UK Justice Forum

Disappeared and Abducted Children and Young Adults => Madeleine McCann (3) disappeared from her parent's holiday apartment at Ocean Club, Praia da Luz, Portugal on 3 May 2007. No trace of her has ever been found. => Topic started by: DCI on May 29, 2013, 05:37:54 PM

Title: Amarals wife. Alexandra Sofia de Sousa Manjua Leal complaint to the police
Post by: DCI on May 29, 2013, 05:37:54 PM
Alexandra Sofia de Sousa Manjua Leal complaint to the police

Alexandra Sofia de Sousa Manjua Leal

Excellency

Dr. Guilhermino Encarnação

Faro's Director of the Judiciary Police

Faro, 23/12/2007


Dear Sir:

As you know I'm the wife of the Coordinator of Criminal Investigation Gonçalo Amaral, with whom I have a daughter minor of age, with 4 years old, named Inês Sofia. You know also that Inês Sofia is living temporarily with her father
By the present way I want to expose to you:

1. As agreed with my husband, Inês Sofia should spend Christmas with me, since last Thrusday, day 20th. In that day, I contacted Gonçalo by mobile phone, and I was informed that Inês was with him, in trip to Coimbra and would only return on the following day;

2. On Friday 21th, I called again my husband, around lunch time. He informed me they were still on trip and at soon he arrive to Faro he will give me Inês. I waited until 8 PM without any news and Gonçalo never answered my phone calls. I then decided to go to a pub where I encountered Gonçalo and other colleagues of him consuming alcoholic beverages, Asking him by Inês Sofia, he answered, visible drunken, that “she was resting” and that he will give me the child the following day. Then he departed, driving an Audi car from the police.

3.On Saturday 22nd , and after many attempts, my husband finally answered the phone in the middle of the afternoon, and asked me to get Inês in home. I rushed to the residence, but nobody was there. After a while, Gonçalo appeared driving the same car, and again in a notorious state of drunkenness. Having asked him for Inês Sofia, he ordered me to go inside the house, where he insulted me and threatened me of death.

4. Today, Sunday 23th, and after numerous attempts, Gonçalo never answered his phone and he is not at home.

Unfortunately, this situation is not an unique and isolated act, and you Sir well know about other times in the past where I've also asked for your help. Once more, I ask again for your help, in order to guarantee Inês Sofia integrity, and in order to localize her.

Best Regards,

Alexandra Sofia de Sousa Manjua Leal

(http://i84.servimg.com/u/f84/12/44/92/11/letter10.jpg)

(http://i1296.photobucket.com/albums/ag1/gilet2013/Policereciept1438x600_zps352753ee.jpg)(http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_0PRT7WgBWRI/TPfdaxACNLI/AAAAAAAAAC4/PWFqM0dD-qI/s1600/Image%2B12%2Bpolice%2Breciept2%2B%2528442%2Bx%2B600%2529.jpg)
Title: Re: Amarals wife. Alexandra Sofia de Sousa Manjua Leal complaint to the police
Post by: Redblossom on May 29, 2013, 06:27:22 PM
A discredited forgery, and nothing to do with the case apart from highlighting the obscene lengths some people go to



 next...
 8)--))
Title: Re: Amarals wife. Alexandra Sofia de Sousa Manjua Leal complaint to the police
Post by: debunker on May 29, 2013, 06:35:39 PM
A discredited forgery, and nothing to do with the case apart from highlighting the obscene lengths some people go to



 next...
 8)--))

Your evidence for it being a forgery is......

Or is it just your hope that it may be a forgery?
Title: Re: Amarals wife. Alexandra Sofia de Sousa Manjua Leal complaint to the police
Post by: DCI on May 29, 2013, 06:38:54 PM
A discredited forgery, and nothing to do with the case apart from highlighting the obscene lengths some people go to



 next...
 8)--))

Thats what Joanna Morais said. She was wrong too. Never mind, its genuine alright.
Title: Re: Amarals wife. Alexandra Sofia de Sousa Manjua Leal complaint to the police
Post by: Redblossom on May 29, 2013, 06:40:10 PM
A discredited forgery, and nothing to do with the case apart from highlighting the obscene lengths some people go to



 next...
 8)--))

Your evidence for it being a forgery is......

Or is it just your hope that it may be a forgery?

You do make assumptions and accusations dont you such alot of the time dear, do your own donkey work, Sofia Leal has said so herself
Title: Re: Amarals wife. Alexandra Sofia de Sousa Manjua Leal complaint to the police
Post by: debunker on May 29, 2013, 06:44:51 PM
A discredited forgery, and nothing to do with the case apart from highlighting the obscene lengths some people go to



 next...
 8)--))

Your evidence for it being a forgery is......

Or is it just your hope that it may be a forgery?

You do make assumptions and accusations dont you such alot of the time dear, do your own donkey work, Sofia Leal has said so herself

No assumptions or accusations there- just a request for you to back up your post and a question about your possible motives.

Cite?
Title: Re: Amarals wife. Alexandra Sofia de Sousa Manjua Leal complaint to the police
Post by: DCI on May 29, 2013, 06:47:41 PM
A discredited forgery, and nothing to do with the case apart from highlighting the obscene lengths some people go to



 next...
 8)--))

Your evidence for it being a forgery is......

Or is it just your hope that it may be a forgery?

You do make assumptions and accusations dont you such alot of the time dear, do your own donkey work, Sofia Leal has said so herself

Course she has, she can't deny the official stamp, on it though.

next..
 8)--))
Title: Re: Amarals wife. Alexandra Sofia de Sousa Manjua Leal complaint to the police
Post by: registrar on May 29, 2013, 06:52:20 PM
dated, signed - that makes it a document

Anyone calling it a forgery - should rather have the guts to name the forgerer

CR - as we know, are watching
Title: Re: Amarals wife. Alexandra Sofia de Sousa Manjua Leal complaint to the police
Post by: Eleanor on May 29, 2013, 06:53:25 PM
It is true.  It is registered in The Police Station Log.  Both Gocalo Amaral and Sofia Leal are notorious liars.  And they were both found guilty in a Court of Law of cheating Amaral's brother.
Title: Re: Amarals wife. Alexandra Sofia de Sousa Manjua Leal complaint to the police
Post by: Redblossom on May 29, 2013, 07:05:09 PM
No assumptions or accusations there- just a request for you to back up your post and a question about your possible motives.

Cite?



My possible motives? Gosh, you are such a joker at times. The cite is there, you only have to GOOGLE, Im sure even you can manage that?

But lets be KIND to you

Wife of Gonçalo Amaral denies having reported her husband to the PJ for abuse and threats of death O Crime (appears in paper edition only)
 
"Our marriage went through a difficult phase and he always respected me"
 
Interviewer: José Leite
Issue: 19 February 2009
Thanks to 'Beachy' for translation
 
- "The McCann couple is clearly guilty of one thing: not telling the truth"
- "Gonçalo Amaral had no choice: to defend his dignity he had to leave the PJ"
 
In an exclusive interview in "O Crime", Sofia Leal, wife of Gonçalo Amaral, said the letter that the press suggested was directed to the PJ, and which speaks of insults, death threats and her husband's alcoholism is false, and that its disclosure is intended only to tarnish the image of the principal investigator of the "Maddie case".
 
Meanwhile, in a notice filed this week in the Court of Faro, Leonor's lawyer, who made the letter public, requested that the National Director of the PJ confirm the authenticity of the document.
 
O Crime - Do you consider that the letter disclosed by Leonor's lawyer is false? Then how is it explained that your signature is on it? What do you think is behind its dissemination in the current context?
 
Sofia Leal - Completely false, both the content and authorship. Furthermore, we need only look at the credibility and reputation of those who made it public, it is just one more slander, an attempt to tarnish the image of my husband. It seems that this time, in a desperate attempt, they are attacking one of the key pillars of Gonçalo Amaral's life: the family.
 
Accepting that the letter is false, has any legal action been taken against the perpetrator of the forgery?
 
Let me be very frank: unlike my husband, I do not believe in the justice system. This is not a critical sector, or even corporate. I respect, of course, the professionals of this sector. But, like nearly all the Portuguese, I know what would happen. From here until ten years, more or less, we would be in court discussing this issue, which, meanwhile, would have already expired. Anyway, I hope that Dr. Marcos Aragão, in the near future, will be committed in order to receive psychiatric treatment, his dementia being declared and considered inimputable in relation to the acts he has committed. Anyway, this week he will be reported to the Ethics Council of the Bar, an institution that does not accept in its midst people who do not conduct themselves with dignity in the career of the law.
 
Did Gonçalo Amaral once threaten you with death and insulted [you] as it says in the letter?
 
Never, as I said, the content of the document is completely false. Gonçalo is a very (sometimes too) peaceful person. [Anyone] who lives with us and knows our relationship knows the affection and respect with which he has always treated me. And this is indeed the pillar of our relationship.


http://www.mccannfiles.com/id131.html


Title: Re: Amarals wife. Alexandra Sofia de Sousa Manjua Leal complaint to the police
Post by: debunker on May 29, 2013, 07:08:58 PM
Your cosing is mashed.

