Wandering Off Topic

[Wonderfulspam]

So you hide your child?s body in a bin and signal to the world that?s what you?ve done by looking in bins and telling people you think she might have been put in a bin.  Yes, that makes sense.

How would anyone ever know?

[jassi]

"As soon as it was light Gerry and I resumed our search. We went up and down roads we?d never seen before, having barely left the Ocean Club complex all week. We jumped over walls and raked through undergrowth. We looked in ditches and holes. All was quiet apart from the sound of barking dogs, which added to the eeriness of the atmosphere. I remember opening a big dumpster-type bin and saying to myself, please God, don?t let her be in here. The most striking and horrific thing about all this was that we were completely alone. Nobody else, it seemed, was out looking for Madeleine. Just us, her parents. We must have been out for at least an hour before returning to David and Fiona?s apartment."

[/b]

Gosh, they spent a WHOLE hour searching.  What comittment  they had.

[Joe Blogs]

The bin theory was invented to explain how Gerry could dispose of a body quickly without it ever being discovered.  There is never any attempt to suggest precisely where this bin was or why Gerry would choose the most visible, illuminated and likely to be populated with diners and drinkers part of town instead of heading away from town to find a quieter place with a bin. 

Also, I?ve no idea either why Gerry would risk moving the body twice - why not simply leave it on the wasteland he allegedly dumped it on first?  What difference would a few hundred metres make as to whether or not he dunnit?  He didn?t know at the time that putting the body in a bin would be the most successful means of body disposal he could think of.  In fact Faithlilly?s theory is that he put the body in the bin because he wanted it to be found so that they could get the body back for a decent Christian funeral!  I mean it?s all nuts really.  He should have tossed it over Robert Murat?s wall - then Murat would be in prison right now, the McCanns would have got their body back, and we wouldn?t be having daft conversations about the case 18 years later.

The point I was making was if Maddies body was found and time of death was confirmed this would have to correspond with the McCanns version of events, Vertigo.
I mean, to exagerate, you couldn't have the McCanns report the body going missing a few hours ago and if then found have the pathologist confirm that Maddie had actually died a few days ago! see what i'm getting at?
If Maddies body was found in a bin the next morning then time of death would have needed to correspond with the McCanns version of when she went missing, yes?
I mean the McCanns were doctors and were well aware that time of death would immediately be established if Maddie was found, so if Faiths theory is correct, that would point to Maddie dying on the day she was reported missing, else if she had died the day before this would be picked up at the autopsy and the McCanns would have been exposed as the culprits!

[Lace]

Recalling the night that the three-year-old, whom she described as ?a real cutie and a real sweetheart? disappeared, the former nanny said she was alerted to a disturbance at the resort and arrived at the apartment to find Kate McCann weeping.
She said: ?She was crying but almost in a catatonic state and Gerry was very distressed. That?s the one thing I really remember from him, looking under the cars. I can?t forget that.?
The young woman joined the search for the missing toddler, recalling: ?We were told to start looking in bins in case her body was in there. It was at that point we realised this was serious.?

[Vertigo Swirl]

Recalling the night that the three-year-old, whom she described as ?a real cutie and a real sweetheart? disappeared, the former nanny said she was alerted to a disturbance at the resort and arrived at the apartment to find Kate McCann weeping.
She said: ?She was crying but almost in a catatonic state and Gerry was very distressed. That?s the one thing I really remember from him, looking under the cars. I can?t forget that.?
The young woman joined the search for the missing toddler, recalling: ?We were told to start looking in bins in case her body was in there. It was at that point we realised this was serious.?

Good find.  My, they were brazen those McCanns, telling people to look where they'd just dumped the body!

[Vertigo Swirl]

The point I was making was if Maddies body was found and time of death was confirmed this would have to correspond with the McCanns version of events, Vertigo.
I mean, to exagerate, you couldn't have the McCanns report the body going missing a few hours ago and if then found have the pathologist confirm that Maddie had actually died a few days ago! see what i'm getting at?
If Maddies body was found in a bin the next morning then time of death would have needed to correspond with the McCanns version of when she went missing, yes?
I mean the McCanns were doctors and were well aware that time of death would immediately be established if Maddie was found, so if Faiths theory is correct, that would point to Maddie dying on the day she was reported missing, else if she had died the day before this would be picked up at the autopsy and the McCanns would have been exposed as the culprits!

Yes I understood what you were driving at but the idea that Madeleine died day(s) before 3rd May is too barmy to give any credence to I'm afraid.

[kizzy]

The Smiths did not see the child?s face at all so would not have been put off by that photograph.  Smith even said he thought the child might have been Madeleine the very next day but still waited 22 days to go to the police.

he thought the child might have been Madeleine the very next day but still waited 22 days to go to the police.

