Author Topic: Wandering Off Topic  (Read 2268032 times)

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Offline ShiningInLuz

Re: Wandering Off Topic
« Reply #5910 on: July 25, 2019, 11:18:57 AM »
I recall my last trip to Portugal we stayed in Vilamoura just chilling but did some nice coastal walks on the cliffs and booked a trip to St Vincent's but missed the *coach  8)><(  For some reason I really wanted to visit that place.  I think I had a fascination with it as its the most southwesternmost point of mainland Europe.  Is it worth a trip?

= a sad tourist on a coach trip  8(8-))

St Vincent is the Anglican name used for the Catholic church of Nossa Senhora da Luz, in Luz.

I don't know where yours is, sorry.

I believe the southern-most part of Portugal would be Sagres, famous for beer and the sailing academy of Prince Henry The Navigator. 
What's up, old man?

Offline ShiningInLuz

Re: Wandering Off Topic
« Reply #5911 on: July 25, 2019, 12:04:56 PM »
OK, in direct reply to misty, so that I am down to 14 items in my backlog, here we go.

A gun that appears to mismatch to the weapon used by Grilo.

DNA on (or in) the gun barrel.

The defence claiming contamination of evidence.  Presumably claiming that because it is the boyfriend's DNA on the gun.  If the gun did not fire the death bullet, why care?  If it turns out this gun was owned by the boyfriend and it's Grilo's DNA on the gun, things get tasty, even if this was not the murder weapon.

The Grilo case interests me for 2 main reasons linked to the Madeleine case.  Body occultation and decomposition.  And the amount of information emerging into the public domain during an active investigation.

NB.  This story has evolved rapidly in the media since it first emerged.  From memory, it started with disappeared triathlete.  Then to his body found.  I was puzzled by why his bike had not been found.  Later, his wife claimed she had tossed it over the side of a river bridge.  I still don't know if the bike has been retrieved.
What's up, old man?

Offline jassi

Re: Wandering Off Topic
« Reply #5912 on: July 25, 2019, 01:37:59 PM »
In light of a post on another thread, it might be useful to discuss what is acceptable as a cite and who should make that decision.

Most cites come from on line media sources of one sort or another so should be equally acceptable on the forum

My view is that if a quoted cite supports the view being expressed by the poster, then that is acceptable. unless it is merely an opinion piece from another blog or forum.

What are posters' views ?
I believe everything. And l believe nothing.
I suspect everyone. And l suspect no one.
I gather the facts, examine the clues... and before   you know it, the case is solved!"

Or maybe not -

OG have been pushed out by the Germans who have reserved all the deck chairs for the foreseeable future

Offline Vertigo Swirl

Re: Wandering Off Topic
« Reply #5913 on: July 25, 2019, 03:03:56 PM »
In light of a post on another thread, it might be useful to discuss what is acceptable as a cite and who should make that decision.

Most cites come from on line media sources of one sort or another so should be equally acceptable on the forum

My view is that if a quoted cite supports the view being expressed by the poster, then that is acceptable. unless it is merely an opinion piece from another blog or forum.

What are posters' views ?
providing cites is a waste of time if people are allowed to claim that the cite proves nothing when it clearly does, imo.
"You can't reason with the unreasonable".

Offline Holly Goodhead

Re: Wandering Off Topic
« Reply #5914 on: July 25, 2019, 03:21:25 PM »
St Vincent is the Anglican name used for the Catholic church of Nossa Senhora da Luz, in Luz.

I don't know where yours is, sorry.

I believe the southern-most part of Portugal would be Sagres, famous for beer and the sailing academy of Prince Henry The Navigator.

I don't believe in deities although happy to wander around churches/cathedrals appreciating the architecture.

Is the Sagres brewery still in existence?
Just my opinion of course but Jeremy Bamber is innocent and a couple from UK, unknown to T9, abducted Madeleine McCann - motive unknown.  Was J J murdered as a result of identifying as a goth?

Offline misty

Re: Wandering Off Topic
« Reply #5915 on: July 25, 2019, 05:07:41 PM »
St Vincent is the Anglican name used for the Catholic church of Nossa Senhora da Luz, in Luz.

I don't know where yours is, sorry.

I believe the southern-most part of Portugal would be Sagres, famous for beer and the sailing academy of Prince Henry The Navigator.

Cape St. Vincent is the Portuguese equivalent of Lands End in UK. I seem to recall Nick van der Leek mentioned it in one of his Madeleine case books, due to the legendary ravens (guarding the grave of Deacon St. Vincent) which Nick used as a metaphor for doubt.

Offline sadie

Re: Wandering Off Topic
« Reply #5916 on: July 25, 2019, 05:47:18 PM »
Are you sure they didn't do a wrist version, in tasteful yellow and green ?   8(0(*

What a lovely tasteful person you are  8)-)))

Offline sadie

Re: Wandering Off Topic
« Reply #5917 on: July 25, 2019, 06:12:24 PM »
I recall my last trip to Portugal we stayed in Vilamoura just chilling but did some nice coastal walks on the cliffs and booked a trip to St Vincent's but missed the *coach  8)><(  For some reason I really wanted to visit that place.  I think I had a fascination with it as its the most southwesternmost point of mainland Europe.  Is it worth a trip?

