What Time Did The Bamber’s Have Their Last Dinner?

[Holly Goodhead]

I think the notion JB carried out the murders much earlier in the evening has too many obstacles to overcome:

1.  June was known to go to bed after NB.  June took a phone call from PB at 10 pm which lasted some 20 mins.

2.  NB was last seen in the fields around 10.30 pm by Len Foakes and needed to be up again early in the morning to instruct others and get on with the harvest.

3.  JB called JM at circa 10 pm and again this call lasted some 20 minutes. If he didn't call from GH where did he call from?  On the basis he called from GH he then had to get to WHF, supposedly on his mother's bike wearing his wetsuit, enter WHF through a window with the rifle, or search it out, creep upstairs to shoot SC? June?  Twins? and hope NB was otherwise engaged enabling him to lie in wait to ambush NB as he came up the stairs. The he did what for some 3/4 hours before phoning JM and the police?  What advantage to him in delaying in this scenario which I find completely implausible? 

[Holly Goodhead]

I don't think anyone can assume that JB couldn't know that police wouldn't go storming in to a potential hostage situation. The iranian embassy siege lasted for 6 days and was big news. I doubt JB was expecting the SAS to turn up when he thumbed through the phone book.

Come to think of it, was not dialling 999 part of his ruse in this regard, so the police wouldn't immediately scramble the armed bobbies?

But if he had already delayed for some 3/4 hours for whatever reason(s) what would be the point in delaying further? 

[APRIL]

I don't think anyone can assume that JB couldn't know that police wouldn't go storming in to a potential hostage situation. The iranian embassy siege lasted for 6 days and was big news. I doubt JB was expecting the SAS to turn up when he thumbed through the phone book.

Come to think of it, was not dialling 999 part of his ruse in this regard, so the police wouldn't immediately scramble the armed bobbies?

Absolutely. I imagine it was ALL about delaying tactics from the moment of the completion of the murders.

[Common sense]

But if he had already delayed for some 3/4 hours for whatever reason(s) what would be the point in delaying further?

Maybe it had only been an hour from the murders and the call to police, just time to have a shower, put the towels and clothes in the wash, call JM to tell her everything is going well and do his hair.

There can be no disputing the fact that police thought they could be dealing with a hostage situation, JB had no control but it can't be assumed that he didn't have a reasonable idea of how it would go down.

I don't think it would have mattered if they had smashed the door in an found them all dead at 4am either. Determining TOD is still an inexact science today.

JB never once said, "hey my family are in there and could be in danger, come on - I'll open a window for you" - he didn't have to panic, he knew what the police were going to find. He talked about his porsche instead.

[Caroline]

Maybe it had only been an hour from the murders and the call to police, just time to have a shower, put the towels and clothes in the wash, call JM to tell her everything is going well and do his hair.

There can be no disputing the fact that police thought they could be dealing with a hostage situation, JB had no control but it can't be assumed that he didn't have a reasonable idea of how it would go down.

I don't think it would have mattered if they had smashed the door in an found them all dead at 4am either. Determining TOD is still an inexact science today.

JB never once said, "hey my family are in there and could be in danger, come on - I'll open a window for you" - he didn't have to panic, he knew what the police were going to find. He talked about his porsche instead.

That aspect was something he had to play by ear.

[ISpyWithMyEye]

I think the notion JB carried out the murders much earlier in the evening has too many obstacles to overcome:

1.  June was known to go to bed after NB.  June took a phone call from PB at 10 pm which lasted some 20 mins.

2.  NB was last seen in the fields around 10.30 pm by Len Foakes and needed to be up again early in the morning to instruct others and get on with the harvest.

3.  JB called JM at circa 10 pm and again this call lasted some 20 minutes. If he didn't call from GH where did he call from?  On the basis he called from GH he then had to get to WHF, supposedly on his mother's bike wearing his wetsuit, enter WHF through a window with the rifle, or search it out, creep upstairs to shoot SC? June?  Twins? and hope NB was otherwise engaged enabling him to lie in wait to ambush NB as he came up the stairs. The he did what for some 3/4 hours before phoning JM and the police?  What advantage to him in delaying in this scenario which I find completely implausible?

