UK Justice Forum 🇬🇧

Disappeared and Abducted Children and Young Adults => Madeleine McCann (3) disappeared from her parent's holiday apartment at Ocean Club, Praia da Luz, Portugal on 3 May 2007. No trace of her has ever been found. => Topic started by: John on November 05, 2018, 12:43:06 AM

Title: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: John on November 05, 2018, 12:43:06 AM
'Poisonous Liar' Top cop who taunted Kate and Gerry has made nearly £350k from Maddie McCann in book and DVD deals.

Kate and Gerry McCann are currently challenging Goncalo Amaral at the European Court of Human Rights in Strasbourg to stop him from cashing in.

By Nick Pisa in Strasbourg
4th November 2018

(https://img.playbuzz.com/image/upload/q_auto:good,f_auto,fl_lossy,w_640,c_limit/v1541376177/u1fpqp0lwglrdcvdmh4r.jpg)

AN ex-police chief who cruelly claimed Madeleine McCann’s parents covered up her death has made more than £350,000 from his book and a DVD.

Portuguese cop Goncalo Amaral’s huge earnings from The Truth Of The Lie have been revealed in court documents.

Kate and Gerry McCann are in a legal battle with Amaral at the European Court of Human Rights over the smears.

Amaral cruelly claims Madeleine, abducted aged three from an Algarve holiday apartment in 2007, died in an accident and the McCanns then covered it up.

Kate and Gerry, who have fought a lengthy legal battle to stop Amaral cashing in, are currently challenging him at the European Court of Human Rights in Strasbourg. A source close to them said: “If Goncalo Amaral continues to make these outrageous claims then he will find he has a tough fight on his hands.

“Kate and Gerry are not going to let him get away with what he said about them.”

Amaral’s earnings from the book are revealed in documents filed at the ECHR.

They show he made 342,111 euros from book sales in 2008-2009 and another 40,000 euros from the DVD spin-off.

The book was translated into multiple languages, with more than 180,000 copies printed. There are fears Amaral plans a follow-up.

An injunction against the book, stopping further sales, was issued in 2009 when the McCanns began a libel action against Amaral, who led the initial Portuguese police inquiry into Madeleine’s disappearance.

They won the case in 2015 but the ruling was overturned on appeal — a decision upheld by Portugal’s Supreme Court. Amaral was awarded compensation.

The injunction on the book was also lifted, leading to thousands more sales and even more cash for Amaral. He is said to have made at least £20,000 from interviews with newspapers and TV stations.

The McCanns have gone to the ECHR in a final effort to avoid paying Amaral £750,000 in compensation.
But it could take until 2021 before the judges decide.

The McCanns fear if they lose, Amaral’s payout will wipe away what is left in the fund set up to finance the continuing search for Madeleine.

Sources close to the family also fear Brexit may have an impact — with judges taking “vengeance” over Britain leaving the EU by ruling against them.

In their argument to the ECHR, the McCanns’ legal team describe the pain and emotional agony Kate and Gerry have gone though since Madeleine disappeared during a family holiday in Praia da Luz in May 2007.

They detail the anguish of the couple being absurdly made suspects by the Portuguese police followed by the pain of Amaral’s outlandish accusations.

The lawyers say Amaral’s book “incriminated innocent citizens, accused of terrible crimes they never committed”. It goes on to say they are trying to “protect not only their reputation but that of the child as well”.

They also say Amaral’s book was “extravagant” and “damaged the good reputation” of the McCann family.

Amaral previously argued in his defence that the book’s allegations come from the police investigation.

He was removed as the investigation head in October 2007 and subsequently left the police to write his book.

A source said: “Kate and Gerry still have full confidence the European Court of Human Rights will find in their favour.

“It hasn’t altered their determination to carry on searching for their daughter. They have never given up hope and this case is an awful distraction but they feel compelled to do something.”

The Met Police has spent £11.6million on the hunt for Madeleine. Last month a request was made to the Home Office for a further six months funding.

The McCanns’ Portuguese lawyer Isabel Duarte said: “This will be our final appeal. The basis is the violation of my clients’ fundamental human rights.”

https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/7658444/cop-made-350k-off-maddie-mccann/

335
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: misty on November 05, 2018, 01:07:17 AM
Why do the press keep reporting Amaral was awarded £750,000 compensation? Is there any truth in this?
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: John on November 05, 2018, 01:39:23 AM
Why do the press keep reporting Amaral was awarded £750,000 compensation? Is there any truth in this?

That figure appears to be made up of the initial award made to the McCanns of £430,000 plus costs.  More restitution than compensation but then Amaral is free to sue any time he likes too.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: misty on November 05, 2018, 01:52:05 AM
That figure appears to be made up of the initial award made to the McCanns of £430,000 plus costs.  More restitution than compensation but then Amaral is free to sue any time he likes too.
So at what stage are the McCanns supposed to have received the amount they were initially awarded?
How is Amaral free to sue now when there is a time limit on defamation cases?
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: barrier on November 05, 2018, 06:58:54 AM
I see brexit gets a mention got to be some ones fault one supposes.Still it's good publicity for the book for any one who is unaware of it,no such thing as bad publicity.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Vertigo Swirl on November 05, 2018, 07:11:23 AM
Does anyone know how Amaral is getting on with sueing the last newspaper to make supposedly false allegations about him?
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Sunny on November 05, 2018, 07:18:22 AM
'Poisonous Liar' Top cop who taunted Kate and Gerry has made nearly £350k from Maddie McCann in book and DVD deals.

Kate and Gerry McCann are currently challenging Goncalo Amaral at the European Court of Human Rights in Strasbourg to stop him from cashing in.

By Nick Pisa in Strasbourg
4th November 2018

(https://img.playbuzz.com/image/upload/q_auto:good,f_auto,fl_lossy,w_640,c_limit/v1541376177/u1fpqp0lwglrdcvdmh4r.jpg)

AN ex-police chief who cruelly claimed Madeleine McCann’s parents covered up her death has made more than £350,000 from his book and a DVD.

Portuguese cop Goncalo Amaral’s huge earnings from The Truth Of The Lie have been revealed in court documents.

Kate and Gerry McCann are in a legal battle with Amaral at the European Court of Human Rights over the smears.

Amaral cruelly claims Madeleine, abducted aged three from an Algarve holiday apartment in 2007, died in an accident and the McCanns then covered it up.

Kate and Gerry, who have fought a lengthy legal battle to stop Amaral cashing in, are currently challenging him at the European Court of Human Rights in Strasbourg. A source close to them said: “If Goncalo Amaral continues to make these outrageous claims then he will find he has a tough fight on his hands.

“Kate and Gerry are not going to let him get away with what he said about them.”

Amaral’s earnings from the book are revealed in documents filed at the ECHR.

They show he made 342,111 euros from book sales in 2008-2009 and another 40,000 euros from the DVD spin-off.

The book was translated into multiple languages, with more than 180,000 copies printed. There are fears Amaral plans a follow-up.

An injunction against the book, stopping further sales, was issued in 2009 when the McCanns began a libel action against Amaral, who led the initial Portuguese police inquiry into Madeleine’s disappearance.

They won the case in 2015 but the ruling was overturned on appeal — a decision upheld by Portugal’s Supreme Court. Amaral was awarded compensation.

The injunction on the book was also lifted, leading to thousands more sales and even more cash for Amaral. He is said to have made at least £20,000 from interviews with newspapers and TV stations.

The McCanns have gone to the ECHR in a final effort to avoid paying Amaral £750,000 in compensation.
But it could take until 2021 before the judges decide.

The McCanns fear if they lose, Amaral’s payout will wipe away what is left in the fund set up to finance the continuing search for Madeleine.

Sources close to the family also fear Brexit may have an impact — with judges taking “vengeance” over Britain leaving the EU by ruling against them.

In their argument to the ECHR, the McCanns’ legal team describe the pain and emotional agony Kate and Gerry have gone though since Madeleine disappeared during a family holiday in Praia da Luz in May 2007.

They detail the anguish of the couple being absurdly made suspects by the Portuguese police followed by the pain of Amaral’s outlandish accusations.

The lawyers say Amaral’s book “incriminated innocent citizens, accused of terrible crimes they never committed”. It goes on to say they are trying to “protect not only their reputation but that of the child as well”.

They also say Amaral’s book was “extravagant” and “damaged the good reputation” of the McCann family.

Amaral previously argued in his defence that the book’s allegations come from the police investigation.

He was removed as the investigation head in October 2007 and subsequently left the police to write his book.

A source said: “Kate and Gerry still have full confidence the European Court of Human Rights will find in their favour.

“It hasn’t altered their determination to carry on searching for their daughter. They have never given up hope and this case is an awful distraction but they feel compelled to do something.”

The Met Police has spent £11.6million on the hunt for Madeleine. Last month a request was made to the Home Office for a further six months funding.

The McCanns’ Portuguese lawyer Isabel Duarte said: “This will be our final appeal. The basis is the violation of my clients’ fundamental human rights.”

https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/7658444/cop-made-350k-off-maddie-mccann/

It does seem that the McCanns have definitely gone to the ECHR in Strasbourg and that this Nick Pisa has seen their application. 

Their application seems to be all about reputation damage including "the child", presumably Madeleine.  Has Goncalo Amaral damaged Madeleine's reputation?

According to Nick Pisa they are taking Goncalo Amaral to court at the ECHR which is of course, wrong.

Lastly, are we to suppose that the couple haven't paid their costs to the Supreme Court and Goncalo Amaral, including his unfrozen assets, as yet?    I was sure that those costs had to be paid regardless of whether there was an appeal to the ECHR.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Mr Gray on November 05, 2018, 07:18:53 AM
Well done the Sun.... I'm sure amaral supports  their  right to free speech
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Vertigo Swirl on November 05, 2018, 07:19:15 AM
I recall a while back there was this view (certainly among some of the Sceptic Intelligensia) that the British media had collectively ceased to refer to Amaral in negative terms as they all secretly knew he was in the right and also believed that he was geared up to sue anyone who said nasty things about him.  I wonder what those people think now?  Surely this article is worth a bitter and twisted blog entry on its own?
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Vertigo Swirl on November 05, 2018, 07:20:15 AM
Well done the Sun.... I'm sure amaral supports  their  right to free speech
Good point, I’m sure he does, lol.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Mr Gray on November 05, 2018, 07:23:25 AM
It does seem that the McCanns have definitely gone to the ECHR in Strasbourg and that this Nick Pisa has seen their application. 

Their application seems to be all about reputation damage including "the child", presumably Madeleine.  Has Goncalo Amaral damaged Madeleine's reputation?

According to Nick Pisa they are taking Goncalo Amaral to court at the ECHR which is of course, wrong.

Lastly, are we to suppose that the couple haven't paid their costs to the Supreme Court and Goncalo Amaral, including his unfrozen assets, as yet?    I was sure that those costs had to be paid regardless of whether there was an appeal to the ECHR.

I don't see any claim to ne taking amaral you the ECHR.. as I have said previously the claim is against Portugal  Re amarals claims
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Sunny on November 05, 2018, 07:26:09 AM
I don't see any claim to ne taking amaral you the ECHR.. as I have said previously the claim is against Portugal  Re amarals claims

Perhaps you didn't read it correctly then, Davel.   From the above article.

Kate and Gerry McCann are in a legal battle with Amaral at the European Court of Human Rights over the smears.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Mr Gray on November 05, 2018, 07:30:19 AM
Perhaps you didn't read it correctly then, Davel.   From the above article.

Kate and Gerry McCann are in a legal battle with Amaral at the European Court of Human Rights over the smears.


They are in a legal battle over the claims made by amaral... I would say your interpretation is wrong
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Mr Gray on November 05, 2018, 07:56:08 AM
It's good to see the sun calling amaral a liar.... Something some posters, here believe but are not allowed to say
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: slartibartfast on November 05, 2018, 08:08:47 AM
'Poisonous Liar' Top cop who taunted Kate and Gerry has made nearly £350k from Maddie McCann in book and DVD deals.

Kate and Gerry McCann are currently challenging Goncalo Amaral at the European Court of Human Rights in Strasbourg to stop him from cashing in.

By Nick Pisa in Strasbourg
4th November 2018

(https://img.playbuzz.com/image/upload/q_auto:good,f_auto,fl_lossy,w_640,c_limit/v1541376177/u1fpqp0lwglrdcvdmh4r.jpg)

AN ex-police chief who cruelly claimed Madeleine McCann’s parents covered up her death has made more than £350,000 from his book and a DVD.

Portuguese cop Goncalo Amaral’s huge earnings from The Truth Of The Lie have been revealed in court documents.

Kate and Gerry McCann are in a legal battle with Amaral at the European Court of Human Rights over the smears.

Amaral cruelly claims Madeleine, abducted aged three from an Algarve holiday apartment in 2007, died in an accident and the McCanns then covered it up.

Kate and Gerry, who have fought a lengthy legal battle to stop Amaral cashing in, are currently challenging him at the European Court of Human Rights in Strasbourg. A source close to them said: “If Goncalo Amaral continues to make these outrageous claims then he will find he has a tough fight on his hands.

“Kate and Gerry are not going to let him get away with what he said about them.”

Amaral’s earnings from the book are revealed in documents filed at the ECHR.

They show he made 342,111 euros from book sales in 2008-2009 and another 40,000 euros from the DVD spin-off.

The book was translated into multiple languages, with more than 180,000 copies printed. There are fears Amaral plans a follow-up.

An injunction against the book, stopping further sales, was issued in 2009 when the McCanns began a libel action against Amaral, who led the initial Portuguese police inquiry into Madeleine’s disappearance.

They won the case in 2015 but the ruling was overturned on appeal — a decision upheld by Portugal’s Supreme Court. Amaral was awarded compensation.

The injunction on the book was also lifted, leading to thousands more sales and even more cash for Amaral. He is said to have made at least £20,000 from interviews with newspapers and TV stations.

The McCanns have gone to the ECHR in a final effort to avoid paying Amaral £750,000 in compensation.
But it could take until 2021 before the judges decide.

The McCanns fear if they lose, Amaral’s payout will wipe away what is left in the fund set up to finance the continuing search for Madeleine.

Sources close to the family also fear Brexit may have an impact — with judges taking “vengeance” over Britain leaving the EU by ruling against them.

In their argument to the ECHR, the McCanns’ legal team describe the pain and emotional agony Kate and Gerry have gone though since Madeleine disappeared during a family holiday in Praia da Luz in May 2007.

They detail the anguish of the couple being absurdly made suspects by the Portuguese police followed by the pain of Amaral’s outlandish accusations.

The lawyers say Amaral’s book “incriminated innocent citizens, accused of terrible crimes they never committed”. It goes on to say they are trying to “protect not only their reputation but that of the child as well”.

They also say Amaral’s book was “extravagant” and “damaged the good reputation” of the McCann family.

Amaral previously argued in his defence that the book’s allegations come from the police investigation.

He was removed as the investigation head in October 2007 and subsequently left the police to write his book.

A source said: “Kate and Gerry still have full confidence the European Court of Human Rights will find in their favour.

“It hasn’t altered their determination to carry on searching for their daughter. They have never given up hope and this case is an awful distraction but they feel compelled to do something.”

The Met Police has spent £11.6million on the hunt for Madeleine. Last month a request was made to the Home Office for a further six months funding.

The McCanns’ Portuguese lawyer Isabel Duarte said: “This will be our final appeal. The basis is the violation of my clients’ fundamental human rights.”

https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/7658444/cop-made-350k-off-maddie-mccann/

It’s the Sun and as usual riddled with errors. If what was stated were true the case would have been declared inadmissible by now.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Mr Gray on November 05, 2018, 08:15:56 AM
It’s the Sun and as usual riddled with errors. If what was stated were true the case would have been declared inadmissible by now.

There is a lot there, stated that is true... Sceptics have completely misjudged the situation  IMO...
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Vertigo Swirl on November 05, 2018, 08:21:36 AM
It’s the Sun and as usual riddled with errors. If what was stated were true the case would have been declared inadmissible by now.
Riddle with errors?  A bit like Amaral’s book and DVD then.  I’m glad to see the Spice Girls are getting back together btw (unless that’s a an error too...)
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: jassi on November 05, 2018, 08:41:38 AM
Does anyone know how Amaral is getting on with sueing the last newspaper to make supposedly false allegations about him?

No.  Next question.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Mr Gray on November 05, 2018, 09:13:22 AM
No.  Next question.

If he thought that was bad he must be livid about this.... His problem is... Is poisonous liar fair comment
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: jassi on November 05, 2018, 09:18:02 AM
It’s the Sun and as usual riddled with errors. If what was stated were true the case would have been declared inadmissible by now.

I wonder what might have prompted this article at this time?
Has the application been rejected and this is a way of trying to get the public on side?
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: jassi on November 05, 2018, 09:28:00 AM
I see the Mail is carrying a similar bullshit story. Probably a McCann Syndicate production.  8(0(*

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-6352723/Policeman-led-hunt-Madeleine-McCann-350-000-book.html
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Mr Gray on November 05, 2018, 09:34:19 AM
I see the Mail is carrying a similar bullshit story. Probably a McCann Syndicate production.  8(0(*

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-6352723/Policeman-led-hunt-Madeleine-McCann-350-000-book.html

I think it's, an excellent article... Putting amaral in his place..
And I doubt he has, any grounds to sue... The UK press can call him a, poisonous liar... I wonder what his, response, will be
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Angelo222 on November 05, 2018, 10:20:49 AM
I see the Mail is carrying a similar bullshit story. Probably a McCann Syndicate production.  8(0(*

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-6352723/Policeman-led-hunt-Madeleine-McCann-350-000-book.html

We all know where these stories are originating don't we.

