Author Topic: If the children were being sedated...  (Read 64661 times)

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Offline Eleanor

Re: If the children were being sedated...
« Reply #165 on: December 10, 2024, 03:10:22 PM »
Fck knows. What do you think?
I do know, on the balance of probabilities, the 15 matching DNA markers mean that was MM's bodily fluid. So again, Mrs Alf Sceptic, what do you think?
I'm beginning to smell a rat here.....

I don't suppose you care if you are right or wrong.  And nor do I.

Offline The General

Re: If the children were being sedated...
« Reply #166 on: December 10, 2024, 03:24:16 PM »
I don't suppose you care if you are right or wrong.  And nor do I.
Of course not, nothing here is of any relevance. It's just a wee game.
In the immortal words of the late Jim Morrison, 'nobody here gets out alive'.
« Last Edit: December 10, 2024, 03:35:15 PM by Eleanor »
Subject Matter Expert - Hobos.

Offline The General

Re: If the children were being sedated...
« Reply #167 on: December 10, 2024, 03:48:35 PM »
Of course not, nothing here is of any relevance. It's just a wee game.
In the immortal words of the late Jim Morrison, 'nobody here gets out alive'.
Of all the words to edit out of that post, you decided upon Elatron? Please accept my apologies for any offence caused.
Subject Matter Expert - Hobos.

Offline Vertigo Swirl

Re: If the children were being sedated...
« Reply #168 on: December 10, 2024, 05:26:37 PM »
Fck knows. What do you think?
I do know, on the balance of probabilities, the 15 matching DNA markers mean that was MM's bodily fluid. So again, Mrs Alf Sceptic, what do you think?
I'm beginning to smell a rat here.....
Fck knows appears to be your only working theory and it’s not terribly impressive.  I think it’s unlikely that Madeleine died in the apartment on the evening of the 3rd May.  I think it must have happened earlier because I don’t think heavily sedated children get out of bed within an hour of being tucked up in bed, I don’t think it’s plausible that she fell off the sofa spraying blood everywhere or down the stairs to be discovered by one of thr Tapas group who then immediately hatched a plot round the dinner table, I don’t think Gerry’s dumb enough to carry her uncovered corpse through town at the same time the alarm is being raised so yeah, it’s got to have all happened earlier in the holiday.  Now, what do you think, or is it still fck knows?  You seem convinced she died in the apartment and are willing to speculate about sedation and double doses so surely your speculation goes beyond that point?  Come on, we need a really brilliant cast iron plausible, logical theory and so far there isn’t one but I feel with my brains and your beauty we can finally achieve this.
"You can't reason with the unreasonable".

Offline Wonderfulspam

Re: If the children were being sedated...
« Reply #169 on: December 11, 2024, 12:14:53 AM »
Fck knows appears to be your only working theory and it’s not terribly impressive.  I think it’s unlikely that Madeleine died in the apartment on the evening of the 3rd May.  I think it must have happened earlier because I don’t think heavily sedated children get out of bed within an hour of being tucked up in bed, I don’t think it’s plausible that she fell off the sofa spraying blood everywhere or down the stairs to be discovered by one of thr Tapas group who then immediately hatched a plot round the dinner table, I don’t think Gerry’s dumb enough to carry her uncovered corpse through town at the same time the alarm is being raised so yeah, it’s got to have all happened earlier in the holiday.  Now, what do you think, or is it still fck knows?  You seem convinced she died in the apartment and are willing to speculate about sedation and double doses so surely your speculation goes beyond that point?  Come on, we need a really brilliant cast iron plausible, logical theory and so far there isn’t one but I feel with my brains and your beauty we can finally achieve this.

The McCanns didn't have access to a car on the evening of May 3rd, it makes sense that Gerry’s only option was to carry Maddie, clothed not uncovered, through the dark deserted streets. It's not that there isn't a logical & plausible explanation that involves the McCanns, rather that you refuse to accept the eye witness testimony of it.
Christian Brueckner Fan Club

Offline Vertigo Swirl

Re: If the children were being sedated...
« Reply #170 on: December 11, 2024, 07:27:05 AM »
The McCanns didn't have access to a car on the evening of May 3rd, it makes sense that Gerry’s only option was to carry Maddie, clothed not uncovered, through the dark deserted streets. It's not that there isn't a logical & plausible explanation that involves the McCanns, rather that you refuse to accept the eye witness testimony of it.
It wasn’t his only option to pick the exact moment the alarm was raised.  It wasn’t his only option to walk through the part of town most likely to be seen.  It wasn’t his only option to carry a corpse in his arms when he had a perfectly good blue sportsbag for the job.  But ok, if it was Gerry at that time (and the evidence that it was him is shaky at best) explain tne logical and plausible theory up to that point. When in the timeline did Madeleine die, who discovered her dead, which of the group also knew and when were they informed?  And how did the defrosted bodily fluids get in the back of the hire car?
« Last Edit: December 11, 2024, 07:29:30 AM by Alf »
"You can't reason with the unreasonable".