So all we have is a denial by an embarrassed person. Has she sued the lawyer who published it- it looks libellous to me if it is a forgery.

Beachy did the translation. I know that her Portuguese is virtually nil.
Title: Re: Amarals wife. Alexandra Sofia de Sousa Manjua Leal complaint to the police
Post by: DCI on May 29, 2013, 07:16:34 PM

Your cosing is mashed.

So all we have is a denial by an embarrassed person. Has she sued the lawyer who published it- it looks libellous to me if it is a forgery.

Beachy did the translation. I know that her Portuguese is virtually nil.

Beachy did what translation, debunker?
Not the above, she didn't. It was done by a trusted, Portuguese person, years ago!
Title: Re: Amarals wife. Alexandra Sofia de Sousa Manjua Leal complaint to the police
Post by: Redblossom on May 29, 2013, 07:17:47 PM
My cosing is mashed? What does cosing mean? Thanks in advance DB

Registrar, CR can watch as much as they like, Sofia Leal states its a forgery, she should know, besides his is nothing more than a DCI and co attemptto blacken Mr Amarals name and sod all to do with Maddie vanishing off the face of the earth, perhaps time for some to get their  feetand brains on the ground
 8((()*/
Title: Re: Amarals wife. Alexandra Sofia de Sousa Manjua Leal complaint to the police
Post by: registrar on May 29, 2013, 07:17:58 PM
Beachy (another alleged ex copper)  had his paws on this doc?

Nuff said

Title: Re: Amarals wife. Alexandra Sofia de Sousa Manjua Leal complaint to the police
Post by: debunker on May 29, 2013, 07:19:10 PM

Your cosing is mashed.

So all we have is a denial by an embarrassed person. Has she sued the lawyer who published it- it looks libellous to me if it is a forgery.

Beachy did the translation. I know that her Portuguese is virtually nil.

Beachy did what translation, debunker?
Not the above, she didn't. It was done by a trusted, Portuguese person, years ago!

I am talking about the interview translation in RedBlossom's mashed coding which clearly says:

"Thanks to 'Beachy' for translation"

I know more than I care to discuss about Beachy. I do know that she lies through her teeth. But she is not fluent in Portuguese.
Title: Re: Amarals wife. Alexandra Sofia de Sousa Manjua Leal complaint to the police
Post by: DCI on May 29, 2013, 07:24:02 PM
dated, signed - that makes it a document

Anyone calling it a forgery - should rather have the guts to name the forgerer

CR - as we know, are watching

 8((()*/
I won't hold my breath, Registrar. They could always get a copy from Faro, no charge  ?>)()<
Title: Re: Amarals wife. Alexandra Sofia de Sousa Manjua Leal complaint to the police
Post by: DCI on May 29, 2013, 07:25:13 PM

Your cosing is mashed.

So all we have is a denial by an embarrassed person. Has she sued the lawyer who published it- it looks libellous to me if it is a forgery.

Beachy did the translation. I know that her Portuguese is virtually nil.

Beachy did what translation, debunker?
Not the above, she didn't. It was done by a trusted, Portuguese person, years ago!

I am talking about the interview translation in RedBlossom's mashed coding which clearly says:

"Thanks to 'Beachy' for translation"

I know more than I care to discuss about Beachy. I do know that she lies through her teeth. But she is not fluent in Portuguese.

My apologies, debunker  8()-000(
Title: Re: Amarals wife. Alexandra Sofia de Sousa Manjua Leal complaint to the police
Post by: registrar on May 29, 2013, 07:26:47 PM
My cosing is mashed? What does cosing mean? Thanks in advance DB

Registrar, CR can watch as much as they like, Sofia Leal states its a forgery, she should know, besides his is nothing more than a DCI and co attemptto blacken Mr Amarals name and sod all to do with Maddie vanishing off the face of the earth, perhaps time for some to get their  feetand brains on the ground
 8((()*/

She either wrote the doc and SIGNED it or she didn't - simple as

I go for the former

In judiciary terms Portugal is the wild west - peeps make statements and declarations at will

Worth the paper they are written on?

Debatable

But forgery remains forgery

And you, redblossom made that claim - back it up with evidence kindly
Title: Re: Amarals wife. Alexandra Sofia de Sousa Manjua Leal complaint to the police
Post by: debunker on May 29, 2013, 07:27:25 PM

Your cosing is mashed.

So all we have is a denial by an embarrassed person. Has she sued the lawyer who published it- it looks libellous to me if it is a forgery.

Beachy did the translation. I know that her Portuguese is virtually nil.

Beachy did what translation, debunker?
Not the above, she didn't. It was done by a trusted, Portuguese person, years ago!

I am talking about the interview translation in RedBlossom's mashed coding which clearly says:

"Thanks to 'Beachy' for translation"

I know more than I care to discuss about Beachy. I do know that she lies through her teeth. But she is not fluent in Portuguese.

My apologies, debunker  8()-000(

Thanks. Because of the mashed coding, I did not see it the first time either. Beachy deserves a thread of her own!
Title: Re: Amarals wife. Alexandra Sofia de Sousa Manjua Leal complaint to the police
Post by: DCI on May 29, 2013, 07:42:13 PM
My cosing is mashed? What does cosing mean? Thanks in advance DB

Registrar, CR can watch as much as they like, Sofia Leal states its a forgery, she should know, besides his is nothing more than a DCI and co attemptto blacken Mr Amarals name and sod all to do with Maddie vanishing off the face of the earth, perhaps time for some to get their  feetand brains on the ground
 8((()*/

She either wrote the doc and SIGNED it or she didn't - simple as

I go for the former

In judiciary terms Portugal is the wild west - peeps make statements and declarations at will

Worth the paper they are written on?

Debatable

But forgery remains forgery

And you, redblossom made that claim - back it up with evidence kindly

If its a forgery, then she should have a word with Dr. Guilhermino Encarnação.  8**8:/:

Amaral needs no help, to blacken his name. he did that himself, years before Madeleine was abducted.
Title: Re: Amarals wife. Alexandra Sofia de Sousa Manjua Leal complaint to the police
Post by: DCI on May 29, 2013, 08:00:50 PM

I did not make the claim it was a forgery, Sofia Leal did, if you think she is a liar, take it up with her, ta

NOW what has this to do with Maddie vanishing into thn air?

A discredited forgery, and nothing to do with the case apart from highlighting the obscene lengths some people go to

 next...
 8)--))

Yes you did!

of course I did, because the alledged author said it was, how hard is that for you to understand? it really cant be that hard. Seriously. its your prerogative to believe marcos the mad lawyer, who has admitted to using illegal tactics in this case, if thats your kind of thing, totally up to you

 @)(++(* @)(++(* @)(++(* @)(++(* @)(++(* @)(++(*

Insult, when you know you are wrong. Marcos is that mad, he beat Gonc, hands down, in court  8)><(
Title: Re: Amarals wife. Alexandra Sofia de Sousa Manjua Leal complaint to the police
Post by: icabodcrane on May 29, 2013, 08:59:20 PM
No assumptions or accusations there- just a request for you to back up your post and a question about your possible motives.

Cite?



My possible motives? Gosh, you are such a joker at times. The cite is there, you only have to GOOGLE, Im sure even you can manage that?


 
 
" Anyway, I hope that Dr Marcos Aragao, in the near future, will be committed in order to receive psychiatric treatment, his dementia being declared and considered inimputable in relation to the acts he has committed. Anyway, this week he will be reported to the Ethics Council of the Bar, an institution that does not accept in its midst people who do not conduct themselves with dignity in the career of the law"
 

http://www.mccannfiles.com/id131.html

Is Marcos Aragao the lawyer who admitted being paid by Metado 3,  the McCann's private detectives ?    (   or was that someone else ? )
Title: Re: Amarals wife. Alexandra Sofia de Sousa Manjua Leal complaint to the police
Post by: Mrs. B on May 29, 2013, 09:10:29 PM
(http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_0PRT7WgBWRI/TPfdaxACNLI/AAAAAAAAAC4/PWFqM0dD-qI/s1600/Image%2B12%2Bpolice%2Breciept2%2B%2528442%2Bx%2B600%2529.jpg)

Hmm....that will take some explaining - I think.
Title: Re: Amarals wife. Alexandra Sofia de Sousa Manjua Leal complaint to the police
Post by: DCI on May 29, 2013, 09:19:33 PM
(http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_0PRT7WgBWRI/TPfdaxACNLI/AAAAAAAAAC4/PWFqM0dD-qI/s1600/Image%2B12%2Bpolice%2Breciept2%2B%2528442%2Bx%2B600%2529.jpg)

Hmm....that will take some explaining - I think.