(https://media1.tenor.com/images/252075a33c0f8abd23cfd0a06eb1ecb6/tenor.gif?itemid=7444337)
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Mr Gray on November 05, 2018, 10:21:28 AM
I see the Mail is carrying a similar bullshit story. Probably a McCann Syndicate production.  8(0(*

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-6352723/Policeman-led-hunt-Madeleine-McCann-350-000-book.html

I see comments by critical of amaral are being removed... The usual censorship
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Mr Gray on November 05, 2018, 10:22:12 AM
We all know where these stories are originating don't we.
The point is can amaral sue or is it fair comment... Are you still trying to say there's no ECHR case
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Erngath on November 05, 2018, 10:24:29 AM
I see the Mail is carrying a similar bullshit story. Probably a McCann Syndicate production.  8(0(*

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-6352723/Policeman-led-hunt-Madeleine-McCann-350-000-book.html


Is the entire article " bullshit" or just  parts of it?
In your opinion  of course.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Mr Gray on November 05, 2018, 10:25:20 AM
It's rather hard for supporters to read a story so critical of amaral
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Erngath on November 05, 2018, 10:25:53 AM
The point is can amaral sue or is it fair comment

Surely he wouldn't sue as he is such a stalwart believer in free speech ?
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: G-Unit on November 05, 2018, 10:29:07 AM
Is there a need for Leveson 2 or will IPSO show some teeth, I wonder? The Editors of both newspapers are not taking notice of the Editor's code in my opinion;

1. Accuracy

i) The Press must take care not to publish inaccurate, misleading or distorted information or images, including headlines not supported by the text.

ii) A significant inaccuracy, misleading statement or distortion must be corrected, promptly and with due prominence, and — where appropriate — an apology published. In cases involving IPSO, due prominence should be as required by the regulator.

iii) A fair opportunity to reply to significant inaccuracies should be given, when reasonably called for.

iv) The Press, while free to editorialise and campaign, must distinguish clearly between comment, conjecture and fact.
https://www.ipso.co.uk/editors-code-of-practice/#Accuracy
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Mr Gray on November 05, 2018, 10:30:04 AM
Amaral has been described by the Sun as a poisonous liar... That really is, highly significant

Amaral being given a, taste of his own medicine.... About time too
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Angelo222 on November 05, 2018, 10:33:24 AM
Amaral has been described by the Sun as a poisonous liar... That really is, highly significant

There was a two day hearing in court last week in the case about the refusal of the government to implement the findings of the Levenson Inquiry. That headline in the Sun is a classic example if one were needed of what is wrong with MSM these days.

https://www.itv.com/news/2018-11-01/high-court-challenge-begins-over-cancellation-of-part-two-of-leveson-inquiry/
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Mr Gray on November 05, 2018, 10:35:15 AM
There was a two day hearing in court last week in the case about the refusal of the government to implement the first  do the of the Levenson Inquiry. That headline in the Sun is a classic example if what is wrong with MSM these days.

Yet when the press were printing allegations  against the McCann's you were fully supportive of the press...amaral is, free to sue.. But does he have a case
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Angelo222 on November 05, 2018, 10:37:22 AM
Yet when the press were printing allegations  against the McCann's you were fully supportive of the press...amaral is, free to sue.. But does he have a case

Did the press call the McCanns "liars" recently?
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Erngath on November 05, 2018, 10:38:57 AM
Did the press call the McCanns "liars" recently?


Amaral has accused them of being liars.
Has he not?
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Mr Gray on November 05, 2018, 10:39:55 AM
Did the press call the McCanns "liars" recently?

As I said... Amaral can sue... But if the press can show he has lied... He has no case... The press should be free to make such an accusation in this case... Amaral is free to sue... What's the problem
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Mr Gray on November 05, 2018, 10:42:36 AM
Why are the sceptics not rejoicing  in the coming court case where amaral can humiliate the UK press
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: G-Unit on November 05, 2018, 10:44:54 AM
Inaccuracies;

Kate and Gerry McCann are currently challenging Goncalo Amaral at the European Court of Human Rights in Strasbourg to stop him from cashing in
The ECHR does't accept applications against individuals

They won the case in 2015 but the ruling was overturned on appeal — a decision upheld by Portugal’s Supreme Court. Amaral was awarded compensation.
The Portuguese courts did not award compensation to Amaral

The McCanns have gone to the ECHR in a final effort to avoid paying Amaral £750,000 in compensation.

If the McCanns owe this money it isn't compensation.

Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: sadie on November 05, 2018, 10:53:11 AM
As I said... Amaral can sue... But if the press can show he has lied... He has no case... The press should be free to make such an accusation in this case... Amaral is free to sue... What's the problem
No way can Amaral sue ... and he must know that as he has a Court conviction for perjury.

Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Erngath on November 05, 2018, 10:54:13 AM
Inaccuracies;

Kate and Gerry McCann are currently challenging Goncalo Amaral at the European Court of Human Rights in Strasbourg to stop him from cashing in
The ECHR does't accept applications against individuals

They won the case in 2015 but the ruling was overturned on appeal — a decision upheld by Portugal’s Supreme Court. Amaral was awarded compensation.
The Portuguese courts did not award compensation to Amaral

The McCanns have gone to the ECHR in a final effort to avoid paying Amaral £750,000 in compensation.

If the McCanns owe this money it isn't compensation.


But no inaccuracy imo in printing that he is a "  Poisonous Liar" ?
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Eleanor on November 05, 2018, 10:59:47 AM
Sauce for The Goose is......etcetera.  At least in Portugal.  Or is this, "Free Speach, but only for Me?"

The Law of Unintended Consequences.

I don't know who is legally responsible for this farce.  Probably Portugal.  But they can't have it both ways.

Amaral won't sue, and I doubt that he ever intended to.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Erngath on November 05, 2018, 11:04:46 AM
Inaccuracies;

Kate and Gerry McCann are currently challenging Goncalo Amaral at the European Court of Human Rights in Strasbourg to stop him from cashing in
The ECHR does't accept applications against individuals

They won the case in 2015 but the ruling was overturned on appeal — a decision upheld by Portugal’s Supreme Court. Amaral was awarded compensation.
The Portuguese courts did not award compensation to Amaral

The McCanns have gone to the ECHR in a final effort to avoid paying Amaral £750,000 in compensation.

If the McCanns owe this money it isn't compensation.

The rest of the article is accurate then?
Including the description of Amaral?
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Mr Gray on November 05, 2018, 11:07:53 AM
Inaccuracies;

Kate and Gerry McCann are currently challenging Goncalo Amaral at the European Court of Human Rights in Strasbourg to stop him from cashing in
The ECHR does't accept applications against individuals

They won the case in 2015 but the ruling was overturned on appeal — a decision upheld by Portugal’s Supreme Court. Amaral was awarded compensation.
The Portuguese courts did not award compensation to Amaral

The McCanns have gone to the ECHR in a final effort to avoid paying Amaral £750,000 in compensation.

If the McCanns owe this money it isn't compensation.

A favourable ruling will silence amaral
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: G-Unit on November 05, 2018, 11:17:59 AM
The rest of the article is accurate then?
Including the description of Amaral?

I have listed inaccuracies which can be proved to be inaccurate and therefore breach the Editor's Code agreed with IPSO. The description of Amaral is an opinion and any challenge would have to be made in the civil courts.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Vertigo Swirl on November 05, 2018, 11:18:17 AM
If the Sun can call Amaral a poisonous liar then there should be no concern on this forum if any of us choose to refer to him in these terms, right?
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Eleanor on November 05, 2018, 11:19:17 AM
A favourable ruling will silence amaral

Will it?  He will lose most of his money, and might not care any more.  But then neither will The McCanns,
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: slartibartfast on November 05, 2018, 11:20:30 AM
If the Sun can call Amaral a poisonous liar then there should be no concern on this forum if any of us choose to refer to him in these terms, right?

You can say what the Sun said. Stating it yourself, no.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: jassi on November 05, 2018, 11:29:07 AM
If the Sun can call Amaral a poisonous liar then there should be no concern on this forum if any of us choose to refer to him in these terms, right?

No skin off my nose - as they say  ?{)(**
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Erngath on November 05, 2018, 11:29:37 AM
You can say what the Sun said. Stating it yourself, no.

If that headline calling him a "Poisonous Liar" is seen today by a vast number of the UK public, not only those who buy the paper but by many who will scan the headlines of all newspaper, why  cannot that same opinion be expressed here?
Interested to know why.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: jassi on November 05, 2018, 11:30:09 AM
Will it? He will lose most of his money, and might not care any more.  But then neither will The McCanns,

What money do you thing he is going to lose?
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Eleanor on November 05, 2018, 11:30:43 AM
If the Sun can call Amaral a poisonous liar then there should be no concern on this forum if any of us choose to refer to him in these terms, right?

Do we really need to?  I would prefer that we didn't.

He is a very sad, little man who wrecked his own life when he could have behaved with dignity.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Eleanor on November 05, 2018, 11:33:53 AM
You can say what the Sun said. Stating it yourself, no.

You could be right.  But only according to The Rules of this Forum.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Vertigo Swirl on November 05, 2018, 11:33:57 AM
No skin off my nose - as they say  ?{)(**
I’m more interested in the views of the mod who seems a little inconsistent in the application of the rule on this forum, no offence to you or the skin on your nose like.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Eleanor on November 05, 2018, 11:35:47 AM
If that headline calling him a "Poisonous Liar" is seen today by a vast number of the UK public, not only those who buy the paper but by many who will scan the headlines of all newspaper, why  cannot that same opinion be expressed here?
Interested to know why.

Just Not Nice, Love.  We are better than that.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Eleanor on November 05, 2018, 11:37:28 AM
What money do you thing he is going to lose?

I don't know, Jassi.  This whole thing has always been a bit beyond my comprehension.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Eleanor on November 05, 2018, 11:41:14 AM
I’m more interested in the views of the mod who seems a little inconsistent in the application of the rule on this forum, no offence to you or the skin on your nose like.

Whatever I might think, I don't like Criticism of Moderation.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Erngath on November 05, 2018, 11:41:51 AM
Do we really need to?  I would prefer that we didn't.

He is a very sad, little man who wrecked his own life when he could have behaved with dignity.

I wouldn't use the description printed today in the Sun, but neither would I agree with your description of him.
Sorry Eleanor.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Eleanor on November 05, 2018, 11:45:07 AM
I wouldn't use the description printed today in the Sun, but neither would I agree with your description of him.
Sorry Eleanor.

No need to apologise, Erngath.  I made a statement that you don't agree with.  Good for you.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: G-Unit on November 05, 2018, 11:49:33 AM
Will it?  He will lose most of his money, and might not care any more.  But then neither will The McCanns,

Amaral's finances won't be affected by any ruling made by the ECHR.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: G-Unit on November 05, 2018, 12:07:37 PM
It's not the first time compensation has been mentioned, perhaps there's some underlying truth? I don't know about Portuguese law, but in the UK compensation can be ordered if a freezing injunction has been imposed on someone.

As the McCanns froze Amaral's assets for eight years there could be some compensatory payment due to him for that, I suppose.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Mr Gray on November 05, 2018, 12:10:00 PM
It's not the first time compensation has been mentioned, perhaps there's some underlying truth? I don't know about Portuguese law, but in the UK compensation can be ordered if a freezing injunction has been imposed on someone.

As the McCanns froze Amaral's assets for eight years there could be some compensatory payment due to him for that, I suppose.

Have his assets been unfrozen.... It's coming up to 2 years since the verdict
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Vertigo Swirl on November 05, 2018, 12:12:31 PM
Do we really need to?  I would prefer that we didn't.

He is a very sad, little man who wrecked his own life when he could have behaved with dignity.
I think this case has been the making of the man, bringing him fame and riches he never would have enjoyed had a little girl not gone missing on his patch.  Not to mention a whole new look and an earring to boot.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Eleanor on November 05, 2018, 12:15:42 PM
Amaral's finances won't be affected by any ruling made by the ECHR.

Of course they will.  Amaral already owed a lot of money to other people, including The State of Portugal long before Madeleine ever went to Portugal.

No one seems to know who has precedence.  But Amaral made no attempt whatsoever to pay these debts during the period of his acquisition of the money and The Court Case brought by The McCanns, which was nigh on a year.
This is a disgrace.

There is a queue.  But the money has been sequestered.  There won't be much left by the time all of his creditors have been paid.

Debtors, Creditors?  Sorry, my knowledge of The English Language fails me for a minute.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: jassi on November 05, 2018, 12:17:31 PM
Of course they will.  Amaral already owed a lot of money to other people, including The State of Portugal long before Madeleine ever went to Portugal.

No one seems to know who has precedence.  But Amaral made no attempt whatsoever to pay these debts during the period of his acquisition of the money and The Court Case brought by The McCanns, which was nigh on a year.
This is a disgrace.

There is a queue.  But the money has been sequestered.  There won't be much left by the time all of his creditors have been paid.

Debtors, Creditors?  Sorry, my knowledge of The English Language fails me for a minute.

Nothing to do with the European court or any decision they may ultimately make.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Erngath on November 05, 2018, 12:18:01 PM
I think this case has been the making of the man, bringing him fame and riches he never would have enjoyed had a little girl not gone missing on his patch.  Not to mention a whole new look and an earring to boot.

Any middle aged man sporting an earring is not a good look.
"Says it all" Lol.
IMO.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Eleanor on November 05, 2018, 12:26:07 PM
I think this case has been the making of the man, bringing him fame and riches he never would have enjoyed had a little girl not gone missing on his patch.  Not to mention a whole new look and an earring to boot.

I thought he look better and more real when he was a mad, fat detective with unkempt hair shouting at The Media. 

He just looks like a ponce now imo.  Sad really.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: G-Unit on November 05, 2018, 12:26:33 PM
Of course they will.  Amaral already owed a lot of money to other people, including The State of Portugal long before Madeleine ever went to Portugal.

No one seems to know who has precedence.  But Amaral made no attempt whatsoever to pay these debts during the period of his acquisition of the money and The Court Case brought by The McCanns, which was nigh on a year.
This is a disgrace.

There is a queue.  But the money has been sequestered.  There won't be much left by the time all of his creditors have been paid.

Debtors, Creditors?  Sorry, my knowledge of The English Language fails me for a minute.

I repeat; nothing the ECHR does will affect any of that.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Eleanor on November 05, 2018, 12:32:40 PM
Nothing to do with the European court or any decision they may ultimately make.

No, of course not.  You are right.  But Portugal will want their Taxes, along with everyone else to whom he owes money.

He could have paid these Debts willingly.  But he didn't.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: G-Unit on November 05, 2018, 12:32:56 PM
Any middle aged man sporting an earring is not a good look.
"Says it all" Lol.
IMO.

When does 'middle age' begin?

(https://hearinghealthmatters.org/hearinginternational/files/2016/02/mer.jpg)
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Vertigo Swirl on November 05, 2018, 12:34:37 PM
When does 'middle age' begin?

(https://hearinghealthmatters.org/hearinginternational/files/2016/02/mer.jpg)
At last.  Some decent eye candy.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: G-Unit on November 05, 2018, 12:40:25 PM
Is 50 'middle aged'?


(https://latimesblogs.latimes.com/.a/6a00d8341c630a53ef0162fbf11c03970d-pi)
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Vertigo Swirl on November 05, 2018, 12:41:12 PM
Is 50 'middle aged'?


(https://latimesblogs.latimes.com/.a/6a00d8341c630a53ef0162fbf11c03970d-pi)
keep ‘em coming.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Erngath on November 05, 2018, 12:47:59 PM
When does 'middle age' begin?

(https://hearinghealthmatters.org/hearinginternational/files/2016/02/mer.jpg)



Yuk!
He's always sported one.
Guess he is middle aged now.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Erngath on November 05, 2018, 12:48:36 PM
Is 50 'middle aged'?


(https://latimesblogs.latimes.com/.a/6a00d8341c630a53ef0162fbf11c03970d-pi)

Yes!
Who is he?
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Vertigo Swirl on November 05, 2018, 12:50:25 PM
Yes!
Who is he?
Eddie Murphy I think.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Erngath on November 05, 2018, 12:51:16 PM
Eddie Murphy I think.

Definitely middle aged.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Eleanor on November 05, 2018, 01:06:29 PM
Definitely middle aged.

Not even all that dishy.  But he could kick a ball.  Oh My.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Angelo222 on November 05, 2018, 01:28:39 PM
Inaccuracies;

Kate and Gerry McCann are currently challenging Goncalo Amaral at the European Court of Human Rights in Strasbourg to stop him from cashing in
The ECHR does't accept applications against individuals

They won the case in 2015 but the ruling was overturned on appeal — a decision upheld by Portugal’s Supreme Court. Amaral was awarded compensation.
The Portuguese courts did not award compensation to Amaral

The McCanns have gone to the ECHR in a final effort to avoid paying Amaral £750,000 in compensation.

If the McCanns owe this money it isn't compensation.

It's what we have come to expect from a Murdoch rag like the Sun where truth comes second every time.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Mr Gray on November 05, 2018, 01:30:26 PM
It's what we have come to expect from a Murdoch rag like the Sun where truth comes second every time.

There's a lot of truth in the article
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Angelo222 on November 05, 2018, 01:31:08 PM
No way can Amaral sue ... and he nust know that

AIMO

Why not Sadie?  If I read the ongoings correctly then Goncalo is biding his time until the ECHR case is settled.  He will then be free from all incumbrances to sue for damages.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Mr Gray on November 05, 2018, 01:32:57 PM
Why not Sadie?  If I read the ongoings correctly then Goncalo is biding his time until the ECHR case is settled.  He will then be free from all incumbrances to sue for damages.

Check up on your law... What's the timebar in a case like this
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Angelo222 on November 05, 2018, 01:33:07 PM
A favourable ruling will silence amaral

 @)(++(*      ...you thought that before and look what happened, the Supreme Court declared they hadn't even been cleared. Talk about putting the cat among the pigeons.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Angelo222 on November 05, 2018, 01:35:27 PM
Check up on your law... What's the timebar in a case like this

The time bar starts from the end of all proceedings which includes any appeal to the European Court.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Eleanor on November 05, 2018, 01:36:25 PM
Why not Sadie?  If I read the ongoings correctly then Goncalo is biding his time until the ECHR case is settled.  He will then be free from all incumbrances to sue for damages.

No he won't.. Amaral has a few other encumbrances.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Angelo222 on November 05, 2018, 01:37:47 PM
No he won't.. Amaral has a few other encumbrances.

He has previously said that he would seek damages so time will tell on that score.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Mr Gray on November 05, 2018, 01:39:19 PM
The time bar starts from the end of all proceedings which includes any appeal to the European Court.

No it doesnt
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Angelo222 on November 05, 2018, 01:41:52 PM
The real lie is that funds which were earmarked to search for a missing child are being squandered on lawyers simply to protect the parents already tarnished reputations.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Eleanor on November 05, 2018, 01:42:15 PM
He has previously said that he would seek damages so time will tell on that score.

One might wonder if he has the cheek.  But then he is a very silly man.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Vertigo Swirl on November 05, 2018, 01:42:21 PM
He has previously said that he would seek damages so time will tell on that score.
he also said he was going to sue the British tabs a few weeks ago.  All hot air IMO.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Angelo222 on November 05, 2018, 01:43:51 PM
No it doesnt

The damages case has been appealed to Portugal's highest court and now allegedly to the ECHR.  Proceedings are therefore ongoing.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Mr Gray on November 05, 2018, 01:45:46 PM
The damages case has been appealed to Portugal's highest court and now allegedly to the ECHR.  Proceedings are therefore ongoing.

There is no real evidence amaral intends to sue the McCann's... There have been claims by the paers either way but nothing from amaral
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Mr Gray on November 05, 2018, 01:50:21 PM
The damages case has been appealed to Portugal's highest court and now allegedly to the ECHR.  Proceedings are therefore ongoing.

