Author Topic: The bike  (Read 8549 times)

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Offline Brietta

Re: The bike
« Reply #15 on: February 16, 2020, 02:20:59 PM »
Well, it is possible that Nevill made the call before being shot, I don't believe the call took place but nevertheless it is an alternative view.

I think had he been capable of making a call to anyone ... it would have been to the police.
"All I'm going to say is that we've conducted a very serious investigation and there's no indication that Madeleine McCann's parents are connected to her disappearance. On the other hand, we have a lot of evidence pointing out that Christian killed her," Wolter told the "Friday at 9"....

Offline APRIL

Re: The bike
« Reply #16 on: February 16, 2020, 02:41:52 PM »
I think had he been capable of making a call to anyone ... it would have been to the police.


I think that's fair comment/

Offline Caroline

Re: The bike
« Reply #17 on: February 16, 2020, 03:30:38 PM »
Like the phone call it can't be proved one way or the other.

His own admission proves it.

Offline steve_trousers

Re: The bike
« Reply #18 on: February 16, 2020, 07:40:27 PM »
Going back to the question of did he use a bicycle, i'm sure he did but did they not find a speck of blood in his Astra?

If my memory serves it was a very tiny amount on the gear knob, and could well have had an innocent agricultural explanation.

Offline Inspector Gadget

Re: The bike
« Reply #19 on: February 16, 2020, 08:44:36 PM »
Going back to the question of did he use a bicycle, i'm sure he did but did they not find a speck of blood in his Astra?

If my memory serves it was a very tiny amount on the gear knob, and could well have had an innocent agricultural explanation.

Good point Steve, presumably they tested this having found it ? Do you recall the results? If he did make two calls then a car would be the only way he could get back and make them within 10mins but I just can’t see it. Especially as JM statement and the police found the bike at his.

Offline steve_trousers

Re: The bike
« Reply #20 on: February 16, 2020, 08:53:56 PM »
I don't think they did test it, it was such a tiny amount and easily explained as a nick, I suppose. Maybe Bamber didn't deny it and had an explanation.

Here is a link to a short thread on the matter, it was found in the citroen not the astra

Back in 2014, Scipio_usmc wrote :

Quote
I don't think either of the blood stains consisted of enough blood to make it clear it was related to the murder nor could it be determined whose blood it was so they are basically of no value evidence wise.


http://miscarriageofjustice.co/index.php?topic=3857.msg144398#msg144398
« Last Edit: February 16, 2020, 09:25:43 PM by steve_trousers »

Offline Caroline

Re: The bike
« Reply #21 on: February 17, 2020, 04:49:03 PM »
I think had he been capable of making a call to anyone ... it would have been to the police.

AS I said, I don't think the call happened but the notion that it couldn't have been on the basis that Nevill was injured doesn't take into account that it could have been made prior to injury.

Offline Inspector Gadget

Re: The bike
« Reply #22 on: February 17, 2020, 05:55:07 PM »
AS I said, I don't think the call happened but the notion that it couldn't have been on the basis that Nevill was injured doesn't take into account that it could have been made prior to injury.

I disagree as the notion that Sheila was going crazy with a gun would mean to assume that she hadn’t fired yet.
If she had fired then he would have dialled 999 rather than JB at 3am
If she hadn’t fired then he would have just disarmed her rather than waste time calling JB for sure.

It’s just common sense that he wouldn’t have called JB in either scenario.
« Last Edit: February 17, 2020, 08:35:00 PM by Inspector Gadget »

Offline Caroline

Re: The bike
« Reply #23 on: February 17, 2020, 06:11:06 PM »
You agree a phonecall can’t be proved one way or another?  Well it was disproved based on the open phone line, the inability for NB to be able to speak plus one look at his police statements where he contradicted himself. That was enough proof for the jury who found his guilty 10-2 using this exact piece of evidence from the prosecution.

You know that I do actually agree and I don't think such a call happened BUT it is not impossible that IF he called (which again, I don't think he did) it COULD have been prior to any injury. Of course it is common sense that he made no such call but that doesn't make it impossible. I'm being generous to the other side.  8((()*/

Offline adam

Re: The bike
« Reply #24 on: February 17, 2020, 06:59:47 PM »
I disagree as the notion that Sheila was going crazy with a gun would mean to assume that she hadn’t fired yet.
If she had fired then he would have dialled 999 rather than JB at 3am
If she hadn’t fired then he would have just disarmed her rather than waste time failing JB for sure.

It’s just common sense that he wouldn’t have called JB in either scenario.

Yes as head of the family he would have disarmed Sheila prior to any shots being fired.

