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Disappeared and Abducted Children and Young Adults => Madeleine McCann (3) disappeared from her parent's holiday apartment at Ocean Club, Praia da Luz, Portugal on 3 May 2007. No trace of her has ever been found. => Topic started by: faithlilly on April 10, 2013, 04:10:11 PM

Title: Reasons Why Children Should Not Be Left Alone.
Post by: faithlilly on April 10, 2013, 04:10:11 PM
What if Madeleine, on hearing one of the twins wake up, tried to light the cooker to warm a bottle, as mummy does and as a result her nightclothes caught fire ? The first time the McCanns would even have been aware of it would have been when the flames had spread to the front of the apartment and they could be seen from the tapas, in all likelihood too late to save the children.  30 minutes is ample time for this to happen and 50 metres 'as the crow flies' is far enough away to be unable to respond quickly enough.

Did the McCanns never consider that an abductor was the least of the dangers faced by children when left alone ?
Title: Re: Reasons Why Children Should Not Be Left Alone.
Post by: debunker on April 10, 2013, 04:19:29 PM
What if Madeleine, on hearing one of the twins wake up, tried to light the cooker to warm a bottle, as mummy does and as a result her nightclothes caught fire ? The first time the McCanns would even have been aware of it would have been when the flames had spread to the front of the apartment and they could be seen from the tapas, in all likelihood too late to save the children.  30 minutes is ample time for this to happen and 50 metres 'as the crow flies' is far enough away to be unable to respond quickly enough.

Did the McCanns never consider that an abductor was the least of the dangers faced by children when left alone ?

Many Pros and fencesitters decry their child care.

They took a risk that did not pay off.

There was no criminal neglect.

There was no evidence that they had anything criminal to do with Madeleine's disappearance.
Title: Re: Reasons Why Children Should Not Be Left Alone.
Post by: faithlilly on April 10, 2013, 04:26:13 PM
@ debunker

If the McCanns had been checking every thirty minutes and a fire had started do you really think they would not have been charged, and very likely convicted, of child neglect ? The only thing that saved them was the outcome of their actions.
Title: Re: Reasons Why Children Should Not Be Left Alone.
Post by: debunker on April 10, 2013, 04:28:26 PM
@ debunker

If the McCanns had been checking every thirty minutes and a fire had started do you really think they would not have been charged, and very likely convicted, of child neglect ? The only thing that saved them was the outcome of their actions.

No they would not have been charged. Portuguese Law requires intent to harm rather than mere negligence.
Title: Re: Reasons Why Children Should Not Be Left Alone.
Post by: faithlilly on April 10, 2013, 04:31:28 PM
@ debunker

If the McCanns had been checking every thirty minutes and a fire had started do you really think they would not have been charged, and very likely convicted, of child neglect ? The only thing that saved them was the outcome of their actions.

No they would not have been charged. Portuguese Law requires intent to harm rather than mere negligence.

And in the UK , as several times you have posted that the McCanns have been cleared by two separate legal systems
Title: Re: Reasons Why Children Should Not Be Left Alone.
Post by: Gildas on April 10, 2013, 04:41:58 PM
What if Madeleine, on hearing one of the twins wake up, tried to light the cooker to warm a bottle, as mummy does and as a result her nightclothes caught fire ? The first time the McCanns would even have been aware of it would have been when the flames had spread to the front of the apartment and they could be seen from the tapas, in all likelihood too late to save the children.  30 minutes is ample time for this to happen and 50 metres 'as the crow flies' is far enough away to be unable to respond quickly enough.

Did the McCanns never consider that an abductor was the least of the dangers faced by children when left alone ?

Faithlilly, there are a 1001 things that could go wrong, if a child is left alone.

The most obvious is that the child could wake up finding itself alone in the dark, and become terrified.

I have a horror of fire breaking out, and the child becoming trapped in the building.

My wife has fear of little fingers pushed into electrical sockets.

The McCanns made a mistake, and they paid for it. What I don't like is people defending the McCanns, by claiming that it is perfectly acceptable to leave your children unattended.
Title: Re: Reasons Why Children Should Not Be Left Alone.
Post by: debunker on April 10, 2013, 05:32:14 PM
@ debunker

If the McCanns had been checking every thirty minutes and a fire had started do you really think they would not have been charged, and very likely convicted, of child neglect ? The only thing that saved them was the outcome of their actions.

No they would not have been charged. Portuguese Law requires intent to harm rather than mere negligence.