So are proceedings, on-going or allegedly ongoing
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: slartibartfast on November 05, 2018, 01:56:58 PM
So are proceedings, on-going or allegedly ongoing

Until someone produces the case number, allegedly.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: G-Unit on November 05, 2018, 02:15:09 PM
Yes!
Who is he?

He's middle aged, so 'it's not a good look' in your opinion.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: jassi on November 05, 2018, 02:26:35 PM
Until someone produces the case number, allegedly.

If this reporter guy has seen the court documents, then he will have seen the case number and ought to be willing to share.
If on the other hand, if all he has seen is a McCann copy of the application form, there may be no case number.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Mr Gray on November 05, 2018, 02:30:55 PM
Until someone produces the case number, allegedly.

So amaral... According to Angelo... Is awaiting the outcine of the alleged ECHR case before he allegedly intends to sue the McCann's..
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: G-Unit on November 05, 2018, 02:41:41 PM
Is Nick casting aspersions on the ECHR judges?

Sources close to the family also fear Brexit may have an impact — with judges taking “vengeance” over Britain leaving the EU by ruling against them.’

Poor, poor them.  Picked on by the PJ, the 'trolls', the media, Amaral, the Portuguese Judiciary, and perhaps the ECHR judges!

Of course Brexit doesn't affect the rights of UK citizens in relation to the ECHR. Something which 'the sources close to the family' seem to be unaware of.

Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Angelo222 on November 05, 2018, 02:52:49 PM
So amaral... According to Angelo... Is awaiting the outcine of the alleged ECHR case before he allegedly intends to sue the McCann's..

Most assuredly Davel. There is no point in him instigating proceedings if the ECHR won't ratify the Supreme Court's final decision in the original case.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Angelo222 on November 05, 2018, 02:54:26 PM
Is Nick casting aspersions on the ECHR judges?

Sources close to the family also fear Brexit may have an impact — with judges taking “vengeance” over Britain leaving the EU by ruling against them.’

Poor, poor them.  Picked on by the PJ, the 'trolls', the media, Amaral, the Portuguese Judiciary, and perhaps the ECHR judges!

Of course Brexit doesn't affect the rights of UK citizens in relation to the ECHR. Something which 'the sources close to the family' seem to be unaware of.

It'll be the McCanns versus Europe next...watch this space.  @)(++(*
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: G-Unit on November 05, 2018, 02:59:33 PM
It'll be the McCanns versus Europe next...watch this space.  @)(++(*

Apparently we will only lose our rights under the ECHR if the UK passes laws post-Brexit to that effect. If they do, perhaps the McCanns will sue their own government? No-one, it seems, is allowed to stand in their way.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Gertrude on November 05, 2018, 03:00:14 PM
he also said he was going to sue the British tabs a few weeks ago.  All hot air IMO.

It's probable it may take more than a couple of weeks?
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Gertrude on November 05, 2018, 03:02:13 PM
Is Nick casting aspersions on the ECHR judges?

Sources close to the family also fear Brexit may have an impact — with judges taking “vengeance” over Britain leaving the EU by ruling against them.’

Poor, poor them.  Picked on by the PJ, the 'trolls', the media, Amaral, the Portuguese Judiciary, and perhaps the ECHR judges!

Of course Brexit doesn't affect the rights of UK citizens in relation to the ECHR. Something which 'the sources close to the family' seem to be unaware of.

   @)(++(*
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Angelo222 on November 05, 2018, 03:04:14 PM
No way can Amaral sue ... and he nust know that as he has a Court conviction for perjury.

His minor perjury conviction has no relevance to the McCann case Sadie. He is free to sue if he so chooses and I can't see any Portuguese court denying him justice given what has already transpired.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Erngath on November 05, 2018, 03:18:41 PM
He's middle aged, so 'it's not a good look' in your opinion.

No, not at all.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Mr Gray on November 05, 2018, 05:01:59 PM
His minor perjury conviction has no relevance to the McCann case Sadie. He is free to sue if he so chooses and I can't see any Portuguese court denying him justice given what has already transpired.

And I can't see the ECHR denying the McCanns justice
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Eleanor on November 05, 2018, 05:07:43 PM
His minor perjury conviction has no relevance to the McCann case Sadie. He is free to sue if he so chooses and I can't see any Portuguese court denying him justice given what has already transpired.

Sadly, nor can I.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Mr Gray on November 05, 2018, 05:24:54 PM
The important point is amaral has been called a poisonous liar... It will be interesting to see how he reacts
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Eleanor on November 05, 2018, 05:29:44 PM
The important point is amaral has been called a poisonous liar... It will be interesting to see how he reacts

I doubt he's a Poisonous Liar.  But he is a bit of a septic fibber.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: faithlilly on November 05, 2018, 05:50:35 PM
Any middle aged man sporting an earring is not a good look.
"Says it all" Lol.
IMO.

Aren’t you one of the posters who berate other posters for bringing the parent’s appearances into the argument ?
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Vertigo Swirl on November 05, 2018, 05:55:37 PM
Is Nick casting aspersions on the ECHR judges?

Sources close to the family also fear Brexit may have an impact — with judges taking “vengeance” over Britain leaving the EU by ruling against them.’

Poor, poor them.  Picked on by the PJ, the 'trolls', the media, Amaral, the Portuguese Judiciary, and perhaps the ECHR judges!

Of course Brexit doesn't affect the rights of UK citizens in relation to the ECHR. Something which 'the sources close to the family' seem to be unaware of.
Yes, poor parents of a missing child who have to deal not only with the tragedy of a their loss but also the on-going vitriol and mockery inherent in attitudes such as that expressed in your post.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Erngath on November 05, 2018, 06:22:16 PM
Aren’t you one of the posters who berate other posters for bringing the parent’s appearances into the argument ?

Lol.
It's the wearing of a earring by a middle-aged man which I criticize.
It's a fashion which in my opinion is not suited to middle aged men.
If Gerry McCann decided to sport an earring, I would find it equally ridiculous.
If at anytime in the future he does so, you have my word that I will be just as critical.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Eleanor on November 05, 2018, 06:25:21 PM
Lol.
It's the wearing of a earring by a middle-aged man which I criticize.
It's a fashion which in my opinion is not suited to middle aged men.
If Gerry McCann decided to sport an earring, I would find it equally ridiculous.
If at anytime in the future he does so, you have my word that I will be just as critical.

Don't imagine that you will be the only one.  Oh My.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Vertigo Swirl on November 05, 2018, 06:30:43 PM
Lol.
It's the wearing of a earring by a middle-aged man which I criticize.
It's a fashion which in my opinion is not suited to middle aged men.
If Gerry McCann decided to sport an earring, I would find it equally ridiculous.
If at anytime in the future he does so, you have my word that I will be just as critical.
Jeez, can you imagine the mockery if that ever happened!!
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: G-Unit on November 05, 2018, 06:42:39 PM
Yes, poor parents of a missing child who have to deal not only with the tragedy of a their loss but also the on-going vitriol and mockery inherent in attitudes such as that expressed in your post.

All true though.................

Yesterday friends of the couple angrily accused police of a deliberate smear campaign .....The couple's spokesman Clarence Williams said yesterday: "Being declared arguidos almost three months ago caused the McCanns' immense anguish and continues to do so.
https://www.standard.co.uk/news/portuguese-police-rushed-to-make-mccanns-suspects-to-avoid-new-law-6623136.html

"Kate and I had the misfortune to suffer from everything the press could throw at us,"
https://www.theguardian.com/media/2013/feb/09/gerry-mccann-leveson-inquiry-press-control-laws

Gerry McCann calls for example to made of ‘vile’ internet trolls
https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2014/oct/03/gerry-mccann-calls-example-made-vile-internet-trolls

Mrs Cameron told the court in Lisbon's Palace of Justice on Wednesday that the book and TV documentary based on it caused the family to be "vilified" and "demonised".
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-24370905

The McCanns accused the Supreme Court judges who ruled against them in their court fight with ex-police chief Goncalo Amaral of nonsensical 'contradictions'.
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-4338616/McCanns-lose-final-court-case-silence-policeman.html
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Vertigo Swirl on November 05, 2018, 06:46:47 PM
All true though.................

Yesterday friends of the couple angrily accused police of a deliberate smear campaign .....The couple's spokesman Clarence Williams said yesterday: "Being declared arguidos almost three months ago caused the McCanns' immense anguish and continues to do so.
https://www.standard.co.uk/news/portuguese-police-rushed-to-make-mccanns-suspects-to-avoid-new-law-6623136.html

"Kate and I had the misfortune to suffer from everything the press could throw at us,"
https://www.theguardian.com/media/2013/feb/09/gerry-mccann-leveson-inquiry-press-control-laws

Gerry McCann calls for example to made of ‘vile’ internet trolls
https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2014/oct/03/gerry-mccann-calls-example-made-vile-internet-trolls

Mrs Cameron told the court in Lisbon's Palace of Justice on Wednesday that the book and TV documentary based on it caused the family to be "vilified" and "demonised".
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-24370905

The McCanns accused the Supreme Court judges who ruled against them in their court fight with ex-police chief Goncalo Amaral of nonsensical 'contradictions'.
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-4338616/McCanns-lose-final-court-case-silence-policeman.html
So what?  I suppose you think they should have soaked up all the lies and the smears and suffered in silence, doing nothing to counteract them for 11+ years, just like you no doubt would have done. 
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Erngath on November 05, 2018, 06:50:06 PM
All true though.................

Yesterday friends of the couple angrily accused police of a deliberate smear campaign .....The couple's spokesman Clarence Williams said yesterday: "Being declared arguidos almost three months ago caused the McCanns' immense anguish and continues to do so.
https://www.standard.co.uk/news/portuguese-police-rushed-to-make-mccanns-suspects-to-avoid-new-law-6623136.html

"Kate and I had the misfortune to suffer from everything the press could throw at us,"
https://www.theguardian.com/media/2013/feb/09/gerry-mccann-leveson-inquiry-press-control-laws

Gerry McCann calls for example to made of ‘vile’ internet trolls
https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2014/oct/03/gerry-mccann-calls-example-made-vile-internet-trolls

Mrs Cameron told the court in Lisbon's Palace of Justice on Wednesday that the book and TV documentary based on it caused the family to be "vilified" and "demonised".
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-24370905

The McCanns accused the Supreme Court judges who ruled against them in their court fight with ex-police chief Goncalo Amaral of nonsensical 'contradictions'.
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-4338616/McCanns-lose-final-court-case-silence-policeman.html



Isn't it dreadful the abuse and vitriol that the parents of a missing child have had to endure.
Quite shocking reading those links.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Brietta on November 05, 2018, 07:14:35 PM
His minor perjury conviction has no relevance to the McCann case Sadie. He is free to sue if he so chooses and I can't see any Portuguese court denying him justice given what has already transpired.

I don't think a conviction for perjury can ever be considered minor.

Among the definitions for perjury are ~ lying under oath ~ giving false evidence/testimony ~ bearing false witness/testimony ~ making false statements.

"Amaral was found guilty of falsifying evidence" https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1186727/Madeleine-chief-detective-convicted-falsifying-evidence-separate-missing-child-case.html

In my opinion it is incompatible for a senior police officer whose conviction for the criminal offence of perjury was upheld on appeal to continue employment as his word can no longer be relied upon.
Quite often I believe the opportunity is taken to go before being pushed and losing one's pension rights.

Maybe describing Amaral as a 'poisonous liar' could be considered a bit OTT but I think that might be qualified by whether or not you are the one he is telling lies about ... as per his conviction for falsifying documents.

Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Mr Gray on November 05, 2018, 07:20:07 PM
His conviction fir perjury might make  it easy for the sun to defend their accusation
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Brietta on November 05, 2018, 07:30:02 PM


Isn't it dreadful the abuse and vitriol that the parents of a missing child have had to endure.
Quite shocking reading those links.

In my opinion the most shocking link is the one which accuses the investigators of a headlong rush to make Madeleine's parents suspects in her disappearance knowing the weakness of their case against them could not have happened when the change in the law came into force only days later.
https://www.standard.co.uk/news/portuguese-police-rushed-to-make-mccanns-suspects-to-avoid-new-law-6623136.html

If that wasn't deliberate character assassination I wouldn't know how else to describe it.

Does it enter the realm of poisonous lying though?  Only I think if it could be proved that the forensic evidence had not actually been misunderstood.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: slartibartfast on November 05, 2018, 07:40:27 PM
“Gonçalo Amaral was convicted for simple false statement, since the version of the alleged fall on the stairs of Leonor Cipriano wasn't proved. Thus, the court considered that Amaral had lied, in order to cover the actions of his unknown colleagues.

The court concluded that António Nunes Cardoso falsified a document, which reported the fall on the stairs of Leonor Cipriano. The sentence for Cardoso was aggravated, given his position as a police officer, "of whom is required to fight the crime."


So basically because the court didn’t believe the fall, the officer who documented it and the officer who repeated what he was told were convicted. Bit of a miscarriage of justice really.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Vertigo Swirl on November 05, 2018, 07:43:38 PM
“Gonçalo Amaral was convicted for simple false statement, since the version of the alleged fall on the stairs of Leonor Cipriano wasn't proved. Thus, the court considered that Amaral had lied, in order to cover the actions of his unknown colleagues.

The court concluded that António Nunes Cardoso falsified a document, which reported the fall on the stairs of Leonor Cipriano. The sentence for Cardoso was aggravated, given his position as a police officer, "of whom is required to fight the crime."


So basically because the court didn’t believe the fall, the officer who documented it and the officer who repeated what he was told were convicted. Bit of a miscarriage of justice really.
In what way was it a miscarriage of justice and if it was, why was there no appeal?
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: G-Unit on November 05, 2018, 07:44:39 PM
Lol.
It's the wearing of a earring by a middle-aged man which I criticize.
It's a fashion which in my opinion is not suited to middle aged men.
If Gerry McCann decided to sport an earring, I would find it equally ridiculous.
If at anytime in the future he does so, you have my word that I will be just as critical.

I thought you quite liked the Eddie Murphy one.  8(>((
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Miss Taken Identity on November 05, 2018, 07:46:11 PM
All true though.................

Yesterday friends of the couple angrily accused police of a deliberate smear campaign .....The couple's spokesman Clarence Williams said yesterday: "Being declared arguidos almost three months ago caused the McCanns' immense anguish and continues to do so.
https://www.standard.co.uk/news/portuguese-police-rushed-to-make-mccanns-suspects-to-avoid-new-law-6623136.html

"Kate and I had the misfortune to suffer from everything the press could throw at us,"
https://www.theguardian.com/media/2013/feb/09/gerry-mccann-leveson-inquiry-press-control-laws

Gerry McCann calls for example to made of ‘vile’ internet trolls
https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2014/oct/03/gerry-mccann-calls-example-made-vile-internet-trolls

Mrs Cameron told the court in Lisbon's Palace of Justice on Wednesday that the book and TV documentary based on it caused the family to be "vilified" and "demonised".
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-24370905

The McCanns accused the Supreme Court judges who ruled against them in their court fight with ex-police chief Goncalo Amaral of nonsensical 'contradictions'.
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-4338616/McCanns-lose-final-court-case-silence-policeman.html

You could also add to that the smear of the people who gave up sleep to search for Madeleine>  No one is searching they are out there by themselves...

The interpreter was smeared... the holiday company... the town and the country! NOW it;s the EU as a whole. OMG  stop already.

Anyway more hot news off the press.  My friends daughter has sent the copy of the MUD dumsun slagpaper to the ECHR which accuses them of bias if we have Brexit.

Now we know where they stand on the Brexit issue.... oh dear!    #not them as well
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Erngath on November 05, 2018, 08:07:26 PM
I thought you quite liked the Eddie Murphy one.  8(>((


No, sorry I didn't.
I think I may have caused confusion by my 'yes " post which was intended as the answer to your query as to whether I considered him middle aged

Sorry you will have to continue posting photos of middle aged men with an earring until you find one which meets with my approval.

If you find a photo of George Clooney with an earring I will be hugely disappointed. @)(++(*
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Vertigo Swirl on November 05, 2018, 08:16:47 PM

No, sorry I didn't.
I think I may have caused confusion by my 'yes " post which was intended as the answer to your query as to whether I considered him middle aged

Sorry you will have to continue posting photos of middle aged men with an earring until you find one which meets with my approval.

If you find a photo of George Clooney with an earring I will be hugely disappointed. @)(++(*
He was younger, and it does suit him IMO... 8(>((

https://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2015/05/19/09/28D6093D00000578-3086968-Looks_familiar_His_hair_and_sideburns_might_be_in_abundance_but_-a-11_1432023013115.jpg

(https://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2015/05/19/09/28D6093D00000578-3086968-Looks_familiar_His_hair_and_sideburns_might_be_in_abundance_but_-a-11_1432023013115.jpg)
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Erngath on November 05, 2018, 08:21:27 PM
He was younger, and it does suit him IMO... 8(>((

https://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2015/05/19/09/28D6093D00000578-3086968-Looks_familiar_His_hair_and_sideburns_might_be_in_abundance_but_-a-11_1432023013115.jpg

(https://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2015/05/19/09/28D6093D00000578-3086968-Looks_familiar_His_hair_and_sideburns_might_be_in_abundance_but_-a-11_1432023013115.jpg)


 8((()*/
However he is very young there.
Wouldn't look good now.
Too classy now for that!


Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Vertigo Swirl on November 05, 2018, 08:27:20 PM

 8((()*/
However he is very young there.
Wouldn't look good now.
Too classy now for that!
He has the look of Springsteen in that picture (the Boss still wears an earring but then he is the Boss, can we have a few exemptions to the rule?  Rock Stars OK, ex-cops turned media celebs not OK).
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Erngath on November 05, 2018, 08:31:26 PM
He has the look of Springsteen in that picture (the Boss still wears an earring but then he is the Boss, can we have a few exemptions to the rule?  Rock Stars OK, ex-cops turned media celebs not OK).


I'll allow you Springsteen.  8((()*/

Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Miss Taken Identity on November 05, 2018, 08:36:24 PM
He has the look of Springsteen in that picture (the Boss still wears an earring but then he is the Boss, can we have a few exemptions to the rule?  Rock Stars OK, ex-cops turned media celebs not OK).

lol Ergarth won't have it now you have upset her!..

Lovely picture. He is an absolute gentleman and a lovely person. I disagree with a lot of what he says on the political scene- I know he is misguided on some issues.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: barrier on November 05, 2018, 09:08:40 PM
From the opening gambit by John.

"AN ex-police chief who cruelly claimed Madeleine McCann’s parents covered up her death has made more than £350,000 from his book and a DVD.

Portuguese cop Goncalo Amaral’s huge earnings from The Truth Of The Lie have been revealed in court documents".



