The Neglect question

[stephen25000]

Can anyone give me examples where other parents of inexplicably missing children have courted the media spotlight so assiduously?  To the extent where they've winkled their way into official causes as un-, semi- or even official spokespeople?  Where such parents have held forth on various subjects as though they are leading authorities in the fields, where such parents have repeatedly failed to acknowledge their wrongdoing in setting off the whole chain of events, therefore setting a hideously bad example to all?  Would it not be fair to say that the neglect is proven as they have a missing, in all likelihood dead, child and if that's not harm, what is?  Regardless of whether the UK or Portuguese authorities have taken the step of charging them or not, it doesn't alter the facts of what they did and have failed to take responsibility for.

"Back garden"
"Well within the bounds of responsible parenting"

Oh yes?

Just asking again -  do the McCanns represent the absolute nadir of bad parenting against which all other cases must be judged?  Some of the Anti McCanns seem to equate Kate and Gerry with Fred and Rosemary West for example - is this the reason why you "sceptics" will never tire in your online campaign of criticisim, because the McCanns are THAT terrible? 

Is a large part of your antipathy actually down to the fact that they have chosen to keep their child's name in the news?  Do you think these are the actions of guilty people?   Why do you think parents who are involved in a major cover-up involving the hiding of their child's dead body would be so keen to keep the spotlight on themselves for 6 years?  Is this usual behaviour of people with something awful to hide? Got any examples of others who have so assiduously sought to keep the spotlight on themselves and their alleged crime for such a length of time?

Rather than me cut and paste from, read the posts on there Amazon as regards the above statements.

You might learn something.

[Joanne]

There have been thousands of cases of neglectful parents doing stupid things, many have been punished some have not, yet the focus for the past 6 years for many  people has been the alleged neglect of the McCanns (allegations of neglect which incidentally was dismissed by the Portuguese authorities and which clearly did not overly trouble the UK authorities as I believe the McCanns' other children still reside with them and have never been taken into care).  So, why the constant harping on about the McCanns above all others?  Do they represent the absolute nadir of bad parenting against which all other cases must be judged?  Some of the Anti McCanns seem to equate Kate and Gerry with Fred and Rosemary West for example - is this the reason why you "sceptics" will never tire in your online campaign of criticism, because the McCanns are THAT terrible?

The difference in the Mccanns and the others are that the others didn't call the news teams in, write a book, set a 'charity' up, start hiring such people as Clarence Mitchell to head up their campaign, start jetting off round the world doing public speaking and endless press conferences et, all might I add without their other 2 children.
Why did they set up a website shortly after Madeleine disappeared? Others would be following all the leads and looking for their child.
Why when Kate entered the room and swore the door slammed, did she not feel the cold in that bedroom since they have all said it was a cold night in Portugal for the time of year?

If you do such an idiotic thing like leaving your kids on their own while you chose to go out for a meal and something happens, then they're going to get criticised. They then expect other people to help them sort their own mess out. They raised millions for the 'charity', I don't suppose they offered to pay the cost of the search by the police and all the man hours in because they wanted to go out?
I'm so sick of this hindsight rubbish, they had foresight, they're both doctors and must risk assess on a daily basis or is it the old saying of "All brains and no common sense"?. if they were a couple who lived in Wigan or something and had low paid jobs and claimed housing benefit or something and were a bit over weight, they'd be slaughtered by the public.
Kerry Needham recieved very little help when her son Ben went missing, they received very little support and MOST of the work they did and still do to try and find Ben has been driven by her and her family and not rich bystanders.

[C.Edwards]

Where have the McCanns ever come out and said, "we were wrong."  Unequivocally, that is.  As Stephen has pointed out, it's always been excuses. "How were we to know". "Well within the bounds of responsible parenting". "Like dining in your own backyard".  If anyone chooses to come out in public and peddle such nonsense they deserve all the abuse they get every single time they stick their heads over the parapet until such time as they publicly admit that they are the reason Madeleine is missing regardless of whether it was abduction by human or alien or even the less palatable accidental death/cover up.  All we get is an endless procession of idiots telling them "we've all done it" (no we sodding well haven't), making ridiculous comparisons between children sleeping in another room or playing in the garden out of sight or some other nonsense.  It's always excuses with the McCanns and their supporters.  There is no excuse for deserting your role as parent.

