners to keep their residents and staff safe, surely?

https://www.carehomeselection.co.uk/factsheets/difference-council-owned-care-homes-privately-owned-care-homes/

Offline Vertigo Swirl

Re: Was the NHS Protected at the Cost of Lives in Care Homes ?
« Reply #12 on: May 08, 2020, 11:59:46 PM »
You have a point there, and I have heard this argument put forward before. After all, they charge enough.

Are all care homes private businesses, do you know?
84% are, but of course it’s totally the government’s fault if they aren’t run efficiently

https://www.theguardian.com/society/2019/sep/19/84-of-care-home-beds-in-england-owned-by-private-firms
Mare's eat oat's and doe's eat oat's and little lamb's eat ivy.

Offline Davel

Re: Was the NHS Protected at the Cost of Lives in Care Homes ?
« Reply #13 on: May 09, 2020, 08:34:17 AM »
Care homes are private commercial businesses so it was up to the owners to keep their residents and staff safe, surely?

You are absolutely right......commercial businesses making a lot of money...often owned by doctors

Offline Davel

Re: Was the NHS Protected at the Cost of Lives in Care Homes ?
« Reply #14 on: May 09, 2020, 08:38:25 AM »
From the daily mail confirming its the doctors...not the govt...sending patients back to care homes.then we have GPs who wont visit the care homes....

Hospitals' deadly betrayal: Doctors sent elderly patients back to care homes despite KNOWING they had coronavirus but did not tell staff and triggered new outbreaks