These court documents wouldn't happen to be the first judgement in 2015 would they,these were the kind of figures talked about if I recall.


Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: barrier on November 05, 2018, 09:10:53 PM
I'm sure some one will determine how the sun know this to be true.

"Amaral cruelly claims Madeleine, abducted aged three from an Algarve holiday apartment in 2007, died in an accident and the McCanns then covered it up".
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: barrier on November 05, 2018, 09:19:50 PM
Once again from the article.

"Last month a request was made to the Home Office for a further six months funding".


Strangely no confirmation of any funding granted,given its sister paper the Sun on sunday in its paper version claimed it had been granted.

Whilst on the sun don't forget the trash it put out about Hillsborough,before they are held up as a paragon of virtue in reporting the truth.

Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: barrier on November 05, 2018, 09:53:50 PM
From the opening gambit by John.

"AN ex-police chief who cruelly claimed Madeleine McCann’s parents covered up her death has made more than £350,000 from his book and a DVD.

Portuguese cop Goncalo Amaral’s huge earnings from The Truth Of The Lie have been revealed in court documents".



These court documents wouldn't happen to be the first judgement in 2015 would they,these were the kind of figures talked about if I recall.

A bit of searching brings this up.

"33. The defendant Gonçalo Amaral received the following amounts from the sale of the book: 2008 and 2009, the amount of € 342.111,86 (n°s 3 and 4)".

Taken from the supreme court judgement.
http://www.gerrymccannsblogs.co.uk/Supreme_Court_31_01_2017.htm#32

Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Carana on November 05, 2018, 10:31:39 PM
If this reporter guy has seen the court documents, then he will have seen the case number and ought to be willing to share.
If on the other hand, if all he has seen is a McCann copy of the application form, there may be no case number.

Is this the same Nick Pisa who filed an entire article in the Mail, including descriptions on non-existent details, on when the Knox appeal trial upheld the verdict, that was suddenly whooshed when the verdict was actually totally the opposite?

I read the original before it was whooshed. All I can find now is a screen-shot of part of it.

https://www.dailyedge.ie/wrong-footed-newspaper-sites-accident-publish-knox-is-guilty-stories-244427-Oct2011/

If so, I wouldn't place bets on the idea that he's seen anything at all.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Carana on November 05, 2018, 10:33:43 PM
He has the look of Springsteen in that picture (the Boss still wears an earring but then he is the Boss, can we have a few exemptions to the rule?  Rock Stars OK, ex-cops turned media celebs not OK).

More Richard Gere, I think. lol
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Carana on November 05, 2018, 10:45:41 PM

 8((()*/
However he is very young there.
Wouldn't look good now.
Too classy now for that!

I find some middle-aged men more attractive than when they were younger, oddly enough. Although it might be that hint of maturity. And / or the fact that my teen years have long since passed. :)
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Brietta on November 05, 2018, 11:04:25 PM
Is this the same Nick Pisa who filed an entire article in the Mail, including descriptions on non-existent details, on when the Knox appeal trial upheld the verdict, that was suddenly whooshed when the verdict was actually totally the opposite?

I read the original before it was whooshed. All I can find now is a screen-shot of part of it.

https://www.dailyedge.ie/wrong-footed-newspaper-sites-accident-publish-knox-is-guilty-stories-244427-Oct2011/

If so, I wouldn't place bets on the idea that he's seen anything at all.
He didn't really say anything we didn't already know 🤪 but least he managed to generate a bit of discussion on the forum for a day.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: G-Unit on November 05, 2018, 11:14:46 PM
He didn't really say anything we didn't already know 🤪 but least he managed to generate a bit of discussion on the forum for a day.

Yes. Repeating what others have already written is all he did. Money for old rope being a journalist, it seems.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Carana on November 05, 2018, 11:18:27 PM
He didn't really say anything we didn't already know 🤪 but least he managed to generate a bit of discussion on the forum for a day.

There's no news to discuss at the moment.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: faithlilly on November 05, 2018, 11:31:56 PM
Lol.
It's the wearing of a earring by a middle-aged man which I criticize.
It's a fashion which in my opinion is not suited to middle aged men.
If Gerry McCann decided to sport an earring, I would find it equally ridiculous.
If at anytime in the future he does so, you have my word that I will be just as critical.

Why would you even consider his attire important ?
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Erngath on November 06, 2018, 08:26:43 AM
Why would you even consider his attire important ?

It seems to be you who is attaching any importance to what was a passing remark about my dislike of middle aged men( apart from Bruce Springsteen), suddenly sporting an earring.
However my remark did result in some fairly pleasant photographs being posted by GU and VS.
I'm still hoping for one of Matthew Fox.  @)(++(*
Preferably not sporting an earring.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Vertigo Swirl on November 06, 2018, 09:01:11 AM
It seems to be you who is attaching any importance to what was a passing remark about my dislike of middle aged men( apart from Bruce Springsteen), suddenly sporting an earring.
However my remark did result in some fairly pleasant photographs being posted by GU and VS.
I'm still hoping for one of Matthew Fox.  @)(++(*
Preferably not sporting an earring.
Two sexy men getting it on, one with, one without.
(https://ksassets.timeincuk.net/wp/uploads/sites/55/2016/11/GettyImages-625083066.jpg)
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Erngath on November 06, 2018, 10:53:59 AM
Two sexy men getting it on, one with, one without.
(https://ksassets.timeincuk.net/wp/uploads/sites/55/2016/11/GettyImages-625083066.jpg)



Agreed.
Both looking good.
Bruce scrubs up well. 8((()*/
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Sunny on November 06, 2018, 04:11:52 PM
An article about Nick Pisa

https://www.independent.co.uk/arts-entertainment/films/news/amanda-knox-netflix-documentary-nick-pisa-journalist-meredith-kercher-rafalle-sollecito-a7342376.html
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Carana on November 06, 2018, 05:06:54 PM
An article about Nick Pisa

https://www.independent.co.uk/arts-entertainment/films/news/amanda-knox-netflix-documentary-nick-pisa-journalist-meredith-kercher-rafalle-sollecito-a7342376.html

The one and same. If he reports that it's raining, I'd rather check for myself.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Alice Purjorick on November 06, 2018, 09:31:44 PM
The one and same. If he reports that it's raining, I'd rather check for myself.

Using a pluviometer with a UKAS calibration certificate no doubt  8(0(*
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: G-Unit on November 06, 2018, 10:03:38 PM
I'm surprised no-one minds this man making money by printing unsubstantiated stories about a missing child's poor parents.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Alice Purjorick on November 06, 2018, 10:11:12 PM
Lol.
It's the wearing of a earring by a middle-aged man which I criticize.
It's a fashion which in my opinion is not suited to middle aged men.

If Gerry McCann decided to sport an earring, I would find it equally ridiculous.
If at anytime in the future he does so, you have my word that I will be just as critical.

Fashion? Matelots and Corsairs of old wore them commonplace.
Now what is naff and creepy is blokes over 45 wearing baseball caps. Especially the ones with peaks on the back.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Sunny on November 06, 2018, 10:17:19 PM
I wonder who Nick Pisa was quoting when he quoted  that Goncalo Amaral was a "poisonous liar".   

Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: G-Unit on November 06, 2018, 10:32:01 PM
Fashion? Matelots and Corsairs of old wore them commonplace.
Now what is naff and creepy is blokes over 45 wearing baseball caps. Especially the ones with peaks on the back.

Especially with a suit imo;

(https://www.sapiens.org/wp-content/uploads/2016/10/01-AP_28201453883.jpg)

Some old men look OK

(https://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2015/05/28/22/2928B46D00000578-3101455-image-m-184_1432847871656.jpg)
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Mr Gray on November 06, 2018, 10:35:07 PM
Especially with a suit imo;

(https://www.sapiens.org/wp-content/uploads/2016/10/01-AP_28201453883.jpg)

Some old men look OK

(https://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2015/05/28/22/2928B46D00000578-3101455-image-m-184_1432847871656.jpg)

Poisonous liar... The cap certainly  fits
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Vertigo Swirl on November 06, 2018, 10:36:09 PM
I'm surprised no-one minds this man making money by printing unsubstantiated stories about a missing child's poor parents.
Are they harming the search for the child?  Are the poor parents damaged by the article?  Nick Pisa is a journalist, it’s his profession, of course he’s going to get paid, as is every journo who writes about the case for a paper.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Robittybob1 on November 07, 2018, 03:47:44 AM
I'm surprised no-one minds this man making money by printing unsubstantiated stories about a missing child's poor parents.
Are you talk about Goncalo Amaral?
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: barrier on November 07, 2018, 06:58:01 AM
I'm surprised no-one minds this man making money by printing unsubstantiated stories about a missing child's poor parents.
If there is any solace to be had from the story it's masking the inability of SY to find any alleged abductors  being highlighted.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: G-Unit on November 07, 2018, 07:18:59 AM
Are they harming the search for the child?  Are the poor parents damaged by the article?  Nick Pisa is a journalist, it’s his profession, of course he’s going to get paid, as is every journo who writes about the case for a paper.

A false report is a false report. Whether it's favourable or unfavourable shouldn't be relevant.

Gerry McCann repeats calls he made to the public inquiry into press intrusion, conducted by Lord Justice Leveson, for a “quick, effective way of correcting false reports in newspapers”
https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2014/oct/02/gerry-mccann-madeleine-sunday-times-libel-payout

Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Vertigo Swirl on November 07, 2018, 07:27:23 AM
A false report is a false report. Whether it's favourable or unfavourable shouldn't be relevant.

Gerry McCann repeats calls he made to the public inquiry into press intrusion, conducted by Lord Justice Leveson, for a “quick, effective way of correcting false reports in newspapers”
https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2014/oct/02/gerry-mccann-madeleine-sunday-times-libel-payout
How is this article “press intrusion “?  How is it proven to be false?   Certainly the “poisonous liar” bit would appear to be bang on the money but if you’re so concerned about it you can write to the press complaints commission or whatever they’re called these days, in fact why not rally together some support for it and get lots of people complaining? 
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Carana on November 07, 2018, 08:33:12 AM
Using a pluviometer with a UKAS calibration certificate no doubt  8(0(*

Absolutely. ;)
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Carana on November 07, 2018, 08:59:49 AM
A false report is a false report. Whether it's favourable or unfavourable shouldn't be relevant.

Gerry McCann repeats calls he made to the public inquiry into press intrusion, conducted by Lord Justice Leveson, for a “quick, effective way of correcting false reports in newspapers”
https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2014/oct/02/gerry-mccann-madeleine-sunday-times-libel-payout

I don't know whether it's a false report or not, but I wouldn't take a bet on its accuracy. If he has seen the application, it would have been helpful to provide information as to how the court ruling contravened articles in the Convention.

However unfair I personally find the outcome of the PT court, justice isn't always fair. I'm still curious as to the legal aspects submitted in the ECtHR application.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: jassi on November 07, 2018, 09:10:48 AM
I don't know whether it's a false report or not, but I wouldn't take a bet on its accuracy. If he has seen the application, it would have been helpful to provide information as to how the court ruling contravened articles in the Convention.

However unfair I personally find the outcome of the PT court, justice isn't always fair. I'm still curious as to the legal aspects submitted in the ECtHR application.

If the ECHR find against the McCanns, will you consider that unfair as well ?
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Carana on November 07, 2018, 09:41:18 AM
If the ECHR find against the McCanns, will you consider that unfair as well ?

I'm doing my best to separate my own feelings of fairness from the legal aspects.

I don't find it fair that he has gained a fortune based on a) insisting that Madeleine died that night and b) that  the parents were involved in criminal activities surrounding her, as yet unproven, death. He most certainly wouldn't have been acquitted in a UK court, but Portuguese law is... different.

The current question, AFAIK, is in what way(s) the State of Portugal violated their rights as per legislation in the ECHR.

Without knowing the legal basis for the application, let alone how the Court may rule, I can't answer your question, Jassi.

Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: G-Unit on November 07, 2018, 09:50:26 AM
How is this article “press intrusion “?  How is it proven to be false?   Certainly the “poisonous liar” bit would appear to be bang on the money but if you’re so concerned about it you can write to the press complaints commission or whatever they’re called these days, in fact why not rally together some support for it and get lots of people complaining?

I never said it was press intrusion. It is false on several details which I have previously pointed out. The body you are attempting to refer to is IPSO. 
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Eleanor on November 07, 2018, 09:53:17 AM
I'm doing my best to separate my own feelings of fairness from the legal aspects.

I don't find it fair that he has gained a fortune based on a) insisting that Madeleine died that night and b) that  the parents were involved in criminal activities surrounding her, as yet unproven, death. He most certainly wouldn't have been acquitted in a UK court, but Portuguese law is... different.

The current question, AFAIK, is in what way(s) the State of Portugal violated their rights as per legislation in the ECHR.

Without knowing the legal basis for the application, let alone how the Court may rule, I can't answer your question, Jassi.

I also have tried to separate my feelings from the legal aspects, and it isn't actually all that difficult once you accept that Portugal has a different attitude.

I certainly now know more about Portuguese Law than I ever wanted to.  And while I often don't agree, my thought on that subject are irrelevant.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Vertigo Swirl on November 07, 2018, 09:57:34 AM
I never said it was press intrusion. It is false on several details which I have previously pointed out. The body you are attempting to refer to is IPSO.
Members of that other forum you belong to are I see already writing their angry letters of complaint, be sure to add your voice won’t you?
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: G-Unit on November 07, 2018, 09:59:11 AM
I'm doing my best to separate my own feelings of fairness from the legal aspects.

I don't find it fair that he has gained a fortune based on a) insisting that Madeleine died that night and b) that  the parents were involved in criminal activities surrounding her, as yet unproven, death. He most certainly wouldn't have been acquitted in a UK court, but Portuguese law is... different.

The current question, AFAIK, is in what way(s) the State of Portugal violated their rights as per legislation in the ECHR.

Without knowing the legal basis for the application, let alone how the Court may rule, I can't answer your question, Jassi.

I admire your honesty Carana. Personal feelings of fairness are immaterial in a court of law.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: G-Unit on November 07, 2018, 10:08:29 AM
Members of that other forum you belong to are I see already writing their angry letters of complaint, be sure to add your voice won’t you?

If you are trying to goad me it won't work. Anyone has the right to complain if newspaper editor's breach the code they have agreed to abide by. whatever online forums they may or may not belong to.

https://www.ipso.co.uk/editors-code-of-practice/#Accuracy
https://www.ipso.co.uk/complain/#WhoCanComplain
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: G-Unit on November 07, 2018, 10:54:22 AM
There has already been a ruling on calling Amaral a liar;

UK DAILY EXPRESS PUBLISHES WRITTEN APOLOGY OVER HEADLINE CALLING MADDIE COP A LIAR

“On the 29th April 2015 we published a headline on the front page which said “Maddy detective did lie about death cover-up claim”. We would like to make it clear that there was no determination by the Portuguese court that Mr Amaral lied. In fact the court ruled that Mr Amaral had breached the McCann’s right to reputation and ordered him to pay damages to them”.
http://portugalresident.com/uk-daily-express-publishes-written-apology-over-headline-calling-maddie-cop-a-liar
https://www.ipso.co.uk/rulings-and-resolution-statements/ruling/?id=03363-15
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Vertigo Swirl on November 07, 2018, 10:58:08 AM
If you are trying to goad me it won't work. Anyone has the right to complain if newspaper editor's breach the code they have agreed to abide by. whatever online forums they may or may not belong to.

https://www.ipso.co.uk/editors-code-of-practice/#Accuracy
https://www.ipso.co.uk/complain/#WhoCanComplain
I'm suggesting that rather than whingeing about the injustice of it all on here, you could actually make a difference and whinge to the relevant authority, plus strength in numbers and all that.  Just being helpful is all.  One would have to wonder why anyone who felt so strongly about this grave injustice to poor Mr Amaral WOULDN'T write an angry letter about it!
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: faithlilly on November 07, 2018, 11:44:18 AM
I'm suggesting that rather than whingeing about the injustice of it all on here, you could actually make a difference and whinge to the relevant authority, plus strength in numbers and all that.  Just being helpful is all.  One would have to wonder why anyone who felt so strongly about this grave injustice to poor Mr Amaral WOULDN'T write an angry letter about it!

Amaral has received justice. It’s the parents who feel they haven’t.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: G-Unit on November 07, 2018, 11:46:55 AM
I'm suggesting that rather than whingeing about the injustice of it all on here, you could actually make a difference and whinge to the relevant authority, plus strength in numbers and all that.  Just being helpful is all.  One would have to wonder why anyone who felt so strongly about this grave injustice to poor Mr Amaral WOULDN'T write an angry letter about it!

Is pointing out inaccuracies in a newspaper story whingeing?

Amaral doesn't come into it, it's the British public who are being misled.

You seem to be jumping to the conclusion that I have taken no action.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Carana on November 07, 2018, 11:47:19 AM
I admire your honesty Carana. Personal feelings of fairness are immaterial in a court of law.

Thank you, G-Unit.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Brietta on November 08, 2018, 01:14:07 PM
ByNeil Murphy
5 NOV 2018

A Portuguese detective has made thousands from a book which falsely accuses Madeleine McCann's parents of covering up their daughter's death.

Goncalo Amaral raked in over £350,000 from his book 'The Truth Of The Lie' which falsely claimed Kate and Gerry McCann accidentally killed Madeleine and hid her body, court documents show.
_________________________________________________________________________

The former officer pointed the finger at the British class system in an interview which will be aired on Portuguese news channel CMTV.

Amaral claims Portuguese prosecutors felt ‘intimidated by the United Kingdom’ and claims the McCanns were given special treatment by British authorities because they were doctors.

The ex-policeman refuted claims his officers’ probe was shoddy and says interference from the UK hindered the process.
https://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/news/uk-world-news/madeleine-mccann-cop-pockets-350000-13536790



Is Amaral really going to appear on CMTV to continue the conspiracy theory that 'Portuguese prosecutors felt intimidated by the United Kingdom’ ?
I wonder why he would do that at this moment in time.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Sunny on November 08, 2018, 01:22:09 PM
ByNeil Murphy
5 NOV 2018

A Portuguese detective has made thousands from a book which falsely accuses Madeleine McCann's parents of covering up their daughter's death.

Goncalo Amaral raked in over £350,000 from his book 'The Truth Of The Lie' which falsely claimed Kate and Gerry McCann accidentally killed Madeleine and hid her body, court documents show.
_________________________________________________________________________

The former officer pointed the finger at the British class system in an interview which will be aired on Portuguese news channel CMTV.

Amaral claims Portuguese prosecutors felt ‘intimidated by the United Kingdom’ and claims the McCanns were given special treatment by British authorities because they were doctors.

