Author Topic: The search area west of Rua Primeiro de Maio.  (Read 5846 times)

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Offline pegasus

Re: The search area west of Rua Primeiro de Maio.
« Reply #15 on: August 05, 2014, 01:58:57 AM »
Perhaps the special scanning cameras in  the helicopters showed nothing of interest ... so why waste their time digging?
By using IR photography maybe they can detect recent ground disturbances on open ground, but not under trees. 

Here is the northern end of that plot. In background is block 4.

https://maps.google.co.uk/maps?q=8600+Praia+da+Luz,+Portugal&ll=37.087993,-8.732237&spn=0.001305,0.002468&hnear=Praia+da+Luz,+Portugal&t=m&z=19&layer=c&cbll=37.087908,-8.732194&panoid=JPty9ddW2pkbbk3iyzni_Q&cbp=12,48.63,,0,-5.87

Offline John

Re: The search area west of Rua Primeiro de Maio.
« Reply #16 on: August 05, 2014, 03:00:39 AM »
As Amaral found out when he attempted to bury the family pet dog that had been run over, the ground in Portugal is rock hard.  I don't see any would-be abductor going armed with a shovel.  If Madeleine was hidden anywhere t had to be in a ready made hole or a well.
A malicious prosecution for a crime which never existed. An exposé of egregious malfeasance by public officials.
Indeed, the truth never changes with the passage of time.

Offline sadie

Re: The search area west of Rua Primeiro de Maio.
« Reply #17 on: August 05, 2014, 05:53:12 AM »
As Amaral found out when he attempted to bury the family pet dog that had been run over, the ground in Portugal is rock hard.  I don't see any would-be abductor going armed with a shovel.  If Madeleine was hidden anywhere t had to be in a ready made hole or a well.

Good thinking.

That is probably why they honed in on that big hole in the hilly wasteland.    The big hole tht we saw 2 or 3 months ago to the SW of Oceann Club

ferryman

  • Guest
Re: The search area west of Rua Primeiro de Maio.
« Reply #18 on: August 05, 2014, 06:19:11 AM »
As Amaral found out when he attempted to bury the family pet dog that had been run over, the ground in Portugal is rock hard.  I don't see any would-be abductor going armed with a shovel.  If Madeleine was hidden anywhere t had to be in a ready made hole or a well.

My "sympathy" with that (non) "argument" is precisely zero!

Amaral simply plagiarised the proper detective-work of Mark Harrison in digging holes in various places in PdL and ruling out burial in coming up with a half-cocked "!thesis" of his own that Gerry hid (Amaral's operative word!) Madeleine's body on the beach.

If you read Harrison's report carefully, you'll find he noted an area of free-standing rocks where he says that it would be possible (sic) to secrete the body of a small child.

But at no point did Harrison say that anything of the kind had happened to Madeleine, done by Gerry or anyone else.

Amaral's (perfectly disgraceful) "thesis" is contained in his El Mundo interview.

When will people wake up to what a pack of outright lies and distortions Amaral has told, both in his book and in interviews? 

Sub Surface Burial on P D Luz Beach

For Body Disposal Purposes The Beach Can Be Separated And
Discussed Into 6 Areas.

Figure 2.The boulders in the rock falls are too large
to man handle. Vegetative growth suggests rock
falls have been in situ for some time. The low energy
wave action would not move any of the boulders. It
is possible a small child could be secreted amongst
the rocks in natural voids.


Figure 3.The cliff edge at the base of the beach is at
an angle that inhibits soil removal. The shale re fills
any hole dug and is unsuitable to achieve a burial.

Figure4.At the base of the cliff are wave cuts where
the bedrock has been eroded by wave action. Here
sand can be easily dug but after a few centimetres
the digger reaches the bed rock, preventing a
successful burial.

Figure 5.The beach cusps or berms are mounds of
sand made by wind action. These cusps form at the
limit of the tides reach and would only be recovered
in storm conditions. Digging on the cusps is easy but to achieve as
more than a few centimetres depth is very difficult to
the fine sand granules refill the hole


Figure 6.The dark sand in this image shows the
intertidal area. Here digging and burial could
possibly be achieved although it would be through a
mixture of grave1 and water. However any burial
would be quickly exposed by wave action and
ultimately taken into the sea.


At one point, Harrison makes reference to occultation of a body, giving rise to fevered speculation in certain quarters that Madeleine's disappearance had something to do with the 'occult'.

Of course occultation simply means hiding ...
« Last Edit: August 05, 2014, 06:49:04 AM by ferryman »

Offline bros

Re: The search area west of Rua Primeiro de Maio.
« Reply #19 on: August 05, 2014, 09:10:55 AM »
My five cents here.


I believe SJ and JP were not exclusively looking for "remains" while doing ground " swipe" this is just my opinion going into 2 nd month of reading available materials  and every lead I can find on internet.

ferryman

  • Guest
Re: The search area west of Rua Primeiro de Maio.
« Reply #20 on: August 05, 2014, 09:14:25 AM »
My five cents here.