Thanks Mrs B, been looking for that.  8((()*/

Do you mind if I add it to my original post?
Title: Re: Amarals wife. Alexandra Sofia de Sousa Manjua Leal complaint to the police
Post by: Mrs. B on May 29, 2013, 09:23:31 PM
Not at all, DCI  8((()*/
Title: Re: Amarals wife. Alexandra Sofia de Sousa Manjua Leal complaint to the police
Post by: DCI on May 29, 2013, 09:25:56 PM
Not at all, DCI  8((()*/

Thanks, added  8)--))
Title: Re: Amarals wife. Alexandra Sofia de Sousa Manjua Leal complaint to the police
Post by: Redblossom on May 29, 2013, 10:01:02 PM
No assumptions or accusations there- just a request for you to back up your post and a question about your possible motives.

Cite?



My possible motives? Gosh, you are such a joker at times. The cite is there, you only have to GOOGLE, Im sure even you can manage that?


 
 
" Anyway, I hope that Dr Marcos Aragao, in the near future, will be committed in order to receive psychiatric treatment, his dementia being declared and considered inimputable in relation to the acts he has committed. Anyway, this week he will be reported to the Ethics Council of the Bar, an institution that does not accept in its midst people who do not conduct themselves with dignity in the career of the law"
 

http://www.mccannfiles.com/id131.html

Is Marcos Aragao the lawyer who admitted being paid by Metado 3,  the McCann's private detectives ?    (   or was that someone else ? )

Yep that was him admitted to getting paid to dig dirt on mr amaral, quite an odious character at best

You would think the mccanns and their dodgy m3 cohorts woyod be looking for madeleine instead
Title: Re: Amarals wife. Alexandra Sofia de Sousa Manjua Leal complaint to the police
Post by: gilet on May 30, 2013, 01:07:39 AM
Might as well have the first page of the Police receipt for that letter from Sofia Amaral.

(http://i1296.photobucket.com/albums/ag1/gilet2013/Policereciept1438x600_zps352753ee.jpg)

Title: Re: Amarals wife. Alexandra Sofia de Sousa Manjua Leal complaint to the police
Post by: gilet on May 30, 2013, 01:12:01 AM
Quite clearly denials are not worth anything.

I saw Redblossom denied that the translation she had posted had been done by the fraud, Beachy.

Hilarious really when her own post contained the evidence that it was done by that fraud called Beachy.

So what reliance can we place on simple denials. I would suggest none at all.

Its baffling to me that while Sofia Leal has (due to embarrassment or maybe at the request/co-ercion of Goncalo?) made a denial about the matter, not one of the police officers has ever denied it and quite a few were involved in taking that statement.

Can anyone explain if this was the forgery that is claimed by some, then why have the police not denied it being the real thing, why none of these officers have denied their involvement in it etc.?

Till they do, I think we should take the denial with the same pinch of salt as that lie/denial by Redblossom earlier.
Title: Re: Amarals wife. Alexandra Sofia de Sousa Manjua Leal complaint to the police
Post by: Angelo222 on May 30, 2013, 08:29:10 AM
I don't think this thread should continue if there is the slightest possibility that the documents are fake.   Unless there is corroboration such as a separate report or even a newspaper article about this complaint I suggest it is archived immediately.
Title: Re: Amarals wife. Alexandra Sofia de Sousa Manjua Leal complaint to the police
Post by: Carana on May 30, 2013, 09:00:10 AM
It was submitted as a court document apparently.

It is described in point 26.

Tribunal Judicial da Comarca de Portimão

1º Juízo Criminal

Processo nº 330/04.2JAPTM

8-Participação apresentada pela esposa de Gonçalo de Sousa Amaral, contra o próprio marido, ao Director de Faro da Polícia Judiciária no dia 23 de Dezembro de 2007, constituído por 1 (uma) página;

9-Relatório do Serviço de Piquete da Directoria de Faro da Polícia Judiciária do dia 23 de Dezembro de 2007, constituído por 2 (duas) páginas.


http://www.asmeninasquevieramdasestrelas.com/juridica.html

Title: Re: Amarals wife. Alexandra Sofia de Sousa Manjua Leal complaint to the police
Post by: Mrs. B on May 30, 2013, 09:20:15 AM
Yes, this sentencing report mentions the "letter" - though regarded as not adding any NEW evidence, the document was clearly accepted by court as authentic.

http://www.dgsi.pt/jstj.nsf/954f0ce6ad9dd8b980256b5f003fa814/67e9f860c06af1d9802576a9004e4a2c?OpenDocument

It really never is a good idea to hand in OPEN letters at the front desk of your OH's place of work, addressed to his superiors, in a fit of temper.
Title: Re: Amarals wife. Alexandra Sofia de Sousa Manjua Leal complaint to the police
Post by: debunker on May 30, 2013, 09:26:30 AM
I don't think this thread should continue if there is the slightest possibility that the documents are fake.   Unless there is corroboration such as a separate report or even a newspaper article about this complaint I suggest it is archived immediately.

Except there seem to be official stamps.

Why do you say this when you are willing to host considerable defamatory material about the McCanns and the Tapas 7.

Bias?
Title: Re: Amarals wife. Alexandra Sofia de Sousa Manjua Leal complaint to the police
Post by: Chinagirl on May 30, 2013, 09:49:19 AM
I don't think this thread should continue if there is the slightest possibility that the documents are fake.   Unless there is corroboration such as a separate report or even a newspaper article about this complaint I suggest it is archived immediately.

Except there seem to be official stamps.

Why do you say this when you are willing to host considerable defamatory material about the McCanns and the Tapas 7.

Bias?

Debunker's point here is well made.

The only suggestion that the letter is fake has come from Leal herself, and "she would say that, wouldn't she?"
Title: Re: Amarals wife. Alexandra Sofia de Sousa Manjua Leal complaint to the police
Post by: Carana on May 30, 2013, 09:53:25 AM
My only concern is for Amaral's little girl who will also soon have access to the Internet.

I don't have a problem with the subject of this thread as it's a court document and she was directly involved in the underlying incident in question.

I would, however, object to a certain other alleged incident being posted - for her sake.
Title: Re: Amarals wife. Alexandra Sofia de Sousa Manjua Leal complaint to the police
Post by: Benice on May 30, 2013, 10:08:32 AM
Quite clearly denials are not worth anything.

I saw Redblossom denied that the translation she had posted had been done by the fraud, Beachy.

Hilarious really when her own post contained the evidence that it was done by that fraud called Beachy.

So what reliance can we place on simple denials. I would suggest none at all.

Its baffling to me that while Sofia Leal has (due to embarrassment or maybe at the request/co-ercion of Goncalo?) made a denial about the matter, not one of the police officers has ever denied it and quite a few were involved in taking that statement.

Can anyone explain if this was the forgery that is claimed by some, then why have the police not denied it being the real thing, why none of these officers have denied their involvement in it etc.?

Till they do, I think we should take the denial with the same pinch of salt as that lie/denial by Redblossom earlier.

I agree.  Also IMO the following quote from the letter is very telling.

Quote
Unfortunately, this situation is not an unique and isolated act, and you Sir well know about other times in the past where I've also asked for your help.  Once more, I ask again for your help, in order to guarantee Inês Sofia integrity, and in order to localize her.  Unquote

If this IS true, then it gives weight to the letter being authentic - and would appear to be another complaint in a long line of them to the Director of Judiciary Police - all of which he would be able to confirm.     

If it's NOT true, then surely all Sofia Leal had to do was ask the Director to confirm that she had never made any previous complaints to him about Amaral's behaviour and that the claims made in the letter were untrue.     A statement from him to that effect  would have given a great deal of credence to her claim that the letter of complaint was a forgery.

It seems a simple and obvious solution - and would not involve any of the protracted legal issues which she gave as her reason for not sueing anyone.    So why didn't she do that?




Title: Re: Amarals wife. Alexandra Sofia de Sousa Manjua Leal complaint to the police
Post by: Redblossom on May 30, 2013, 10:16:26 AM
Quite clearly denials are not worth anything.

I saw Redblossom denied that the translation she had posted had been done by the fraud, Beachy.

Hilarious really when her own post contained the evidence that it was done by that fraud called Beachy.


So what reliance can we place on simple denials. I would suggest none at all.

Its baffling to me that while Sofia Leal has (due to embarrassment or maybe at the request/co-ercion of Goncalo?) made a denial about the matter, not one of the police officers has ever denied it and quite a few were involved in taking that statement.

Can anyone explain if this was the forgery that is claimed by some, then why have the police not denied it being the real thing, why none of these officers have denied their involvement in it etc.?

Till they do, I think we should take the denial with the same pinch of salt as that lie/denial by Redblossom earlier.

You are obviously very blind indeed then as I didnt post any such thing. Try specsavers and have a nice day.
 8((()*/
Title: Re: Amarals wife. Alexandra Sofia de Sousa Manjua Leal complaint to the police
Post by: Mrs. B on May 30, 2013, 10:18:08 AM
The problem, as I see it, is that it's very difficult to prove forgery once you have presented yourself IN PERSON to the officer in charge at the desk (i.e. one of your husband's colleagues who obviously will KNOW who you are), handed over an OPEN letter (which anyone of the officers present could read & probably did) addressed to your husband's boss?