Yes, and they’d have all been asleep in bed by midnight

Jeremy was just a 15 minute bicycle ride away, that’s hardly long

He could have easily got to WHF around midnight, killed everyone, left around 1am, and got home at 1:20am

That’s gave him an hour and half to possibly have another shower, put his clothes in the washing machine despite not needing to but just to be on the safe side...had a drink or coffees, probably a sandwich, dry his hair....the timing matches perfectly for when he rang Julie and said he hadn’t slept all night. That was the only truth he told her...he hadn’t slept as he’d been to a WHF and killed everyone.

Why would he tell the police he went to sleep at midnight (then changed it in his next statement to 11:30) but tell Julie he hadn’t slept at all?

C’mon....it’s too easy to see through his lies !

[barrier]

Maybe it had only been an hour from the murders and the call to police, just time to have a shower, put the towels and clothes in the wash, call JM to tell her everything is going well and do his hair.

There can be no disputing the fact that police thought they could be dealing with a hostage situation, JB had no control but it can't be assumed that he didn't have a reasonable idea of how it would go down.

I don't think it would have mattered if they had smashed the door in an found them all dead at 4am either. Determining TOD is still an inexact science today.

JB never once said, "hey my family are in there and could be in danger, come on - I'll open a window for you" - he didn't have to panic, he knew what the police were going to find. He talked about his porsche instead.

Feeling for a pulse and finding the bodies still warm at that time would have been a good indicator,but any how that's speculation.

[ISpyWithMyEye]

Feeling for a pulse and finding the bodies still warm at that time would have been a good indicator,but any how that's speculation.

Dead bodies cool at different rates according to the atmosphere and temperature etc.

In the Bambers’ case the fact they all had rigor mortis gave Dr Vanezis an approximate idea of time of death, but it was variable, of course

There’d have been no need to check for pulses as it was evident they’d all been long dead...

[Nicholas]

Bamber apparently interjected and suggested SC take a holiday April

No mention of him interjecting and suggesting SC take a holiday in his recorded piece repeated during Crimes that shook Britain

@ approx 38.33 here https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=scX821rcU5k

[Caroline]

Dead bodies cool at different rates according to the atmosphere and temperature etc.

In the Bambers’ case the fact they all had rigor mortis gave Dr Vanezis an approximate idea of time of death, but it was variable, of course

There’s have been no need to check for pulses as it was evident they’d all been long dead...

Vanezis didn't see the bodies until around 3pm in the afternoon Spy.

[Caroline]

Bamber apparently interjected and suggested SC take a holiday April

Wasn't she already on holiday? 

[Nicholas]

Wasn't she already on holiday? 

More of Bamber’s ‘dupers delight’

[ISpyWithMyEye]

Vanezis didn't see the bodies until around 3pm in the afternoon Spy.

Yep, I know he didn’t, Caroline

But the police brought in the local GP shortly after raiding the property and he didn’t even touch their bodies — there was no need as he could see they’d been dead for many hours. That’s why he probably didn’t notice Sheila’s first bullet wound on her neck as her head was slightly tilted and there was so much dried blood.

He would have seen by their colouring and mottling they’d been dead hours, so there was no need to check for a pulse, or even a temperature

[Nicholas]

No mention of him interjecting and suggesting SC take a holiday in his recorded piece repeated during Crimes that shook Britain

@ approx 38.33 here https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=scX821rcU5k

And it seems he told Roger Wilkes he left the kitchen - after eating a sandwich ‘to check that the dryer was still running’ ? on the way that’s apparently when he spotted the rabbits ?

https://soundcloud.com/hachetteaudiouk/blood-relations-by-roger-wilkes-read-by-colin-mace-audiobook-extract

[The General]

Yep, I know he didn’t, Caroline

But the police brought in the local GP shortly after raiding the property and he didn’t even touch their bodies — there was no need as he could see they’d been dead for many hours. That’s why he probably didn’t notice Sheila’s first bullet wound on her neck as her head was slightly tilted and there was so much dried blood.

He would have seen by their colouring and mottling they’d been dead hours, so there was no need to check for a pulse, or even a temperature

Pure, unadulterated conjecture. The bit about the bullet wound? Shut up. You expect this nonsense to get pumped out unchecked? Show me a cite, Quincy.