Yes and so did his son peter who found out at the airport from another passenger. His first thought was Maddie.

Being the girl carried.....seems to me it struck a cord as something not being right in what they saw

Why you try to discredit MS when he acted in good faith an honest working man with no axe to grind by coming forward.

Who obviously didn't just jump in feet first...gave it a lot of thought of what he saw.

Also obvious it was not something he did lightly - it took courage - but he knew he was telling the truth.

Willing to stand by what he saw...and believing the girl was Maddie.

[kizzy]

Rare trousers?  Can you shed more light on the rarity value of these trousers?  I?ve already mentioned that both myself and my ex had trousers like this when we went on early family holidays together which you could roll up with tabs that you secured to buttons on the side.  I think we got them in Tesco??s (yes we were a very stylish couple).

Rare trousers?  Can you shed more light on the rarity value of these trousers?

Maybe I should have said designer......certainly not the ones your talking about from the supermarkets.

I know exactly what your talking about my daughter got some when she was 12 that was in 2012 from asda.

I know the year as it was a specific holiday.

They were not around in 2007 ...more to the point they were wide legged so you could roll them up.

They were also crop legged to make them into -  knee length  or shorts.

Not classic cut like Martin Smith described..

Seems gmc didn't need the roll ups -  he already had them with no tabs or button in sight.

https://www.facebook.com/photo/?fbid=8612250715475490&set=pcb.2965873896902413

[kizzy]

Recalling the night that the three-year-old, whom she described as ?a real cutie and a real sweetheart? disappeared, the former nanny said she was alerted to a disturbance at the resort and arrived at the apartment to find Kate McCann weeping.
She said: ?She was crying but almost in a catatonic state and Gerry was very distressed. That?s the one thing I really remember from him, looking under the cars. I can?t forget that.?
The young woman joined the search for the missing toddler, recalling: ?We were told to start looking in bins in case her body was in there. It was at that point we realised this was serious.?

We were told to start looking in bins in case her body was in there.

Were the bins empty by then......wasn't it the mccs who looked first -  seems to make sure they were empty.

Why on earth would an abductor go to all that trouble to take her -  then throw Maddie straight into a bin.

[Vertigo Swirl]

he thought the child might have been Madeleine the very next day but still waited 22 days to go to the police.

Yes and so did his son peter who found out at the airport from another passenger. His first thought was Maddie.

Being the girl carried.....seems to me it struck a cord as something not being right in what they saw

Why you try to discredit MS when he acted in good faith an honest working man with no axe to grind by coming forward.

Who obviously didn't just jump in feet first...gave it a lot of thought of what he saw.

Also obvious it was not something he did lightly - it took courage - but he knew he was telling the truth.

Willing to stand by what he saw...and believing the girl was Maddie.

Would you spend three weeks thinking about a possible kidnapping that you saw taking place before going to the police?  Do you think that would be the honourable thing to do? 

[Vertigo Swirl]

Rare trousers?  Can you shed more light on the rarity value of these trousers?

Maybe I should have said designer......certainly not the ones your talking about from the supermarkets.

I know exactly what your talking about my daughter got some when she was 12 that was in 2012 from asda.

I know the year as it was a specific holiday.

They were not around in 2007 ...more to the point they were wide legged so you could roll them up.

They were also crop legged to make them into -  knee length  or shorts.

Not classic cut like Martin Smith described..

Seems gmc didn't need the roll ups -  he already had them with no tabs or button in sight.

https://www.facebook.com/photo/?fbid=8612250715475490&set=pcb.2965873896902413

Designer?  That is not how any of the Smiths described the trousers.  They did say the material was heavier than linen and that's not how those trousers that Gerry look at all, those look very lightweight.  Is there a photo which shows Gerry's trousers in full?  How do we know for certain that those trousers weren't actually cropped, in fact how do we know for certain that they aren't the exact same ones in the photo you linked to above?

[kizzy]

Designer?  That is not how any of the Smiths described the trousers.  They did say the material was heavier than linen and that's not how those trousers that Gerry look at all, those look very lightweight.  Is there a photo which shows Gerry's trousers in full?  How do we know for certain that those trousers weren't actually cropped, in fact how do we know for certain that they aren't the exact same ones in the photo you linked to above?

That is not how any of the Smiths described the trousers.

No, Smith didn't ...i did.

NOTE 5
"He was wearing cream or beige-coloured cloth trousers in a classic cut. He did not see his shoes. He did not notice the body clothing and cannot describe the colour or fashion of the same."

NOTE 6
"His trousers were smooth "rights" along the legs, beige in colour, cotton fabric, thicker than linen, possibly with buttons, and without any other decoration."

