Why was there no security at Ocean Club?

[C.Edwards]

@ Martha re: "a) Many children of 3 and under have been abused by paedophiles so it is not entirely unheard of"

I challenge you to find something to back up that assertion.  There's way too much on that link to c&p and it's entirely work safe, it's a statistical site.

A Plymouth nursery where a worker sexually abused children "provided an ideal environment" for her to abuse, an inquiry has found.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-devon-11682161


A nursery worker in South Lanarkshire has admitted sexually assaulting two toddlers enrolled at the child-care centre where he was employed.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-glasgow-west-18023422


A woman nursery worker has been arrested in connection an alleged sex assault on a child in her care.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1221694/Police-arrest-female-nursery-worker-Leeds-child-sex-abuse-charges.html

AND

http://ukpaedos-exposed.com/category/nursery-worker/

What relevance have nursery workers (i.e. acquaintance based contacts) got to do with stranger abduction as would have to be the case with the McCanns?  Unless you're suspecting Pennington or Baker?

[C.Edwards]

@ Martha re: "a) Many children of 3 and under have been abused by paedophiles so it is not entirely unheard of"

I challenge you to find something to back up that assertion.  There's way too much on that link to c&p and it's entirely work safe, it's a statistical site.

A Plymouth nursery where a worker sexually abused children "provided an ideal environment" for her to abuse, an inquiry has found.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-devon-11682161


A nursery worker in South Lanarkshire has admitted sexually assaulting two toddlers enrolled at the child-care centre where he was employed.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-glasgow-west-18023422


A woman nursery worker has been arrested in connection an alleged sex assault on a child in her care.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1221694/Police-arrest-female-nursery-worker-Leeds-child-sex-abuse-charges.html

AND

http://ukpaedos-exposed.com/category/nursery-worker/

What relevance have nursery workers (i.e. acquaintance based contacts) got to do with stranger abduction as would have to be the case with the McCanns?  Unless you're suspecting Pennington or Baker?

The relevance is that paedophiles can and do abuse children aged 3 and under I would have thought, as I said!

No, don't go moving the goalposts now.  I can provide statistics showing it's far more likely that the parents will commit these atrocities than anything else, but I have no interest in casting those kind of aspersions at the T9.

We're talking of stranger abduction here, as I'm entertaining your belief that a stranger abducted Madeleine McCann.  Ignore acquaintances and parental contact based abduction from the statistics and find me examples where strangers (outside of India and China where it is more frequent) have abducted children of Madeleine's age for sexual purposes or for "stolen to order" purposes.

It is, of course, possible that the McCann case is the one-in-a-billion occurrence that defies all the statistical odds, I accept that, but it's just a whole lot less likely to have happened than any of you believe.

[debunker]

@ Martha re: "a) Many children of 3 and under have been abused by paedophiles so it is not entirely unheard of"

I challenge you to find something to back up that assertion.  There's way too much on that link to c&p and it's entirely work safe, it's a statistical site.

A Plymouth nursery where a worker sexually abused children "provided an ideal environment" for her to abuse, an inquiry has found.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-devon-11682161


A nursery worker in South Lanarkshire has admitted sexually assaulting two toddlers enrolled at the child-care centre where he was employed.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-glasgow-west-18023422


A woman nursery worker has been arrested in connection an alleged sex assault on a child in her care.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1221694/Police-arrest-female-nursery-worker-Leeds-child-sex-abuse-charges.html

AND

http://ukpaedos-exposed.com/category/nursery-worker/

What relevance have nursery workers (i.e. acquaintance based contacts) got to do with stranger abduction as would have to be the case with the McCanns?  Unless you're suspecting Pennington or Baker?

The relevance is that paedophiles can and do abuse children aged 3 and under I would have thought, as I said!

No, don't go moving the goalposts now.  I can provide statistics showing it's far more likely that the parents will commit these atrocities than anything else, but I have no interest in casting those kind of aspersions at the T9.

We're talking of stranger abduction here, as I'm entertaining your belief that a stranger abducted Madeleine McCann.  Ignore acquaintances and parental contact based abduction from the statistics and find me examples where strangers (outside of India and China where it is more frequent) have abducted children of Madeleine's age for sexual purposes or for "stolen to order" purposes.