Also, we do know of Ms. Leal's fondness for "open letters", that letter wasn't the last one she wrote.
Title: Re: Amarals wife. Alexandra Sofia de Sousa Manjua Leal complaint to the police
Post by: Angelo222 on May 30, 2013, 10:32:57 AM

Why do you say this when you are willing to host considerable defamatory material about the McCanns and the Tapas 7.

Bias?

Another challenge to Debunker.  Cite this defamatory material you so casually refer to??
Title: Re: Amarals wife. Alexandra Sofia de Sousa Manjua Leal complaint to the police
Post by: debunker on May 30, 2013, 11:30:25 AM

Why do you say this when you are willing to host considerable defamatory material about the McCanns and the Tapas 7.

Bias?

Another challenge to Debunker.  Cite this defamatory material you so casually refer to??

Almost everything about the McCanns and the Tapas 7.

If Sally Bercow's tweet "Why is Lord McAlpine Trending? Innocent Face" is libel, then most comments about the McCanns are also defamatory.

Last time I posted about this the thread was erased!
Title: Re: Amarals wife. Alexandra Sofia de Sousa Manjua Leal complaint to the police
Post by: sadie on May 30, 2013, 12:33:12 PM

Why do you say this when you are willing to host considerable defamatory material about the McCanns and the Tapas 7.

Bias?

Another challenge to Debunker.  Cite this defamatory material you so casually refer to??

Almost everything about the McCanns and the Tapas 7.

If Sally Bercow's tweet "Why is Lord McAlpine Trending? Innocent Face" is libel, then most comments about the McCanns are also defamatory.

Last time I posted about this the thread was erased!
We have all seen the defamatory posts about the Mccanns and the Tapas , Angelo.

Several were downright make up = lies

Maybe you missed them, but they were there.  Maybe eventually removed.  Dunno


Am not going to waste the time sourcing them because we have all seen them
Title: Re: Amarals wife. Alexandra Sofia de Sousa Manjua Leal complaint to the police
Post by: DCI on May 30, 2013, 01:35:35 PM
OK, Angelo, remove the thread, if you want to, it still won't change the FACT, that its true. Sorry if that hurts.
I thought, this forum, expected anything to be backed up with proof. You got it, but you still don't believe it 
Do you think I've got a PJ rubber stamp, on my desk?

You keep saying, if it was my Daughter, I'd do this, that and the other. Well she isn't, is she?
You would be over there, living on what? Don't say get a job, because you can't work and look for your daughter.

So you think the PJ, would give them a badge, so they could do what ever they want to find Madeleine? Yeah right!
The first time they, knocked on a door, they would be shown, dreaded police station stairs.
You expect them to drag the twins, around, with them, too? Great send the kids to a Portuguese school.

You really sound like, someone's been bending your ear.
Title: Re: Amarals wife. Alexandra Sofia de Sousa Manjua Leal complaint to the police
Post by: sadie on May 30, 2013, 02:05:40 PM
Exactly  DC1  8((()*/

That's what it sounds like to me too.  The [ censored word] are known for it ... reputedly
Title: Re: Amarals wife. Alexandra Sofia de Sousa Manjua Leal complaint to the police
Post by: Redblossom on May 30, 2013, 10:48:10 PM
It was submitted as a court document apparently.

It is described in point 26.

Tribunal Judicial da Comarca de Portimão

1º Juízo Criminal

Processo nº 330/04.2JAPTM

8-Participação apresentada pela esposa de Gonçalo de Sousa Amaral, contra o próprio marido, ao Director de Faro da Polícia Judiciária no dia 23 de Dezembro de 2007, constituído por 1 (uma) página;

9-Relatório do Serviço de Piquete da Directoria de Faro da Polícia Judiciária do dia 23 de Dezembro de 2007, constituído por 2 (duas) páginas.


http://www.asmeninasquevieramdasestrelas.com/juridica.html

unreliable source as its from the unreliable marcos

And the official .pt court one doesnt state sofia leal appeared in person does it? If so, i will give way here


Title: Re: Amarals wife. Alexandra Sofia de Sousa Manjua Leal complaint to the police
Post by: Carana on May 30, 2013, 10:55:27 PM
It was submitted as a court document apparently.

It is described in point 26.

Tribunal Judicial da Comarca de Portimão

1º Juízo Criminal

Processo nº 330/04.2JAPTM

8-Participação apresentada pela esposa de Gonçalo de Sousa Amaral, contra o próprio marido, ao Director de Faro da Polícia Judiciária no dia 23 de Dezembro de 2007, constituído por 1 (uma) página;

9-Relatório do Serviço de Piquete da Directoria de Faro da Polícia Judiciária do dia 23 de Dezembro de 2007, constituído por 2 (duas) páginas.


http://www.asmeninasquevieramdasestrelas.com/juridica.html

unreliable source as its from the unreliable marcos

And the official .pt court one doesnt state sofia leal appeared in person does it? If so, i will give way here

The point was whether the letter was a forgery or not.
Title: Re: Amarals wife. Alexandra Sofia de Sousa Manjua Leal complaint to the police
Post by: TTSOFAFM on May 30, 2013, 11:01:42 PM
It was submitted as a court document apparently.

It is described in point 26.

Tribunal Judicial da Comarca de Portimão

1º Juízo Criminal

Processo nº 330/04.2JAPTM

8-Participação apresentada pela esposa de Gonçalo de Sousa Amaral, contra o próprio marido, ao Director de Faro da Polícia Judiciária no dia 23 de Dezembro de 2007, constituído por 1 (uma) página;

9-Relatório do Serviço de Piquete da Directoria de Faro da Polícia Judiciária do dia 23 de Dezembro de 2007, constituído por 2 (duas) páginas.


http://www.asmeninasquevieramdasestrelas.com/juridica.html

unreliable source as its from the unreliable marcos

And the official .pt court one doesnt state sofia leal appeared in person does it? If so, i will give way here

The documents were accepted in the judgment and they were verified.

Quote
Reinforcing all original documentary evidence offered here, another crucial new evidence concerning the aforementioned complaint filed by the wife of the then Coordinator of the Judicial Police II against her husband, that only we learned this year. This document, corroborated by another Service Picket Judicial Police, of the utmost importance, since it proves the violent personality, criminal and inhuman the maximum charge on the ground by the police investigations "If BB", the then Coordinator II. Credible and reliable source linked to the very Judicial Police (who have requested anonymity), made ​​us and get a full copy exactly as the original of that complaint by the wife of II, against her own husband, the Director of the Judicial Police in Faro day December 23, 2007. In this letter we highlight serious charges against her husband's wife (then separate), namely "insults", "death threats", "driving police cars in visible state of intoxication" and "danger to the integrity of a their daughter 4 years old. " Confirming the authenticity of this document, we were sent by the same source another new document, which is a true copy, full and exactly as the original, the Report Service Directory Faro Picket of the Judicial Police, on 23 December 2007, where you can read on page 2:
"It was an open letter delivered this picket by Mrs. RR directed at Mr Deputy National Director, lic. SS.". And the document is the Service of Judicial Police Picket duly signed by the Coordinator in charge of Criminal Investigation, licensed EEA, the Inspector UU. And, as the document Picket Service of Judicial Police, it is an "open letter" Wife II logo is well founded argument that can not be argued in any way that knowledge of such a
letter might constitute "wanton privacy" or that such a letter has no relevance to the process, as constituting, as it constitutes a public complaint against the wife of her husband, the severity of reported crimes is clearly evident and relevant for the proof of personality extremely violent and criminal the then Coordinator of the Judicial Police II. Join it also attached to this pleading, both of these documents, which is attested here constitute faithful copies, integrals exactly conforming documents.

http://www.dgsi.pt/jstj.nsf/954f0ce6ad9dd8b980256b5f003fa814/67e9f860c06af1d9802576a9004e4a2c?OpenDocument

I think it is evident that those are the documents this judgment was referring to.
Title: Re: Amarals wife. Alexandra Sofia de Sousa Manjua Leal complaint to the police
Post by: Redblossom on May 30, 2013, 11:04:10 PM
It was submitted as a court document apparently.

It is described in point 26.

Tribunal Judicial da Comarca de Portimão

1º Juízo Criminal

Processo nº 330/04.2JAPTM

8-Participação apresentada pela esposa de Gonçalo de Sousa Amaral, contra o próprio marido, ao Director de Faro da Polícia Judiciária no dia 23 de Dezembro de 2007, constituído por 1 (uma) página;

9-Relatório do Serviço de Piquete da Directoria de Faro da Polícia Judiciária do dia 23 de Dezembro de 2007, constituído por 2 (duas) páginas.


http://www.asmeninasquevieramdasestrelas.com/juridica.html

unreliable source as its from the unreliable marcos

And the official .pt court one doesnt state sofia leal appeared in person does it? If so, i will give way here

The point was whether the letter was a forgery or not.