= a sad tourist on a coach trip  8(8-))

When we were there I was struck by long and very high cliffs, a kind of barren landscape and a mighty fort

it was many years ago, but somehow we were made aware of some of the History.  They were, rightly so, very proud of their adventuring and brave sea farers.  They discovered all sorts of places around the world and brought immense wealth to Portugal. 



Offline ShiningInLuz

Re: Wandering Off Topic
« Reply #5918 on: July 25, 2019, 07:51:51 PM »
I don't believe in deities although happy to wander around churches/cathedrals appreciating the architecture.

Is the Sagres brewery still in existence?

Nossa Senhora da Luz is quite small.  I've never been inside it, only seen the photos.  It features in the alleged tale of people seen sneaking in at night to secrete MBM in the coffin of a woman lying in rest before cremation, which I rate as cobblers.  It also features in whether it connects by underground passages to the sea, another rumour I'm dismissive of.

Sagres beer is one of the main brands of beer in Portugal. It's not to my taste, so I've never bothered to locate the brewery.
What's up, old man?

Offline ShiningInLuz

Re: Wandering Off Topic
« Reply #5919 on: July 25, 2019, 08:02:02 PM »
Cape St. Vincent is the Portuguese equivalent of Lands End in UK. I seem to recall Nick van der Leek mentioned it in one of his Madeleine case books, due to the legendary ravens (guarding the grave of Deacon St. Vincent) which Nick used as a metaphor for doubt.

OK, I've looked it up now. It's on the SW, some distance from Sagres.  I've never visited that.  I note Google maps advertises a fork and knife named 'the last sausage before America'.

 (&^&
What's up, old man?

Offline misty

Re: Wandering Off Topic
« Reply #5920 on: July 25, 2019, 10:18:28 PM »
In light of a post on another thread, it might be useful to discuss what is acceptable as a cite and who should make that decision.

Most cites come from on line media sources of one sort or another so should be equally acceptable on the forum

My view is that if a quoted cite supports the view being expressed by the poster, then that is acceptable. unless it is merely an opinion piece from another blog or forum.

What are posters' views ?

Sounds good to me (especially the "not suspects" quote) as long as counter-argument is accepted in the same way.

Offline misty

Re: Wandering Off Topic
« Reply #5921 on: July 25, 2019, 11:56:24 PM »
https://www.portugalresident.com/2019/07/25/shock-and-disbelief-after-portuguese-justice-frees-israeli-sex-trafficking-kingpin/

By Natasha Donn  2019-07-25 Posted  2019-07-25  InTop Stories 

Shock and disbelief after Portuguese justice frees Israeli ‘sex trafficking kingpin’

Authorities hunting a former Israeli soldier wanted for sex trafficking minors in Colombia heard with a mixture of shock and disbelief that a Portuguese judge has freed him.

National and international media were full of the arrest of Assi Moosh in Oeiras two months ago (click here).

Dubbing him “the baron of sex tourism” and “the devil of Taganga” (after the Colombian village where young women and minors were sexually exploited), the stories explained how authorities of various countries had been hunting Moosh down, with the purposes of getting him extradited to Colombia to face charges, including drug trafficking and money-laundering.

There was even talk of Moosh, 46, being involved in a possible homicide.

Focus on the holiday island of Ibiza led authorities to Barcelona, and later to Portugal.

Then, the ‘grand announcement’ that he had been ‘caught’ in an operation involving Spanish and Portuguese police, and would be held in preventive custody pending extradition to Colombia.

And then it all went quiet.

Now, both Israeli and Colombian sources have heard Moosh was released from custody on June 28 and “could be anywhere”.

“It’s completely crazy”, an Israeli journalist who has been tracking Moosh for years told us.
“None of us can understand it”.

Requests by the Resident for information – from the Public Ministry and PJ – elicited no response, but a news story in Colombian newspaper El Tiempo claims Moosh was freed by Lisbon judge María Guillhermina Vaz Pereira Santos, on the basis that legal time limits for his detention had expired, that the case was ‘complicated’ because Moosh claimed to understand no Spanish, and that Portugal anyway has no extradition agreement with Colombia.

Citing a Colombian official, El Tiempo said authorities in that country will now be trying, through Interpol, to secure another Blue Notice for Moosh’s recapture.

He is still wanted in Colombia for a multitude of offences, not least the “possible disappearance of one of his partners”.

El Tiempo adds that Moosh insists he is innocent, and that everything the media has said about him is false.
But this is not the only instance recently where an apparent wanted felon has been suddenly released after high-profile capture.

Back in March, newspapers here were full of the arrest in Malaga, Spain, of “the largest drug trafficker in Portugal”.

Frankelim Lobo was wanted in connection with Operation Achilles – an investigation that had been ongoing for years into a network of drug trafficking which has also implicated high-ranking policemen (click here).

But judge Ana Peres has now freed him from preventive custody, accepting that prosecutors’ arguments that he had ‘fled Portuguese justice’ were not in fact true. Lobo had apparently notified authorities “after leaving jail in 2014” that he would be moving permanently to Malaga.