[C.Edwards]

There have been thousands of cases of neglectful parents doing stupid things, many have been punished some have not, yet the focus for the past 6 years for many  people has been the alleged neglect of the McCanns (allegations of neglect which incidentally was dismissed by the Portuguese authorities and which clearly did not overly trouble the UK authorities as I believe the McCanns' other children still reside with them and have never been taken into care).  So, why the constant harping on about the McCanns above all others?  Do they represent the absolute nadir of bad parenting against which all other cases must be judged?  Some of the Anti McCanns seem to equate Kate and Gerry with Fred and Rosemary West for example - is this the reason why you "sceptics" will never tire in your online campaign of criticism, because the McCanns are THAT terrible?

The difference in the Mccanns and the others are that the others didn't call the news teams in, write a book, set a 'charity' up, start hiring such people as Clarence Mitchell to head up their campaign, start jetting off round the world doing public speaking and endless press conferences et, all might I add without their other 2 children.
Why did they set up a website shortly after Madeleine disappeared? Others would be following all the leads and looking for their child.
Why when Kate entered the room and swore the door slammed, did she not feel the cold in that bedroom since they have all said it was a cold night in Portugal for the time of year?

If you do such an idiotic thing like leaving your kids on their own while you chose to go out for a meal and something happens, then they're going to get criticised. They then expect other people to help them sort their own mess out. They raised millions for the 'charity', I don't suppose they offered to pay the cost of the search by the police and all the man hours in because they wanted to go out?
I'm so sick of this hindsight rubbish, they had foresight, they're both doctors and must risk assess on a daily basis or is it the old saying of "All brains and no common sense"?. if they were a couple who lived in Wigan or something and had low paid jobs and claimed housing benefit or something and were a bit over weight, they'd be slaughtered by the public.
Kerry Needham recieved very little help when her son Ben went missing, they received very little support and MOST of the work they did and still do to try and find Ben has been driven by her and her family and not rich bystanders.

Bloody well said Joanne. 

[puglove]

There have been thousands of cases of neglectful parents doing stupid things, many have been punished some have not, yet the focus for the past 6 years for many  people has been the alleged neglect of the McCanns (allegations of neglect which incidentally was dismissed by the Portuguese authorities and which clearly did not overly trouble the UK authorities as I believe the McCanns' other children still reside with them and have never been taken into care).  So, why the constant harping on about the McCanns above all others?  Do they represent the absolute nadir of bad parenting against which all other cases must be judged?  Some of the Anti McCanns seem to equate Kate and Gerry with Fred and Rosemary West for example - is this the reason why you "sceptics" will never tire in your online campaign of criticism, because the McCanns are THAT terrible?

The difference in the Mccanns and the others are that the others didn't call the news teams in, write a book, set a 'charity' up, start hiring such people as Clarence Mitchell to head up their campaign, start jetting off round the world doing public speaking and endless press conferences et, all might I add without their other 2 children.
Why did they set up a website shortly after Madeleine disappeared? Others would be following all the leads and looking for their child.
Why when Kate entered the room and swore the door slammed, did she not feel the cold in that bedroom since they have all said it was a cold night in Portugal for the time of year?

If you do such an idiotic thing like leaving your kids on their own while you chose to go out for a meal and something happens, then they're going to get criticised. They then expect other people to help them sort their own mess out. They raised millions for the 'charity', I don't suppose they offered to pay the cost of the search by the police and all the man hours in because they wanted to go out?
I'm so sick of this hindsight rubbish, they had foresight, they're both doctors and must risk assess on a daily basis or is it the old saying of "All brains and no common sense"?. if they were a couple who lived in Wigan or something and had low paid jobs and claimed housing benefit or something and were a bit over weight, they'd be slaughtered by the public.
Kerry Needham recieved very little help when her son Ben went missing, they received very little support and MOST of the work they did and still do to try and find Ben has been driven by her and her family and not rich bystanders.

I completely agree with this.

[stephen25000]

There have been thousands of cases of neglectful parents doing stupid things, many have been punished some have not, yet the focus for the past 6 years for many  people has been the alleged neglect of the McCanns (allegations of neglect which incidentally was dismissed by the Portuguese authorities and which clearly did not overly trouble the UK authorities as I believe the McCanns' other children still reside with them and have never been taken into care).  So, why the constant harping on about the McCanns above all others?  Do they represent the absolute nadir of bad parenting against which all other cases must be judged?  Some of the Anti McCanns seem to equate Kate and Gerry with Fred and Rosemary West for example - is this the reason why you "sceptics" will never tire in your online campaign of criticism, because the McCanns are THAT terrible?

