UK Justice Forum 🇬🇧
UK and North American politics. => A look at British politics in the light of the decision to leave the EU. => Topic started by: faithlilly on May 07, 2020, 02:26:03 PM
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https://uk.reuters.com/article/uk-health-coronavirus-britain-elderly-sp/special-report-in-shielding-its-hospitals-from-covid-19-britain-left-many-of-the-weakest-exposed-idUKKBN22H2EI
Why were hundreds, if not thousands, of elderly people, many who had tested positive for coronavirus, sent back to from hospital to their care homes to infect their fellow residents and carers ?Why when we were supposed to be protecting our elderly was the virus allowed to run amok through our care home system ? Was this what Cummings meant when he said while talking about herd immunity that ‘so what if a few old people die’ ?
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https://uk.reuters.com/article/uk-health-coronavirus-britain-elderly-sp/special-report-in-shielding-its-hospitals-from-covid-19-britain-left-many-of-the-weakest-exposed-idUKKBN22H2EI
Why were hundreds, if not thousands, of elderly people, many who had tested positive for coronavirus, sent back to from hospital to their care homes to infect their fellow residents and carers ?Why when we were supposed to be protecting our elderly was the virus allowed to run amok through our care home system ? Was this what Cummings meant when he said while talking about herd immunity that ‘so what if a few old people die’ ?
The decision to discharge a patient from hospital is taken by doctors... There was more than enough capacity to cope with covid patients..
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On the Madeleine forum if you quoted an unnamed source in the MSM you’d be sneered at and ridiculed. On this part of the forum however it seems unnamed sources in the media are good to go.
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https://uk.reuters.com/article/uk-health-coronavirus-britain-elderly-sp/special-report-in-shielding-its-hospitals-from-covid-19-britain-left-many-of-the-weakest-exposed-idUKKBN22H2EI
Why were hundreds, if not thousands, of elderly people, many who had tested positive for coronavirus, sent back to from hospital to their care homes to infect their fellow residents and carers ?Why when we were supposed to be protecting our elderly was the virus allowed to run amok through our care home system ? Was this what Cummings meant when he said while talking about herd immunity that ‘so what if a few old people die’ ?
I'm a cynic, I'm afraid. I don't believe the primary aim was ever to protect the elderly or those already "vulnerable". They have been told to stay at home (and care homes are "home" for many), so that they wouldn't overwhelm the NHS, ie use hospital beds and resources.
The NHS has been under-resourced and/or badly managed (I'm not sure which) for many years, and it would not have been able to cope with hundreds of very frail/elderly/sick patients. That wouldn't have looked too good for our government!
As for Dominic Cummings, I don't really believe he's that wicked.
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The decision to discharge a patient from hospital is taken by doctors... There was more than enough capacity to cope with covid patients..
They didn’t know that at the time. I think it is beyond dispute that elderly patients who had tested positive were sent back to care homes....care homes that had, at first and now, limited access to PPE and tests. I have several friends who work in care homes and each tell similar stories. One was terrified to go back to work after her holidays because she felt so vulnerable due to inadequate protection.
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I'm a cynic, I'm afraid. I don't believe the primary aim was ever to protect the elderly or those already "vulnerable". They have been told to stay at home (and care homes are "home" for many), so that they wouldn't overwhelm the NHS, ie use hospital beds and resources.
The NHS has been under-resourced and/or badly managed (I'm not sure which) for many years, and it would not have been able to cope with hundreds of very frail/elderly/sick patients. That wouldn't have looked too good for our government!
As for Dominic Cummings, I don't really believe he's that wicked.
I think he’d see it as pragmatic rather than wicked.
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I'm a cynic, I'm afraid. I don't believe the primary aim was ever to protect the elderly or those already "vulnerable". They have been told to stay at home (and care homes are "home" for many), so that they wouldn't overwhelm the NHS, ie use hospital beds and resources.
The NHS has been under-resourced and/or badly managed (I'm not sure which) for many years, and it would not have been able to cope with hundreds of very frail/elderly/sick patients. That wouldn't have looked too good for our government!
As for Dominic Cummings, I don't really believe he's that wicked.
Don't you think it rather odd that we are even mentioning an unelected political 'adviser' Dominic Cummings as a player in the same breath as the infected elderly and vulnerable dispatched from hospital to care homes where uninfected elderly and vulnerable reside.
Not forgetting that no provision was made to provide protective clothing for carers who in many instances had little or no training in dealing with what happens in a pandemic.
Smacks to me as akin to biological warfare against the elderly which flies in the face of any pretence of us being a caring and nurturing society.
When this is over, I await the inquest (if any) into this particular situation with interest.
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Don't you think it rather odd that we are even mentioning an unelected political 'adviser' Dominic Cummings as a player in the same breath as the infected elderly and vulnerable dispatched from hospital to care homes where uninfected elderly and vulnerable reside.
Not forgetting that no provision was made to provide protective clothing for carers who in many instances had little or no training in dealing with what happens in a pandemic.
Smacks to me as akin to biological warfare against the elderly which flies in the face of any pretence of us being a caring and nurturing society.