Lobo is now bound to periodic reporting into his local police station – and the charge of criminal association has been dropped.

Say reports, the decision has dealt a major blow to the whole Achilles case, bearing in mind it is already being tried in the courts, and prosecutors’ case implicated Lobo as having a “principal role” within it.

Coincidentally perhaps, Achilles has a strong Colombian connection.

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------

See https://www.portugalresident.com/2016/04/14/operation-achilles-sees-pj-top-brass-behind-bars/  for a few more details about Operation Achilles.

Offline sadie

Re: Wandering Off Topic
« Reply #5922 on: July 26, 2019, 01:41:01 AM »
https://www.portugalresident.com/2019/07/25/shock-and-disbelief-after-portuguese-justice-frees-israeli-sex-trafficking-kingpin/

By Natasha Donn  2019-07-25 Posted  2019-07-25  InTop Stories 

Shock and disbelief after Portuguese justice frees Israeli ‘sex trafficking kingpin’

Authorities hunting a former Israeli soldier wanted for sex trafficking minors in Colombia heard with a mixture of shock and disbelief that a Portuguese judge has freed him.

National and international media were full of the arrest of Assi Moosh in Oeiras two months ago (click here).

Dubbing him “the baron of sex tourism” and “the devil of Taganga” (after the Colombian village where young women and minors were sexually exploited), the stories explained how authorities of various countries had been hunting Moosh down, with the purposes of getting him extradited to Colombia to face charges, including drug trafficking and money-laundering.

There was even talk of Moosh, 46, being involved in a possible homicide.

Focus on the holiday island of Ibiza led authorities to Barcelona, and later to Portugal.

Then, the ‘grand announcement’ that he had been ‘caught’ in an operation involving Spanish and Portuguese police, and would be held in preventive custody pending extradition to Colombia.

And then it all went quiet.

Now, both Israeli and Colombian sources have heard Moosh was released from custody on June 28 and “could be anywhere”.

“It’s completely crazy”, an Israeli journalist who has been tracking Moosh for years told us.
“None of us can understand it”.

Requests by the Resident for information – from the Public Ministry and PJ – elicited no response, but a news story in Colombian newspaper El Tiempo claims Moosh was freed by Lisbon judge María Guillhermina Vaz Pereira Santos, on the basis that legal time limits for his detention had expired, that the case was ‘complicated’ because Moosh claimed to understand no Spanish, and that Portugal anyway has no extradition agreement with Colombia.

Citing a Colombian official, El Tiempo said authorities in that country will now be trying, through Interpol, to secure another Blue Notice for Moosh’s recapture.

He is still wanted in Colombia for a multitude of offences, not least the “possible disappearance of one of his partners”.

El Tiempo adds that Moosh insists he is innocent, and that everything the media has said about him is false.
But this is not the only instance recently where an apparent wanted felon has been suddenly released after high-profile capture.

Back in March, newspapers here were full of the arrest in Malaga, Spain, of “the largest drug trafficker in Portugal”.

Frankelim Lobo was wanted in connection with Operation Achilles – an investigation that had been ongoing for years into a network of drug trafficking which has also implicated high-ranking policemen (click here).

But judge Ana Peres has now freed him from preventive custody, accepting that prosecutors’ arguments that he had ‘fled Portuguese justice’ were not in fact true. Lobo had apparently notified authorities “after leaving jail in 2014” that he would be moving permanently to Malaga.

Lobo is now bound to periodic reporting into his local police station – and the charge of criminal association has been dropped.

Say reports, the decision has dealt a major blow to the whole Achilles case, bearing in mind it is already being tried in the courts, and prosecutors’ case implicated Lobo as having a “principal role” within it.

Coincidentally perhaps, Achilles has a strong Colombian connection.

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------

See https://www.portugalresident.com/2016/04/14/operation-achilles-sees-pj-top-brass-behind-bars/  for a few more details about Operation Achilles.

Neither of your ' click heres'  opens up misty and neither does the website in blue.  Did they originally?


What interesting names the first Judge has.   María Guillhermina Vaz Pereira Santos



So much for Justice in Portugal

Offline misty

Re: Wandering Off Topic
« Reply #5923 on: July 26, 2019, 02:08:29 AM »
Neither of your ' click heres'  opens up misty and neither does the website in blue.  Did they originally?


What interesting names the first Judge has.   María Guillhermina Vaz Pereira Santos



So much for Justice in Portugal

For the "click here" links you have to go to the main news article url at top of post.
Blue link opens OK for me.
The judge is the Vice President of the Appeal Court.

Offline sadie

Re: Wandering Off Topic
« Reply #5924 on: July 26, 2019, 12:00:58 PM »
For the "click here" links you have to go to the main news article url at top of post.
Blue link opens OK for me.
The judge is the Vice President of the Appeal Court.

What an interesting name she has


 María Guillhermina Vaz Pereira Santos


And she is the Vice President of the Appeal Court.   Would that be the national Vice President ... or just a regional Appeal Court ?