The ex-policeman refuted claims his officers’ probe was shoddy and says interference from the UK hindered the process.
https://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/news/uk-world-news/madeleine-mccann-cop-pockets-350000-13536790



Is Amaral really going to appear on CMTV to continue the conspiracy theory that 'Portuguese prosecutors felt intimidated by the United Kingdom’ ?
I wonder why he would do that at this moment in time.

Why not?    We have had the spokesman for the McCanns in the media regularly and Gerry McCann on radio 4 recently..
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Mr Gray on November 08, 2018, 01:33:21 PM
It will be interesting to see if he continues to make allegations against the McCann's or whether the upcoming ECHR alleged just my opinion case will temper his accusations
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Brietta on November 08, 2018, 01:37:42 PM
Why not?    We have had the spokesman for the McCanns in the media regularly and Gerry McCann on radio 4 recently..

Why not?  Probably for the same reason some think he has maintained a 'dignified silence' over the past few months while awaiting the turn of events at the European court.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: jassi on November 08, 2018, 01:51:57 PM
ByNeil Murphy
5 NOV 2018

A Portuguese detective has made thousands from a book which falsely accuses Madeleine McCann's parents of covering up their daughter's death.

Goncalo Amaral raked in over £350,000 from his book 'The Truth Of The Lie' which falsely claimed Kate and Gerry McCann accidentally killed Madeleine and hid her body, court documents show.
_________________________________________________________________________

The former officer pointed the finger at the British class system in an interview which will be aired on Portuguese news channel CMTV.

Amaral claims Portuguese prosecutors felt ‘intimidated by the United Kingdom’ and claims the McCanns were given special treatment by British authorities because they were doctors.

The ex-policeman refuted claims his officers’ probe was shoddy and says interference from the UK hindered the process.
https://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/news/uk-world-news/madeleine-mccann-cop-pockets-350000-13536790



Is Amaral really going to appear on CMTV to continue the conspiracy theory that 'Portuguese prosecutors felt intimidated by the United Kingdom’ ?
I wonder why he would do that at this moment in time.

Probably because he was asked.
As far as I know, it's not usual for people to roll up at a radio or TV studio and say 'I'd like to give an interview'
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Brietta on November 08, 2018, 02:07:59 PM
Probably because he was asked.
As far as I know, it's not usual for people to roll up at a radio or TV studio and say 'I'd like to give an interview'

Wonder what the going rate for interviews is nowadays?

Snip
It is believed that he also made £20,000 from interviews about Madeleine’s disappearance ...
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-6352723/Policeman-led-hunt-Madeleine-McCann-350-000-book.html
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: jassi on November 08, 2018, 02:14:34 PM
Wonder what the going rate for interviews is nowadays?

Snip
It is believed that he also made £20,000 from interviews about Madeleine’s disappearance ...
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-6352723/Policeman-led-hunt-Madeleine-McCann-350-000-book.html

So they didn't know, but wrote it anyway.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Vertigo Swirl on November 08, 2018, 03:06:37 PM
Is pointing out inaccuracies in a newspaper story whingeing?

Amaral doesn't come into it, it's the British public who are being misled.

You seem to be jumping to the conclusion that I have taken no action.
I thought it was a similar article to this that so rankled the great man that he promised to take action against the British media? 
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Vertigo Swirl on November 08, 2018, 03:07:54 PM
Amaral has received justice. It’s the parents who feel they haven’t.
The grave injustice of being called a poisonous liar by the British media is what I was referring to.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Vertigo Swirl on November 08, 2018, 03:09:54 PM
Probably because he was asked.
As far as I know, it's not usual for people to roll up at a radio or TV studio and say 'I'd like to give an interview'
And yet that’s precisely the level of control some believe the McCanns are currently exercising over the British media!
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Brietta on November 08, 2018, 03:20:02 PM
So they didn't know, but wrote it anyway.

Who knows? ... it could have been a conservative estimate, apparently he did very many interviews on Portuguese television as well as in print media.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: jassi on November 08, 2018, 03:20:51 PM
And yet that’s precisely the level of control some believe the McCanns are currently exercising over the British media!

Are they ? Can't say I'd noticed.  Apart from Gerry appearing on Psued's Corner, when have they been interviewed recently?
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Vertigo Swirl on November 08, 2018, 03:24:13 PM
Are they ? Can't say I'd noticed.  Apart from Gerry appearing on Psued's Corner, when have they been interviewed recently?
I think you’ll find that *some* people believe these latest articles about the ECHR have been deliberately orchestrated by Team McCann, hence the belief they are controlling the media for some sinister purpose.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Brietta on November 08, 2018, 03:49:59 PM
Are they ? Can't say I'd noticed.  Apart from Gerry appearing on Psued's Corner, when have they been interviewed recently?
Do you have a cite for Gerry appearing on psued's corner?
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: jassi on November 08, 2018, 03:54:57 PM
Do you have a cite for Gerry appearing on psued's corner?

His recent  little poetry session on the BBC
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Sunny on November 08, 2018, 03:56:55 PM
Wonder what the going rate for interviews is nowadays?

Snip
It is believed that he also made £20,000 from interviews about Madeleine’s disappearance ...
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-6352723/Policeman-led-hunt-Madeleine-McCann-350-000-book.html

How much did the McCanns make out of their interviews Brietta?
https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/2779529/madeleine-mccann-family-tv-10th-anniversary/
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: faithlilly on November 08, 2018, 05:24:33 PM
I think you’ll find that *some* people believe these latest articles about the ECHR have been deliberately orchestrated by Team McCann, hence the belief they are controlling the media for some sinister purpose.

Feeding yes, controlling no.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: G-Unit on November 08, 2018, 05:38:49 PM
How much did the McCanns make out of their interviews Brietta?
https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/2779529/madeleine-mccann-family-tv-10th-anniversary/

All those bids for the 10th anniversary interview and they accepted none of them. The money could have gone towards paying the sizeable amount in costs they had just been ordered to pay in Portugal.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Vertigo Swirl on November 08, 2018, 07:19:54 PM
Feeding yes, controlling no.
Given that you seem to believe thst no one is interested in the McCanns anymore and wish they would quietly sink into obscurity why do you think the papers keep on putting their stories on the front pages of the newspapers?
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: faithlilly on November 08, 2018, 07:22:46 PM
Given that you seem to believe thst no one is interested in the McCanns anymore and wish they would quietly sink into obscurity why do you think the papers keep on putting their stories on the front pages of the newspapers?

It’s cheap.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Vertigo Swirl on November 08, 2018, 08:19:54 PM
It’s cheap.
Haha, so are articles about Brexit or X Factor or any other number of stories.  You have failed to come up with a sensible reason for the continuing front page stories about the McCanns.  IMO.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Brietta on November 08, 2018, 08:44:31 PM
How much did the McCanns make out of their interviews Brietta?
https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/2779529/madeleine-mccann-family-tv-10th-anniversary/

 ... Nothing.

Snip

Kate and Gerry McCann, both 39, were reported to have been offered more than £1 million to appear on either Oprah Winfrey’s chat show or ABC’s talk show with Barbara Walters.
______________________________________________________________________________________

Clarence Mitchell, the couple’s spokesman, confirmed that the McCanns had been approached by both chat show programmes but insisted no money had been discussed.

He said the couple had ruled out doing any interviews while they remained arguidos, or formal suspects, in the case.

He said: "There is categorically no truth to the suggestion that any sort of bidding war is currently taking place between American networks or American programmes.

"Gerry and Kate will not be doing any sit-down interviews whilst they remain arguidos because of their legal position and this has been communicated clearly to any media, international or domestic, who are continuing to bid for interviews with them. Nor has any money for any such interview ever been discussed in any shape or form."
______________________________________________________________________________________

A spokesman for Harpo Productions, which produces the Oprah Winfrey show in the US, confirmed they had approached the McCanns about an interview, but insisted they were not involved in a bidding war.

She said: "The Oprah Winfrey Show does not pay for news interviews."

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/1576625/Madeleine-McCann-parents-in-1m-Oprah-bid.html

Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: faithlilly on November 09, 2018, 12:39:46 AM
Haha, so are articles about Brexit or X Factor or any other number of stories.  You have failed to come up with a sensible reason for the continuing front page stories about the McCanns.  IMO.

Brexit and X Facror stories do appear on the front pages of the tabloids but Sun readers need a varied diet so free press releases provided by Mitchell are welcome additions to the usual tabloid fodder.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Vertigo Swirl on November 09, 2018, 07:17:00 AM
Brexit and X Facror stories do appear on the front pages of the tabloids but Sun readers need a varied diet so free press releases provided by Mitchell are welcome additions to the usual tabloid fodder.
So newspapers are not bothered if stories interest their readers, and would favour a cheap story no one is interested in for their front pages, over what exactly...?  Give us an example of a not cheap story that Sun readers would be interested in? 
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Vertigo Swirl on November 09, 2018, 08:10:47 AM
'Poisonous Liar' Top cop who taunted Kate and Gerry has made nearly £350k from Maddie McCann in book and DVD deals.

Kate and Gerry McCann are currently challenging Goncalo Amaral at the European Court of Human Rights in Strasbourg to stop him from cashing in.

By Nick Pisa in Strasbourg
4th November 2018

(https://img.playbuzz.com/image/upload/q_auto:good,f_auto,fl_lossy,w_640,c_limit/v1541376177/u1fpqp0lwglrdcvdmh4r.jpg)

AN ex-police chief who cruelly claimed Madeleine McCann’s parents covered up her death has made more than £350,000 from his book and a DVD.

Portuguese cop Goncalo Amaral’s huge earnings from The Truth Of The Lie have been revealed in court documents.

Kate and Gerry McCann are in a legal battle with Amaral at the European Court of Human Rights over the smears.

Amaral cruelly claims Madeleine, abducted aged three from an Algarve holiday apartment in 2007, died in an accident and the McCanns then covered it up.

Kate and Gerry, who have fought a lengthy legal battle to stop Amaral cashing in, are currently challenging him at the European Court of Human Rights in Strasbourg. A source close to them said: “If Goncalo Amaral continues to make these outrageous claims then he will find he has a tough fight on his hands.

“Kate and Gerry are not going to let him get away with what he said about them.”

Amaral’s earnings from the book are revealed in documents filed at the ECHR.

They show he made 342,111 euros from book sales in 2008-2009 and another 40,000 euros from the DVD spin-off.

The book was translated into multiple languages, with more than 180,000 copies printed. There are fears Amaral plans a follow-up.

An injunction against the book, stopping further sales, was issued in 2009 when the McCanns began a libel action against Amaral, who led the initial Portuguese police inquiry into Madeleine’s disappearance.

They won the case in 2015 but the ruling was overturned on appeal — a decision upheld by Portugal’s Supreme Court. Amaral was awarded compensation.

The injunction on the book was also lifted, leading to thousands more sales and even more cash for Amaral. He is said to have made at least £20,000 from interviews with newspapers and TV stations.

The McCanns have gone to the ECHR in a final effort to avoid paying Amaral £750,000 in compensation.
But it could take until 2021 before the judges decide.

The McCanns fear if they lose, Amaral’s payout will wipe away what is left in the fund set up to finance the continuing search for Madeleine.

Sources close to the family also fear Brexit may have an impact — with judges taking “vengeance” over Britain leaving the EU by ruling against them.

In their argument to the ECHR, the McCanns’ legal team describe the pain and emotional agony Kate and Gerry have gone though since Madeleine disappeared during a family holiday in Praia da Luz in May 2007.

They detail the anguish of the couple being absurdly made suspects by the Portuguese police followed by the pain of Amaral’s outlandish accusations.

The lawyers say Amaral’s book “incriminated innocent citizens, accused of terrible crimes they never committed”. It goes on to say they are trying to “protect not only their reputation but that of the child as well”.

They also say Amaral’s book was “extravagant” and “damaged the good reputation” of the McCann family.

Amaral previously argued in his defence that the book’s allegations come from the police investigation.

He was removed as the investigation head in October 2007 and subsequently left the police to write his book.

A source said: “Kate and Gerry still have full confidence the European Court of Human Rights will find in their favour.

“It hasn’t altered their determination to carry on searching for their daughter. They have never given up hope and this case is an awful distraction but they feel compelled to do something.”

The Met Police has spent £11.6million on the hunt for Madeleine. Last month a request was made to the Home Office for a further six months funding.

The McCanns’ Portuguese lawyer Isabel Duarte said: “This will be our final appeal. The basis is the violation of my clients’ fundamental human rights.”

https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/7658444/cop-made-350k-off-maddie-mccann/
A Boris Brexit Story, a Spice Girls story and a Madeleine McCann story - why was the latter the big headline if no one is interested in the McCanns anymore and wishes they would go away?
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: jassi on November 09, 2018, 08:42:03 AM
I liken it to a scab.
 You know you shouldn't pick at it, but it proves difficult to avoid doing so
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: G-Unit on November 09, 2018, 08:46:46 AM
ByNeil Murphy
5 NOV 2018

A Portuguese detective has made thousands from a book which falsely accuses Madeleine McCann's parents of covering up their daughter's death.

Goncalo Amaral raked in over £350,000 from his book 'The Truth Of The Lie' which falsely claimed Kate and Gerry McCann accidentally killed Madeleine and hid her body, court documents show.
_________________________________________________________________________

The former officer pointed the finger at the British class system in an interview which will be aired on Portuguese news channel CMTV.

Amaral claims Portuguese prosecutors felt ‘intimidated by the United Kingdom’ and claims the McCanns were given special treatment by British authorities because they were doctors.

The ex-policeman refuted claims his officers’ probe was shoddy and says interference from the UK hindered the process.
https://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/news/uk-world-news/madeleine-mccann-cop-pockets-350000-13536790



Is Amaral really going to appear on CMTV to continue the conspiracy theory that 'Portuguese prosecutors felt intimidated by the United Kingdom’ ?
I wonder why he would do that at this moment in time.

Another highly inaccurate article.

The distraught couple are now in a legal battle with the former Policia Judiciaria officer at the European Court of Human Rights over the false claims. WRONG

The McCann's sought to halt the sale of the book by issuing an injunction and began a libel case against the Portuguese detective in 2015. WRONG

But he successfully overturned the ruling last April - forcing Kate and Gerry to lodge an appeal in Portugal’s Supreme Court. WRONG
https://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/news/uk-world-news/madeleine-mccann-cop-pockets-350000-13536790

I think this journalist is confused. He seems to know the content of this interview which has not yet been broadcast. I think he's referring to a past event, not a future one.




Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Brietta on November 09, 2018, 09:09:37 AM
Another highly inaccurate article.

The distraught couple are now in a legal battle with the former Policia Judiciaria officer at the European Court of Human Rights over the false claims. WRONG

The McCann's sought to halt the sale of the book by issuing an injunction and began a libel case against the Portuguese detective in 2015. WRONG

But he successfully overturned the ruling last April - forcing Kate and Gerry to lodge an appeal in Portugal’s Supreme Court. WRONG
https://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/news/uk-world-news/madeleine-mccann-cop-pockets-350000-13536790

I think this journalist is confused. He seems to know the content of this interview which has not yet been broadcast. I think he's referring to a past event, not a future one.

Well he does tend to reiterate the same old same old whenever or wherever or interviewed by whom and even those he denies giving ... so who would really be able to tell the difference?
(http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-kpG4EzvoZiI/WQHvIPIzVtI/AAAAAAAANsQ/XilpHr0VfZ4vKEKirer2P-RfbOsWnG3UwCLcB/s640/ga1.jpg)
Amaral not giving an interview to Channel 7 Australian journalist
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: jassi on November 09, 2018, 09:25:17 AM
Well he does tend to reiterate the same old same old whenever or wherever or interviewed by whom and even those he denies giving ... so who would really be able to tell the difference?
(http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-kpG4EzvoZiI/WQHvIPIzVtI/AAAAAAAANsQ/XilpHr0VfZ4vKEKirer2P-RfbOsWnG3UwCLcB/s640/ga1.jpg)
Amaral not giving an interview to Channel 7 Australian journalist

I believe that Australian program was very much a cut & paste job.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: The General on November 09, 2018, 09:28:44 AM
If I was in his position, as a disenfranchised ex-cop with a story to tell and people who want to hear that story, I'd be giving an interview to the milkman for a few quid. I'd regurgitate that sh** ad nauseum to anyone who pays.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Mr Gray on November 09, 2018, 09:40:29 AM
Strange his silence have g been called a poisoned liar
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Brietta on November 09, 2018, 09:47:34 AM
If I was in his position, as a disenfranchised ex-cop with a story to tell and people who want to hear that story, I'd be giving an interview to the milkman for a few quid. I'd regurgitate that sh** ad nauseum to anyone who pays.


In my opinion that is exactly what he did ... the only problem for him as far as I can see is that he didn't really have a story to tell and if he had told the one he did differently he could have been quids in.
I think that 'Ace up his sleeve' must be causing chafing and discomfort by now.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: The General on November 09, 2018, 10:17:53 AM


In my opinion that is exactly what he did ... the only problem for him as far as I can see is that he didn't really have a story to tell and if he had told the one he did differently he could have been quids in.
I think that 'Ace up his sleeve' must be causing chafing and discomfort by now.
.....and yet that lack of a story hasn't held him back at all, in fact it's compelling enough for global media to keep coming back. I doubt it chafes at all.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: G-Unit on November 09, 2018, 10:18:38 AM
I believe that Australian program was very much a cut & paste job.


I don't think the woman involved works for Channel 7 any more. Apparently trying to pass off old interviews as new ones was frowned upon.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Erngath on November 09, 2018, 10:24:20 AM
.....and yet that lack of a story hasn't held him back at all, in fact it's compelling enough for global media to keep coming back. I doubt it chafes at all.


Do you believe the ace is still up his sleeve, waiting  to be shown at some time in the future?
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: faithlilly on November 09, 2018, 10:40:27 AM
A Boris Brexit Story, a Spice Girls story and a Madeleine McCann story - why was the latter the big headline if no one is interested in the McCanns anymore and wishes they would go away?

You’d have to provide figures for sales of the Sun when Madeleine McCann is featured and when she isn’t. Once you prove sales do actually go up then we can discuss.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Eleanor on November 09, 2018, 10:49:12 AM
If I was in his position, as a disenfranchised ex-cop with a story to tell and people who want to hear that story, I'd be giving an interview to the milkman for a few quid. I'd regurgitate that sh** ad nauseum to anyone who pays.

Could you please watch your language.  Entirely unnecessary.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Brietta on November 09, 2018, 10:55:58 AM
.....and yet that lack of a story hasn't held him back at all, in fact it's compelling enough for global media to keep coming back. I doubt it chafes at all.

Do you imagine that outside our little internet chat fora the world at large knows anything about Amaral and if they even care if they do.

Why else might it have come as a surprise to some that he was at one time rolling in cash as a result not of his success in solving the case of a missing child but of playing prosecution, judge and jury as far as her parents are concerned.  All without one iota of proof and singularly flying in the face of logic as determined by the PJ and prosecutors in 2008.