The difference in the Mccanns and the others are that the others didn't call the news teams in, write a book, set a 'charity' up, start hiring such people as Clarence Mitchell to head up their campaign, start jetting off round the world doing public speaking and endless press conferences et, all might I add without their other 2 children.
Why did they set up a website shortly after Madeleine disappeared? Others would be following all the leads and looking for their child.
Why when Kate entered the room and swore the door slammed, did she not feel the cold in that bedroom since they have all said it was a cold night in Portugal for the time of year?

If you do such an idiotic thing like leaving your kids on their own while you chose to go out for a meal and something happens, then they're going to get criticised. They then expect other people to help them sort their own mess out. They raised millions for the 'charity', I don't suppose they offered to pay the cost of the search by the police and all the man hours in because they wanted to go out?
I'm so sick of this hindsight rubbish, they had foresight, they're both doctors and must risk assess on a daily basis or is it the old saying of "All brains and no common sense"?. if they were a couple who lived in Wigan or something and had low paid jobs and claimed housing benefit or something and were a bit over weight, they'd be slaughtered by the public.
Kerry Needham recieved very little help when her son Ben went missing, they received very little support and MOST of the work they did and still do to try and find Ben has been driven by her and her family and not rich bystanders.

Well said Joanne.

[C.Edwards]

There have been thousands of cases of neglectful parents doing stupid things, many have been punished some have not, yet the focus for the past 6 years for many  people has been the alleged neglect of the McCanns (allegations of neglect which incidentally was dismissed by the Portuguese authorities and which clearly did not overly trouble the UK authorities as I believe the McCanns' other children still reside with them and have never been taken into care).  So, why the constant harping on about the McCanns above all others?  Do they represent the absolute nadir of bad parenting against which all other cases must be judged?  Some of the Anti McCanns seem to equate Kate and Gerry with Fred and Rosemary West for example - is this the reason why you "sceptics" will never tire in your online campaign of criticism, because the McCanns are THAT terrible?

The difference in the Mccanns and the others are that the others didn't call the news teams in, write a book, set a 'charity' up, start hiring such people as Clarence Mitchell to head up their campaign, start jetting off round the world doing public speaking and endless press conferences et, all might I add without their other 2 children.
Why did they set up a website shortly after Madeleine disappeared? Others would be following all the leads and looking for their child.
Why when Kate entered the room and swore the door slammed, did she not feel the cold in that bedroom since they have all said it was a cold night in Portugal for the time of year?

If you do such an idiotic thing like leaving your kids on their own while you chose to go out for a meal and something happens, then they're going to get criticised. They then expect other people to help them sort their own mess out. They raised millions for the 'charity', I don't suppose they offered to pay the cost of the search by the police and all the man hours in because they wanted to go out?
I'm so sick of this hindsight rubbish, they had foresight, they're both doctors and must risk assess on a daily basis or is it the old saying of "All brains and no common sense"?. if they were a couple who lived in Wigan or something and had low paid jobs and claimed housing benefit or something and were a bit over weight, they'd be slaughtered by the public.
Kerry Needham recieved very little help when her son Ben went missing, they received very little support and MOST of the work they did and still do to try and find Ben has been driven by her and her family and not rich bystanders.

I'm getting the vibe very strongly that you think the McCanns should have just piped down, bowed their heads, self-flagellated for a bit, maybe offered themselves up to be imprisoned for neglect and then just shut up and not bother to publicise the case of their missing child, am I right?  That would be your preferred action if your child went missing would it?  You'd be dead set against publicity for him or her and hope that somehow you'd stumble across them by scouring the  world on your own?

Dunno about Joanne but I'd have done something stupid and way out left field like cooperate with the authorities and hope that those that knew what they were doing would find her. I can't imagine any parent of a genuinely missing child acting any differently. Hence my suspicion about the McCanns and their behaviour ever since.

[Lace]

The difference in the Mccanns and the others are that the others didn't call the news teams in, write a book, set a 'charity' up, start hiring such people as Clarence Mitchell to head up their campaign, start jetting off round the world doing public speaking and endless press conferences et, all might I add without their other 2 children.
Why did they set up a website shortly after Madeleine disappeared? Others would be following all the leads and looking for their child.
Why when Kate entered the room and swore the door slammed, did she not feel the cold in that bedroom since they have all said it was a cold night in Portugal for the time of year?

