Gerry and Kate's reaction to sniffer dogs didnt make sense new ninemsn article

[pathfinder73]

You have not provided a cite for Morse.  Blood from a missing person who disappeared under mysterious circumstances is incriminating.

[Mr Gray]

Why don't you provide a cite Sadie? Oh......you can't 

Cadaver dogs alert to dried blood from a live human being but they are not brought in to find live humans. They are brought in to find evidence of death.

Absolutely correct
The task of the cadaver dog is to find evidence of death
In this case he didn't find any

[ferryman]

You have not provided a cite for Morse.  Blood from a missing person who disappeared under mysterious circumstances is incriminating.

Blood found in quantities compatible with loss of life, maybe.

But small traces?

Nah!

Doesn't prove anything at all.

[Robittybob1]

Blood found in quantities compatible with loss of life, maybe.

But small traces?

Nah!

Doesn't prove anything at all.

It could prove or suggest he (the blood donor) had been there.  e.g if Maddie's blood had been found in Murat's villa, that would be significant no matter how small a quantity found.

[pathfinder73]

Morse was not trained to react to blood.

Part of the controversy of D'Andre Lane's conviction for the murder of his (I think!) step-daughter was that there were no retrievable remains.

But judges held the conviction, nonetheless, to be safe.

Morse was trained to detect blood (a part of human remains) so you are wrong.

Lane is facing mandatory life in prison if convicted. The case relies on circumstantial evidence and is using a cadaver dog named Morse, who is handled by forensic canine expert Martin Grime.

“You have no way of telling what Morse responded to,”said Johnson, noting the positive detection hasn’t been connected to Bianca’s body or anyone else’s. “You don’t know if it was a positive or negative response.”

Grime conceded a determination is usually made when something is found.

“The corroboration would normally be you finding a cadaver, bone or human blood that I could see,” he told Johnson, adding that the dog has never given a false response.

Rex A. Stockham, forensic canine program manager for the FBI, also testified about Morse on Wednesday. He said the English springer spaniel is regularly tested for proficiency, and while no dog is perfect, Morse has been accurate.

“I’m aware of no false positives for Morse,” he said. “We’ve never had any case yet where the dog has responded and it’s been shown to be incorrect.”

http://madeleinemccann.org/blog/2014/04/20/bianca-jones-trial-of-dandre-lane/

[ferryman]

It could prove or suggest he (the blood donor) had been there.  e.g if Maddie's blood had been found in Murat's villa, that would be significant no matter how small a quantity found.

Location can be crucial, that's true.

To be clear, it never was, but if Madeleine's blood had been found (in any quantity) in the Renault Scenic, hired 3 weeks after the last (reported) sighting, that would have been deeply damning of the McCanns.

Finding Bianca's blood (in minute traces) in Bianca's bedroom proves diddlysquat (ie nothing at all).

And Morse's reaction in Bianca's bedroom was admissible as evidence in court precisely because he was (deliberately) not sensitised to blood.

[ferryman]

Morse was trained to detect blood (a part of human remains) so you are wrong.

Lane is facing mandatory life in prison if convicted. The case relies on circumstantial evidence and is using a cadaver dog named Morse, who is handled by forensic canine expert Martin Grime.

“You have no way of telling what Morse responded to,”said Johnson, noting the positive detection hasn’t been connected to Bianca’s body or anyone else’s. “You don’t know if it was a positive or negative response.”[/u]

Grime conceded a determination is usually made when something is found.

“The corroboration would normally be you finding a cadaver, bone or human blood that I could see,” he told Johnson, adding that the dog has never given a false response.

Rex A. Stockham, forensic canine program manager for the FBI, also testified about Morse on Wednesday. He said the English springer spaniel is regularly tested for proficiency, and while no dog is perfect, Morse has been accurate.

“I’m aware of no false positives for Morse,” he said. “We’ve never had any case yet where the dog has responded and it’s been shown to be incorrect.”

http://madeleinemccann.org/blog/2014/04/20/bianca-jones-trial-of-dandre-lane/

In the Bianca Jones case nothing (that could be analysed in a laboratory) was found.

[Mr Gray]

Morse was trained to detect blood (a part of human remains) so you are wrong.

Lane is facing mandatory life in prison if convicted. The case relies on circumstantial evidence and is using a cadaver dog named Morse, who is handled by forensic canine expert Martin Grime.

“You have no way of telling what Morse responded to,”said Johnson, noting the positive detection hasn’t been connected to Bianca’s body or anyone else’s. “You don’t know if it was a positive or negative response.”

Grime conceded a determination is usually made when something is found.

“The corroboration would normally be you finding a cadaver, bone or human blood that I could see,” he told Johnson, adding that the dog has never given a false response.

Rex A. Stockham, forensic canine program manager for the FBI, also testified about Morse on Wednesday. He said the English springer spaniel is regularly tested for proficiency, and while no dog is perfect, Morse has been accurate.

“I’m aware of no false positives for Morse,” he said. “We’ve never had any case yet where the dog has responded and it’s been shown to be incorrect.”

http://madeleinemccann.org/blog/2014/04/20/bianca-jones-trial-of-dandre-lane/

An absolutely nonsensical statement

How can any alert be shown to be incorrect
It may well not be incorrect but it can't be proved to be incorrect
And it may well be correct but it can't be proved to be correct

[ferryman]

An absolutely nonsensical statement

How can any alert be shown to be incorrect
It may well not be incorrect but it can't be proved to be incorrect
And it may well be correct but it can't be proved to be correct

In fairness, Dave, I think that refers to controlled conditions in training, rather than in operational deployment.

[ferryman]

Who believes Mark Harrison wrote, with a straight face, that the villa the McCanns moved into well after a full scale police and civilian search for Madeleine had been mounted would be (sic) an obvious place to look for Madeleine's concealed and deceased remains?

Anyone?

Harrison certainly wrote it.

[Robittybob1]

Who believes Mark Harrison wrote, with a straight face, that the villa the McCanns moved into well after a full scale police and civilian search for Madeleine had been mounted would be (sic) an obvious place to look for Madeleine's concealed and deceased remains?

Anyone?

Harrison certainly wrote it.

I wonder if they checked the freezer?

[misty]

I wonder if they checked the freezer?

The PJ found a body in a freezer just a couple of days ago.
http://portugalresident.com/frozen-body-of-elderly-woman-discovered-in-freezer

[pathfinder73]

Both dogs alerted behind the sofa. Any investigator worth anything after seeing the crime scene photos of the sofa can't miss the possible meaning of what happened to Madeleine that night.

Look at the crumpled curtain suggesting the sofa was quickly pushed back against the wall to cover up where the dogs later alerted.

This is not rocket science. It is common sense when you start to bring evidence together IMO.

[Mr Gray]

Both dogs alerted behind the sofa. Any investigator worth anything after seeing the crime scene photos of the sofa can't miss the possible meaning of what happened to Madeleine that night.

Look at the crumpled curtain suggesting the sofa was quickly pushed back against the wall to cover up where the dogs later alerted.

This is not rocket science. It is common sense when you bring evidence together.

rowley...there is no evidence as to whether maddie is alive or dead


everything is your opinion based on your misunderstanding of the dog alerts

[pathfinder73]

rowley...there is no evidence as to whether maddie is alive or dead


everythinf is your opinion based on your misunderstanding of the dog alerts

SY were digging in PDL with dogs - they have found zero evidence of an alive Maddy who disappeared 10 years ago. Of course they say there's a possibility she is alive - they said the same about Kate Prout.