If she had fired, he would have fought back straight away. The first two shots were close range, so he was close enough. No time to phone 999 or anyone else.

If he was going to the kitchen, it would have been to escape outside. Very unlikely he would do this and abandon his family if Sheila had the rifle. But very likely if Bamber had the rifle.

Offline Inspector Gadget

Re: The bike
« Reply #25 on: February 17, 2020, 08:41:56 PM »
You know that I do actually agree and I don't think such a call happened BUT it is not impossible that IF he called (which again, I don't think he did) it COULD have been prior to any injury. Of course it is common sense that he made no such call but that doesn't make it impossible. I'm being generous to the other side.  8((()*/

I hear you but where do you draw the line? It has to be presented to a jury in such a way that they can make a decision based on what the evidence suggests. The fact a phone had the handset off the hook means his statement that myster posted via soundcloud about the phone being engaged immediately means that it’s a lie anyway. It would have been an open line so regardless of when this phantom call was made it was proven to be a lie. He didn’t think it through properly. In additional to this handset evidence, the coincidence of the phone being moved from bedside to kitchen under magazines is another piece of circumstantial evidence that points to it being even less likely that NB made a call even before or after.

Offline Caroline

Re: The bike
« Reply #26 on: February 17, 2020, 09:17:36 PM »
I hear you but where do you draw the line? It has to be presented to a jury in such a way that they can make a decision based on what the evidence suggests. The fact a phone had the handset off the hook means his statement that myster posted via soundcloud about the phone being engaged immediately means that it’s a lie anyway. It would have been an open line so regardless of when this phantom call was made it was proven to be a lie. He didn’t think it through properly. In additional to this handset evidence, the coincidence of the phone being moved from bedside to kitchen under magazines is another piece of circumstantial evidence that points to it being even less likely that NB made a call even before or after.

Like I said, I agree with you. The phone call was one of the first things that made me suspicious of Bamber's innocence. Nevill never called Bamber that night.

I think Bamber left the phone off the hook in order that if rang, the caller would get the engaged tone, that way they would think Nevill was using the phone - hence - still alive. Unfortunately, he didn't know enough about the tones and tied himself in a knot with how the alleged call ended with Nevill.

Just to clear up someone points about the phones - the dial phone was from the bedroom. Bamber argued that the push button found in the rack was a 'spare' but I believe it was the kitchen phone. 

Offline steve_trousers

Re: The bike
« Reply #27 on: February 18, 2020, 12:07:40 AM »
Yes Caroline it's curious the whole affair with the telephones. So the bedroom one was removed the day before and hidden until after the murders took place. When Nevill and June discovered it was missing their first reaction was the kids have hidden it. But the kids were asleep by then so the ticking off would have to wait for the morning. That's a dark, macabre angle in his planning if that was the case. Or, have I got the telephone swapping all wrong?

Offline Caroline

Re: The bike
« Reply #28 on: February 18, 2020, 01:15:00 AM »
Yes Caroline it's curious the whole affair with the telephones. So the bedroom one was removed the day before and hidden until after the murders took place. When Nevill and June discovered it was missing their first reaction was the kids have hidden it. But the kids were asleep by then so the ticking off would have to wait for the morning. That's a dark, macabre angle in his planning if that was the case. Or, have I got the telephone swapping all wrong?

The phone situation is quite complicated - the dial telephone was (according to the house keeper) usually in the bedroom. There was two phones in the kitchen; a cordless (which Nevill liked to use) and a push button (later found in the rack). On 5th August a Mr Pike collected the cordless phone as it has a problem with the ringer, this should have left the push button phone (as it was later found to be in full working order) in the kitchen and the dial phone in the bedroom. Someone brought the dial phone downstairs as put the push button in the rack. When it happened, is open to interpretation.

Offline steve_trousers

Re: The bike
« Reply #29 on: February 18, 2020, 01:33:59 AM »
The phone situation is quite complicated - the dial telephone was (according to the house keeper) usually in the bedroom. There was two phones in the kitchen; a cordless (which Nevill liked to use) and a push button (later found in the rack). On 5th August a Mr Pike collected the cordless phone as it has a problem with the ringer, this should have left the push button phone (as it was later found to be in full working order) in the kitchen and the dial phone in the bedroom. Someone brought the dial phone downstairs as put the push button in the rack. When it happened, is open to interpretation.

I see. The late Bob Woffenden cited this as the straw that broke the camels back and finally switched sides.
You can see how that bedroom telephone might thwart Jeremy's plans. On the other hand Nevill may have just got annoyed with having the old fashioned dial telephone in the bedroom, taken it downstairs and forgot to bring the digital one up. Odd that it had to happen that weekend though, another coincidence.