The same beige trouses are on the bed.


yet

In her statement given to Police on the
6th September 2007 the day before she was made an arguido, Kate McCann stated that Gerry McCann was wearing blue denim trousers on the night Madeleine disappeared but cannot remember what else he was wearing. (See Note 7)

Seems he changed into denim to give interview ....that's why beige trousers were thrown on the bed.

IIRC wasn't they dirty from kneeling on floor praying like a Arab. Or whatever.


The Smith family's descriptions of the child being carried by this man on Rua da Escola Primera at 9.55pm on the night Madeleine McCann disappeared match Madeleine McCann's age, physique and hair style.

[kizzy]

Would you spend three weeks thinking about a possible kidnapping that you saw taking place before going to the police?  Do you think that would be the honourable thing to do?

It doesn't matter what we would do.....its what MS felt comfortable doing.

The fact is Martin Smith is a respected member of the public honourable and cautious it would seem.

Again you don't believe MS when he says it was Maddie.

yet your quite willing to believe H B a low life criminal waiting 10 year. ...because it involves CB.

10 year........and you want to rubbish 19 days.....ur posts says a lot about you and your reasoning.

The fact also M S who could have explained why never got the chance ...because G,A, was took off the case.

So never got chance to do a follow up or - the reconstruction.

[Vertigo Swirl]

It doesn't matter what we would do.....its what MS felt comfortable doing.

The fact is Martin Smith is a respected member of the public honourable and cautious it would seem.

Again you don't believe MS when he says it was Maddie.

yet your quite willing to believe H B a low life criminal waiting 10 year. ...because it involves CB.

10 year........and you want to rubbish 19 days.....ur posts says a lot about you and your reasoning.

The fact also M S who could have explained why never got the chance ...because G,A, was took off the case.

So never got chance to do a follow up or - the reconstruction.

Firstly it wasn't 19 days, it was 22 days between the sighting and the statements being given.  I personally think it is inexcusable for a fine upstanding citizen to wait that long.  Waiting 22 days means your memory of what you think you saw is likely to be very vague, they even admitted as much.  They all thought the girl they saw might have been Madeleine and they might have been right, but then again they might not have.  I am not accusing them of lying or making things up.

 Helge Busching is a n'er do well who says he went to the police in 2007 and was ignored.  He may be lying or he may not but the one thing his testimony provided was evidence which resulted in the capture and successful conviction of a rapist, which lends credibility to what he said, as does proof that he and CB were where he said they were when Bruckner made his remarks about Madeleine.  Unlike the Smiths he's a wrong 'un so if he took years to dob his ex mate in it, then that doesn't really surprise me - he was probably after some sort of advantage by doing so, but that doesn't necessarily mean he's lying about what CB said to him.   
I have no idea what your last sentence means btw. 

[kizzy]

Firstly it wasn't 19 days, it was 22 days between the sighting and the statements being given.  I personally think it is inexcusable for a fine upstanding citizen to wait that long.  Waiting 22 days means your memory of what you think you saw is likely to be very vague, they even admitted as much.  They all thought the girl they saw might have been Madeleine and they might have been right, but then again they might not have.  I am not accusing them of lying or making things up.

 Helge Busching is a n'er do well who says he went to the police in 2007 and was ignored.  He may be lying or he may not but the one thing his testimony provided was evidence which resulted in the capture and successful conviction of a rapist, which lends credibility to what he said, as does proof that he and CB were where he said they were when Bruckner made his remarks about Madeleine.  Unlike the Smiths he's a wrong 'un so if he took years to dob his ex mate in it, then that doesn't really surprise me - he was probably after some sort of advantage by doing so, but that doesn't necessarily mean he's lying about what CB said to him.   
I have no idea what your last sentence means btw.

I have no idea what your last sentence means btw.


Well it meant Martin Smith would  no doubt -  had the chance to explain why he waited to contact police..


But we will never know because G.A. was took off the case in the middle of sorting it.



The Smith family?Irishman Martin Smith and his family?were planned to return to Praia da Luz in September 2007 for a formal reconstruction of their sighting of a man carrying a child, but the trip was cancelled.
According to the PJ (Portuguese Judicial Police) files and reports surrounding the case:


The Planned Trip: Resources had been allocated to bring the Smith family back to Portugal to perform a reconstruction of the event they witnessed around 10 pm on May 3, 2007.
Cancellation:

The reconstruction was cancelled when Gon?alo Amaral, the lead detective on the case, was removed from the investigation.


Significance of the Sighting: The Smith family?s testimony is considered a crucial lead, as they described seeing a man carrying a child who matched the description of Madeleine McCann walking away from the apartment.