Cristovao wasn't stupid enough to miss out on enjoying the proceeds from one of his series of books on missing children ... on this occasion, Madeleine ... without let or hindrance of missing out on the rewards a best seller generates.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Lace on November 09, 2018, 11:31:43 AM
IMO I would agree with the Nick Pisa in what he says.   Amaral stated in his book that the DNA and dog alerts proved there was a body,  is that true? No.   It is poisonous as people believe him.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: G-Unit on November 09, 2018, 11:56:02 AM
IMO I would agree with the Nick Pisa in what he says.   Amaral stated in his book that the DNA and dog alerts proved there was a body,  is that true? No.   It is poisonous as people believe him.

I think you'll find that statement is not a fact, it's an opinion.

Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: sadie on November 09, 2018, 02:59:23 PM
If I was in his position, as a disenfranchised ex-cop with a story to tell and people who want to hear that story, I'd be giving an interview to the milkman for a few quid. I'd regurgitate that sh** ad nauseum to anyone who pays.

Some people have morals, others don't
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Vertigo Swirl on November 09, 2018, 03:00:35 PM
You’d have to provide figures for sales of the Sun when Madeleine McCann is featured and when she isn’t. Once you prove sales do actually go up then we can discuss.
When you provide proof that I said sales go up when the McCanns feature on the front pages then we can continue the discussion.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Vertigo Swirl on November 09, 2018, 03:03:24 PM
I think you'll find that statement is not a fact, it's an opinion.
Are you claiming people don’t subscribe to Amaral ‘s view that Madeleine died in the apartment and her parents covered up her death?
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: sadie on November 09, 2018, 03:12:40 PM
I think you'll find that statement is not a fact, it's an opinion.

It's a fact.

As an email from a friend who was a strong early supporter, now very elderly and retired from discussions, proved to me only about three weeks ago



His daughter and son in law had come across some Amaral propaganda and had fallen for it.  They had very nearly persuaded him too.

I soon told him about some of the actual facts and additionally showed how many of the senior PJ were provern liars / criminals and he realised what was happening.   



A great big propaganda and disinformation assault on The Mccanns has taken place.  Still is.

And unfortunately the lies seem to be winning over the facts.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Vertigo Swirl on November 09, 2018, 03:57:07 PM
I liken it to a scab.
 You know you shouldn't pick at it, but it proves difficult to avoid doing so
In other words, contrary to Faithlilly’s assertion that no one is interested in McCann stories anymore, they are, like picking at scabs, quite irresistible to the British public!
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: jassi on November 09, 2018, 04:04:08 PM
In other words, contrary to Faithlilly’s assertion that no one is interested in McCann stories anymore, they are, like picking at scabs, quite irresistible to the British public!

Yup,  that's how I see it   ?{)(**
Others may differ.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: barrier on November 09, 2018, 04:32:42 PM
It's a fact.

As an email from a friend who was a strong early supporter, now very elderly and retired from discussions, proved to me only about three weeks ago



His daughter and son in law had come across some Amaral propaganda and had fallen for it.  They had very nearly persuaded him too.

I soon told him about some of the actual facts and additionally showed how many of the senior PJ were provern liars / criminals and he realised what was happening.   



A great big propaganda and disinformation assault on The Mccanns has taken place.  Still is.

And unfortunately the lies seem to be winning over the facts.

Or the facts win over the lies.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: sadie on November 09, 2018, 04:45:34 PM
Or the facts win over the lies.

I hope so.  Seems to be coming together slowly.  Just hope it happens soon
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Lace on November 09, 2018, 04:59:39 PM
I think you'll find that statement is not a fact, it's an opinion.

I'm sorry G-Unit but I think it's fact.   I am forever reading messages after an article in the paper quoting Amaral especially about the Calpol,  but usually they say 'drugged'.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: G-Unit on November 09, 2018, 05:40:09 PM
I'm sorry G-Unit but I think it's fact.   I am forever reading messages after an article in the paper quoting Amaral especially about the Calpol,  but usually they say 'drugged'.

Do they mention him by name?
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: faithlilly on November 09, 2018, 07:20:02 PM
When you provide proof that I said sales go up when the McCanns feature on the front pages then we can continue the discussion.

You appear to be claiming that McCann stories appear on the front pages of tabloids because they sell copy. You could only know that by comparing how many copies that are sold when there’s a McCann story on the front pages compared to when there isn’t.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Robittybob1 on November 09, 2018, 07:21:59 PM
You appear to be claiming that McCann stories appear on the front pages of tabloids because they sell copy. You could only know that by comparing how many copies that are sold when there’s a McCann story on the front pages compared to when there isn’t.
But then you would have to consider the other stories as well.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Brietta on November 09, 2018, 07:37:17 PM
You appear to be claiming that McCann stories appear on the front pages of tabloids because they sell copy. You could only know that by comparing how many copies that are sold when there’s a McCann story on the front pages compared to when there isn’t.

Daily Express editor Peter Hill defends Madeleine McCann coverage
Snip

At the time the Daily Express regarded the police as a credible source of information, he added. "I didn't know that they were behaving like tinpot Ruritanian idiots," Hill said.

_____________________________________________________________________
 
"I accept that we did libel Mr and Mrs McCann because under the law, we clearly didn't tell the truth about them," he said.

Madeleine McCann's disappearance generated huge amounts of public interest, with the Express receiving 10,000 messages a day about the story and its sales increasing by many thousands of copies each time an article about the missing child appeared on the front page, Hill added.

"You have got to remember that this was the most astonishing chain of events. Nothing comparable to this had been seen since the Lindberg kidnapping in 1932," he said.

https://www.theguardian.com/media/2009/apr/28/daily-express-peter-hill-mps
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Carana on November 09, 2018, 08:01:47 PM
Daily Express editor Peter Hill defends Madeleine McCann coverage
Snip

At the time the Daily Express regarded the police as a credible source of information, he added. "I didn't know that they were behaving like tinpot Ruritanian idiots," Hill said.

_____________________________________________________________________
 
"I accept that we did libel Mr and Mrs McCann because under the law, we clearly didn't tell the truth about them," he said.

Madeleine McCann's disappearance generated huge amounts of public interest, with the Express receiving 10,000 messages a day about the story and its sales increasing by many thousands of copies each time an article about the missing child appeared on the front page, Hill added.

"You have got to remember that this was the most astonishing chain of events. Nothing comparable to this had been seen since the Lindberg kidnapping in 1932," he said.

https://www.theguardian.com/media/2009/apr/28/daily-express-peter-hill-mps

From what I've read (no, I couldn't provide links now), there was a legal loophole which was manna for tabloid heaven in that the case took place on foreign soil and therefore wasn't clearly subject to the usual reporting rules.

From my own observation (and it may also have cropped up in the Leveson inquiry), the lack of a PT media strategy had led to excesses in the PT  tabloids, which ended up being repeated in the UK tabloids with the addition of the usual  tabloid drop-down menu of adjectives such as "Portuguese sources outrageously /  disgracefully /... / claim that..." and thought they'd get away with it.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Vertigo Swirl on November 09, 2018, 08:03:59 PM
You appear to be claiming that McCann stories appear on the front pages of tabloids because they sell copy. You could only know that by comparing how many copies that are sold when there’s a McCann story on the front pages compared to when there isn’t.
What factors do you think determine which stories appear on the front page of any given newspaper?
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: G-Unit on November 09, 2018, 08:21:30 PM
Daily Express editor Peter Hill defends Madeleine McCann coverage
Snip

At the time the Daily Express regarded the police as a credible source of information, he added. "I didn't know that they were behaving like tinpot Ruritanian idiots," Hill said.

_____________________________________________________________________
 
"I accept that we did libel Mr and Mrs McCann because under the law, we clearly didn't tell the truth about them," he said.

Madeleine McCann's disappearance generated huge amounts of public interest, with the Express receiving 10,000 messages a day about the story and its sales increasing by many thousands of copies each time an article about the missing child appeared on the front page, Hill added.

"You have got to remember that this was the most astonishing chain of events. Nothing comparable to this had been seen since the Lindberg kidnapping in 1932," he said.

https://www.theguardian.com/media/2009/apr/28/daily-express-peter-hill-mps

Apart from a few official announcements the Express didn't print quotes from the Portuguese Police, they repeated stories taken from the Portuguese media which were purported to have come from the Portuguese Police. Hill admitted that in his evidence;

However, the Portuguese police, because of the rules in Portugal which forbid them from commenting on cases, resorted to leaking all manner of information to the Portuguese media and this was where we went wrong of course because we picked up these stories.
https://publications.parliament.uk/pa/cm200910/cmselect/cmcumeds/362/9042803.htm

So he wasn't relying on the credibility of the Police, he was relying on the credibility of the Portuguese Press. Nevertheless he still blames the Police and insults them by referring to them as behaving like 'tinpot Ruritanian idiots'.

Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Carana on November 09, 2018, 08:47:38 PM
Apart from a few official announcements the Express didn't print quotes from the Portuguese Police, they repeated stories taken from the Portuguese media which were purported to have come from the Portuguese Police. Hill admitted that in his evidence;

However, the Portuguese police, because of the rules in Portugal which forbid them from commenting on cases, resorted to leaking all manner of information to the Portuguese media and this was where we went wrong of course because we picked up these stories.
https://publications.parliament.uk/pa/cm200910/cmselect/cmcumeds/362/9042803.htm

So he wasn't relying on the credibility of the Police, he was relying on the credibility of the Portuguese Press. Nevertheless he still blames the Police and insults them by referring to them as behaving like 'tinpot Ruritanian idiots'.

I'm not sure he was relying on  anything aside from column inches with "Maddie" at the top of the search engines.

There's also a certain xenophobic tendency to take into account in UK tabloids...
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: G-Unit on November 09, 2018, 09:03:13 PM
I'm not sure he was relying on  anything aside from column inches with "Maddie" at the top of the search engines.

There's also a certain xenophobic tendency to take into account in UK tabloids...

Which some of their readership seem to share. It's quite incomprehensible to me, I'm afraid.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: pathfinder73 on November 09, 2018, 09:39:23 PM
It's a fact.

As an email from a friend who was a strong early supporter, now very elderly and retired from discussions, proved to me only about three weeks ago



His daughter and son in law had come across some Amaral propaganda and had fallen for it.  They had very nearly persuaded him too.

I soon told him about some of the actual facts and additionally showed how many of the senior PJ were provern liars / criminals and he realised what was happening.   



A great big propaganda and disinformation assault on The Mccanns has taken place.  Still is.

And unfortunately the lies seem to be winning over the facts.

The propaganda in this case is abduction with no proof. Somebody saying that happened doesn't mean it's true. It's only true if you want it to be with no evidence - like you claiming a photo of Bushra was Madeleine.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Carana on November 09, 2018, 11:10:44 PM
Which some of their readership seem to share. It's quite incomprehensible to me, I'm afraid.

It's the old argument  of whether the media cater to the bias of their readership, or whether the public is attracted to what the media publishes.

For a long time, my staple was the IHT so I really wasn't used to the tabloid press. It took a while until it dawned on me that tabloids didn't feel bound by the usual journalistic ethics. Makes me feel old,  when I think back.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: faithlilly on November 09, 2018, 11:57:11 PM
Daily Express editor Peter Hill defends Madeleine McCann coverage
Snip

At the time the Daily Express regarded the police as a credible source of information, he added. "I didn't know that they were behaving like tinpot Ruritanian idiots," Hill said.

_____________________________________________________________________
 
"I accept that we did libel Mr and Mrs McCann because under the law, we clearly didn't tell the truth about them," he said.

Madeleine McCann's disappearance generated huge amounts of public interest, with the Express receiving 10,000 messages a day about the story and its sales increasing by many thousands of copies each time an article about the missing child appeared on the front page, Hill added.

"You have got to remember that this was the most astonishing chain of events. Nothing comparable to this had been seen since the Lindberg kidnapping in 1932," he said.

https://www.theguardian.com/media/2009/apr/28/daily-express-peter-hill-mps

Peter Hill was talking about 10 years ago. Do you have anything more recent ?
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: faithlilly on November 10, 2018, 12:01:47 AM
Apart from a few official announcements the Express didn't print quotes from the Portuguese Police, they repeated stories taken from the Portuguese media which were purported to have come from the Portuguese Police. Hill admitted that in his evidence;

However, the Portuguese police, because of the rules in Portugal which forbid them from commenting on cases, resorted to leaking all manner of information to the Portuguese media and this was where we went wrong of course because we picked up these stories.
https://publications.parliament.uk/pa/cm200910/cmselect/cmcumeds/362/9042803.htm

So he wasn't relying on the credibility of the Police, he was relying on the credibility of the Portuguese Press. Nevertheless he still blames the Police and insults them by referring to them as behaving like 'tinpot Ruritanian idiots'.

What has always puzzled me is that if the articles were not true why would they have needed to be leaked ? Couldn’t the journalists simply have made them up ?
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: G-Unit on November 10, 2018, 08:17:28 AM
What has always puzzled me is that if the articles were not true why would they have needed to be leaked ? Couldn’t the journalists simply have made them up ?

The UK journalists didn't just take the stories from the Portuguese press and print them verbatim. According to 
Clarence Mitchell. They changed them and exaggerated them;

Something that was even often just a suggestion or an allegation, unsourced in the Portuguese press, by the time it found its way across the Channel, had become hardened up into fact with an extra scare headline or whatever on top of it. That is where the real problems started because these things would end up in the cuttings file and would become an accepted fact in the story when in fact they were complete distortions in many cases or entirely untrue in others.
https://publications.parliament.uk/pa/cm200910/cmselect/cmcumeds/362/9031008.htm
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Eleanor on November 11, 2018, 06:04:21 AM

But was Amaral a Poisonous Liar?  Personally, I think that description is a bit over the top, but he was definitely a bit of a Fibber.

I don't know why, but I doubt that it was anything to do with his Honour, unless he feels that The PJ treated him badly, despite not sacking him when he was convicted of Perjury.

So is Amaral's main gripe against The PJ and not The McCanns at all?
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: barrier on November 11, 2018, 08:32:12 AM
But was Amaral a Poisonous Liar?  Personally, I think that description is a bit over the top, but he was definitely a bit of a Fibber.

I don't know why, but I doubt that it was anything to do with his Honour, unless he feels that The PJ treated him badly, despite not sacking him when he was convicted of Perjury.

So is Amaral's main gripe against The PJ and not The McCanns at all?

I suspect those who refer to him as a "poisonous liar" do so because of a position they can,nothing to do with actually knowing it.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Vertigo Swirl on November 11, 2018, 08:34:09 AM

Why were SY searching for her remains in 2014 then?
Cite needed for “searching for her remains”.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Eleanor on November 11, 2018, 08:48:41 AM

Why were SY searching for her remains in 2014 then?

This is by the by.  Police do search scrubland and often find nothing.  It is part of the process and should have been done by The PJ much sooner.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Eleanor on November 11, 2018, 08:50:37 AM
I suspect those who refer to him as a "poisonous liar" do so because of a position they can,nothing to do with actually knowing it.

It is a matter of Opinion, to which we are all entitled.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: barrier on November 11, 2018, 09:11:35 AM
Cite needed for “searching for her remains”.

To paraphrase a reply from your good self the other day,Oh! FGS.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: barrier on November 11, 2018, 09:36:06 AM
It is a matter of Opinion, to which we are all entitled.


One can have one,but as to one is entitled is a different matter.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Vertigo Swirl on November 11, 2018, 09:37:07 AM
To paraphrase a reply from your good self the other day,Oh! FGS.
You asked me for a cite that I have given a million times before which confirmed the veracity of my post, hence my exasperation .  You will be unable to provide a cite to prove the veracity of yours, so you are not entitled to FGS me.  8(>((
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: sadie on November 11, 2018, 09:55:16 AM
But was Amaral a Poisonous Liar?  Personally, I think that description is a bit over the top, but he was definitely a bit of a Fibber.

I don't know why, but I doubt that it was anything to do with his Honour, unless he feels that The PJ treated him badly, despite not sacking him when he was convicted of Perjury.

So is Amaral's main gripe against The PJ and not The McCanns at all?

I am sorry Eleanor, but he has shown himself to be a liar.  He is a convicted perjurer FGS.

And look at the so called evidence in the Joana case.  There is none IMO, yet it comes from him that

1)  Leonor and Joao were having top level hanky panky when Joana saw them so they killed her
2)  Leonor threw herself down the stairs when IMO it was untrue
3)  Joanas blood was in the fridge, when it was never tested and could even have been pigs blood
4)  Joanas body was chopped up into small pieces,and fed to the pigs.  No evidence of that

Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: G-Unit on November 11, 2018, 10:11:55 AM
But was Amaral a Poisonous Liar?  Personally, I think that description is a bit over the top, but he was definitely a bit of a Fibber.

I don't know why, but I doubt that it was anything to do with his Honour, unless he feels that The PJ treated him badly, despite not sacking him when he was convicted of Perjury.

So is Amaral's main gripe against The PJ and not The McCanns at all?

Amaral was convicted in 2009, wasn't he? He had already retired from the PJ by then.
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/5370361/Madeleine-McCann-police-chief-found-guilty-of-falsifying-evidence.html

He was certainly displeased with the PJ who wouldn't allow him to defend himself publicly in 2007. In my opinion that's why he decided to retire and put his story into book form.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: jassi on November 11, 2018, 10:17:44 AM
You asked me for a cite that I have given a million times before which confirmed the veracity of my post, hence my exasperation .  You will be unable to provide a cite to prove the veracity of yours, so you are not entitled to FGS me.  8(>((

Really? I know you post a lot, but not as much as that.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: barrier on November 11, 2018, 10:20:48 AM
I am sorry Eleanor, but he has shown himself to be a liar.  He is a convicted perjurer FGS.

And look at the so called evidence in the Joana case.  There is none IMO, yet it comes from him that

1)  Leonor and Joao were having top level hanky panky when Joana saw them so they killed her
2)  Leonor threw herself down the stairs when IMO it was untrue
3)  Joanas blood was in the fridge, when it was never tested and could even have been pigs blood
4)  Joanas body was chopped up into small pieces,and fed to the pigs.  No evidence of that

It doesn't come from him.
"They later claimed they were tortured into confessing but police said that Mrs Cipriano tried to commit suicide by throwing herself off a staircase.
Three inspectors – Leonel Marques, Pereira Cristovao and Paulo Marques Bom – were cleared of torture after a seven-month trial at Faro Court in the Algarve."