If you do such an idiotic thing like leaving your kids on their own while you chose to go out for a meal and something happens, then they're going to get criticised. They then expect other people to help them sort their own mess out. They raised millions for the 'charity', I don't suppose they offered to pay the cost of the search by the police and all the man hours in because they wanted to go out?
I'm so sick of this hindsight rubbish, they had foresight, they're both doctors and must risk assess on a daily basis or is it the old saying of "All brains and no common sense"?. if they were a couple who lived in Wigan or something and had low paid jobs and claimed housing benefit or something and were a bit over weight, they'd be slaughtered by the public.
Kerry Needham recieved very little help when her son Ben went missing, they received very little support and MOST of the work they did and still do to try and find Ben has been driven by her and her family and not rich bystanders.


The McCanns didn't inform the media,  one of the friends did.

The police had left the McCanns and said they would return in the morning.    Can you imagine how they must have felt?     

Here in Britain the public are informed straight away about a missing child.    Do you know that Portugal now has an emergency number for missing children so that the news of a missing child can be sent out straight away?

The McCanns received money from people who wanted to help them and the search for Madeleine.   The fund was set up as they had to put this money somewhere,   what should they have done stuck it in a biscuit tin?

Clarence Mitchell was brought in to help with the media as the McCanns could not cope with it.

You mention Ben Needhams mother,   no they didn't have so much public awareness there wasn't internet as we know it now.     Mrs.  Needham has said herself she wished she had had the media that the McCanns received,  no doubt she too would have informed the media by internet if she could have.

Haven't Greece now opened the Ben Needham case?      Was that to do with the publicity of the McCanns case?

[C.Edwards]

So - because Kerry Needham received very little help we think the McCanns should also have received very little help, is that the consensus here?

Kerry Needham continues to receive very little help.  Although I obviously don't know anything about how grieving parents behave (rolling eyes smiley) she is a mother who exhibits all signs that I would expect to see in one.  It would be nice for her case to get a SY review and/or resources, no?

[Lace]

So - because Kerry Needham received very little help we think the McCanns should also have received very little help, is that the consensus here?

Kerry Needham continues to receive very little help.  Although I obviously don't know anything about how grieving parents behave (rolling eyes smiley) she is a mother who exhibits all signs that I would expect to see in one.  It would be nice for her case to get a SY review and/or resources, no?

Haven't Greece opened the Needham case?

Tell how do grieving parents behave?    That is one of the silliest comments I have ever read.

[Eleanor]

Grieving parents crawl on their hands and knees, allegedly, knocking on doors and demanding entry.  Wailing and crying incoherently when interviewed by anyone at all.

[Joanne]

So - because Kerry Needham received very little help we think the McCanns should also have received very little help, is that the consensus here?

No. The feeling is that because the Mccanns were doctors, affluent et al, that they couldn't possibly have done anything 'bad' to their children but in the Needham case, the consensus was they weren't keeping an eye on ben and they must have known what happened.

Thank you for your kind comments.

[Eleanor]

But apparently grieving parents do NOT get down on their knees and bury their faces in the ground and make terrible noises - oh no, that means they dunnit, see?

And both of them at the same time.  Very odd.  Especially on that hard, tiled floor.  Very painful.  They must've dunnit.

[puglove]

So - because Kerry Needham received very little help we think the McCanns should also have received very little help, is that the consensus here?

No. The feeling is that because the Mccanns were doctors, affluent et al, that they couldn't possibly have done anything 'bad' to their children but in the Needham case, the consensus was they weren't keeping an eye on ben and they must have known what happened.

Thank you for your kind comments.

So many times, I've heard the McCanns say "we regret what we did, but..." then try to justify their recklessness. I know this doesn't help in any way, and has been said a thousand times, but it was bloody insanity to leave three tiny children alone in an apartment. Anything could have gone wrong. They could have lost all three.

[puglove]

So - because Kerry Needham received very little help we think the McCanns should also have received very little help, is that the consensus here?

No. The feeling is that because the Mccanns were doctors, affluent et al, that they couldn't possibly have done anything 'bad' to their children but in the Needham case, the consensus was they weren't keeping an eye on ben and they must have known what happened.

Thank you for your kind comments.

So many times, I've heard the McCanns say "we regret what we did, but..." then try to justify their recklessness. I know this doesn't help in any way, and has been said a thousand times, but it was bloody insanity to leave three tiny children alone in an apartment. Anything could have gone wrong. They could have lost all three.

It's been said a thousand times?  More like 100,000 times, but thanks for saying it again even though you know it doesn't help. I expect you'll feel like saying it again soon.  Probably still be saying it next year, and the year after that, and the year after that....

As long as I have to think about what may have happened (and, god forbid, may still be happening) to that little girl, because of her parents' stupidity, yes, I probably will.