Offline Wonderfulspam

Re: If the children were being sedated...
« Reply #171 on: December 11, 2024, 07:33:06 AM »
It wasn’t his only option to pick the exact moment the alarm was raised.  It wasn’t his only option to walk through the part of town most likely to be seen.  It wasn’t his only option to carry a corpse in his arms when he had a perfectly good blue sportsbag for the job.  But ok, if it was Gerry at that time (and the evidence that it was him is shaky at best) explain tne logical and plausible theory up to that point. When in the timeline did Madeleine die, who discovered her dead, which of the group also knew and when were they informed?  And how did the defrosted bodily fluids get in the back of the hire car?

She died some time on the 3rd of May. Either Kate, Gerry or both of them discovered her dead, particularly if they murdered her. I don't know who else knew if anyone & it wasn't defrosted Maddie juice in the hire car imo
Christian Brueckner Fan Club

Offline Wonderfulspam

Re: If the children were being sedated...
« Reply #172 on: December 11, 2024, 07:39:06 AM »

Where did Brueckner murder Maddie? How did he murder her? What did he do with her Body? Who else knew about the Murder? I mean, obviously, if we can't answer these questions then Brueckner must not have murdered her.
Christian Brueckner Fan Club

Offline The General

Re: If the children were being sedated...
« Reply #173 on: December 11, 2024, 07:51:40 AM »
Fck knows appears to be your only working theory and it’s not terribly impressive.  I think it’s unlikely that Madeleine died in the apartment on the evening of the 3rd May.  I think it must have happened earlier because I don’t think heavily sedated children get out of bed within an hour of being tucked up in bed, I don’t think it’s plausible that she fell off the sofa spraying blood everywhere or down the stairs to be discovered by one of thr Tapas group who then immediately hatched a plot round the dinner table, I don’t think Gerry’s dumb enough to carry her uncovered corpse through town at the same time the alarm is being raised so yeah, it’s got to have all happened earlier in the holiday.  Now, what do you think, or is it still fck knows?  You seem convinced she died in the apartment and are willing to speculate about sedation and double doses so surely your speculation goes beyond that point?  Come on, we need a really brilliant cast iron plausible, logical theory and so far there isn’t one but I feel with my brains and your beauty we can finally achieve this.
It's still fck knows. I'd at one point been inclined to believe HCW with his unequivocal fingering of CB, given his apparent certainty in his new evidence. But 4 years on, which is a record by the way, I've checked, he's actually further away from charging CB than ever. It's clear he has nothing, as his reliance on and his testing of his hobo testimony demonstrates. He needed those charges to stick so he could then use his hobos futher down the line.
So, to answer your question, there's even less evidence of an abduction now than ever, as HCW has blown part of his narrative / corroboration. It's a mortal blow.
Unless, of course, there's another strawman out there they can try to pin it on; what's the odds of another paedo-abductor waiting in the wings (I'm surprised they didn't bump into eachother outside 5a)

This leaves us with a fcking great vacuum, with the only remotely feasible explanation being the statistically most likely cause being parental involvement filling it.

As an aside, and I've discussed this at length with you misguided McCannerettes (did you swoon over Les McKeown and dress up in plaid too? Such an impressionale bunch), HCW has inadvertently introduced more reasonable doubt. Yes, the explicit language of 'reasonable doubt' may not actually be used, the principle is embedded in the inquisitorial system's safeguards to prevent wrongful convictions. Because HCW decided to turn the most recent trial in to a circus, resulting in the judge castigating him for broadcasting CB to the globe, any circumstantial evidence will be essentially soiled goods, the bar for burden of proof raised and FF may only need reach into his breast pocket and pull out the reasonable doubt card, perhaps even before it gets to trial, given the pre-screening legal system in Germany - they ain't gonna risk getting burned twice, not with the biggest trial the world has seen since Nuremberg.
Subject Matter Expert - Hobos.

Offline Vertigo Swirl

Re: If the children were being sedated...
« Reply #174 on: December 11, 2024, 07:58:16 AM »
Where did Brueckner murder Maddie? How did he murder her? What did he do with her Body? Who else knew about the Murder? I mean, obviously, if we can't answer these questions then Brueckner must not have murdered her.
If an abductor removed a child from an apartment and drove her away then he could plausibly and logically have murdered her and dumped her body in some remote spot in his own time whenever he fancied and no one need be any the wiser.  Obviously that couldn’t possibly have happened but whether you admit it or not the timeline for the McCanns ti murder and dispose of a body is very much tighter.  Obviously they did it, but I don’t think it was remotely realistic that it happened on the evening of the 3rd May.  It makes no sense.
"You can't reason with the unreasonable".