It is, of course, possible that the McCann case is the one-in-a-billion occurrence that defies all the statistical odds, I accept that, but it's just a whole lot less likely to have happened than any of you believe.

It is not one in a billion by any account. I have worked in Child Abuse Cases where the child was no more than a toddler. There are certainly organised groups of paedophiles with similar interests. Starngely, female offenders usually only target very young and older childre; why we do not know. Men tend to target 7-12 year olds.

[C.Edwards]

Sorry Martha, you're off into an area of simple implausibility now.  You need to understand the difference between opportunistic acquaintance and familial abuse and stranger abduction.  By your logic I could claim that Madeleine was obviously snatched by a giant eagle as I saw that one on the internet video pick up the baby and almost get away with it. Just because it's happened once, etc.

If you look at it statistically only with no other factors or evidence, the family or friends did it in all probability.  That's why the police should always start there.  That the PJ allowed themselves to be distracted from that angle of investigation from the outset is their single biggest failing for me.

[debunker]

Sorry Martha, you're off into an area of simple implausibility now.  You need to understand the difference between opportunistic acquaintance and familial abuse and stranger abduction.  By your logic I could claim that Madeleine was obviously snatched by a giant eagle as I saw that one on the internet video pick up the baby and almost get away with it. Just because it's happened once, etc.

If you look at it statistically only with no other factors or evidence, the family or friends did it in all probability.  That's why the police should always start there.  That the PJ allowed themselves to be distracted from that angle of investigation from the outset is their single biggest failing for me.

You are misusing statistics. Statistics do not speak to single events.

[C.Edwards]

You are misusing statistics. Statistics do not speak to single events.

Damn. If only I'd posted pretty much that on several occasions...  You just skim read things and pick out the bits you want to deal with, don't you?

[debunker]

You are misusing statistics. Statistics do not speak to single events.

Damn. If only I'd posted pretty much that on several occasions...  You just skim read things and pick out the bits you want to deal with, don't you?

No. I speak the truth.

[debunker]

I am finding it difficult to determine the difference in attitude and manners between CEdwards Drunk and CEdwards sober!

[Luz]

Another was the break-in to Pamela Fenn's apartment a week or so before Madeleine was taken.  No sign of a break-in there either!

Where is that documented?

There were NEVER any intrusions in  inhabited homes in Praia da Luz, there were only attempts towards houses that were vacant, and very scarce (3 attempts in a close to a thousand houses perimeter) until 2007.

[debunker]

Another was the break-in to Pamela Fenn's apartment a week or so before Madeleine was taken.  No sign of a break-in there either!

Where is that documented?

There were NEVER any intrusions in  inhabited homes in Praia da Luz, there were only attempts towards houses that were vacant, and very scarce (3 attempts in a close to a thousand houses perimeter) until 2007.

Your basis for saying there were no 'intrusions' is what? Prejudice and emotion? Xenophobia?

[Carana]

Another was the break-in to Pamela Fenn's apartment a week or so before Madeleine was taken.  No sign of a break-in there either!

Where is that documented?

There were NEVER any intrusions in  inhabited homes in Praia da Luz, there were only attempts towards houses that were vacant, and very scarce (3 attempts in a close to a thousand houses perimeter) until 2007.

When questioned she said that she never saw any strange person or action before or after the event. She claims however, that a week previously she was the victim of an attempted robbery, which was not successful and neither was anything taken, thinking that the crying of the child could be linked to another attempted robbery in the residence.
http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/PAMELA_FENN.htm

[AnneGuedes]

@ Martha re: "a) Many children of 3 and under have been abused by paedophiles so it is not entirely unheard of"

I challenge you to find something to back up that assertion.  There's way too much on that link to c&p and it's entirely work safe, it's a statistical site.

What would you deduce if those crimes had happened in the Algarve !

A Plymouth nursery where a worker sexually abused children "provided an ideal environment" for her to abuse, an inquiry has found.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-devon-11682161


A nursery worker in South Lanarkshire has admitted sexually assaulting two toddlers enrolled at the child-care centre where he was employed.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-glasgow-west-18023422


A woman nursery worker has been arrested in connection an alleged sex assault on a child in her care.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1221694/Police-arrest-female-nursery-worker-Leeds-child-sex-abuse-charges.html

AND

http://ukpaedos-exposed.com/category/nursery-worker/