When this is over, I await the inquest (if any) into this particular situation with interest.
And the fact that Cummings is involved in SAGE is equally troubling considering his past history.
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Don't you think it rather odd that we are even mentioning an unelected political 'adviser' Dominic Cummings as a player in the same breath as the infected elderly and vulnerable dispatched from hospital to care homes where uninfected elderly and vulnerable reside.
Not forgetting that no provision was made to provide protective clothing for carers who in many instances had little or no training in dealing with what happens in a pandemic.
Smacks to me as akin to biological warfare against the elderly which flies in the face of any pretence of us being a caring and nurturing society.
When this is over, I await the inquest (if any) into this particular situation with interest.
The carers who are "outside the NHS" have been treated appallingly, IMO, and they don't even get paid very much. Yet, those I have seen interviewed in the media seem absolutely dedicated to the people they look after.
I take a very dim view of the fact that all those patients were kicked out of hospital in the first place, but this isn't a new phenomenon. The NHS always wants to get people out of hospital as soon as possible, often before they have recovered sufficiently. It's not only elderly people either. These days, you need to be in danger of dying before you can get a hospital bed-----IMO.
What is happening in many care homes is appalling, but I feel even sorrier for elderly people who live alone in their own homes, and who rely on carers who might or might not turn up.
Dominic Cummings has far too much influence------again, my opinion, and I don't like it. However, I wont go as far as to say he wants elderly people to die. As far as I know, there is no actual evidence that he said it--------or is there?
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Care homes are private commercial businesses so it was up to the owners to keep their residents and staff safe, surely?
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Care homes are private commercial businesses so it was up to the owners to keep their residents and staff safe, surely?
You have a point there, and I have heard this argument put forward before. After all, they charge enough.
Are all care homes private businesses, do you know?
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Care homes are private commercial businesses so it was up to the owners to keep their residents and staff safe, surely?
https://www.carehomeselection.co.uk/factsheets/difference-council-owned-care-homes-privately-owned-care-homes/
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You have a point there, and I have heard this argument put forward before. After all, they charge enough.
Are all care homes private businesses, do you know?
84% are, but of course it’s totally the government’s fault if they aren’t run efficiently
https://www.theguardian.com/society/2019/sep/19/84-of-care-home-beds-in-england-owned-by-private-firms
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Care homes are private commercial businesses so it was up to the owners to keep their residents and staff safe, surely?
You are absolutely right......commercial businesses making a lot of money...often owned by doctors
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From the daily mail confirming its the doctors...not the govt...sending patients back to care homes.then we have GPs who wont visit the care homes....
Hospitals' deadly betrayal: Doctors sent elderly patients back to care homes despite KNOWING they had coronavirus but did not tell staff and triggered new outbreaks
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A little background to explain why we have got ourselves in this position re: care homes ( and yes yet again it was the Tories ).
https://lowdownnhs.info/analysis/long-read/the-history-of-privatisation-second-in-a-series-by-john-lister/
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From the daily mail confirming its the doctors...not the govt...sending patients back to care homes.then we have GPs who wont visit the care homes....
Hospitals' deadly betrayal: Doctors sent elderly patients back to care homes despite KNOWING they had coronavirus but did not tell staff and triggered new outbreaks
Look at recent pictures of what are termed covodiots,its not the govt forcing them to not social distance.
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A little background to explain why we have got ourselves in this position re: care homes ( and yes yet again it was the Tories ).
https://lowdownnhs.info/analysis/long-read/the-history-of-privatisation-second-in-a-series-by-john-lister/
What about Scotland? hardly a Tory in sight.
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What about Scotland? hardly a Tory in sight.
A disgrace too.
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I would literally rather die than go into a care home.
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I would literally rather die than go into a care home.
I hope I'm gone before I get to the stage where I need "care" at all !
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I would literally rather die than go into a care home.
#metoo.
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#metoo.
Your problem is you may not have a choice
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#metoo.
Good God. This is the first time you have ever agreed with anything I have written on this forum.
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Your problem is you may not have a choice
With the care sector soon to be decimated by the ending of free movement there will be very little social care whether residential or domiciliary anyway.
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Your problem is you may not have a choice
I know. We all run the risk of ending up with less choice than we would like. 8(8-))
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Your problem is you may not have a choice
Hmmm,so true it seem's ,an ex work colleague ended up in one and subsequently died of the virus,but he was far from happy in the home he was put into it seem's,his wife ended up in one before this and she died of dementia,he had no choice.
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Good God. This is the first time you have ever agreed with anything I have written on this forum.
Ha ha!! Well, we all either get old, or know people who get old, so we have that in common !!
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Hmmm,so true it seem's ,an ex work colleague ended up in one and subsequently died of the virus,but he was far from happy in the home he was put into it seem's,his wife ended up in one before this and she died of dementia,he had no choice.
Shakespeare's 7th age.
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https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2020/may/08/care-home-residents-harvested-left-to-die-uk-government-herd-immunity?CMP=Share_iOSApp_Other