Author Topic: For Albertini ...  (Read 117700 times)

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Offline Chinagirl

Re: For Albertini ...
« Reply #330 on: August 19, 2013, 07:16:56 AM »
The mistake you make, Albertini, is to assert that there is a difference to the presumption of innocence between the investigative phase and trial phase.  There isn't, which is why neither a suspect (investigation) nor a defendant (trial) ever has to "demonstrate/prove their innocence."  It is the police who rule one in or out during the investigation, not the suspect by proving/disproving his innocence.
A

Offline Albertini

Re: For Albertini ...
« Reply #331 on: August 19, 2013, 07:38:13 AM »
The mistake you make, Albertini, is to assert that there is a difference to the presumption of innocence between the investigative phase and trial phase.  There isn't, which is why neither a suspect (investigation) nor a defendant (trial) ever has to "demonstrate/prove their innocence."  It is the police who rule one in or out during the investigation, not the suspect by proving/disproving his innocence.

Well clearly it isn't a mistake because, as i keep telling you, the phrase was there in the AG report.

If it was a "mistake" with no firm standing, do you really think the phrase would have been contained twice in the final report?

The police usually ask questions such as "where were you on the night of...." the answer they are looking for is for firm evidence to rule the suspect out of the investigation.

In order to do that, in essence, the suspect has to prove their innocence to the events in question.

Offline Chinagirl

Re: For Albertini ...
« Reply #332 on: August 19, 2013, 07:44:47 AM »
Police arrest caution (UK):

...(your name), I am arresting you on suspicion of (crime). You do not have to say anything. But it may harm your defence if you do not mention when questioned something which you later rely on in court. Anything you do say may be given in evidence.

My underlining.
A

Offline Albertini

Re: For Albertini ...
« Reply #333 on: August 19, 2013, 10:55:25 PM »
Police arrest caution (UK):

...(your name), I am arresting you on suspicion of (crime). You do not have to say anything. But it may harm your defence if you do not mention when questioned something which you later rely on in court. Anything you do say may be given in evidence.

My underlining.

Sure, but what has a caution got to do with a suspect being ruled out of an investigation?

They either comply with the investigation and "prove their innocence" by ruling themselves out, or they choose to remain silent, as is their right, but remain a suspect until such time as their innocence has been proven or the police have gathered evidence against them.

Offline Mr Gray

Re: For Albertini ...
« Reply #334 on: August 19, 2013, 11:04:49 PM »
Sure, but what has a caution got to do with a suspect being ruled out of an investigation?

They either comply with the investigation and "prove their innocence" by ruling themselves out, or they choose to remain silent, as is their right, but remain a suspect until such time as their innocence has been proven or the police have gathered evidence against them.

Albertini, could you tell me what you mean by prove your innocence

Offline Mr Gray

Re: For Albertini ...
« Reply #335 on: August 19, 2013, 11:11:07 PM »
its a simple question . You have used  the phrase a million times. what do you think it means.

Offline Mr Gray

Re: For Albertini ...
« Reply #336 on: August 19, 2013, 11:20:54 PM »
it appears albertini doesn't know what it means

Offline Mr Gray

Re: For Albertini ...
« Reply #337 on: August 19, 2013, 11:33:48 PM »
Sure, but what has a caution got to do with a suspect being ruled out of an investigation?

They either comply with the investigation and "prove their innocence" by ruling themselves out, or they choose to remain silent, as is their right, but remain a suspect until such time as their innocence has been proven or the police have gathered evidence against them.

You say the Mccanns have not proved their innocence  but their arguido status has been removed and SY say they are not suspects..surely this is yet another contradiction in your arguments.

Offline Albertini

Re: For Albertini ...
« Reply #338 on: August 19, 2013, 11:34:38 PM »
Albertini, could you tell me what you mean by prove your innocence

Yes, rule themselves out as suspects to the police.

Offline Albertini

Re: For Albertini ...
« Reply #339 on: August 19, 2013, 11:34:54 PM »
its a simple question . You have used  the phrase a million times. what do you think it means.

I have told you many times.

You are either terminally stupid or have the memory span of a goldfish.
« Last Edit: August 19, 2013, 11:41:00 PM by Albertini »

Offline Albertini

Re: For Albertini ...
« Reply #340 on: August 19, 2013, 11:35:24 PM »
it appears albertini doesn't know what it means

It does love, but you must be patient and wait for my reply.

Offline Albertini

Re: For Albertini ...
« Reply #341 on: August 19, 2013, 11:37:11 PM »
You say the Mccanns have not proved their innocence  but their arguido status has been removed and SY say they are not suspects..surely this is yet another contradiction in your arguments.

Nope, i didn't say it, the AG report removed their Arguido status AND said they had failed to prove their innocence.

Not only are there no contradictions in my argument, that is the position of the AG of Protugal!

Oh that's right, he's an idiot, isn't he?

 @)(++(*

Offline Mr Gray

Re: For Albertini ...
« Reply #342 on: August 19, 2013, 11:39:06 PM »
Yes, rule themselves out as suspects to the police.

and does this then prove their innocence

Offline Mr Gray

Re: For Albertini ...
« Reply #343 on: August 19, 2013, 11:41:07 PM »
Nope, i didn't say it, the AG report removed their Arguido status AND said they had failed to prove their innocence.

Not only are there no contradictions in my argument, that is the position of the AG of Protugal!

Oh that's right, he's an idiot, isn't he?

 @)(++(*

I don't think he said what you think he said. wheres his statement in portuguese

Offline Albertini

Re: For Albertini ...
« Reply #344 on: August 19, 2013, 11:41:36 PM »
and does this then prove their innocence

To the investigation, yes.