How did he do it?

[Andrea]

Pubs been quiet, we have all taken advantage of the good weather earlier in the week

[simong]

I have always thought the twins were shot first, i cant see the twins sleeping through the  noise.

Good morning all...

Bear in mind though that the twins could have been shot quickly at the outset and shot again at the end for good measure.  I agree that they were certainly shot before the adults were.

If Sheila was not shot until the end why did she not try to get out while the gunman was dealing with Nevill downstairs. Could it be that Sheila was locked in her room until everyone else had been dealt with?

Morning John, hope you are well. I was under the impression that one of the twins was shot in an 'arc'. To me that would give the impression of all the wounds being inflicted at once not someone returning to finish off the job.

Certainly is possible that Sheila could have been locked in but i wouldn't want that lack of control if i was the killer.

[Firstimearound]

I thought it was very good barring the shotgun mistake. I can see where McKay is going with his CCRC application with all the gun tests and so on. I think it will help in garnering interest in Bambers case, shame to see it scheduled up against Eastenders which probably decimated the viewing figures. It's good that a new programme has been made about the case.

So where do you stand with this Andi? Did Bamber do it on his own, with an accomplice or did someone else carry out the killings alone?

I think he did it alone, but i wouldnt rule out an accomplice.

Is it officially documented that sheila wasnt wearing underwear? Its something thats been bothering me.

Not if your plan is to go to heaven and meet your sons.   A long white dress would be just the ticket don't you think?

More effective than jeans and t-shirt.

[Andrea]

But had shiela prepared for the final act surely she would want to be found wearing underwear?
Would she want to be found without?

[Firstimearound]

Sheila was a confident woman when it came to modelling.  Topless and nude modelling are things she had done in the past already.

Rather than having the 'perfect set of underwear', it would seem sexier and more alluring to go without.  Underwear was not the same then as it is these days.....and a g-string would certainly not be suitable either.

Better and safer to go without.

[Firstimearound]

Also, if it was Sheila, her thinking would not have been rational.  Wearing underwear would be a rational thought wouldn't it?

[John]

I thought it was very good barring the shotgun mistake. I can see where McKay is going with his CCRC application with all the gun tests and so on. I think it will help in garnering interest in Bambers case, shame to see it scheduled up against Eastenders which probably decimated the viewing figures. It's good that a new programme has been made about the case.

So where do you stand with this Andi? Did Bamber do it on his own, with an accomplice or did someone else carry out the killings alone?

I think he did it alone, but i wouldnt rule out an accomplice.

Is it officially documented that sheila wasnt wearing underwear? Its something thats been bothering me.

Not if your plan is to go to heaven and meet your sons.   A long white dress would be just the ticket don't you think?

More effective than jeans and t-shirt.

Just a few problems with that theory Firstimearound.  Sheila presented no signs of any struggle, her nails were intact which sort of precludes her from firing a rifle 25 times and loading it twice,. There were no other clothes belonging to Sheila found which had blood on them.  There would have been blood in the bathroom and on the towels unless you would have us believe she managed a complete clean up operation as well?

Had Sheila washed as you suggested her hair would have been wet when found.

[simong]

If the twins are shot first then the killer could possibly be using 8 bullets out of 10 maximum rounds with three potential adults waking up. We know that June and Nevill were shot in their room and that Nevill got downstairs presumably during a reload. It just seems very odd to discharge 8 rounds first and then have to reload when another two bullets are spent when there are three more potential victims. Hope you see where i am coming from, I always seem to struggle to get the point across that i am trying to make. 

[Andrea]

Doing her hair and makeup would have been a rational decision also

Imo if sheila did the deed she would have wIted until she wS back in london, she didnt like whf, she would have killed herseld and her sons in her own home, also she would have wanted to die next to her children.

Now if she did it at whf, then the same thing would happened, she would have wanted to die next to her kids.

[Andrea]

Sorry for all the typos, im in bed using my iphone!!

[Firstimearound]

Hi John,

Why could she not dry her hair? They had dryers then too.   

Alot of things where burnt John, an awful lot.  Many items with blood on them too.  Yes, I do believe a t-shirt with blood on it would have been noticed and that it would have been taken away for examination.  But say it was hid, and with the police cock-up the way it was, with all the police coming and going etc....by some young copper, this could have been overlooked.


Say she did the act naked....bar her undies, which were found in water later?  Maybe she did not want to get blood on her clothes.  Maybe she wore a black bin liner - and later put it in the bin.  Who knows.....all I'm saying was if it where Sheila, her thinking was so very far from normal and therefore, her actions would be abnormal as well.  I never knew Sheila or witnessed what she was like during a bad episode.  My view is, if it where her, my thinking to try to understand what she did and how she did it, must be far from normal and rational too.

(No, I do not think she wore a bin liner, for the record, it was only given as an example of irrational thinking and behaviour).

[Firstimearound]

Oh, and her nails were not perfectly manicured, as many believe John.   Not at all.

[Andrea]

If the twins are shot first then the killer could possibly be using 8 bullets out of 10 maximum rounds with three potential adults waking up. We know that June and Nevill were shot in their room and that Nevill got downstairs presumably during a reload. It just seems very odd to discharge 8 rounds first and then have to reload when another two bullets are spent when there are three more potential victims. Hope you see where i am coming from, I always seem to struggle to get the point across that i am trying to make. 

I see what you mean si, easier to do the adults with a full gun and the kids later because they dont pose much of a problem?

[simong]

If the twins are shot first then the killer could possibly be using 8 bullets out of 10 maximum rounds with three potential adults waking up. We know that June and Nevill were shot in their room and that Nevill got downstairs presumably during a reload. It just seems very odd to discharge 8 rounds first and then have to reload when another two bullets are spent when there are three more potential victims. Hope you see where i am coming from, I always seem to struggle to get the point across that i am trying to make. 

I see what you mean si, easier to do the adults with a full gun and the kids later because they dont pose much of a problem?

I need to be less convuluted, you make my point in one sentence! The adults have to be congregated and subdued first as they are more of a threat than the twins. With WHF being so secluded, even if the twins did wake up and try to make an escape, they were not going to get far.

[Firstimearound]

Doing her hair and makeup would have been a rational decision also

Imo if sheila did the deed she would have wIted until she wS back in london, she didnt like whf, she would have killed herseld and her sons in her own home, also she would have wanted to die next to her children.

Now if she did it at whf, then the same thing would happened, she would have wanted to die next to her kids.

But the supposed conversation, around the kitchen table, of social services being brought in and to Sheila, the possibility of someone else having her children, of her losing them, could have sent her over the edge.   The panic, the fear, the anxiety could be enough to bring upon a sudden lapse of rational thinking, depending on her then state of mind.

Maybe the phone calls where to be made the following day, to ask for help.   Sheila may not have fully understood exactly what was being said and flipped....or panicked.

Something within Sheila's mind takes over, and she sets out to ensure she is never seperated from her sons.  To ensure this, her sons would be first on the list.  Next, mum and dad.

In this state, she then prepares herself for being re-united not only with her sons, but with her mu and dad.  If she did do this, she also made sure the boys never missed their grandparents.......and if the phone call is to be believed also, she also tried to make sure her sons never went without their uncle Jeremy too.

Maybe her thinking was to keep the family together - they were not going to be seperated, she loved her sons so much, she did it for them.

Crazy, irrational.....but is this not something that could have been going through Sheila's mind, before she embarked upon her plan to solve the problem that she understood the family had and it's consequences?