Offline Vertigo Swirl

Re: If the children were being sedated...
« Reply #175 on: December 11, 2024, 08:00:17 AM »
She died some time on the 3rd of May. Either Kate, Gerry or both of them discovered her dead, particularly if they murdered her. I don't know who else knew if anyone & it wasn't defrosted Maddie juice in the hire car imo
Whose defrosted bodily fluids were they then?  So are you saying the child was not sedated or that she was deliberately murdered with an od of sedatives?
"You can't reason with the unreasonable".

Offline Vertigo Swirl

Re: If the children were being sedated...
« Reply #176 on: December 11, 2024, 08:02:56 AM »
It's still fck knows. I'd at one point been inclined to believe HCW with his unequivocal fingering of CB, given his apparent certainty in his new evidence. But 4 years on, which is a record by the way, I've checked, he's actually further away from charging CB than ever. It's clear he has nothing, as his reliance on and his testing of his hobo testimony demonstrates. He needed those charges to stick so he could then use his hobos futher down the line.
So, to answer your question, there's even less evidence of an abduction now than ever, as HCW has blown part of his narrative / corroboration. It's a mortal blow.
Unless, of course, there's another strawman out there they can try to pin it on; what's the odds of another paedo-abductor waiting in the wings (I'm surprised they didn't bump into eachother outside 5a)

This leaves us with a fcking great vacuum, with the only remotely feasible explanation being the statistically most likely cause being parental involvement filling it.

As an aside, and I've discussed this at length with you misguided McCannerettes (did you swoon over Les McKeown and dress up in plaid too? Such an impressionale bunch), HCW has inadvertently introduced more reasonable doubt. Yes, the explicit language of 'reasonable doubt' may not actually be used, the principle is embedded in the inquisitorial system's safeguards to prevent wrongful convictions. Because HCW decided to turn the most recent trial in to a circus, resulting in the judge castigating him for broadcasting CB to the globe, any circumstantial evidence will be essentially soiled goods, the bar for burden of proof raised and FF may only need reach into his breast pocket and pull out the reasonable doubt card, perhaps even before it gets to trial, given the pre-screening legal system in Germany - they ain't gonna risk getting burned twice, not with the biggest trial the world has seen since Nuremberg.
I literally lost the will to live half way through that post but fyi Alan was my preferred BCR.  But of the stuff I did read your logic is absolutely whack imo humblest opinion.
« Last Edit: December 11, 2024, 08:11:24 AM by Alf »
"You can't reason with the unreasonable".

Offline The General

Re: If the children were being sedated...
« Reply #177 on: December 11, 2024, 08:12:36 AM »
Where did Brueckner murder Maddie? How did he murder her? What did he do with her Body? Who else knew about the Murder? I mean, obviously, if we can't answer these questions then Brueckner must not have murdered her.
His hobo mates seemed particularly devoid of detail, yet have various versions of CB's apparent previous activities off pat. You'd have thought CB would be equally boashut upl about his most infamous crime?
A solitary, poorly analysed, debunked circa 2007 (remember, the technology is actually 4 years older though) phone mast ping, places his phone somewhere between where he lived and Luz. No, it's apparent that he wasn't even there, unless he's Raffles the Friendly Paedo Ninja, creeping in and out unseen, leaving not a scintilla of his presence. Which is why we can't answer the why, where and who...there is no why, where or who.
« Last Edit: December 11, 2024, 08:59:15 AM by The General »
Subject Matter Expert - Hobos.

Offline The General

Re: If the children were being sedated...
« Reply #178 on: December 11, 2024, 08:15:04 AM »
Whose defrosted bodily fluids were they then?  So are you saying the child was not sedated or that she was deliberately murdered with an od of sedatives?
This is a great question, because they belonged to someone, right?
Subject Matter Expert - Hobos.

Offline jassi

Re: If the children were being sedated...
« Reply #179 on: December 11, 2024, 09:13:27 AM »
This is a great question, because they belonged to someone, right?

Is this the one where the DNA mix was too complex to be interpreted ?

Never heard of that as a flaw in DNA analysis prior to 2007
I believe everything. And l believe nothing.
I suspect everyone. And l suspect no one.
I gather the facts, examine the clues... and before   you know it, the case is solved!"

Or maybe not -

OG have been pushed out by the Germans who have reserved all the deck chairs for the foreseeable future