Fingerprints

[G-Unit]

But what about fingerprints?  The PJ found an unidentified fingerprint on the side of the patio door.  It sent requests to various countries seeking assistance.  No matches were found but Germany said it could have originated from a woman or youth but not a child.  PJ concluded after all it originated from a male officer which seems at odds with Germany saying it originated from a woman or youth.  In any event you would think PJ would operate an elimination database for serving police officers?

Collecting fingerprints from soc would be routine everyday stuff.  How much time and money must PJ waste if they go all over the world looking for answers only to eventually conclude that its one of their own officers/innocent contamination!

It seems to be a mantra of some British people that everyone should do as we do or they're deficient in some way.
Not all European countries hold DNA samples of their police officers;
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2015/sep/10/officers-at-paris-police-headquarters-dna-tested-gang-rape-case
 

[Holly Goodhead]

It is possible for two individuals to share the same dna profile but this isn't so with fingerprints.  Even identical twins do not share the same fingerprints. 

Innocent DNA contamination can cause all sorts of problems.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phantom_of_Heilbronn

As I understand it PJ at first treated the case as a missing child who had most probably wandered off.  For this reason I guess they were not wearing gloves therefore I would have thought it would have been a good idea to rule out innocent contamination from police officers before requesting assistance from various other countries. 

[Holly Goodhead]

Why worry?  Its not as if they sent you the bill.

Not individually no but as a UK tax-payer I'm contributing to the funding of OG which might not have been necessary if PJ are at some stage found to have been less than diligent and competent over their handling of the case.

[The General]

Not individually no but as a UK tax-payer I'm contributing to the funding of OG which might not have been necessary if PJ are at some stage found to have been less than diligent and competent over their handling of the case.

I'm sure you won't miss the 35p.

[jassi]

Not individually no but as a UK tax-payer I'm contributing to the funding of OG which might not have been necessary if PJ are at some stage found to have been less than diligent and competent over their handling of the case.

I think the lack of success by OG after 8 years of effort indicates just how difficult this case has been right from the start.

Complaining about what should or should not have been done back in 2007  achieves nothing - IMO.

[G-Unit]

Not individually no but as a UK tax-payer I'm contributing to the funding of OG which might not have been necessary if PJ are at some stage found to have been less than diligent and competent over their handling of the case.

I think it's highly unlikely that anyone who counts will cast aspersions on the PJ investigation. Scotland Yard are well aware (now) that their methods are required to reach Portuguese, not British standards. T's must be crossed and i's must be dotted. British involvement was not necessary in this case in my opinion.

[Holly Goodhead]

I didn't start off criticising the PJ as I had no reason to hence I started a thread dedicated to this topic:

https://miscarriageofjustice.co/index.php?topic=10977.0

However the fingerprint is pretty damning whichever way you look at it: not wearing gloves and then not eliminating innocent contamination from ungloved officers before seeking assistance from numerous other countries.  Hopefully this will be the end of the matter and we will not at some stage come to learn that Germany was correct in that the unidentified fingerprint did indeed originate from a woman or youth!   

[ShiningInLuz]

I didn't start off criticising the PJ as I had no reason to hence I started a thread dedicated to this topic:

https://miscarriageofjustice.co/index.php?topic=10977.0

However the fingerprint is pretty damning whichever way you look at it: not wearing gloves and then not eliminating innocent contamination from ungloved officers before seeking assistance from numerous other countries.  Hopefully this will be the end of the matter and we will not at some stage come to learn that Germany was correct in that the unidentified fingerprint did indeed originate from a woman or youth!

It was identified as belonging to a GNR officer.

[The General]

I didn't start off criticising the PJ as I had no reason to hence I started a thread dedicated to this topic:

https://miscarriageofjustice.co/index.php?topic=10977.0

However the fingerprint is pretty damning whichever way you look at it: not wearing gloves and then not eliminating innocent contamination from ungloved officers before seeking assistance from numerous other countries.  Hopefully this will be the end of the matter and we will not at some stage come to learn that Germany was correct in that the unidentified fingerprint did indeed originate from a woman or youth!

And of course every crime / missing persons is investigated just like on the telly every time. How dare they not follow strict protocol in every instance. How dare they! Those 3rd world, backward, rednecked, buck toothed neanderthals. Get the banjo out Linus! Let's kick back and whittle some. Yeeeehaaaw. Dust for prints Linus. Ah kent, ah snorted all the chalk ser, yeh. You ain't need no pansy-assed gloves yo, jus git on with collectin and a sendin.