No, my point was did SL present herself to police/courts, if she did then fine, if not, its not hard to forge a document, especially by a lawyer witha confessed agenda, not sayng he did, but in the wider context of his mission to destroy Mr Amaral it makes sense. Even if it were true, it means SOD all in relation to the facts of the Mccann case, threatening your wife  and being in sbitty divorce stages does not automatically mean being guilty of x y z in your job
Title: Re: Amarals wife. Alexandra Sofia de Sousa Manjua Leal complaint to the police
Post by: TTSOFAFM on May 30, 2013, 11:06:16 PM
Redblossom, please read the judgment.  It doesn't matter if she appeared at court or not.  Those documents were corroborated by a person in authority.

Quote
This document, corroborated by another Service Picket Judicial Police,
Title: Re: Amarals wife. Alexandra Sofia de Sousa Manjua Leal complaint to the police
Post by: gilet on May 30, 2013, 11:10:11 PM
This is a very interesting thread. Not because it throws much light on the case of Madeleine or because it even throws much light on this letter.

There are two options regarding the letter.

Believe Sofia Leal when she says she didn't write it, submit it or do anything else about it even though there is clear official evidence that she did.

Or believe the official court documents which prove she did submit it.

But what is very interesting is the way that certain posters automatically believe Sofia Leal and reject the court documents even though there are perfectly obvious reasons (shame, co-ercion) why Sofia Leal might lie about the matter and the official record shows that she is in fact lying.

These same posters are the same posters who believe that the slightest discrepancy in what the McCanns say should automatically be taken as a lie even when the files do not back that up.

And these people claim to be seeking the truth.  The reality shown by this thread is that is simply not the case. They are biased and hypocritical.
Title: Re: Amarals wife. Alexandra Sofia de Sousa Manjua Leal complaint to the police
Post by: gilet on May 30, 2013, 11:13:29 PM
It was submitted as a court document apparently.

It is described in point 26.

Tribunal Judicial da Comarca de Portimão

1º Juízo Criminal

Processo nº 330/04.2JAPTM

8-Participação apresentada pela esposa de Gonçalo de Sousa Amaral, contra o próprio marido, ao Director de Faro da Polícia Judiciária no dia 23 de Dezembro de 2007, constituído por 1 (uma) página;

9-Relatório do Serviço de Piquete da Directoria de Faro da Polícia Judiciária do dia 23 de Dezembro de 2007, constituído por 2 (duas) páginas.


http://www.asmeninasquevieramdasestrelas.com/juridica.html

unreliable source as its from the unreliable marcos

And the official .pt court one doesnt state sofia leal appeared in person does it? If so, i will give way here

The point was whether the letter was a forgery or not.

No, my point was did SL present herself to police/courts, if she did then fine, if not, its not hard to forge a document, especially by a lawyer witha confessed agenda, not sayng he did, but in the wider context of his mission to destroy Mr Amaral it makes sense. Even if it were true, it means SOD all in relation to the facts of the Mccann case, threatening your wife  and being in sbitty divorce stages does not automatically mean being guilty of x y z in your job

Maybe not in Portugal where the standards are clearly far lower than here. No cop being investigated for collusion in torture in another case would have been working (he would have been suspended) and would certainly not have been given another missing child case as Amaral was.

And I think you might find that someone being taken to court as Amaral was regarding threats to his wife might well have found himself suspended over here too.

And as for not being important, it suggests to me that the man is a thug and not a person who should even be a police officer, but my standards clearly differ from yours as you seem to think none of his vile behaviour matters at all.
Title: Re: Amarals wife. Alexandra Sofia de Sousa Manjua Leal complaint to the police
Post by: DCI on May 31, 2013, 12:41:24 AM
Redblossom, please read the judgment.  It doesn't matter if she appeared at court or not.  Those documents were corroborated by a person in authority.

Quote
This document, corroborated by another Service Picket Judicial Police,

Thank you TTSOFAFM, for proving me right.

I'll wait for the apologies, for calling me a liar, and posting forgeries.
Title: Re: Amarals wife. Alexandra Sofia de Sousa Manjua Leal complaint to the police
Post by: Redblossom on May 31, 2013, 01:39:11 AM
Redblossom, please read the judgment.  It doesn't matter if she appeared at court or not.  Those documents were corroborated by a person in authority.

Quote
This document, corroborated by another Service Picket Judicial Police,

Thank you TTSOFAFM, for proving me right.

I'll wait for the apologies, for calling me a liar, and posting forgeries.

Gwt over your ego dear, no one accused YOU lol
Title: Re: Amarals wife. Alexandra Sofia de Sousa Manjua Leal complaint to the police
Post by: Redblossom on May 31, 2013, 01:40:40 AM
Redblossom, please read the judgment.  It doesn't matter if she appeared at court or not.  Those documents were corroborated by a person in authority.

Quote
This document, corroborated by another Service Picket Judicial Police,

So? How does that make the documents authentic?
Title: Re: Amarals wife. Alexandra Sofia de Sousa Manjua Leal complaint to the police
Post by: gilet on May 31, 2013, 01:42:17 AM
Redblossom, please read the judgment.  It doesn't matter if she appeared at court or not.  Those documents were corroborated by a person in authority.

Quote
This document, corroborated by another Service Picket Judicial Police,

So? How does that make the documents authentic?

If you read it you might actually understand.
Title: Re: Amarals wife. Alexandra Sofia de Sousa Manjua Leal complaint to the police
Post by: Redblossom on May 31, 2013, 01:44:03 AM
So? How does that make the documents authentic?

AND the POINT is even if they are, bears no relation whatsoever to MADIIE VANISHING does it?
Title: Re: Amarals wife. Alexandra Sofia de Sousa Manjua Leal complaint to the police
Post by: gilet on May 31, 2013, 01:45:54 AM
So? How does that make the documents authentic?

AND the POINT is even if they are, bears no relation whatsoever to MADIIE VANISHING does it?

Not to the specifics of the disappearance but it could well have a very significant relationship to the way in which the man at the centre of the allegations of disgraceful behaviour conducted himself as co-ordinator of the search for the child.

Title: Re: Amarals wife. Alexandra Sofia de Sousa Manjua Leal complaint to the police
Post by: Redblossom on May 31, 2013, 01:48:11 AM
So? How does that make the documents authentic?

AND the POINT is even if they are, bears no relation whatsoever to MADIIE VANISHING does it?

Some if you have to realise there was a paid agenda to dig out dirt on Mr Amaral, it has been admitted to as well, now I wonder whythat was, prettymuch the same as trying to trash the dogs shameful at best
Title: Re: Amarals wife. Alexandra Sofia de Sousa Manjua Leal complaint to the police
Post by: Redblossom on May 31, 2013, 01:49:00 AM
So? How does that make the documents authentic?

AND the POINT is even if they are, bears no relation whatsoever to MADIIE VANISHING does it?

Not to the specifics of the disappearance but it could well have a very significant relationship to the way in which the man at the centre of the allegations of disgraceful behaviour conducted himself as co-ordinator of the search for the child.

Whatever dream on
Title: Re: Amarals wife. Alexandra Sofia de Sousa Manjua Leal complaint to the police
Post by: gilet on May 31, 2013, 01:51:59 AM
So? How does that make the documents authentic?

AND the POINT is even if they are, bears no relation whatsoever to MADIIE VANISHING does it?

Some if you have to realise there was a paid agenda to dig out dirt on Mr Amaral, it has been admitted to as well, now I wonder whythat was, prettymuch the same as trying to trash the dogs shameful at best

A "paid agenda"? I am in hysterics here.

Why is such a "paid agenda" needed.

The man is a criminal, convicted of lying over collusion in a torture case!

The man has been chased by his own brother for defaulting on debts.

The man chucked his daughter's pet in a bin instead of showing sympathy and dealing with it properly.

The man is a friend to Cristovao who is in trouble for all sorts of alleged criminal behaviour.

The man is accused by his own wife of all kinds of abuse.

Why would anyone need to be paid to expose what everyone knows about him?

Title: Re: Amarals wife. Alexandra Sofia de Sousa Manjua Leal complaint to the police
Post by: gilet on May 31, 2013, 02:04:16 AM
So? How does that make the documents authentic?

AND the POINT is even if they are, bears no relation whatsoever to MADIIE VANISHING does it?

Not to the specifics of the disappearance but it could well have a very significant relationship to the way in which the man at the centre of the allegations of disgraceful behaviour conducted himself as co-ordinator of the search for the child.

Whatever dream on

No dreaming involved at all.

Simple statement of the fact that this behaviour outlined in a letter to his superior by his wife could well have a significant bearing on the way in which he conducted the search for missing Madeleine.

Your point is quite bemusing. Is your comment "Whatever"? a begrudging agreement with what I claim or can you in some way dispute what I believe?

Title: Re: Amarals wife. Alexandra Sofia de Sousa Manjua Leal complaint to the police
Post by: TTSOFAFM on May 31, 2013, 07:35:57 AM
Redblossom, please read the judgment.  It doesn't matter if she appeared at court or not.  Those documents were corroborated by a person in authority.

Quote
This document, corroborated by another Service Picket Judicial Police,

So? How does that make the documents authentic?
Are you being serious?  If a document is corroborated in Court, that does make the authentic.  It would be like a witness statement being read out in court and authenticated and then some one saying because the person is not there it is not authentic.

