Amaral and the dogs

[Alfred R Jones]

Good find by Alfred.

Sadly there are occasions when the dogs fail to find remains despite what must have been their best effort.  It took the determination of her friend to keep the search going before Susan McLean's body was found.

Perhaps like, Mr Amaral the police were giving too much trust to the dog alerts. 
In the case of Portugal the alerts ... in the case of Scotland the lack of them.




Retired US officer travels to Scotland to find her pal's body and slams police failure to find missing tourist
06:00, 19 AUGUST 2015
BY JAMES MONCUR

A RETIRED US army colonel who travelled to Scotland in search of her missing friend has attacked police’s failure to find the woman’s body.

Lorna VanderZanden and a team of volunteers uncovered the remains of Susan McLean at the weekend.

Susan, 61, from Pennsylvania, was on holiday with husband Donald when she disappeared from a hotel in Aberfeldy, Perthshire, three months ago.

And Lorna is furious police were unable to find her in that time, despite using specialist teams including dog handlers and divers.

She said they had passed within feet of the body at one point as they searched the Loch Hoil trail – but chose not to enter the heavily wooded area.

Lorna, 61, said yesterday: “I am totally astonished I could come here and find Susan in four weeks with eight volunteers on two Saturdays when Police Scotland could not find her in three months.

“I was told repeatedly that police and cadaver dogs had searched the entire area from Moness to Gatehouse Nursery to Loch Hoil trail to the Birks of Aberfeldy.

“We found her a couple of hundred yards north of Loch Hoil trail, 25ft from the edge of a section of forest. How could police and cadaver dogs miss her when she was so close to the secondary trail just north of Loch Hoil trail?”

Lorna added that she can’t imagine life without her friend.

She said: “I’ve known her for 27 years and she was closer than a sister. I just couldn’t stay in the U.S and not know what happened.”

Donald added: “I miss Susan every day, especially when I care for our horses or water her flowers. My life and those of my sons and friends are changed forever.”

The criticism of the search for Susan comes just weeks after police bungled the handling of a call to a car crash, leaving tragic Lamara Bell lying in a wrecked car next to her dead boyfriend for three days. She later died in hospital.

Police yesterday confirmed the body was that of Susan.

Superintendent Graeme Murdoch said: “It is my critical assessment, even with hindsight, that our search strategy was sound although it is always frustrating that extensive searches do not yield an early positive outcome.

“Now that remains have been found, I sincerely hope that this will allow some measure of closure for the family and friends.”
http://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/news/scottish-news/retired-officer-travels-scotland-find-6277011

One mustn't criticise the Scottish police though as that would be xenophobic.  And as for the dogs, I expect the body was wrapped in waxy paper or something. 
On a serious note, how awful for all involved, in particular the poor woman who found her friend's body after 3 months. 

[Mr Gray]

The most interesting thing to come out of this recent discussion is that we have learned that the alerts are from the clear cut actions we had been led to believe. it is hardly surprising that we are told by those leading the search that Maddie may still be alive

[mercury]

Yes, I know, but it hasn't been established which decomposing body fluids from a living person Eddie may have been trained to ignore aside from blood.

There's simply no definitive answer to that either way, as no one seems to have asked Grime. Unless anyone finds a case in which Grime has testified in court that Eddie would not react to decomposing urine, semen, vaginal fluids, sputum, nasal secretions, etc., then I don't see why it should be assumed that alerts to such substances are unlikely.

Perhaps this helps

Two relevant parts from the rogatory interview:-

‘The dog EVRD also alerts to blood from a live human being or only from a cadaver’
The dog EVRD is trained using whole and disintegrated material, blood, bone tissue, teeth, etc. and decomposed cross-contaminants. The dog will recognize all or parts of a human cadaver. He is not trained for ‘live’ human odours; no trained dog will recognize the smell of ‘fresh blood’. They find, however, and give the alert for dried blood from a live human being.

EVRD used to be trained using swine (pigs) as their odour is the closest to that of humans. But most of the time, however, the dog was trained using the odour of a human cadaver. Operationally, the dog has ignored large amounts of animal remains/bones when locating human decomposition.

http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/MARTIN_GRIMES_RIGATORY.htm

Parts of a body that have detached,left the body, for wont of better words, from a live human are not the same to the dog as those from a dead human. I think this is what maybe causes alot of confusion.

[stephen25000]

The most interesting thing to come out of this recent discussion is that we have learned that the alerts are from the clear cut actions we had been led to believe. it is hardly surprising that we are told by those leading the search that Maddie may still be alive

Alive ???

Yet there has not been one trace of her since she disappeared.

Unless you believe in fantasies as some clearly do.

[Mr Gray]

Alive ???

Yet there has not been one trace of her since she disappeared.

Unless you believe in fantasies as some clearly do.

Maddie may still be alive..... Fact not fantasy

[ShiningInLuz]

...

Perhaps like, Mr Amaral the police were giving too much trust to the dog alerts. 
In the case of Portugal the alerts ... in the case of Scotland the lack of them.

...

I think this has hit the nail on the head re Amaral and the dogs.

The question I am chewing over is - did Amaral buy into this - or - were the super-successful dogs thrust upon him?

[Mr Gray]

I think this has hit the nail on the head re Amaral and the dogs.

The question I am chewing over is - did Amaral buy into this - or - were the super-successful dogs thrust upon him?

so who thrust it on him...even so he has had ample time to correct himself and the lies he has told....Did anyone really tell amaral the dogs were responsible for 200 criminal convictions

[Lyall]

I think this has hit the nail on the head re Amaral and the dogs.

The question I am chewing over is - did Amaral buy into this - or - were the super-successful dogs thrust upon him?

They had no other clues, and so any police in the world in a comparable situation would have done the same.

(They still have no other clues.)

[Mr Gray]

They had no other clues, and so any police in the world in a comparable situation would have done the same.

(They still have no other clues.)

absolute rubbish....amaral made up evidence...and drew his own made up conclusions that did not follow the evidence

[ferryman]

absolute rubbish....amaral made up evidence...and drew his own made up conclusions that did not follow the evidence

In fact, directly contradicted the evidence.

Harrison never switched the enquiry to one for a child assumed dead, and certainly never said that her concealed remains were somewhere in close proximity to PdL ....

[stephen25000]

Worldwide publicity and not one sign of Madeleine.

It is quite remarkable when the truth is deleted on this forum.  &%+((£

[Lyall]

absolute rubbish....amaral made up evidence...and drew his own made up conclusions that did not follow the evidence

No police anywhere in the world could have or would have ignored those alerts. Fact, davel.

[stephen25000]

No police anywhere in the world could have or would have ignored those alerts. Fact, davel.

Precisely.

[Mr Gray]

No police anywhere in the world could have or would have ignored those alerts. Fact, davel.

what facts

[ferryman]

After a week of intense work, Harrison presents the results of his study to my coordinating group. Even if we were expecting it, his conclusions confirm our worst fears. The most plausible scenario is the following: there is no doubt that Madeleine is dead, and her body is hidden somewhere in the area around Praia da Luz. He praises the quality of the work carried out by the Portuguese authorities in trying to find the little girl alive. According to him, the time has come to redirect the searches in order to find, this time, a body hidden in the surrounding area.

Goncalo Amaral, Truth of the Lie, the chapter The Arrival of the Experts

Against stiff competition, that, by my reckoning, is the most libellous passage in Amaral's book.