Nevill was first shot as he exited his bedroom.

[barrier]

I'm not glossing over anything but the physical evidence doesn't reveal at what stage June sustained the two immediately fatal shots and the twins sustained their gsw's.

NB makes the call to JB
- Whilst NB on call to JB, SC opens fire on June who was in bed with her head on the pillow. June sustains 6 gsw's
- NB hearing shots ring out, drops the phone and runs upstairs where he sustains 2 gsw's to his face on the landing.
- NB turns to retreat downstairs and when he's standing on the main staircase he sustains the 2 gsw's to his rear: shoulder and elbow/chest.
- NB makes it to the kitchen where he sustains the beating
- SC reloads and inflicts the 4 gsw's to the head

I arrived at the above based on the following:

- Layout of WHF
- Pathological evidence particularly wound tracks and trajectories.
- Casings
- Blood stains to carpets, kitchen floor and wallpaper in hall.  Also lack of any trace of NB's blood in bedroom.
- Distance of shots

Pardon? June suffered 7 shots,presumably the seventh was the fatal one if shot in her bed and found at the foot of it on the floor.

[Holly Goodhead]

Pardon? June suffered 7 shots,presumably the seventh was the fatal one if shot in her bed and found at the foot of it on the floor.

June sustained a total of 8 gsw's over 2 episodes evidenced  by a trail of blood originating from her which dripped around the bed from one side to the other and back again.  Either one of the two gsw's she sustained to her head would have immobilised her immediately.

[Vertigo Swirl]

I've told you how I think the killings were committed. 

A shooting reconstruction should have taken place at the time so there's no expert evidence but I told you on another thread how I believe they were committed.  I'll look up my old threads.

In a nutshell:

- NB makes the call to JB
- Whilst NB on call to JB, SC opens fire on June who was in bed with her head on the pillow.  June sustains 6 gsw's
- NB hearing shots ring out, drops the phone and runs upstairs where he sustains 2 gsw's to his face on the landing.
- NB turns to retreat downstairs and when he's standing on the main staircase he sustains the 2 gsw's to his rear: shoulder and elbow/chest.
- NB makes it to the kitchen where he sustains the beating
- SC reloads and inflicts the 4 gsw's to the head

I arrived at the above based on the following:

- Layout of WHF
- Pathological evidence particularly wound tracks and trajectories.
- Casings
- Blood stains to carpets, kitchen floor and wallpaper in hall.  Also lack of any trace of NB's blood in bedroom.
- Distance of shots

If you and/or others disagree perhaps you could give explain how you think SC or JB committed the killings.

Could you start at the very beginning please.  Where was Nevill when SB seized the gun.  What prompted Sheila to go crazy at 3am?

[Holly Goodhead]

Could you start at the very beginning please.  Where was Nevill when SB seized the gun.  What prompted Sheila to go crazy at 3am?

I've no idea.  I can only go on the physical evidence at soc which overwhelmingly places the perp in the main bedroom shooting out onto the landing where NB sustained his facial wounds.  NB turned and when on the main staircase facing down he sustained the two gsw's to the rear.

[APRIL]

I've no idea.  I can only go on the physical evidence at soc which overwhelmingly places the perp in the main bedroom shooting out onto the landing where NB sustained his facial wounds.  NB turned and when on the main staircase facing down he sustained the two gsw's to the rear.

Then how did he manage to speak, coherently, with Jeremy?

[Holly Goodhead]

Then how did he manage to speak, coherently, with Jeremy?

He made the call prior to getting shot and just before arriving on the landing stairs.

[APRIL]

He made the call prior to getting shot and just before arriving on the landing stairs.

It takes us right back to the point I made earlier, doesn't it, if you believe a call was made to Jeremy

I don't know to which "physical evidence" you're referring. There must have been a window during which he, uninjured, could see for himself that Sheila was "going mad" -I doubt it JUST happened, nor that it happened simultaneously with the lifting of the gun, he may even have had the chance of removing the gun when he saw what was transpiring?- and could have intervened.