And in the UK , as several times you have posted that the McCanns have been cleared by two separate legal systems

No UK law does not require intent, only disregard of consequences.
Title: Re: Reasons Why Children Should Not Be Left Alone.
Post by: faithlilly on April 10, 2013, 10:29:18 PM
@ debunker

Then the McCanns were very lucky happened in Portugal then
Title: Re: Reasons Why Children Should Not Be Left Alone.
Post by: debunker on April 10, 2013, 10:37:52 PM
@ debunker

Then the McCanns were very lucky happened in Portugal then

Not really. As per Debunker's Challenge- no one has ever been convicted in the UK for what t h e McCanns did.

1/ Children left in a domestic environment.
2/ Checked as regularly.
3/ No previous charges or concerns for child care or criminal problems.
Title: Re: Reasons Why Children Should Not Be Left Alone.
Post by: faithlilly on April 10, 2013, 10:47:08 PM
@ debunker

But they did show a blatant disregard for the dangers that could befall a child in a domestic environment for even 30 minutes. At the very least they would have been put on the 'at risk' register. Of course we don't know if this did indeed happen.
Title: Re: Reasons Why Children Should Not Be Left Alone.
Post by: debunker on April 10, 2013, 10:53:01 PM
@ debunker

But they did show a blatant disregard for the dangers that could befall a child in a domestic environment for even 30 minutes. At the very least they would have been put on the 'at risk' register. Of course we don't know if this did indeed happen.

If the twins were put onthe at risk register,they wouldnot have been allowed to go to Canada.

I have worked in child protection and it takes serious child neglect or continued child neglect to beplaced on the register.
Title: Re: Reasons Why Children Should Not Be Left Alone.
Post by: faithlilly on April 10, 2013, 11:01:49 PM
@ debunker

It would depend how long they were placed  on the register for, if indeed they were.

I have also known children who were put on the register due to a much lesser degree of child endangerment than that demonstrated by the McCanns.
Title: Re: Reasons Why Children Should Not Be Left Alone.
Post by: debunker on April 10, 2013, 11:11:24 PM
@ debunker

It would depend how long they were placed  on the register for, if indeed they were.

I have also known children who were put on the register due to a much lesser degree of child endangerment than that demonstrated by the McCanns.

We do not know. They went to Canada quite soon after returning to the UK. Even if tgey were placed on the register, that is not crim inal neglect.
Title: Re: Reasons Why Children Should Not Be Left Alone.
Post by: faithlilly on April 10, 2013, 11:26:52 PM
@ debunker

It is nor criminal neglect but it would certainly show that the authorities had concerns for the twins safety.
Title: Re: Reasons Why Children Should Not Be Left Alone.
Post by: debunker on April 10, 2013, 11:30:34 PM
@ debunker

It is nor criminal neglect but it would certainly show that the authorities had concerns for the twins safety.

I would share that concern.

But they are not guilty of neglect or any other form of child abuse.

Glad we have now agreed that FACT.
Title: Re: Reasons Why Children Should Not Be Left Alone.
Post by: faithlilly on April 11, 2013, 07:26:28 PM
@ debunker

They may not be legally guilty of neglect, morally is a whole different matter.
Title: Re: Reasons Why Children Should Not Be Left Alone.
Post by: debunker on April 11, 2013, 07:31:44 PM
@ debunker

They may not be legally guilty of neglect, morally is a whole different matter.

Being criminally responsible makes it a public matter.

Being  moral issue is a private matter for private persons. You have no standing in the matter.   This just makes you a sad [ censored word ].
Title: Re: Reasons Why Children Should Not Be Left Alone.
Post by: faithlilly on April 11, 2013, 07:48:15 PM
@ debunker

No that makes me an adult with a right to post an opinion.

There is however a very interesting discussion on a certain forum which is questioning just what you are.  You appear to be a rather mercurial individual with a CV to suit every discussion.
Title: Re: Reasons Why Children Should Not Be Left Alone.
Post by: debunker on April 11, 2013, 09:03:02 PM
@ debunker

No that makes me an adult with a right to post an opinion.

There is however a very interesting discussion on a certain forum which is questioning just what you are.  You appear to be a rather mercurial individual with a CV to suit every discussion.

The same right you would give to others to criticise your morals in public? Happy with that?
Title: Re: Reasons Why Children Should Not Be Left Alone.
Post by: faithlilly on April 11, 2013, 10:47:19 PM
@ debunker

Others are quite free to criticise my morals if the fancy takes them.