The ambient lighting and its effect on the children's bedroom window.

[Carana]

Thanks G U.

That isn't the photo I have in mind, but how would someone on the passenger's seat (right-hand side) notice a light from behind those trees? As she stated, she saw a light in the front of the McCanns's building. Was that anything other than a small light above the entrance that was permanently on? A light that detected movement?

[DCI]

They are crime scene photos perhaps but the light comes from the PJ lights.  Not from the street lights

This one isn't an official crime scene photo Sadie. No trees!

[John]

A picture taken from another angle some years after the incident.

[Carana]

A picture taken from another angle.

Thanks, John. Where was that taken from and when?

[John]

Thanks, John. Where was that taken from and when?

It was taken in June 2010 from a second storey stairwell in the adjacent block 6.  The position is in front of and set back from the light source in Pathfinders earlier photo.

[John]

I've shown two photos.

The crime scene


And another showing the light source

I would hazard a guess that those two reflections are actually from the camera light, any thoughts?

[DCI]

I would hazard a guess that those two reflections are actually from the camera light.

Yes John maybe. But the second photo shouldn't be used as part of the discussion for the view on the 3rd May 2007. It isn't an official file photo.

[Miss Taken Identity]

The street light is very bright, ecxeptionally in fact. and quite a distance. There is another light next to the aprtment but trees seem to block it?

Bit too bright for people, (burglars) to be 'jemmying shutters?

[sadie]

Thanks G U.

I would point out as well that the 5A is built on sloping land, artificially levelled within the outer wall you see in the image above.

If you take the trouble to look at the Cutting Edge video, you will see that altho the wall is quite low when viewed from block 5 car park, as you walk up the road as "Jane Tanner" did, the top of the wall is way - * way* -  over her head.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=atfDV7imHHY

@ 11.40 and 12.25
[For some reason I cant get this video showing as usual]

Not only was her view blocked by the treeheads, but the wall was way too damned high for the girl who claimed that she saw a grey car in front of 5A as she was driven out of the car park from block 6 opposite.  [Car park exit is just off image to the immediate left].  From that position, even in a Jeep or Land Rover, she could not have seen anything.

She was a Baptista, wasn't she?



Just an observation:   There seem to be lots of Baptistas in this

[sadie]

This one isn't an official crime scene photo Sadie. No trees!

According to the website it shows on, it is one of Pat Browns photos.

And we all know what she was up to, dont we?

ETA :
I was there is mid summer 2010 and you were totally unable to see either that street light or the building [block 6] with its balconies.

The thick heads of trees coverd this view blocking any view.   

These beautiful trees were totally cut down after that.   Not long later Pat Brown appeared on the scene, with her camera and spurious theoriies that the door and window were too over looked for an abduction to have been risked.


THAT IS A LIE.

NOBODY and NOTHING overlooked that window .. nor the doorway ... in 2007

[slartibartfast]

I agree, Brietta.  And I have had enough of insults directed at Sadie.  Or anyone else.

But at least Sadie has been there and done some on the ground research.  Disagree with her if you wish.  Just cut the insults.  No one has the right to insult another poster on this Forum.

As long as she starts providing some cites for her claims and stops pretending to know things no one else does. How can any of her theories be discussed without any substance.

[sadie]

It was taken in June 2010 from a second storey stairwell in the adjacent block 6.  The position is in front of and set back from the light source in Pathfinders earlier photo.

John, thank you for your photograph, but I think you are mistaken.  Without referring back, I can tell you that you have the wrong streetlamp. 

Using your image, the streetlamp in PF's photo is the one just to the right and behind the woman walking.

[pathfinder73]

It was taken in June 2010 from a second storey stairwell in the adjacent block 6.  The position is in front of and set back from the light source in Pathfinders earlier photo.

Thank you John. The photo was taken outside the shutters at apartment 5A. There is also another light in front of the apartments next to the car park entrance (not the red circle).

[sadie]

A picture taken from another angle some years after the incident.

This photograph was taken from an elevated position in Block 6.  From the size of the trees, I would guestimate that it was about the time of the abduction.  Depends, of course, just how much pollarding had gone on.

At this stage there shows a gap between the trees and 5A, but as youcan see the trees stop the light.  There is a tree shaped shadow on the wall of 5A from the streetlamp.

I can assure you that when I first visited 5A, the depth of the shadow over 5A front door was intense, like the black hole of calcutta, ... and very dark over the bedroom window as well.

It was upon seeing that the deeply recessed door was not overlooked from anywhere, was not passed by any walkers etc.  that i decided that the only sensible way in was through the front door.  IIRC the porch light fitting was broken too.

[sadie]

This photograph was taken from an elevated position in Block 6.  From the size of the trees, I would guestimate that it was about the time of the abduction.  Depends, of course, just how much pollarding had gone on.

At this stage there shows a gap between the trees and 5A, but as youcan see the trees stop the light.  There is a tree shaped shadow on the wall of 5A from the streetlamp.

I can assure you that when I first visited 5A, the depth of the shadow over 5A front door was intense, like the black hole of calcutta, ... and very dark over the bedroom window as well.

It was upon seeing that the deeply recessed door was not overlooked from anywhere, was not passed by any walkers etc.  that i decided that the only sensible way in was through the front door.  IIRC the porch light fitting was broken too.

This shot is taken from an elevated position, but shows an elevated view of what the girl , (was she named Baptista?) had as she was driven out.  Please bear in mind that the wall in front of her was the wall we saw "Jane tanner" walk along in the Cutting Edge Video.  And all the length of wall in front of her is higher than she is.

Did she see the grey car where she thought she did?  Cos she certainly didn't see it from there.  I fear she misremembered, unless she had reason to look back into the darkness as they drove past the entrance to block 5 car park around the corner.  Most people look forward rather than back and towards the light rather than into the gloom and blackness.