[Holly Goodhead]

It takes us right back to the point I made earlier, doesn't it, if you believe a call was made to Jeremy

The physical evidence by way of the layout of the farmhouse, blood stains and lack of, casings, distance of shots, trajectories and wound tracks.

[Vertigo Swirl]

I've no idea.  I can only go on the physical evidence at soc which overwhelmingly places the perp in the main bedroom shooting out onto the landing where NB sustained his facial wounds.  NB turned and when on the main staircase facing down he sustained the two gsw's to the rear.

What physical evidence places Sheila in the main bedroom shooting out?  None, yet you have no qualms suggesting this is what happened, yet you can venture no hypothesis regarding where Nevill was when SB seized the gun.  How did he know a) she had gone crazy and b) she had a gun prior to making the alleged phonecall?

[APRIL]

The physical evidence by way of the layout of the farmhouse, blood stains and lack of, casings, distance of shots, trajectories and wound tracks.

Unfortunately, none of the above takes human reactions into consideration.

[Vertigo Swirl]

He made the call prior to getting shot and just before arriving on the landing stairs.

. You say Nevill dropped the phone (which contradicts JB’s evidence that in his view someone deliberately cut the call) so if he was on the phone to JB and didn’t hang up how was Jeremy able to call out to speak to JM?

[Holly Goodhead]

What physical evidence places Sheila in the main bedroom shooting out?  None, yet you have no qualms suggesting this is what happened, yet you can venture no hypothesis regarding where Nevill was when SB seized the gun.  How did he know a) she had gone crazy and b) she had a gun prior to making the alleged phonecall?

I've based my reconstruction based on the physical evidence at soc:

- layout of farmhouse
- Bloodstains and lack of
- Casings
- Distance of shots
- Trajectories gsw's
- Wound tracks

The above all feature in the following and that's how you work out what happened if the data is available:

https://www.sciencedirect.com/book/9780123822413/shooting-incident-reconstruction

The prosecution case at trial was that JB entered his parents room under stealth and opened fire.  The defence didn't present any alternative to this.

[barrier]

June sustained a total of 8 gsw's over 2 episodes evidenced  by a trail of blood originating from her which dripped around the bed from one side to the other and back again.  Either one of the two gsw's she sustained to her head would have immobilised her immediately.

I can find lots of references to 7 shots,where do you get the 8 from?

June's body and clothing were heavily bloodstained; she was found in her nightdress with bare feet. The police believe she had been sitting up during part of the attack, based on the pattern of blood on her clothing. She was found lying on the floor by the door of the master bedroom. She had been shot seven times. One shot to her forehead, between her eyes, was fired from under one foot away. That and another shot to the right side of her head would both have caused her death quickly, the court heard. There were also shots to the right side of her lower neck, her right forearm, and two injuries on the right side of her chest and right knee.[110]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/White_House_Farm_murders

[barrier]

I've based my reconstruction based on the physical evidence at soc:

- layout of farmhouse
- Bloodstains and lack of
- Casings
- Distance of shots
- Trajectories gsw's
- Wound tracks

The above all feature in the following and that's how you work out what happened if the data is available:

https://www.sciencedirect.com/book/9780123822413/shooting-incident-reconstruction

The prosecution case at trial was that JB entered his parents room under stealth and opened fire.  The defence didn't present any alternative to this.

Because there wasn't one perchance.

[Vertigo Swirl]

I've based my reconstruction based on the physical evidence at soc:

- layout of farmhouse
- Bloodstains and lack of
- Casings
- Distance of shots
- Trajectories gsw's
- Wound tracks

The above all feature in the following and that's how you work out what happened if the data is available:

https://www.sciencedirect.com/book/9780123822413/shooting-incident-reconstruction

The prosecution case at trial was that JB entered his parents room under stealth and opened fire.  The defence didn't present any alternative to this.

I can see why you’re avoiding the question and that’s because there really isn’t a plausible explanation.