Nevill's alleged 4 second phone call to Bamber:

[adam]

It's no secret Nevill's call to Bamber only lasted 4 seconds. Bamber's own evidence was that Nevill said 11 words to him before putting the phone down.

The 11 words completed a sentence, rather than Nevill putting the phone down mid sentence. Suggesting it was Nevill's choice to put the phone down.

This is surprising as Nevill had made the big decision that he needed Bamber's help. Then spent up to 5 minutes ringing & waiting for Bamber to answer. So to just speak for 4 seconds & not give Bamber the chance to respond contradicts Nevill's decision.

According to many supporters & Bamber himself, Nevill also phoned Chelmsford police around half an hour after his phone call to Bamber. This call would have lasted at least 5 minutes, rather than 4 seconds.

The only answers for Nevill's 4 second call so far have been 'we weren't there' & 'it doesn't matter'.

A claim that Sheila ordered Nevill at rifle point to phone Bamber has also been made. However surely Nevill would have spent longer than 4 seconds persuading Bamber to go to WHF, in order to appease a 'crazy' Sheila holding him at rifle point. 

Does anyone have any suggestions why Nevill only spoke for 4 seconds to Bamber & then put the phone down ?

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[Angelo222]

It's no secret Nevill's call to Bamber only lasted 4 seconds. Bamber's own evidence was that Nevill said 11 words to him before putting the phone down.

The 11 words completed a sentence, rather than Nevill putting the phone down mid sentence. Suggesting it was Nevill's choice to put the phone down.

This is surprising as Nevill had made the big decision that he needed Bamber's help. Then spent up to 5 minutes ringing & waiting for Bamber to answer. So to just speak for 4 seconds & not give Bamber the chance to respond contradicts Nevill's decision.

According to many supporters & Bamber himself, Nevill also phoned Chelmsford police around half an hour after his phone call to Bamber. This call would have lasted at least 5 minutes, rather than 4 seconds.

The only answers for Nevill's 4 second call so far have been 'we weren't there' & 'it doesn't matter'.

A claim that Sheila ordered Nevill at rifle point to phone Bamber has also been made. However surely Nevill would have spent longer than 4 seconds persuading Bamber to go to WHF, in order to appease a 'crazy' Sheila holding him at rifle point. 

Does anyone have any suggestions why Nevill only spoke for 4 seconds to Bamber & then put the phone down ?

Nevill never phoned anyone, the entire claim was a fabrication invented by Jeremy Bamber merely to strengthen his concocted story.

[adam]

Nevill never phoned anyone, the entire claim was a fabrication invented by Jeremy Bamber merely to strengthen his concocted story.

I was wondering why Bamber said the phone call was 4 seconds.

Bamber may have felt if he went into detail of a two way conversation between him & Nevill, lasting a couple of minutes, he may make a mistake. So he just kept the call to a minimum.

It's doubtful Bamber realised just how short he had made Nevill's call. He does now.

Bamber does not remember what he said to Julie at 10am, 3am & 5am. Together with not remembering what him & Sheila spoke about in the fields. However he remembers the fostering conversation & Nevill's 11 words.

[steve_trousers]

In planning the murders, Bamber must have hesitated over this point. Should he skip the sos phone call and just allow the bodies to be discovered by a 3rd party or is it absolutely necessary that police hear his version of events first?

The phone call ended up being a cornerstone of the prosecutions case, so If he had just allowed the bodies to be discovered next day and raised the possibility of a 3rd party assassin would the outcome at trial have been different ? I bet Bamber has nightmares over his naivety in inventing that phone call from Nevill.

[adam]

In planning the murders, Bamber must have hesitated over this point. Should he skip the sos phone call and just allow the bodies to be discovered by a 3rd party or is it absolutely necessary that police hear his version of events first?

The phone call ended up being a cornerstone of the prosecutions case, so If he had just allowed the bodies to be discovered next day and raised the possibility of a 3rd party assassin would the outcome at trial have been different ? I bet Bamber has nightmares over his naivety in inventing that phone call from Nevill.

There are lots of advantages & disadvantages of Bamber inventing the phone call.

The problem Bamber had was he was a farmer who had early morning starts. He must have been due to be the first person to arrive at WHF. Someone like Barbara Wilson may arrive mid morning if she was due in that day.

Bamber discovering the bodies in the morning is worse than creating a 4am siege situation outside WHF as he can't spend several hours insinuating Sheila to the police. It doesn't round the suspects down to two but surely Julie & the relatives would have reacted in the same way.

He could have gone straight to work on the farm & waited several hours for someone else to hopefully raise an alarm. But then people would ask why he didn't go to WHF or look for Nevill. Espescially if no one noticed a quiet WHF for a long time.

As it happened he invented the 4 second phone call which he says Nevill terminated & then left the phone off the hook so he couldn't ring back. Nevill around 30 minutes later spending at least 5 minutes ringing Chelmsford police, according to Bamber.

[adam]

One thing I can't fault Bamber for doing, was trying to call Nevill back after Nevill put the phone down.

However Nevill felt he had left enough information in these 4 seconds & Bamber would be ringing the WHF door bell soon.

So Nevill left the phone off the hook so Bamber couldn't ring back.

[Holly Goodhead]

It's no secret Nevill's call to Bamber only lasted 4 seconds. Bamber's own evidence was that Nevill said 11 words to him before putting the phone down.

The 11 words completed a sentence, rather than Nevill putting the phone down mid sentence. Suggesting it was Nevill's choice to put the phone down.

