Is there any evidence which implicates Sheila?

[ISpyWithMyEye]

I'm not saying NB didn't sustain appalling injuries from gsw's and non gsw's but is there anything SC was incapable of?

Yes

She was incapable of beating him violently without leaving a TRACE of her nightdress fibres on him or a single hair

[Holly Goodhead]

A laceration isn't superficial! And part of Nevill's brain was exposed from the head wounds!

I haven't seen the soc image of NB's head wounds but what you're saying doesn't surprise me when he sustained two gsw's to his face and four to his head.  The bullets were hollow nosed which are described as mini food mixers tearing through tissue and muscle within the victim.

[Caroline]

Which non-gsw's produced blood?  And if the rifle was the blunt instrument Dr V referred to how come it contained do little blood that a) it didn't transfer to SC's nightdress and b) there was so little blood on the rifle it wasn't even possible to group?

Of course it was the blunt instrument which is why part of the stock broke off. Where are you getting that the lacerations didn't bleed?

There was blood on the rifle but it wouldn't get covered in blood if it was used as a weapon anyway and it would depend on how long it was between the beating and laying the rifle on Sheila that would determine if it was dry enough not to leave a stain. Bamber may also have wiped it.

[Caroline]

I haven't seen the soc image of NB's head wounds but what you're saying doesn't surprise me when he sustained two gsw's to his face and four to his head.  The bullets were hollow nosed which are described as mini food mixers tearing through tissue and muscle within the victim.

I have seen the picture and he was also beaten with a blunt instrument.

[ISpyWithMyEye]

But the non gsw's were largely superficial: abrasions, bruising and lacerations.  The pathologist thought all the non-gsw's were caused at a time NB had ceased moving.

They were hardly superficial

He was hit with such massive fierce a large chunk of wood broke off the rifle and flew across the kitchen!

[clockend]

You will note he repeatedly states he was unable to gauge the pressure applied.

Hi Holly,
just to quote from Dr Vanezis,
"With regard to the right parietal laceration, this is linear and i my view could have been caused by a linear object,
because of the lack of underlying fracture attributable to this injury taken together with the relatively  severe superficial skin injury, this points to a relatively light object being used with a CONSIDERABLE degree of force.

He also remarks that in his opinion none of the fractures to the skull were the result of gun shot wounds,
and by extrapolation in my opinion that would require considerable force with a blunt object.
but that is just my opinion.

http://miscarriageofjustice.co/index.php?topic=205.msg2230#msg2230

[APRIL]

They were hardly superficial

He was hit with such massive fierce a large chunk of wood broke off the rifle and flew across the kitchen!

And given that the ferocity exposed his brain, I rather imagine she'd have been splashed, not only with blood but with brain tissue. She couldn't have inflicted such a wound from a distance, ie holding the business end of the barrel.

[Holly Goodhead]

Hi Holly,
just to quote from Dr Vanezis,
"With regard to the right parietal laceration, this is linear and i my view could have been caused by a linear object,
because of the lack of underlying fracture attributable to this injury taken together with the relatively  severe superficial skin injury, this points to a relatively light object being used with a CONSIDERABLE degree of force.

Hi and welcome to the forum.

Yes but look at the injuries caused by a CONSIDERABLE degree of force: lack of underlying fracture, relatively severe superficial skin injury.

He also remarks that in his opinion none of the fractures to the skull were the result of gun shot wounds,
and by extrapolation in my opinion that would require considerable force with a blunt object.
but that is just my opinion.

http://miscarriageofjustice.co/index.php?topic=205.msg2230#msg2230

What did he say at trial under cross examination about this?

[Caroline]

Hi and welcome to the forum.

Yes but look at the injuries caused by a CONSIDERABLE degree of force: lack of underlying fracture, relatively severe superficial skin injury.

What did he say at trial under cross examination about this?

Did you miss this part?

"He also remarks that in his opinion none of the fractures to the skull were the result of gun shot wounds,
and by extrapolation in my opinion that would require considerable force with a blunt object"

[Vertigo Swirl]

Which non-gsw's produced blood?  And if the rifle was the blunt instrument Dr V referred to how come it contained do little blood that a) it didn't transfer to SC's nightdress and b) there was so little blood on the rifle it wasn't even possible to group?

Perhaps because SC was nowhere near him when he was being beaten around the head?  Just a thought...

[Caroline]

Perhaps because SC was nowhere near him when he was being beaten around the head?  Just a thought...

I think she means no blood was transferred when laid on her body.

[Holly Goodhead]

I think she means no blood was transferred when laid on her body.

Correct.

[Vertigo Swirl]

Correct.

Jeremy had probably already wiped the gun clean of his prints by then and so probably cleaned off the blood as well.

[Brietta]

As I said Dr Vanezis provided a complete breakdown of the non-gsw's and there's nothing about knocking blazes out of.  The non-gsw's did not even produce blood.  NB sustained 2 gsw's to his face and four to his head so yes his head was very badly injured.

Neville's body bore the marks of a brutal beating ...  http://netk.net.au/UK/Bamber1.asp

• His nose was broken
• His eyes had been blackened
• Linear bruising to his cheeks - consistent with having been struck with a long blunt object.
• Lacerations to his head
• Bruising to the right forearm - consistent with having been struck with a long blunt object.
• His left wrist and forearm were bruised
• Three burn like marks on his back

Evidence that a sustained cowardly, hate filled attack was carried out on a dying or dead man already suffering excruciatingly from horrific gun shot wounds is well documented .

[Holly Goodhead]

Perhaps because SC was nowhere near him when he was being beaten around the head?  Just a thought...

There's no evidence the injuries any of the victims sustained produced blood that would deposit on the perp. 

Gunshot wounds can produce high impact back spatter but its dependant on many factors and the small amount of blood that was on the rifle did not resemble high impact back spatter which produces a mist like spray.

71. The rifle bore blood smearing on the barrel in the region of the fore-sight and around the mechanism and there were splashes of blood to the left side of the weapon. The appearance of the blood staining was consistent with it having been used to strike somebody who was already bleeding. On analysis the blood was found to be human blood but tests to determine grouping were unsuccessful. "pull-through" on the barrel of the rifle was conducted for any traces of blood within the weapon. There were none.

And yet a flake of blood measuring a 1/4 of an inch supposedly found inside the silencer had to withstand hot gases from firearm discharge and the cyanoacrylate fuming chamber but was able to turn up a full set of blood group results