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/5370361/Madeleine-McCann-police-chief-found-guilty-of-falsifying-evidence.html

So on what basis does the author refer to Amaral as a "poisinous liar".
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: barrier on November 11, 2018, 10:25:20 AM
You asked me for a cite that I have given a million times before which confirmed the veracity of my post, hence my exasperation .  You will be unable to provide a cite to prove the veracity of yours, so you are not entitled to FGS me.  8(>((


What does a forensic archaeologist look for?
What would cadaver dogs be used for.
Why would officers be lifting up manhole covers then using micro-cameras attached to fibre optic cables.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Vertigo Swirl on November 11, 2018, 10:43:00 AM

What does a forensic archaeologist look for?
What would cadaver dogs be used for.
Why would officers be lifting up manhole covers then using micro-cameras attached to fibre optic cables.
I agree it would seem on the face of it that they were looking for a body, just as, on the face of it, it would seem that The Met are looking for a stranger in connection with Madeleine’s abduction.  If you can accept one, why not the other?
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Eleanor on November 11, 2018, 10:50:00 AM

One can have one,but as to one is entitled is a different matter.

I am, and so apparently was Amaral.  I don't know if you think you aren't.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Eleanor on November 11, 2018, 10:52:09 AM
Amaral was convicted in 2009, wasn't he? He had already retired from the PJ by then.
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/5370361/Madeleine-McCann-police-chief-found-guilty-of-falsifying-evidence.html

He was certainly displeased with the PJ who wouldn't allow him to defend himself publicly in 2007. In my opinion that's why he decided to retire and put his story into book form.

That's what I think.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Eleanor on November 11, 2018, 10:54:33 AM
It doesn't come from him.
"They later claimed they were tortured into confessing but police said that Mrs Cipriano tried to commit suicide by throwing herself off a staircase.
Three inspectors – Leonel Marques, Pereira Cristovao and Paulo Marques Bom – were cleared of torture after a seven-month trial at Faro Court in the Algarve."

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/5370361/Madeleine-McCann-police-chief-found-guilty-of-falsifying-evidence.html

So on what basis does the author refer to Amaral as a "poisinous liar".

Perjury isn't very nice.  Especially coming from a serving Police Officer.  And it is against The Law.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Robittybob1 on November 11, 2018, 11:14:20 AM
In both photos - same woman (or fat guy with manboobs), same girl... but deffo not Madeleine.
That is what I think too.   
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: barrier on November 11, 2018, 11:56:10 AM
I am, and so apparently was Amaral.  I don't know if you think you aren't.

I don't have ideas above my station,today is the 100th anniversary of the signing of the armistice, the sacrifice's the poor sods gave certainly never gave me an entitlement, they preserved me the right which is a world of difference.God bless them all.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Vertigo Swirl on November 11, 2018, 12:00:40 PM
I don't have ideas above my station,today is the 100th anniversary of the signing of the armistice, the sacrifice's the poor sods gave certainly never gave me an entitlement, they preserved me the right which is a world of difference.God bless them all.
Strange.  Today we remember those who fought for our freedoms, including the right to hold an opinion, whatever it may be.  We are all entitled to one, even you, so why argue otherwise?
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Eleanor on November 11, 2018, 12:04:48 PM
I don't have ideas above my station,today is the 100th anniversary of the signing of the armistice, the sacrifice's the poor sods gave certainly never gave me an entitlement, they preserved me the right which is a world of difference.God bless them all.

Perhaps you didn't lose your childhood or your mother, and effectively your father as well.  I am entitled to what they gave up for me.

Strangely enough, I am not a great believer in Free Speech.  My generation didn't need it, and are all too well aware of how much damage it can do thoughtlessly.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: barrier on November 11, 2018, 12:08:35 PM
"believing oneself to be inherently deserving of privileges or special treatment".


Maybe it really is a class thing.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Eleanor on November 11, 2018, 12:11:18 PM
"believing oneself to be inherently deserving of privileges or special treatment".


Maybe it really is a class thing.

Hardly.  Most of the people who lost their lives were very working class.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: barrier on November 11, 2018, 12:13:01 PM
I agree it would seem on the face of it that they were looking for a body, just as, on the face of it, it would seem that The Met are looking for a stranger in connection with Madeleine’s abduction.  If you can accept one, why not the other?


"Rowley 2017:We don't have evidence telling us if Madeleine is alive or dead. It is a missing person’s inquiry but as a team we are realistic about what we might be dealing with - especially as months turn to years".

How does that lend itself to looking for a stranger.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: barrier on November 11, 2018, 12:13:50 PM
Hardly.  Most of the people who lost their lives were very working class.


I wasn't referring to them.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Eleanor on November 11, 2018, 12:17:24 PM

I wasn't referring to them.

You think I'm not working class?  If so, thanks for the compliment.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Vertigo Swirl on November 11, 2018, 12:23:06 PM

"Rowley 2017:We don't have evidence telling us if Madeleine is alive or dead. It is a missing person’s inquiry but as a team we are realistic about what we might be dealing with - especially as months turn to years".

How does that lend itself to looking for a stranger.
Well it does obviously , but you have of course selectively quoted as well. 
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Vertigo Swirl on November 11, 2018, 12:23:34 PM
"believing oneself to be inherently deserving of privileges or special treatment".


Maybe it really is a class thing.
What are you on about?
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: barrier on November 11, 2018, 01:07:48 PM
What are you on about?


Meaning of entitled,Eleanor grasped it.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: barrier on November 11, 2018, 01:09:39 PM
Well it does obviously , but you have of course selectively quoted as well.


Nope,its the only relevant bit,unless you want Do Carmo as well.

Brunt:Do you accept the girl, was abducted.

Pedro Do Carmo:We don't know what happened.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Mr Gray on November 11, 2018, 01:11:01 PM

Meaning of entitled,Eleanor grasped it.
Being entitled to something does not have to involve special priveleges... We are entitled to hold an opinion...that is a fact
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: John on November 11, 2018, 01:39:56 PM
Let's keep posts credible please everyone. 
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: G-Unit on November 11, 2018, 01:55:32 PM
Perjury isn't very nice.  Especially coming from a serving Police Officer.  And it is against The Law.

As South Yorkshire Police discovered, finally, in respect of Hillsborough. Over a hundred statements were altered to get them off the hook.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Vertigo Swirl on November 11, 2018, 01:59:48 PM

Meaning of entitled,Eleanor grasped it.
So if I'm entitled to disability pay it's because it's a class thing.  What utter nonsense.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Vertigo Swirl on November 11, 2018, 02:01:13 PM

Nope,its the only relevant bit,unless you want Do Carmo as well.

Brunt:Do you accept the girl, was abducted.

Pedro Do Carmo:We don't know what happened.
Did Andy Redwood ever say that they were treating the Madeleine McCann case as one of stranger abduction?  If so, why did he ever say that if there was zero evidence to support the theory?  Over to you.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: faithlilly on November 11, 2018, 02:52:49 PM
Did Andy Redwood ever say that they were treating the Madeleine McCann case as one of stranger abduction?  If so, why did he ever say that if there was zero evidence to support the theory?  Over to you.

But he didn’t actually say that if you read the whole quote in context.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Vertigo Swirl on November 11, 2018, 02:56:38 PM
But he didn’t actually say that if you read the whole quote in context.
Here we go round the Mulberry bush, the Mulberry bush, the Mulberry bush. 
Yes he did.  You prefer to squeeze an alternative meaning out of his words, that's your affair.  Every single media outlet in the world who reported it heard what he said and the ALL reported the same thing - the Met believed Madeleine was abducted by a stranger.  Only "sceptics" heard different.  Typical!
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: John on November 11, 2018, 03:13:16 PM
I am sorry Eleanor, but he has shown himself to be a liar.  He is a convicted perjurer FGS.

And look at the so called evidence in the Joana case.  There is none IMO, yet it comes from him that

1)  Leonor and Joao were having top level hanky panky when Joana saw them so they killed her
2)  Leonor threw herself down the stairs when IMO it was untrue
3)  Joanas blood was in the fridge, when it was never tested and could even have been pigs blood
4)  Joanas body was chopped up into small pieces,and fed to the pigs.  No evidence of that

No matter what you think of Amaral, his theories as to what befell Joana Cipriano are based on his direct personal knowledge of the case.  He didn't invent the 'fed her to the pigs story', that came from the mouth of the self-confessed killer himself.

What I cannot understand though is this continual attempt to paint the mother, Leonor Cipriano, as some sort of victim when this couldn't be further from the truth. At best Leonor was complicit in the coverup following the murder of her daughter and at worst she was there when it happened but did nothing to save her.  Either way, the woman is a disgrace.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Mr Gray on November 11, 2018, 03:19:31 PM
No matter what you think of Amaral, his theories as to what befell Joana Cipriano are based on his direct personal knowledge of the case.  He didn't invent the 'fed her to the pigs story', that came from the mouth of the self-confessed killer himself.

What I cannot understand though is this continual attempt to paint the mother, Leonor Cipriano, as some sort of victim when this couldn't be further from the truth. At best Leonor was complicit in the coverup following the murder of her daughter and at worst she was there when it happened but did nothing to save her.  Either way, the woman is a disgrace.
I think she may well be a victim of a miscarriage of justice....weve gone through it all before...there isnt any real evidence Joanna is dead.... We know the PJ were prepared to lie...they claimed she fell down the stairs to cause her injuries which was not accepted by the court...so did they tell other lies to secure the conviction...who knows


His ideas on the McCann case are based on his personal experience of the cse.....and its clear he doesnt understand the evidence...imo
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: John on November 11, 2018, 04:22:30 PM
I think she may well be a victim of a miscarriage of justice....weve gone through it all before...there isnt any real evidence Joanna is dead.... We know the PJ were prepared to lie...they claimed she fell down the stairs to cause her injuries which was not accepted by the court...so did they tell other lies to secure the conviction...who knows


His ideas on the McCann case are nased on his personal experience of the cse.....and its clear he doesnt understand the evidence...imo

I think Gonçalo Amaral understood the evidence extremely well despite the attempts to undermine and derail the investigation. He was placed in an impossible situation given the unprecedented diplomatic intrusion and external police involvement. Ultimately his superiors capitulated to external pressures hanging him out to dry.  A rather sorry episode in policing all said and done.

Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Mr Gray on November 11, 2018, 04:28:11 PM
I think Gonçalo Amaral understood the evidence extremely well despite the attempts to undermine and derail the investigation. He was placed in an impossible situation given the unprecedented diplomatic intrusion and external police involvement. Ultimately his superiors capitulated to external pressures hanging him out to dry.  A rather sorry episode in policing all said and done.

amaral is on record as thinking the dog alerts confirmed a cadaver and the forensics confirmed maddies dna...he was wrong on both
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: faithlilly on November 11, 2018, 06:06:27 PM
Here we go round the Mulberry bush, the Mulberry bush, the Mulberry bush. 
Yes he did.  You prefer to squeeze an alternative meaning out of his words, that's your affair.  Every single media outlet in the world who reported it heard what he said and the ALL reported the same thing - the Met believed Madeleine was abducted by a stranger.  Only "sceptics" heard different.  Typical!

No media outlet printed the comment. I have posted it here, several times, and it is nowhere as cut and dried as supporters would like to suggest.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Vertigo Swirl on November 11, 2018, 06:08:37 PM
No media outlet printed the comment. I have posted it here, several times, and it is nowhere as cut and dried as supporters would like to suggest.
LOL.  No media outlet reported that the Met were treating Madeleine’s disappearance as abduction by a stranger?  Maybe not in the universe you inhabit.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: faithlilly on November 11, 2018, 06:13:34 PM
LOL.  No media outlet reported that the Met were treating Madeleine’s disappearance as abduction by a stranger?  Maybe not in the universe you inhabit.

Verbatim.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Vertigo Swirl on November 11, 2018, 06:13:46 PM
This is just one of numerous media outlets that reported that Andy Redwood said he believed Madeleine was abducted by a stranger.   Why did all the journalists around the world who reported on his statement and wrote that the Met believed Madeleitwas abducted by a stranger not hear what the sceptics heard?  Simple question...

https://www.theguardian.com/uk/2012/apr/25/madeleine-mccann-case-reopen-call
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Vertigo Swirl on November 11, 2018, 06:15:14 PM
Verbatim.
Hundreds of media outlets interpreted his words the same way I (and most normal people) interpreted them.  Only sceptics intuit special alternative meaning from them - why is that?
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Sunny on November 11, 2018, 06:16:30 PM
Hundreds of media outlets interpreted his words the same way I (and most normal people) interpreted them.  Only sceptics intuit special alternative meaning from them - why is that?

Is that the same as supporters and media seem to have mis- interpreted the Attourney General's final statements as the McCanns were cleared?
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: faithlilly on November 11, 2018, 06:20:16 PM
This is just one of numerous media outlets that reported that Andy Redwood said he believed Madeleine was abducted by a stranger.   Why did all the journalists around the world who reported on his statement and wrote that the Met believed Madeleitwas abducted by a stranger not hear what the sceptics heard?  Simple question...

https://www.theguardian.com/uk/2012/apr/25/madeleine-mccann-case-reopen-call

I have no idea. Redwood was certainly clever with his wording.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Mr Gray on November 11, 2018, 06:29:42 PM
I have no idea. Redwood was certainly clever with his wording.

Very clever... If you play it backwards he's saying... We know it was the mccanns
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Lace on November 12, 2018, 09:42:50 AM
Do they mention him by name?

Yes they do.   Haven't you seen many urging the public to read his book?   Read the TRUTH as they say?   He poisoned the public against the McCann's. IMO
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: The General on November 12, 2018, 10:06:16 AM
Very clever... If you play it backwards he's saying... We know it was the mccanns
He could be right.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: G-Unit on November 12, 2018, 10:14:51 AM
Yes they do.   Haven't you seen many urging the public to read his book?   Read the TRUTH as they say?   He poisoned the public against the McCann's. IMO

If the public do read his book they will find he doesn't accuse the McCanns of drugging their children. He discusses the possibility, but reaches no conclusions.



Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: barrier on November 12, 2018, 10:20:41 AM
Here we go round the Mulberry bush, the Mulberry bush, the Mulberry bush. 
Yes he did.  You prefer to squeeze an alternative meaning out of his words, that's your affair.  Every single media outlet in the world who reported it heard what he said and the ALL reported the same thing - the Met believed Madeleine was abducted by a stranger.  Only "sceptics" heard different.  Typical!
Belief, not evidence,thats why its still ongoing.
Still if Redwoods word is his bond,remind us again about the two possibilities he says of the girls fate in leaving 5a.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: G-Unit on November 12, 2018, 10:45:16 AM
Yes they do.   Haven't you seen many urging the public to read his book?   Read the TRUTH as they say?   He poisoned the public against the McCann's. IMO

Just because people share his opinion doesn't mean they do so because they read his book.Who has poisoned the public against Amaral? That has been much more direct, personally insulting and pervasive than anything he has ever said about the McCanns. 
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Mr Gray on November 12, 2018, 10:49:43 AM
Just because people share his opinion doesn't mean they do so because they read his book.Who has poisoned the public against Amaral? That has been much more direct, personally insulting and pervasive than anything he has ever said about the McCanns.

You need to remember amaral is, a convicted criminal

He has accused the McCann's of being criminals
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Erngath on November 12, 2018, 10:50:42 AM
Yes they do.   Haven't you seen many urging the public to read his book?   Read the TRUTH as they say?   He poisoned the public against the McCann's. IMO


Indeed Lace.
There is no doubt that he poisoned the minds of many of the public against Madeleine's parents.
And sadly to this day many believe some of the poison.

Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: barrier on November 12, 2018, 10:52:06 AM

Indeed Lace.
There is no doubt that he poisoned the minds of many of the public against Madeleine's parents.
And sadly to this day many believe some of the poison.

The court of public opinion has no bearing what so ever in the disappearance of Madeleine.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Erngath on November 12, 2018, 10:53:25 AM
The court of public opinion has no bearing what so ever in the disappearance of Madeleine.


??
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Erngath on November 12, 2018, 10:58:03 AM
Just because people share his opinion doesn't mean they do so because they read his book.Who has poisoned the public against Amaral? That has been much more direct, personally insulting and pervasive than anything he has ever said about the McCanns.

Who has poisoned the public against Amaral?
In my opinion he  was responsible for his own bad publicity.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: faithlilly on November 12, 2018, 11:01:07 AM

Indeed Lace.
There is no doubt that he poisoned the minds of many of the public against Madeleine's parents.
And sadly to this day many believe some of the poison.

And if this was a popularity contest your thoughts would be relevant by it isn’t so.....?
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Erngath on November 12, 2018, 11:04:50 AM
And if this was a popularity contest your thoughts would be relevant by it isn’t so.....?

Thanks for that.
It doesn't make any sense.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Lace on November 12, 2018, 11:21:45 AM
Just because people share his opinion doesn't mean they do so because they read his book.Who has poisoned the public against Amaral? That has been much more direct, personally insulting and pervasive than anything he has ever said about the McCanns.

His opinion is his book though isn't it?   Though he doesn't say it's just his opinion at the end of the book he says it was proven that Madeleine died in 5a,  that the DNA results and dog alerts prove that she died,  which is a lie.

I think saying that the McCann's give their daughter Calpol which made Madeleine sleepy and she fell of the sofa and died  The McCann's hid her body and faked an abduction surely cancels out anything the public has said about Amaral.   IMO
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: faithlilly on November 12, 2018, 11:25:44 AM
Thanks for that.
It doesn't make any sense.

It makes perfect sense.

While petitions like the one last year illustrates the public’s disgust with the parent’s treatment of their children, gaining over 130,000 signatures, it makes no difference to the ongoing investigation or indeed has it anything to do with Amaral.

https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/3197252/madeleine-mccann-petition-charged-child-neglect/
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Erngath on November 12, 2018, 11:37:26 AM
It makes perfect sense.

While petitions like the one last year illustrates the public’s disgust with the parent’s treatment of their children, gaining over 130,000 signatures, it makes no difference to the ongoing investigation or indeed has it anything to do with Amaral.

https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/3197252/madeleine-mccann-petition-charged-child-neglect/

Everything to do with the poison spread by Amaral and those who promote such poison..
Many of the signatories will no doubt belong to those still seeking some type of revengeful "justice" being dealt to Madeleine's parents.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Erngath on November 12, 2018, 11:41:36 AM
His opinion is his book though isn't it?   Though he doesn't say it's just his opinion at the end of the book he says it was proven that Madeleine died in 5a,  that the DNA results and dog alerts prove that she died,  which is a lie.

I think saying that the McCann's give their daughter Calpol which made Madeleine sleepy and she fell of the sofa and died  The McCann's hid her body and faked an abduction surely cancels out anything the public has said about Amaral.   IMO

Indeed Lace.
His book will have fuelled the poisonous lies and bile which is spouted on forums and online comments and on line petitions.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: faithlilly on November 12, 2018, 11:43:13 AM
Everything to do with the poison spread by Amaral and those who promote such poison..
Many of the signatories will no doubt belong to those still seeking some type of revengeful "justice" being dealt to Madeleine's parents.