I believe SJ and JP were not exclusively looking for "remains" while doing ground " swipe" this is just my opinion going into 2 nd month of reading available materials  and every lead I can find on internet.

Do you mean SY (Scotland Yard), Bros?

Offline bros

Re: The search area west of Rua Primeiro de Maio.
« Reply #21 on: August 05, 2014, 01:01:45 PM »
Correct. Scotland Yard. My mistake,txns.

Offline Wonderfulspam

Re: The search area west of Rua Primeiro de Maio.
« Reply #22 on: August 05, 2014, 01:15:12 PM »
My five cents here.


I believe SJ and JP were not exclusively looking for "remains" while doing ground " swipe" this is just my opinion going into 2 nd month of reading available materials  and every lead I can find on internet.

They were looking for that secret underground bunker she's being held captive in, IMO.
Christian Brueckner Fan Club

Offline Eleanor

Re: The search area west of Rua Primeiro de Maio.
« Reply #23 on: August 05, 2014, 03:21:18 PM »
They were looking for that secret underground bunker she's being held captive in, IMO.

You could be right.  They might be surreptitiously flying over other places on their way to what might not be their objective.
« Last Edit: August 21, 2014, 05:24:48 PM by Mr Moderator »

Offline pegasus

Re: The search area west of Rua Primeiro de Maio.
« Reply #24 on: August 18, 2014, 01:20:46 AM »
http://www.justpamalam.co.uk/hg/PA310172_550.jpg
A good photo of inside the tree-covered northeast end of this plot.
Photo is I believe taken from just over the road from block 4, with camera pointing southwest.
Note the excellent concealment from view by trees.
Back in 2007 this area was further concealed by a panel fence.
Photo is by Heri.
« Last Edit: August 18, 2014, 01:28:22 AM by pegasus »

Offline sadie

Re: The search area west of Rua Primeiro de Maio.
« Reply #25 on: August 18, 2014, 10:49:16 AM »
http://www.justpamalam.co.uk/hg/PA310172_550.jpg
A good photo of inside the tree-covered northeast end of this plot.
Photo is I believe taken from just over the road from block 4, with camera pointing southwest.
Note the excellent concealment from view by trees.
Back in 2007 this area was further concealed by a panel fence.
Photo is by Heri.

I think you are right, Pegasus. 
To the rear left appears to be the Luztor building, where one of the arguidos was on the balcony IIRC.
To the rear right appears to be the staff quarters building

It appears, this photo covers the whole length of the waste land, from North to south, a distance of some 200+ yards or 190 metres.   As can be seen the view is very much foreshortened.   The wooded area was almost exclusively at this northern end, but I understand it is being developed now, so the whole area might have changed.

By shortest walking route, this closest area of the waste land is just about 140 metres from 5A

Offline pathfinder73

Re: The search area west of Rua Primeiro de Maio.
« Reply #26 on: August 18, 2014, 12:49:28 PM »
It would only take a few minutes to walk to the wasteland and back. Anyone could manage that on a check and keep their alibi. But when is the best time to do it without the missing child being seen? 1. when everyone is present at the table. 2. in the dark - less people/witnesses about and harder to positively identify. 3. child concealed in wardrobe bag?
Smithman carrying a child in his arms checked his watch after passing the Smith family and the time was 10:03. Both are still unidentified 10 years later.

Offline sadie

Re: The search area west of Rua Primeiro de Maio.
« Reply #27 on: August 18, 2014, 12:56:37 PM »
It would only take a few minutes to walk to the wasteland and back. Anyone could manage that on a check and keep their alibi. But when is the best time to do it without the missing child being seen? 1. when everyone is present at the table. 2. in the dark - less people/witnesses about and harder to positively identify. 3. child concealed in wardrobe bag?
What an imagination you have, PFinder !

But you are correct.  It wouldn't take long !


Offline pegasus

Re: The search area west of Rua Primeiro de Maio.
« Reply #28 on: August 18, 2014, 10:13:20 PM »
I think you are right, Pegasus. 
To the rear left appears to be the Luztor building, where one of the arguidos was on the balcony IIRC.
To the rear right appears to be the staff quarters building

It appears, this photo covers the whole length of the waste land, from North to south, a distance of some 200+ yards or 190 metres.   As can be seen the view is very much foreshortened.   The wooded area was almost exclusively at this northern end, but I understand it is being developed now, so the whole area might have changed.

By shortest walking route, this closest area of the waste land is just about 140 metres from 5A
Yes the tree cover is at north (near in photo) end.
A small part of Luztur is barely visible on the left.
Buildings in centre are on south side of Rua Joaquim Teixeira.
And Edificio Pedras Brancas, or Staff Quarters as you call it, white and blue (as in an employee statement) on the right.
« Last Edit: August 21, 2014, 05:26:35 PM by Mr Moderator »