When you're critiquing the fingerprint gathering and subsequent chain of custody with very little contextual, evidential basis and arriving at the conclusion that it was probably pivotal and the perp would probably have been apprehended 12 years ago, yeh, you've probably watched too much CSI:Sc..thorpe at this point.

[Holly Goodhead]

And of course every crime / missing persons is investigated just like on the telly every time. How dare they not follow strict protocol in every instance. How dare they! Those 3rd world, backward, rednecked, buck toothed neanderthals. Get the banjo out Linus! Let's kick back and whittle some. Yeeeehaaaw. Dust for prints Linus. Ah kent, ah snorted all the chalk ser, yeh. You ain't need no pansy-assed gloves yo, jus git on with collectin and a sendin.

When you're critiquing the fingerprint gathering and subsequent chain of custody with very little contextual, evidential basis and arriving at the conclusion that it was probably pivotal and the perp would probably have been apprehended 12 years ago, yeh, you've probably watched too much CSI:Sc..thorpe at this point.

Well for a start I can't see any evidence from the wit stat of Nelson Filipe Pacheco da Costa that he handled the patio doors:

https://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/NELSON-DA-COSTA-1.htm

He refers to entering 5A by the main (wooden) door and searching the apartment.  He does not refer to the patio doors and/or searching the back/balcony. 

Then we have an anomaly in that according to Germany the unidentified fingerprint originated from a woman or youth and not a male (officer) as PJ claim.  Added to which we know for a fact GA was found guilty of falsifying documents in another case.

 
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/5370361/Madeleine-McCann-police-chief-found-guilty-of-falsifying-evidence.html

Finally my abductor/suspect is female 

[The General]

Well for a start I can't see any evidence from the wit stat of Nelson Filipe Pacheco da Costa that he handled the patio doors:

https://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/NELSON-DA-COSTA-1.htm

He refers to entering 5A by the main (wooden) door and searching the apartment.  He does not refer to the patio doors and/or searching the back/balcony. 

Then we have an anomaly in that according to Germany the unidentified fingerprint originated from a woman or youth and not a male (officer) as PJ claim.  Added to which we know for a fact GA was found guilty of falsifying documents in another case.

 
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/5370361/Madeleine-McCann-police-chief-found-guilty-of-falsifying-evidence.html

Finally my abductor/suspect is female 

Interesting.

In terms of GA being convicted, etc, I would suggest that most police officers past or present will do one or more of the following: mis-handling evidence, not following protocol, intimidating witnesses, overt leniency, nepotism, theft, assault, minor / major corruption, cover up for colleagues, lie for colleagues, failure to follow up for whatever reason, go easy on someone / let someone off, go the extra mile for a local resident, help an elderly person, give 10 quid to a junkie, piss in a suspects sink, lie under oath, embellish an account to get a conviction, procrastinate, make a gut call, not 'call it in', mislay evidence, create or plant evidence, racial profiling, sexual assault / harassment, victimisation or bullying, stab colleagues in the back, misuse of resources, mistakenly obliterate evidence, turn in shit faced, turn in on time for 30 years, etc, etc. They're human beings.
 

[Mr Gray]

Interesting.

In terms of GA being convicted, etc, I would suggest that most police officers past or present will do one or more of the following: mis-handling evidence, not following protocol, intimidating witnesses, overt leniency, nepotism, theft, assault, minor / major corruption, cover up for colleagues, lie for colleagues, failure to follow up for whatever reason, go easy on someone / let someone off, go the extra mile for a local resident, help an elderly person, give 10 quid to a junkie, piss in a suspects sink, lie under oath, embellish an account to get a conviction, procrastinate, make a gut call, not 'call it in', mislay evidence, create or plant evidence, racial profiling, sexual assault / harassment, victimisation or bullying, stab colleagues in the back, misuse of resources, mistakenly obliterate evidence, turn in shit faced, turn in on time for 30 years, etc, etc. They're human beings.

most police officers do not manage to get themselves on the Amnesty international website..re accusations of torture....Amaral managed it as did Almeida another one of amarals team

[The General]

most police officers do not manage to get themselves on the Amnesty international website..re accusations of torture....Amaral managed it as did Almeida another one of amarals team

Didn't say they did. But good going though, to be fair. Scale of possibility. My local newsagent is unlikely to be able to, even if he had the propensity.
What's your point?

[Mr Gray]

Didn't say they did. But good going though, to be fair. Scale of possibility. My local newsagent is unlikely to be able to, even if he had the propensity.
What's your point?

my point is obvious in the context of your post.

[Holly Goodhead]

Didn't say they did. But good going though, to be fair. Scale of possibility. My local newsagent is unlikely to be able to, even if he had the propensity.
What's your point?

People in positions of trust do abuse it but I don't believe they're in the majority.