Don’t you think the parents are responsible at all for the way the public feel, especially about the neglect issue ?
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Eleanor on November 12, 2018, 11:49:05 AM
He could be right.

That is just silly.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Erngath on November 12, 2018, 11:58:13 AM
Don’t you think the parents are responsible at all for the way the public feel, especially about the neglect issue ?

Many of those who post their comments on online newspapers,  post their comments on Madeleine forums and sign petitions rarely keep their criticism to the neglect issue.
Many continue their spiteful bile with comments accusing Madeleine's parents of being involved in her disappearance.
Much of this continued belief is due to the unproven and malicious, IMO, thoughts of Amaral.


Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: faithlilly on November 12, 2018, 12:00:12 PM
Many of those who post their comments on online newspapers,  post their comments on Madeleine forums and sign petitions rarely keep their criticism to the neglect issue.
Many continue their spiteful bile with comments accusing Madeleine's parents of being involved in her disappearance.
Much of this continued belief is due to the unproven and malicious, IMO, thoughts of Amaral.

That doesn’t answer my question.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Erngath on November 12, 2018, 12:04:34 PM
If the public do read his book they will find he doesn't accuse the McCanns of drugging their children. He discusses the possibility, but reaches no conclusions.

But surely by raising that possibility he has brought such a possibility into the minds of his readers.
And then this possibility has become much more than a possibility in the minds of many.
Is it morally right to do this without any evidence at all?
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Erngath on November 12, 2018, 12:05:08 PM
That doesn’t answer my question.

I believe it does!
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: jassi on November 12, 2018, 12:12:08 PM
But surely by raising that possibility he has brought such a possibility into the minds of his readers.
And then this possibility has become much more than a possibility in the minds of many.
Is it morally right to do this without any evidence at all?

Why not?
Forums are awash with theories. none of them supported by reliable evidence.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: faithlilly on November 12, 2018, 12:14:41 PM
I believe it does!

This was the question.

Don’t you think the parents are responsible at all for the way the public feel, especially about the neglect issue ?

A yes or no answer would suffice though a fuller answer would be appreciated.

In the early days of the case, before the parents were made arguidos and before Amaral’s book,  I believe that 70% of those who voted in a poll believed the parents should have been charged with neglect. A more recent one found the same. So it would appear Amaral’s conclusions have had little effect in terms of how the parents are viewed.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Erngath on November 12, 2018, 12:17:40 PM
Why not?
Forums are awash with theories. none of them supported by reliable evidence.

I did mean was it morally right for AMARAL to raise these possibilities and leave many who do now regard these as truths, without him having any evidence.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Erngath on November 12, 2018, 12:21:11 PM
This was the question.

Don’t you think the parents are responsible at all for the way the public feel, especially about the neglect issue ?

A yes or no answer would suffice though a fuller answer would be appreciated.

In the early days of the case, before the parents were made arguidos and before Amaral’s book,  I believe that 70% of those who voted in a poll believed the parents should have been charged with neglect. A more recent one found the same. So it would appear Amaral’s conclusions have had little effect in terms of how the parents are viewed.

That's just nonsense.
Many people have criticized the parents child care arrangements.
Most of my friends and family have done so but they do not continue their criticism into pointing the finger at Madeleine's parents for being involved in her disappearance.
That finger pointing exists because of Amaral.


You do seem to place an incredible amount of faith in these online polls!
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: jassi on November 12, 2018, 12:25:49 PM
That's just nonsense.
Many people have criticized the parents child care arrangements.
Most of my friends and family have done so but they do not continue their criticism into pointing the finger at Madeleine's parents for being involved in her disappearance.
That finger pointing exists because of Amaral.

In my opinion that is just rubbish.
 There were plenty of theories around about their culpability long before Amaral wrote his book.
That's one reason that the Mirror forum was shut down - again IMO
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: faithlilly on November 12, 2018, 12:26:36 PM
That's just nonsense.
Many people have criticized the parents child care arrangements.
Most of my friends and family have done so but they do not continue their criticism into pointing the finger at Madeleine's parents for being involved in her disappearance.
That finger pointing exists because of Amaral.

So you agree that the parents unpopularity existed long before Amaral made his thoughts known and, for reasons other than their alleged part in her disappearance.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: G-Unit on November 12, 2018, 12:29:21 PM
But surely by raising that possibility he has brought such a possibility into the minds of his readers.
And then this possibility has become much more than a possibility in the minds of many.
Is it morally right to do this without any evidence at all?

I would say that the possibility was in people's minds long before Amaral even started his book. It was put there by the UK media. In my opinion the behaviour of the media was far more morally reprehensible than Amaral's. They printed rumours, he documented the course of the investigation.

'Without any evidence at all' is your opinion, by the way, which others disagree with.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Erngath on November 12, 2018, 12:32:50 PM
In my opinion that is just rubbish.
 There were plenty of theories around about their culpability long before Amaral wrote his book.
That's one reason that the Mirror forum was shut down - again IMO

There were many theories indeed.
So did the drug theory precede his book?

These theories were limited to those who were sufficiently interested to post on online forums but his book delivered his unproven theories to a much wider public and since then these theories have taken root in the minds of many.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Erngath on November 12, 2018, 12:36:51 PM
So you agree that the parents unpopularity existed long before Amaral made his thoughts known and, for reasons other than their alleged part in her disappearance.

No I don't agree but let's leave it there.
You ignore points raised in my posts, and then continue with your quite frequent way of responding to a post by beginning your reply by" So you agree that......"  when in fact I have not.
An unpleasant way of posting IMO
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Lace on November 12, 2018, 12:50:42 PM
This was the question.

Don’t you think the parents are responsible at all for the way the public feel, especially about the neglect issue ?

A yes or no answer would suffice though a fuller answer would be appreciated.

In the early days of the case, before the parents were made arguidos and before Amaral’s book,  I believe that 70% of those who voted in a poll believed the parents should have been charged with neglect. A more recent one found the same. So it would appear Amaral’s conclusions have had little effect in terms of how the parents are viewed.


That's not right.  Amaral's conclusions did have an effect on how the McCann's were viewed.   Do you think these people say 'Read Amaral's book'  because the parents were neglectful?

I remember seeing 100% DNA of Madeleine in 5a on the front of newspapers,   I thought then the McCann's must be guilty,  it wasn't until later that I found out that actually no there wasn't 100% DNA found of Madeleine in 5a there wasn't anything at all.    Then Amaral writes his book and he says the DNA and cadaver alerts prove Madeleine died in 5a,   well I know that isn't true as I follow the case but what about all the people who don't? They read his book and knowing he was the Police Officer who dealt with the case,  they think what he says is correct.   I have seen it actually written in comments in the paper that Amaral is right,  read Amaral's book.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: G-Unit on November 12, 2018, 01:04:54 PM
There were many theories indeed.
So did the drug theory precede his book?

These theories were limited to those who were sufficiently interested to post on online forums but his book delivered his unproven theories to a much wider public and since then these theories have taken root in the minds of many.

Do you really not know whether the'drug theory' preceded Amaral's book? I find that difficult to believe, but a google search will provide the answer.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Erngath on November 12, 2018, 01:08:23 PM
Do you really not know whether the'drug theory' preceded Amaral's book? I find that difficult to believe, but a google search will provide the answer.

I admit to not having an encyclopedic knowledge of all the details of this case.
I won't bother googling but thank you for your help.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: G-Unit on November 12, 2018, 01:20:57 PM
I admit to not having an encyclopedic knowledge of all the details of this case.
I won't bother googling but thank you for your help.

So was your question a valid plea for information or an attempt at inferring that no-one thought the McCanns drugged their kids until they read Amaral's book?
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Eleanor on November 12, 2018, 01:21:46 PM

That's not right.  Amaral's conclusions did have an effect on how the McCann's were viewed.   Do you think these people say 'Read Amaral's book'  because the parents were neglectful?

I remember seeing 100% DNA of Madeleine in 5a on the front of newspapers,   I thought then the McCann's must be guilty,  it wasn't until later that I found out that actually no there wasn't 100% DNA found of Madeleine in 5a there wasn't anything at all.    Then Amaral writes his book and he says the DNA and cadaver alerts prove Madeleine died in 5a,   well I know that isn't true as I follow the case but what about all the people who don't? They read his book and knowing he was the Police Officer who dealt with the case,  they think what he says is correct.   I have seen it actually written in comments in the paper that Amaral is right,  read Amaral's book.

Yes, me too.  I thought The McCanns must be guilty.  Until I spotted the Quote Marks, Question Marks, and Sources Said.

It was all an utter disgrace in the name of God knows what.

I more or less believed in The Media in those days.  I am no longer quite the fool I was.  Or anywhere near as nice as I was.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Sunny on November 12, 2018, 01:22:44 PM
There were many theories indeed.
So did the drug theory precede his book?

These theories were limited to those who were sufficiently interested to post on online forums but his book delivered his unproven theories to a much wider public and since then these theories have taken root in the minds of many.

In my limited experience it was the McCanns suing Goncalo Amaral that raised awareness of his book and then awareness of his theories on Madeleine's fate. 

I have not seen his book published in English except online.   IMO the McCanns don't appear to care about their reputation in Portugal, and all news in Portugal appears to be secondhand via the UK media.   This is with the exception of  their legal action which has received massive publicity at each step, all causing the damage that you believe they have suffered.  This "damage" is from the court process and publicity of the same, rather than Goncalo Amaral's book itself.

All IMO.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Eleanor on November 12, 2018, 01:35:40 PM
In my limited experience it was the McCanns suing Goncalo Amaral that raised awareness of his book and then awareness of his theories on Madeleine's fate. 

I have not seen his book published in English except online.   IMO the McCanns don't appear to care about their reputation in Portugal, and all news in Portugal appears to be secondhand via the UK media.   This is with the exception of  their legal action which has received massive publicity at each step, all causing the damage that you believe they have suffered.  This "damage" is from the court process and publicity of the same, rather than Goncalo Amaral's book itself.

All IMO.

One would have to be a fool if one thought that Amaral's Book had no impact.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: jassi on November 12, 2018, 01:41:15 PM
Hardly a best seller though, was it?
Not a Richard & Judy Book to be found on every coffee table.
And yet such an apparent impact.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: slartibartfast on November 12, 2018, 01:57:13 PM
One would have to be a fool if one thought that Amaral's Book had no impact.

That was what the McCanns took into the damages trial. We know how that turned out.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Erngath on November 12, 2018, 02:01:37 PM
Hardly a best seller though, was it?
Not a Richard & Judy Book to be found on every coffee table.
And yet such an apparent impact



There is no Richard and Judy book on my coffee table!

Even though it wasn't a best seller, parts of his book have become set in stone for some.
His thoughts and "raised possibilities" have become part and parcel of the armoury of those who attack the McCanns on online forums, newspaper comments and on line polls
His "possibilities" are regurgitated at every opportunity.
Then these "possibilities" are spread by word of mouth to many who have not read his book.
He didn't have to have a best seller for his "possibilities" to become fact in the mind of some.

I believe his "raised possibilities " have had an impact on the belief that Madeleine's parents were involved in her disappearance.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: jassi on November 12, 2018, 02:11:47 PM
Hardly a best seller though, was it?
Not a Richard & Judy Book to be found on every coffee table.
And yet such an apparent impact



There is no Richard and Judy book on my coffee table!

Even though it wasn't a best seller, parts of his book have become set in stone for some.
His thoughts and "raised possibilitie" have become part and parcel of the armoury of those who attack the McCanns on online forums, newspaper comments and on line polls
His "possibilities" are regurgitated at every opportunity.
Then these "possibilities" are spread by word of mouth to many who have not read his book.
He didn't have to have a best seller for his "possibilities" to become fact in the mind of some.

I believe his "raised possibilities " have had an impact on the belief that Madeleine's parents were involved in her disappearance.

Wow and he did all this without a professional PR machine behind him, either.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Carana on November 12, 2018, 02:15:58 PM
So you agree that the parents unpopularity existed long before Amaral made his thoughts known and, for reasons other than their alleged part in her disappearance.

Yes, from memory.  However, how much of that was the result of PJ leaks to the PT media (while he was still in charge of it), cribbed by the UK tabloids?

Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Erngath on November 12, 2018, 02:16:36 PM
Wow and he did all this without a professional PR machine behind him, either.


Perhaps not a professional PR machine but a fair number of devotees who spread the word. 8((()*/
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: jassi on November 12, 2018, 02:18:30 PM
How galling that must be for McCann supporters
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Eleanor on November 12, 2018, 02:34:42 PM
How galling that must be for McCann supporters

No.  Just Shock, Horror at the Perfidy.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: The General on November 12, 2018, 02:42:35 PM
One would have to be a fool if one thought that Amaral's Book had no impact.
It had an impact, but it's not exactly Harry Potter and the Smell of Death, is it?
The vast majority of the general public probably wouldn't know the guy at all. Coupled with the fact that it's not even published in English, the reach for a pdf or html version book is negligible in the great scheme of things.

In fact, as has already been alluded to, the book and Amaral himself were only made notorious by the MSM and their salacious tittle tattle and the high profile injuction / trial, and probably the only time Joe Public had ever heard of the guy.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Vertigo Swirl on November 12, 2018, 03:54:32 PM
Belief, not evidence,thats why its still ongoing.
Still if Redwoods word is his bond,remind us again about the two possibilities he says of the girls fate in leaving 5a.
you are (deliberately?) missing my point.  If there actually was no evidence of abduction then why would the Met actually announce at all that that is what they believed had happened?
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Vertigo Swirl on November 12, 2018, 06:51:03 PM
This was the question.

Don’t you think the parents are responsible at all for the way the public feel, especially about the neglect issue ?

A yes or no answer would suffice though a fuller answer would be appreciated.

In the early days of the case, before the parents were made arguidos and before Amaral’s book,  I believe that 70% of those who voted in a poll believed the parents should have been charged with neglect. A more recent one found the same. So it would appear Amaral’s conclusions have had little effect in terms of how the parents are viewed.
Teo separate issues isn’t it?  Amaral is not responsible for people’s view of the McCanns as neglectful parents, that view sprung out of the righteous indignation of thousands of online perfect parents to the actions taken by the McCanns and their friends.  No, Amaral is responsible (largely in my view) for undermining the lifting of the arguido ststus by timing his book to coincide almost exactly with its lifting so that on the one hand the PJ had to admit there was no evidence against the parents but on the other along comes the most infamous cop on the case claiming cast iron proof that Madeleine died in the apartment and pointing the finger firmly at the parents.  This surely gave rise to plenty more “doubters” than there ever were before, gave him a career for life spreading his misinformation and lies and inevitably (regardless of what the bonkers Justice System decided) caused untold misery to the parents of the missing child as well as her extended family, and quite likely harmed the on-going search for Madeleine.  All IMO. 
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: faithlilly on November 12, 2018, 07:08:10 PM
Teo separate issues isn’t it?  Amaral is not responsible for people’s view of the McCanns as neglectful parents, that view sprung out of the righteous indignation of thousands of online perfect parents to the actions taken by the McCanns and their friends.  No, Amaral is responsible (largely in my view) for undermining the lifting of the arguido ststus by timing his book to coincide almost exactly with its lifting so that on the one hand the PJ had to admit there was no evidence against the parents but on the other along comes the most infamous cop on the case claiming cast iron proof that Madeleine died in the apartment and pointing the finger firmly at the parents.  This surely gave rise to plenty more “doubters” than there ever were before, gave him a career for life spreading his misinformation and lies and inevitably (regardless of what the bonkers Justice System decided) caused untold misery to the parents of the missing child as well as her extended family, and quite likely harmed the on-going search for Madeleine.  All IMO.

Amaral couldn’t publish his book before the case was shelved.

If you take an objective view the release of the book straight after the parents had been declared, according to them, innocent or cleared could adversely have affected it’s sales.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Vertigo Swirl on November 12, 2018, 07:23:07 PM
Amaral couldn’t publish his book before the case was shelved.

If you take an objective view the release of the book straight after the parents had been declared, according to them, innocent or cleared could adversely have affected it’s sales.
No, IMO it was the PERFECT time to release his book because it coincided with maximum publicity for the case, snubbed a nose at the archiving report and the McCanns, and any book that claimed to solve the mystery of what happened to the child by revealing “The Truth Of the Lie” was bound to sell well especially at that time.  He could have published his book at any time after the shelving of the case, but I believe he chose the next day, which says to me he was determined to ride on the coat-tails of the case, the report and the lifting of the arguido ststus.  ALL IMO
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: faithlilly on November 12, 2018, 07:39:30 PM
No, IMO it was the PERFECT time to release his book because it coincided with maximum publicity for the case, snubbed a nose at the archiving report and the McCanns, and any book that claimed to solve the mystery of what happened to the child by revealing “The Truth Of the Lie” was bound to sell well especially at that time.  He could have published his book at any time after the shelving of the case, but I believe he chose the next day, which says to me he was determined to ride on the coat-tails of the case, the report and the lifting of the arguido ststus.  ALL IMO

Your opinion’s hardly objective though is it ?
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: Brietta on November 13, 2018, 10:22:34 PM
If Scotland Yard had taken their investigation ~ which happens to be into Madeleine's abduction ~ as far as it is possible to take it, why would they seek funding to keep it going?

Once all the i's are dotted and the t's crossed investigations are put on hold until new evidence or information comes along which merits another look.

The investigation into Madeleine McCann's disappearance has not yet reached that stage.  Scotland Yard have made a case for funding and the Home Office have been convinced enough by the case made to agree the request.

By definition they are still actively pursuing Madeleine McCann's case.

That fact alone gives the lie to the content within the pages of 'the truth of the lie' and the many subsequent hours of Amaral interview footage promoting his case ... does that make him a liar?

Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: misty on November 14, 2018, 12:07:27 AM
I don't believe they will make any progress, in fact I think they have ceased actively investigating the case.  IMO, all they are doing now is housekeeping functions. 

We know thanks to the public utterances of a former senior SY officer that the investigation was not as comprehensive as it could have been which in itself raises many questions.

When the former SY officer was in discussion about a role in OG the Portuguese were not on side. IMO that would have affected the investigative range of any UK-led review.
Title: Re: Sun's Nick Pisa refers to Gonçalo Amaral as a "Poisonous Liar".
Post by: barrier on November 14, 2018, 04:28:55 PM
When the former SY officer was in discussion about a role in OG the Portuguese were not on side. IMO that would have affected the investigative range of any UK-led review.

There is nothing to indicate the PJ are on side as you put it,Grange are investigating an abduction,Do Carmo says they don't know what happened adding we have to prepared to deal with different scenarios, one is blinkered the other clearly is not imo.

Ref for Do Carmo, Brunt anniversary thing last year.