As much as you wish to deny these documents are genuine, RedBlossom, the court documentation states otherwise.  And if I was to lay my trust as to who is speaking the truth, an official judgment or a forum poster, I think I will stick with the Official Judgment.
Title: Re: Amarals wife. Alexandra Sofia de Sousa Manjua Leal complaint to the police
Post by: sadie on May 31, 2013, 10:37:15 AM
So? How does that make the documents authentic?

AND the POINT is even if they are, bears no relation whatsoever to MADIIE VANISHING does it?

Some if you have to realise there was a paid agenda to dig out dirt on Mr Amaral, it has been admitted to as well, now I wonder whythat was, prettymuch the same as trying to trash the dogs shameful at best

A "paid agenda"? I am in hysterics here.

Why is such a "paid agenda" needed.

The man is a criminal, convicted of lying over collusion in a torture case!

The man has been chased by his own brother for defaulting on debts.

The man chucked his daughter's pet in a bin instead of showing sympathy and dealing with it properly.

The man is a friend to Cristovao who is in trouble for all sorts of alleged criminal behaviour.

The man is accused by his own wife of all kinds of abuse.

Why would anyone need to be paid to expose what everyone knows about him?

 8@??)( 8@??)( 8@??)(

Excellent post Gilet

in a nutshell

There you are Red
Title: Re: Amarals wife. Alexandra Sofia de Sousa Manjua Leal complaint to the police
Post by: Carana on May 31, 2013, 11:30:49 AM
Redblossom, please read the judgment.  It doesn't matter if she appeared at court or not.  Those documents were corroborated by a person in authority.

Quote
This document, corroborated by another Service Picket Judicial Police,

So? How does that make the documents authentic?
Are you being serious?  If a document is corroborated in Court, that does make the authentic.  It would be like a witness statement being read out in court and authenticated and then some one saying because the person is not there it is not authentic.

As much as you wish to deny these documents are genuine, RedBlossom, the court documentation states otherwise.  And if I was to lay my trust as to who is speaking the truth, an official judgment or a forum poster, I think I will stick with the Official Judgment.


From the legal remarks on the document submitted to the court:


2.1.8.) O outro documento apresentado pela recorrente respeita a uma carta endereçada pela esposa do Sr. Inspector II, de quem se encontrava separada, ao Sr. Director Nacional Adjunto da Directoria de Faro da Polícia Judiciária, queixando-se deste. Está datada de 23/12/2007. A recorrente diz que só agora teve conhecimento da dita. É de admitir como prova nova.


Doesn't this say that it was admitted as new evidence? Perhaps a Portuguese-speaker could clarify in case I've misunderstood.

If so, I doubt that this would have been the case if it had not been considered authentic.



Amongst the points in that letter:
4. Today, Sunday 23th, and after numerous attempts, Gonçalo never answered his phone and he is not at home.

For a mother trying to find her child and get her back home for Christmas, I don't see how the content of her letter could have referred to her concerns on Sunday, 23 December, with a PJ record acknowledging it on the same date, if it hadn't been personally delivered.  >@@(*&)




Title: Re: Amarals wife. Alexandra Sofia de Sousa Manjua Leal complaint to the police
Post by: Benice on May 31, 2013, 12:14:07 PM
Redblossom, please read the judgment.  It doesn't matter if she appeared at court or not.  Those documents were corroborated by a person in authority.

Quote
This document, corroborated by another Service Picket Judicial Police,

So? How does that make the documents authentic?
Are you being serious?  If a document is corroborated in Court, that does make the authentic.  It would be like a witness statement being read out in court and authenticated and then some one saying because the person is not there it is not authentic.

As much as you wish to deny these documents are genuine, RedBlossom, the court documentation states otherwise.  And if I was to lay my trust as to who is speaking the truth, an official judgment or a forum poster, I think I will stick with the Official Judgment.


From the legal remarks on the document submitted to the court:


2.1.8.) O outro documento apresentado pela recorrente respeita a uma carta endereçada pela esposa do Sr. Inspector II, de quem se encontrava separada, ao Sr. Director Nacional Adjunto da Directoria de Faro da Polícia Judiciária, queixando-se deste. Está datada de 23/12/2007. A recorrente diz que só agora teve conhecimento da dita. É de admitir como prova nova.


Doesn't this say that it was admitted as new evidence? Perhaps a Portuguese-speaker could clarify in case I've misunderstood.

If so, I doubt that this would have been the case if it had not been considered authentic.



Amongst the points in that letter:
4. Today, Sunday 23th, and after numerous attempts, Gonçalo never answered his phone and he is not at home.

For a mother trying to find her child and get her back home for Christmas, I don't see how the content of her letter could have referred to her concerns on Sunday, 23 December, with a PJ record acknowledging it on the same date, if it hadn't been personally delivered.  >@@(*&)

Good point Carana.
Title: Re: Amarals wife. Alexandra Sofia de Sousa Manjua Leal complaint to the police
Post by: TTSOFAFM on May 31, 2013, 12:30:35 PM
Redblossom, please read the judgment.  It doesn't matter if she appeared at court or not.  Those documents were corroborated by a person in authority.

Quote
This document, corroborated by another Service Picket Judicial Police,

So? How does that make the documents authentic?
Are you being serious?  If a document is corroborated in Court, that does make the authentic.  It would be like a witness statement being read out in court and authenticated and then some one saying because the person is not there it is not authentic.

As much as you wish to deny these documents are genuine, RedBlossom, the court documentation states otherwise.  And if I was to lay my trust as to who is speaking the truth, an official judgment or a forum poster, I think I will stick with the Official Judgment.


From the legal remarks on the document submitted to the court:


2.1.8.) O outro documento apresentado pela recorrente respeita a uma carta endereçada pela esposa do Sr. Inspector II, de quem se encontrava separada, ao Sr. Director Nacional Adjunto da Directoria de Faro da Polícia Judiciária, queixando-se deste. Está datada de 23/12/2007. A recorrente diz que só agora teve conhecimento da dita. É de admitir como prova nova.


Doesn't this say that it was admitted as new evidence? Perhaps a Portuguese-speaker could clarify in case I've misunderstood.

If so, I doubt that this would have been the case if it had not been considered authentic.



Amongst the points in that letter:
4. Today, Sunday 23th, and after numerous attempts, Gonçalo never answered his phone and he is not at home.

For a mother trying to find her child and get her back home for Christmas, I don't see how the content of her letter could have referred to her concerns on Sunday, 23 December, with a PJ record acknowledging it on the same date, if it hadn't been personally delivered.  >@@(*&)

Thank you Carana, for finding that. And you make a very valid point about the date of the letter and the date of the deliverance of such letter. 

Knowing that the documents were authenticated and submitted as evidence as being truthful, it does rather raise questions about the answers Sofia Leal gave in the O Crime Interview.


Quote
O Crime - Do you consider that the letter disclosed by Leonor's lawyer is false? Then how is it explained that your signature is on it? What do you think is behind its dissemination in the current context?
 
Sofia Leal - Completely false, both the content and authorship. Furthermore, we need only look at the credibility and reputation of those who made it public, it is just one more slander, an attempt to tarnish the image of my husband. It seems that this time, in a desperate attempt, they are attacking one of the key pillars of Gonçalo Amaral's life: the family.
 
Accepting that the letter is false, has any legal action been taken against the perpetrator of the forgery?
 
Let me be very frank: unlike my husband, I do not believe in the justice system. This is not a critical sector, or even corporate. I respect, of course, the professionals of this sector. But, like nearly all the Portuguese, I know what would happen. From here until ten years, more or less, we would be in court discussing this issue, which, meanwhile, would have already expired. Anyway, I hope that Dr. Marcos Aragão, in the near future, will be committed in order to receive psychiatric treatment, his dementia being declared and considered inimputable in relation to the acts he has committed. Anyway, this week he will be reported to the Ethics Council of the Bar, an institution that does not accept in its midst people who do not conduct themselves with dignity in the career of the law.
 
Did Gonçalo Amaral once threaten you with death and insulted [you] as it says in the letter?
 
Never, as I said, the content of the document is completely false. Gonçalo is a very (sometimes too) peaceful person. [Anyone] who lives with us and knows our relationship knows the affection and respect with which he has always treated me. And this is indeed the pillar of our relationship.

Source of comments from McCann Files http://www.mccannfiles.com/id131.html
Title: Re: Amarals wife. Alexandra Sofia de Sousa Manjua Leal complaint to the police
Post by: DCI on May 31, 2013, 08:08:28 PM
What a Hypocrite

Open letter to Mrs Healy, Kate.

-- Dear Madam,

Excuse my audacity, but after learning about your comment in your interview with the newspaper, Expresso, on the subject of Gonçalo Amaral, my husband and father of my daughters, I have to send you these words of thanks. For many years I have been trying to make myself understood with this feeling that unites you and I "....and his behaviour is a disgrace professionally and as a person"...

Consider this:
a) Professionally

-- As coordinator of criminal investigation for the PJ, my husband has always refused to sit comfortably behind his desk, from 9 to 5, which is usual for his rank.

