What Time Did The Bamber’s Have Their Last Dinner?

[Common sense]

If JB committed the murders some hours before the claimed tel call from NB wouldn't it have been obvious the victims had been dead for longer to those at soc and the two pathologists who had access to soc images?

Wasn't it the prosecution case that they could well have been killed earlier. TOD is not an exact science?

Conversely JB could not have know the police would delay entry so how would he explain NB alive at circa 3.30 am if he had been dead for some 4 hours?

A fair point. Seems likely he killed them no earlier than 1-2am.

CC said when he stayed at WHF NB went to bed before June.

Maybe not if he had to go out on the tractor late at night

June's head was on the pillow when she was first shot

True, although some say she was sitting up reading her bible. I've not looked into it.

If JB didn't call JM from GH where did he call her from?

No phone records so it's possible he called from WHF but I think my half baked theory has been debunked!

NV was found in his pj's and there's an indentation in his pillow.

Yes alright! - He went to bed - although it's possible the pillows hadn't been fluffed from the night before and he got into his PJs downstairs

Where do NB's night time rituals come from in terms of a cig and nightcap in the lounge before bed?

A good question.

[G-Unit]

So maybe she would hear him in the night and just think "blood Jeremy again" but ignore it.

This time, she wakes up, rouses Nevill but it's too late, JB comes in and starts shooting.

If Nevill was in the bedroom why did he stand by and let his wife be shot in her bed?

[Common sense]

If Nevill was in the bedroom why did he stand by and let his wife be shot in her bed?

Because it seems likely they were both surprised in their bed. NB sprang out and made toward the killer who retreated on to the landing, hitting Nevill who turns and heads downstairs.

This scenario works for me no matter who the killer was but there is just one problem:

There is no time for NB to call anyone.

[Caroline]

If JB committed the murders some hours before the claimed tel call from NB wouldn't it have been obvious the victims had been dead for longer to those at soc and the two pathologists who had access to soc images? How? - The pathologist couldn't give a time of death and gave abroad time span.

Conversely JB could not have know the police would delay entry so how would he explain NB alive at circa 3.30 am if he had been dead for some 4 hours? Unarmed police would walk into a situation where guns are an issue? Do you think people couldn't do their homework back in 1985? It wasn't the dark ages Holly.

CC said when he stayed at WHF NB went to bed before June. He couldn't go to bed before June because he had a load of rape seed to sort out and the dogs to walk, he had to take a shower and probably give himself 5.

June's head was on the pillow when she was first shot - Nobody mentioned June, just you.

If JB didn't call JM from GH where did he call her from? I said he did call her from GH

NV was found in his pj's and there's an indentation in his pillow. I doubt the Bambers were pillow fluffers

Where do NB's night time rituals come from in terms of a cig and nightcap in the lounge before bed? It's documented

[Caroline]

Because it seems likely they were both surprised in their bed. NB sprang out and made toward the killer who retreated on to the landing, hitting Nevill who turns and heads downstairs.

This scenario works for me no matter who the killer was but there is just one problem:

There is no time for NB to call anyone.

If you were the shooter, who would you disarm first, June or Nevill? Bamber would never have let Nevill get passed him.

[Caroline]

We’re Nevill’s trousers in the kitchen?

On the floor, they are part of the fabric object next to him. They are under his. knee so weren't placed there later by police as some have suggested.

[G-Unit]

Because it seems likely they were both surprised in their bed. NB sprang out and made toward the killer who retreated on to the landing, hitting Nevill who turns and heads downstairs.

This scenario works for me no matter who the killer was but there is just one problem:

There is no time for NB to call anyone.

No cartridges were found on the landing.

[Common sense]

Conversely JB could not have know the police would delay entry so how would he explain NB alive at circa 3.30 am if he had been dead for some 4 hours? Unarmed police would walk into a situation where guns are an issue? Do you think people couldn't do their homework back in 1985? It wasn't the dark ages Holly./quote]

Funnily enough, there is an oddball on twitter that repeatedly posts a link to an episode of Brookside, shown just prior to the murders, that depicts a siege situation. There was also the famous embassy siege in the 80's - Bamber had painted the picture of a possible hostage situation, it would be unlikely the police would go bursting in.

[Myster]

No cartridges were found on the landing.

You mean cartridge casings/cases.. and one was found on the mid-landing up against the skirting board.

[Common sense]

No cartridges were found on the landing.

So NB gets shot as he makes his way out of bed and toward the door - but makes no attempt to tackle the killer who retreats from the advancing NB, still pointing the gun so NB turns downstairs and is shot in the back. 

You just said

If Nevill was in the bedroom why did he stand by and let his wife be shot in her bed?

He didn't and we agree he wouldn't. He was taken by surprise, but it would be exactly what he did in any scenario where Sheila is the killer and he decides to nip off and call Jeremy.

[G-Unit]

You mean cartridge casings/cases.. and one was found on the mid-landing up against the skirting board.

Which seems to be a missing cartridge case from the four shots in the kitchen, because each one of those shots were fatal shots.

[Caroline]

Because it seems likely they were both surprised in their bed. NB sprang out and made toward the killer who retreated on to the landing, hitting Nevill who turns and heads downstairs.

This scenario works for me no matter who the killer was but there is just one problem:

There is no time for NB to call anyone.

We don't agree on much but I am with you all the way on this. I think he would have grabbed the rifle - not run away.

[Caroline]

Which seems to be a missing cartridge case from the four shots in the kitchen, because each one of those shots were fatal shots.

If I remember rightly, they attributed the case on the stairs to one of those shots, theorising that it might have stuck in the ridges in one of the raid teams boots. Not sure I buy that though.

[Myster]

Which seems to be a missing cartridge case from the four shots in the kitchen, because each one of those shots were fatal shots.

Carried up on the sole of a TFU boot, so it has been said many times, but could just have easily resulted from one of the final head shots to June as she lay in the doorway. The fourth casing, thought to have been on the kitchen floor might have been swept away in the later clean-up.

[G-Unit]

If I remember rightly, they attributed the case on the stairs to one of those shots, theorising that it might have stuck in the ridges in one of the raid teams boots. Not sure I buy that though.

That cartridge case had to go somewhere and if that wasn't from a kitchen shot what was it from? All the other shots were accounted for by cartridge cases.