This is surprising as Nevill had made the big decision that he needed Bamber's help. Then spent up to 5 minutes ringing & waiting for Bamber to answer. So to just speak for 4 seconds & not give Bamber the chance to respond contradicts Nevill's decision.

According to many supporters & Bamber himself, Nevill also phoned Chelmsford police around half an hour after his phone call to Bamber. This call would have lasted at least 5 minutes, rather than 4 seconds.

The only answers for Nevill's 4 second call so far have been 'we weren't there' & 'it doesn't matter'.

A claim that Sheila ordered Nevill at rifle point to phone Bamber has also been made. However surely Nevill would have spent longer than 4 seconds persuading Bamber to go to WHF, in order to appease a 'crazy' Sheila holding him at rifle point. 

Does anyone have any suggestions why Nevill only spoke for 4 seconds to Bamber & then put the phone down ?

"Sheilas gone crazy she's got a gun".  I make that 8 words and I can say it in around 2 - 3 seconds. 

[adam]

"Sheilas gone crazy she's got a gun".  I make that 8 words and I can say it in around 2 - 3 seconds.

I thought Nevill also said 'please come over'.

[Holly Goodhead]

I thought Nevill also said 'please come over'.

Looks like I can't count!  I meant to say "Sheilas gone crazy she has got a gun" = 8 words. 

No, not according to to early testimony:

http://miscarriageofjustice.co/index.php?topic=5723.msg202984#msg202984

If NB phoned and said "Please come over" then JB's actions thereafter are less convincing.  He received a clear instruction to go over and there was no need for any faffing and dithering.  However if NB said "Sheilas gone crazy she has got a gun" then this imo explains JB faffing and dithering ie trying to make further contact with NB to establish what he wanted doing etc.     

[adam]

Nevill just spending 2-3 seconds saying 'Sheila's gone crazy & she's got the gun', then putting the phone down & leaving it off the hook ?

That is surely the most implausible phone call ever.

Saying 'please come over' is at least asking Bamber to do something. Bamber choosing not to do it.

[Holly Goodhead]

Nevill just spending 2-3 seconds saying 'Sheila's gone crazy & she's got the gun', then putting the phone down & leaving it off the hook ?

That is surely the most implausible phone call ever.

Saying 'please come over' is at least asking Bamber to do something. Bamber choosing not to do it.

All the physical evidence at soc supports "Sheilas gone crazy shes got a gun":

- NB managed to call JB and say "Sheilas gone crazy she has got a gun" before he heard the sound of gunshot and left handset on kitchen worktop to run upstairs.
- June's head was resting on her pillow when she was first shot as per blood stains and Prof MacDonell's report.
- Between NB hearing the sound of first gunshot and sustaining his first gsw, June sustained 5 entry gunshot wounds and possibly a 6th graze wound.
- NB was then shot twice in the face as he approached the bedroom from the landing.  He retreated and was then shot in the back of the shoulder with a further gsw grazing his elbow/chest

All the physical evidence at soc by way of blood stains or lack of, casings, distance of shots, trajectories and wound tracks support this. 

[Myster]

Looks like I can't count!  I meant to say "Sheilas gone crazy she has got a gun" = 8 words. 

No, not according to to early testimony:

http://miscarriageofjustice.co/index.php?topic=5723.msg202984#msg202984

If NB phoned and said "Please come over" then JB's actions thereafter are less convincing.  He received a clear instruction to go over and there was no need for any faffing and dithering.  However if NB said "Sheilas gone crazy she has got a gun" then this imo explains JB faffing and dithering ie trying to make further contact with NB to establish what he wanted doing etc.     

NB did say "Please come over...".... in this mythical call!

https://soundcloud.com/phil-garlic

Hope you're not going to reply with - "I don't believe a word of what Jeremy says after 32 years incarceration"!

Also verified by the JB's subsequent call to the cops...

[Holly Goodhead]

NB did say "Please come over...".... in this mythical call!

https://soundcloud.com/phil-garlic

Hope you're not going to reply with - "I don't believe a word of what Jeremy says after 32 years incarceration"!

Also verified by the JB's subsequent call to the cops...

Initial testimony should trump anything thereafter:

http://miscarriageofjustice.co/index.php?topic=5723.msg202984#msg202984

Based on my correspondence with JB his case knowledge is p*** poor.  Whether he's just thick or his mind has been scrambled over the years by possible PTSD, his long incarceration and some of his more cranky supporters I don't know. 

[adam]

Initial testimony should trump anything thereafter:

http://miscarriageofjustice.co/index.php?topic=5723.msg202984#msg202984

Based on my correspondence with JB his case knowledge is p*** poor.  Whether he's just thick or his mind has been scrambled over the years by possible PTSD, his long incarceration and some of his more cranky supporters I don't know.

As you said, there is a chance Nevill only spent 2-3 seconds saying 'Sheila's gone crazy and she's got the gun'. Then put the phone down & left it off the hook.

Strangest phone call I've ever heard about.

[Holly Goodhead]

As you said, there is a chance Nevill only spent 2-3 seconds saying 'Sheila's gone crazy and she's got the gun'. Then put the phone down & left it off the hook.

Strangest phone call I've ever heard about.

Strange as in unusual yes.  Unusual in that most households in the UK don't feature:

- a mentally unwell daughter
- firearms and ammunition readily available
- remote farmhouse
- a father who was secretive about his daughter's mental illness; a magistrate with low regard for the local police who may not have kept his firearms as recommended or stated by the law and terms of licence; and may have been growing opium poppies illegally on land he was responsible for.

Set against the background the call is not strange and the physical evidence found at soc supports the phone call.