Instead of that, he spent the day (and sometimes the night) on the ground with the investigators, coordinating "on the spot" searches, surveillance, seizures and other duties. What a disgrace! But if this was just about being exposed to the elements, things wouldn't be serious, because as madam Kate knows, the weather here is not bad. The problem is his commitment to the cause which has cost him promotion in his career. I will explain, because this case is contemporary to the search for your daughter. My husband was involved as senior coordinator, and between seizures of drugs, kidnappings and murders, he succeeded in producing a theory about drug trafficking by sea, which he defended before a jury in Lisbon, who congratulated him.

Full of hope, Gonçalo Amaral returned to the Algarve to await the result. It was with astonishment that he learned that he had been passed over by other colleagues (coordinators as it happens, to tell the truth), because he had not managed to get himself into "professonal training" settings. And yes, madam Kate, my husband spent his life working, in the midst of complex investigations. He was the man in Portugal who seized most drugs, but as he didn't have the time to parade himself in the corridors of the PJ's institution, he was not promoted. A disgrace, madam, a disgrace!

As you must know, because you seem very well informed to me, my husband's salary was barely 1.5 times the minimum wage of your country. However, as a wife, mother and Portuguese, I cannot complain, given that Gonçalo Amaral's salary was the equivalent of 4.5 times the minimum wage in Portugal. Pay attention to this, which serves as an example of what I am going to explain: at one time, an individual shot an officer of the PSP and fled into neighbouring Spain. Between the comings and goings of a PJ team, of which my husband was a part, they were there for more than 15 days.


At that time, international expenses were 100€. As madam Kate can imagine, it is not possible on that amount to eat and to lodge in Spain, still less when it is Christmas Eve, and this amount would only be available (with a bit of luck) by Easter. Even with that, Gonçalo Amaral never refused, not even for a day, to search for the evasive murderer, thus increasing our family budget. And this is only one example amongst many. I once suggested to him the creation of a fund, or something else for dealing with these extraordinary expenses, but he never listened to me. While we too had our mortgage to pay...A disgrace, Madam Kate, a disgrace!

b) Also as an individual, his behaviour is a disgrace, because it was never possible to distinguish or to have a private life with the way of working he chose. However, and if my dear friend Madam Kate will allow me, I can give some examples: Five years ago, a child called Joana "disappeared." The mother, just like Madam Kate, tried to project the case into the media, but this was as far as she got...After 8 days, came the confessions and the evidence: During an incestuous act between the mother and the uncle, the child was beaten, later cut into pieces and her body disposed of, no one knows where. The mother and the uncle were imprisoned, with the trial coordinated by Gonçalo Amaral, and bringing each of them nearly 20 years in prison. But going back a bit.

The child died on September 12th. On Christmas Eve, our family were together to begin our prayers, when my husband asked me to prepare a bag with food and warm clothes, because he had not yet carried out his Christmas act of contrition and penitence. Try to imagine, Madam Kate, where Gonçalo Amaral took himself that Christmas night when there was torrential rain and roaring thunder? To the Olhao prison establishment, where João Cipriano, Joana's uncle, was a prisoner; confessed murderer and clinically declared a psychopath. For my husband, giving alms to a beggar did not represent any sacrifice.
On the other hand, joining and sharing his Christmas meal with João Cipriano was the sacrifice he offered to God in memory of Joana. And isn't that a disgrace? Know this, Madam Kate, every year, on September 12th, my husband requests a mass for Joana Isabel Cipriano Guerreiro. He says that no one else will remember the poor child. But people remember to accuse him unjustly of acts and crimes which he has never committed. Isn't that a disgrace, Madam Kate?

I will relate one last story, which still costs me to talk about. This year, in May, we started the process of moving our family to Portimao. My husband's holiday was supposed to start the day after your daughter disappeared. "For obvious reasons," that didn't happen. I started a new job, I looked at houses, I made the move and I tried to settle our daughters into new schools with new routines.

All that alone, without any support from my husband, who, for obvious reasons, was looking for your daughter, Madam Kate. In October, on the day of his birthday, a week after our daughters had started the new school year, Gonçalo Amaral was dismissed and returned to Faro. It was supposed to be a time of the family getting together, but in fact it was even more of a separation. Isn't that a disgrace? Our daughters have never understood, and we have never succeeded in explaining to them what the obvious reasons were that justified a father leaving his daughters to look for a child he didn't know and whom the parents neglected. A disgrace that my dear friend Kate was not there at that time. Perhaps you could have helped us explain the "obvious reasons" to our children for their father's being sent back.

To finish, on the intimate subject of Gonçalo Amaral, I can only tell you that he is exactly as the Latinos have a reputation for: a wild one, and my modesty does not allow me to say any more.

I ask my dear friend to forgive these thoughts of a wife and mother, but I am sure you will understand. I will finish this missive by asking you to pass on to your mother my sincere compliments. She seemed very sincere to me when, during an interview, she said she had the urge to slap those who had left her grandchildren alone. She spoke as openly as a true Portuguese grandmother would have done.

My dear friend Madam Kate, without wishing to bother you any further, I would like you to do me a last favour: now that you are starting to let the truth come out, don't stop, go on, and tell the truth the world is waiting to hear.


With my best regards,

Sofia Leal

(Wife and mother of Gonçalo Amaral's children.)
 
http://www.express.co.uk/posts/view/130241

 
 
 
 
Title: Re: Amarals wife. Alexandra Sofia de Sousa Manjua Leal complaint to the police
Post by: Benice on May 31, 2013, 08:58:49 PM
Quote

I will relate one last story, which still costs me to talk about. This year, in May, we started the process of moving our family to Portimao. My husband's holiday was supposed to start the day after your daughter disappeared. "For obvious reasons," that didn't happen.  Unquote
--------------------------------------
Wasn't he otherwise engaged being made an Arguido on that day?
Title: Re: Amarals wife. Alexandra Sofia de Sousa Manjua Leal complaint to the police
Post by: gilet on May 31, 2013, 09:10:34 PM
Quote

I will relate one last story, which still costs me to talk about. This year, in May, we started the process of moving our family to Portimao. My husband's holiday was supposed to start the day after your daughter disappeared. "For obvious reasons," that didn't happen.  Unquote
--------------------------------------
Wasn't he otherwise engaged being made an Arguido on that day?

Whether being made an arguido or not (and I think that is one of the things that may well have been occupying him on the morning after Madeleine disappeared I have to think, how big of him to give up his holiday? When you join the police you expect to have your life put on hold in emergencies. That simply goes with the territory.

But am I alone in detecting resentment in that brief quote?

Title: Re: Amarals wife. Alexandra Sofia de Sousa Manjua Leal complaint to the police
Post by: Carana on June 01, 2013, 02:53:17 PM
He was the man in Portugal who seized most drugs, but as he didn't have the time to parade himself in the corridors of the PJ's institution, he was not promoted.

- Re his drugs seizure record:
Is there any corroboration for this? In what capacity? As a coordinator? I was led to understand that coordinators aren't necessarily expected to have a hands-on approach (at least in terms of a missing child), so what exactly does this mean?

- Lack of promotion? Because he didn't have time to "lobby"? To which position?
Title: Re: Amarals wife. Alexandra Sofia de Sousa Manjua Leal complaint to the police
Post by: Carana on June 01, 2013, 02:58:13 PM
At that time, international expenses were 100€. As madam Kate can imagine, it is not possible on that amount to eat and to lodge in Spain, still less when it is Christmas Eve, and this amount would only be available (with a bit of luck) by Easter. Even with that, Gonçalo Amaral never refused, not even for a day, to search for the evasive murderer, thus increasing our family budget. And this is only one example amongst many. I once suggested to him the creation of a fund, or something else for dealing with these extraordinary expenses, 

A police officer can't survive on €100 per diem in Spain?
Title: Re: Amarals wife. Alexandra Sofia de Sousa Manjua Leal complaint to the police
Post by: Carana on June 01, 2013, 03:13:41 PM
He asked her to pack food and clothing so that he could share his Christmas meal with João Cipriano?

Did he get permssion from the prison for this? Did João Cipriano want to see him?

What's the corroboration for this?

Hmmm.

Title: Re: Amarals wife. Alexandra Sofia de Sousa Manjua Leal complaint to the police
Post by: Carana on June 01, 2013, 03:15:15 PM
My husband's holiday was supposed to start the day after your daughter disappeared. "For obvious reasons," that didn't happen.

Erm, no. As he was made arguido on that day.
Title: Re: Amarals wife. Alexandra Sofia de Sousa Manjua Leal complaint to the police
Post by: DCI on June 01, 2013, 03:21:31 PM
He asked her to pack food and clothing so that he could share his Christmas meal with João Cipriano?

Did he get permssion from the prison for this? Did João Cipriano want to see him?

What's the corroboration for this?

Hmmm.

Quote
To finish, on the intimate subject of Gonçalo Amaral, I can only tell you that he is exactly as the Latinos have a reputation for: a wild one, and my modesty does not allow me to say any more.

Yes we all know about his abilities in that dept, (http://www.sherv.net/cm/emo/funny/1/vomiting.gif) (http://www.sherv.net/emoticons.html)

Now there is corroboration for that.
Title: Re: Amarals wife. Alexandra Sofia de Sousa Manjua Leal complaint to the police
Post by: Carana on June 01, 2013, 03:24:23 PM
He asked her to pack food and clothing so that he could share his Christmas meal with João Cipriano?

Did he get permssion from the prison for this? Did João Cipriano want to see him?

What's the corroboration for this?

Hmmm.

Quote
To finish, on the intimate subject of Gonçalo Amaral, I can only tell you that he is exactly as the Latinos have a reputation for: a wild one, and my modesty does not allow me to say any more.

Yes we all know about his abilities in that dept, (http://www.sherv.net/cm/emo/funny/1/vomiting.gif) (http://www.sherv.net/emoticons.html)

Now there is corroboration for that.

I have avoided that for the sake of their young daughter. I don't find it fair to her - she's just a little girl.
Title: Re: Amarals wife. Alexandra Sofia de Sousa Manjua Leal complaint to the police
Post by: DCI on June 01, 2013, 03:25:56 PM
He asked her to pack food and clothing so that he could share his Christmas meal with João Cipriano?

Did he get permssion from the prison for this? Did João Cipriano want to see him?

What's the corroboration for this?

Hmmm.

Quote
To finish, on the intimate subject of Gonçalo Amaral, I can only tell you that he is exactly as the Latinos have a reputation for: a wild one, and my modesty does not allow me to say any more.

Yes we all know about his abilities in that dept, (http://www.sherv.net/cm/emo/funny/1/vomiting.gif) (http://www.sherv.net/emoticons.html)

Now there is corroboration for that.

I have avoided that for the sake of their young daughter. I don't find it fair to her - she's just a little girl.

She didn't avoid that, for her young daughter though, did she? Or Kates children!

You're not trying to tell me, their kids didn't hear the arguments, fights and threats. Especially the youngest that was with Amaral, when she tried to get her back home, and complained to the PJ.
Title: Re: Amarals wife. Alexandra Sofia de Sousa Manjua Leal complaint to the police
Post by: gilet on June 01, 2013, 03:27:01 PM
At that time, international expenses were 100€. As madam Kate can imagine, it is not possible on that amount to eat and to lodge in Spain, still less when it is Christmas Eve, and this amount would only be available (with a bit of luck) by Easter. Even with that, Gonçalo Amaral never refused, not even for a day, to search for the evasive murderer, thus increasing our family budget. And this is only one example amongst many. I once suggested to him the creation of a fund, or something else for dealing with these extraordinary expenses, 

A police officer can't survive on €100 per diem in Spain?

I have just checked with my sister and she stayed very recently (two weeks ago) on a short business trip at the Holiday Inn, Madrid (I suspect one of the dearer cities) for €65 per night. I am sure there are cheaper hotels to be found in Spain and especially so four or more years ago.
Title: Re: Amarals wife. Alexandra Sofia de Sousa Manjua Leal complaint to the police
Post by: DCI on June 01, 2013, 03:31:07 PM
He asked her to pack food and clothing so that he could share his Christmas meal with João Cipriano?

Did he get permssion from the prison for this? Did João Cipriano want to see him?

What's the corroboration for this?

Hmmm.

Quote
To finish, on the intimate subject of Gonçalo Amaral, I can only tell you that he is exactly as the Latinos have a reputation for: a wild one, and my modesty does not allow me to say any more.

Yes we all know about his abilities in that dept, (http://www.sherv.net/cm/emo/funny/1/vomiting.gif) (http://www.sherv.net/emoticons.html)

Now there is corroboration for that.

I have avoided that for the sake of their young daughter. I don't find it fair to her - she's just a little girl.

She didn't avoid that, for her young daughter though, did she? Or Kates children!


You're not trying to tell me, their kids didn't hear the arguments, fights and threats. Especially the youngest that was with Amaral, when she tried to get her back home, and complained to the PJ.
Title: Re: Amarals wife. Alexandra Sofia de Sousa Manjua Leal complaint to the police
Post by: DCI on June 01, 2013, 03:33:25 PM
At that time, international expenses were 100€. As madam Kate can imagine, it is not possible on that amount to eat and to lodge in Spain, still less when it is Christmas Eve, and this amount would only be available (with a bit of luck) by Easter. Even with that, Gonçalo Amaral never refused, not even for a day, to search for the evasive murderer, thus increasing our family budget. And this is only one example amongst many. I once suggested to him the creation of a fund, or something else for dealing with these extraordinary expenses, 

A police officer can't survive on €100 per diem in Spain?

I have just checked with my sister and she stayed very recently (two weeks ago) on a short business trip at the Holiday Inn, Madrid (I suspect one of the dearer cities) for €65 per night. I am sure there are cheaper hotels to be found in Spain and especially so four or more years ago.

Since when does a cop, have to pay, for staying somewhere on a case? They claim for everything else.
Title: Re: Amarals wife. Alexandra Sofia de Sousa Manjua Leal complaint to the police
Post by: Carana on June 01, 2013, 03:38:15 PM
At that time, international expenses were 100€. As madam Kate can imagine, it is not possible on that amount to eat and to lodge in Spain, still less when it is Christmas Eve, and this amount would only be available (with a bit of luck) by Easter. Even with that, Gonçalo Amaral never refused, not even for a day, to search for the evasive murderer, thus increasing our family budget. And this is only one example amongst many. I once suggested to him the creation of a fund, or something else for dealing with these extraordinary expenses, 

A police officer can't survive on €100 per diem in Spain?

I have just checked with my sister and she stayed very recently (two weeks ago) on a short business trip at the Holiday Inn, Madrid (I suspect one of the dearer cities) for €65 per night. I am sure there are cheaper hotels to be found in Spain and especially so four or more years ago.

Since when does a cop, have to pay, for staying somewhere on a case? They claim for everything else.

I'm willing to accept that there may have been a per diem arrangement.
Title: Re: Amarals wife. Alexandra Sofia de Sousa Manjua Leal complaint to the police
Post by: Carana on June 01, 2013, 03:44:22 PM
He asked her to pack food and clothing so that he could share his Christmas meal with João Cipriano?

Did he get permssion from the prison for this? Did João Cipriano want to see him?

What's the corroboration for this?

Hmmm.

Quote
To finish, on the intimate subject of Gonçalo Amaral, I can only tell you that he is exactly as the Latinos have a reputation for: a wild one, and my modesty does not allow me to say any more.

Yes we all know about his abilities in that dept, (http://www.sherv.net/cm/emo/funny/1/vomiting.gif) (http://www.sherv.net/emoticons.html)

Now there is corroboration for that.

I have avoided that for the sake of their young daughter. I don't find it fair to her - she's just a little girl.

She didn't avoid that, for her young daughter though, did she? Or Kates children!

You're not trying to tell me, their kids didn't hear the arguments, fights and threats. Especially the youngest that was with Amaral, when she tried to get her back home, and complained to the PJ.


This young girl goes to school and could end up being taunted and bullied, just as the twins* could be.

I feel sorry for her and two wrongs don't make a right.

*ETA and other children

Title: Re: Amarals wife. Alexandra Sofia de Sousa Manjua Leal complaint to the police
Post by: sadie on June 01, 2013, 04:23:37 PM
He asked her to pack food and clothing so that he could share his Christmas meal with João Cipriano?

Did he get permssion from the prison for this? Did João Cipriano want to see him?

What's the corroboration for this?

Hmmm.

That is what he told his wife ... and she believed him.

But he did have a girl friend, didn't he?



 >@@(*&) Now let me see

Quote
To finish, on the intimate subject of Gonçalo Amaral, I can only tell you that he is exactly as the Latinos have a reputation for: a wild one, and my modesty does not allow me to say any more.

He is a latino with all their "special" atributes

Would have been nice to see her on Christmas Day wouldn't it?

And he packed special clothes too .. for Joao, or for him... ?




Only my wondering ?
Title: Re: Amarals wife. Alexandra Sofia de Sousa Manjua Leal complaint to the police
Post by: DCI on June 01, 2013, 04:43:03 PM
He asked her to pack food and clothing so that he could share his Christmas meal with João Cipriano?

Did he get permssion from the prison for this? Did João Cipriano want to see him?

What's the corroboration for this?

Hmmm.

That is what he told his wife ... and she believed him.

But he did have a girl friend, didn't he?



 >@@(*&) Now let me see

Quote
To finish, on the intimate subject of Gonçalo Amaral, I can only tell you that he is exactly as the Latinos have a reputation for: a wild one, and my modesty does not allow me to say any more.

He is a latino with all their "special" atributes

Would have been nice to see her on Christmas Day wouldn't it?

And he packed special clothes too .. for Joao, or for him... ?

Only my wondering ?

(http://www.sherv.net/cm/emo/happy/rolling-on-the-floor-laughing-smiley-emoticon.gif) (http://www.sherv.net/emoticons.html)