Was 50 metres from the apartment 50 metres too far?

[stephen25000]

Not everyone shares your opinion Stephen - and that would include the thousands of other parents who - when on holiday --  also decided to leave their children fast asleep while they went for a meal etc. knowing they would be regularly checked.   As well as those relied on baby alarms to enable them to do the same as the McCann did. 

None of those parents would agree with you IMO.  How could they?

Then there are the parents of other abducted children - who all support the McCanns, . Kerry Needham, Sara Payne, Coral Jones, the Ossie parents (can't remember their name at the mo) - some of whom have met with the McCanns - and surely  - of all people  - they are (tragically) the most qualified to form an accurate impression of them.   They all agree that Madeleine was taken by a stranger and totally empathise with her parents.  Why do you completely ignore these 'experts'?

Also - did you miss this post from one of our members?

Quote from: Tootypopper on November 09, 2013, 04:59:40 PM

Hi! Mum and Dad would scrimp all year to take us on a little holiday to Butlines and what a time we all had! Mum and Dad used the listening service while they had a drink at the club and they would be heart broken if some body were to say that they abandoned us kids.

I am on the fence in this case of Madeleine but if people are saying that they abandoned their kids then they are also saying that my Mum and Dad abandoned us and I find that a bit offensive. This family did just the same as my Mum and Dad did.
UNQUOTE

NOT GOOD ENOUGH.


and how many millions of parents have never done , or would never consider leaving their children, to go out to drink ?

[faithlilly]

The McCanns were warned that leaving the children alone was causing them distress, Madeleine told them so. What kind of parent leaves their children alone, even for an hour, knowing that it had previously caused them distress ?

[G-Unit]

Life is full of all kinds of risks when it comes to babies/children.  Every time you put them in a car are you not knowingly putting their lives in danger?  What parent isn't aware that children die in car crashes every year?

IMO your expectations of how parents should look after their children are unworkable.  If it was possible to behave as I believeyou are suggesting  - there would be no children in A&E, no children drowning in baths, no children consuming pills thinking they are sweets and no cot deaths - to name but a few.

To enable that perfect situation parents would need to have their children under their surveillance 24/7 and never ever be guilty of  human error.  The fact that there is no such thing as a perfect parent seems to have escaped you - particularly when it comes to the McCanns.

The McCanns have said more than once how guilty they feel about what happened to their daughter.  How you can dispute that fact and claim it is 'supporters' who are in denial is a mystery to me.

Your post is an example of the denial I referred to. You are equating what the McCanns did with what most parents do every day. They take their children in cars, but they buy car seats and booster seats to make it as safe as they can. Parents do take their eyes off their children and accidents happen. Accidents happen regardless of how careful we are.

Leaving small children home alone for five evenings in a row isn't accidental, it's the result of a decision taken by two supposedly intelligent people who decided it was an acceptable risk. Not many parents would agree with them imo.

[G-Unit]

what anyone thinks on this forum is of no importance...many parents have left children in similar circumstances...but of course it is a massive stick with which to beat the parents...quite cruel imo

I would say it's more cruel to see the abduction of a child as 'bad luck'. If Madeleine was abducted and is found one day in a 'hellish lair' I wonder what comfort it will be to be told it was just a case of bad luck that she ended up there? Perhaps she'll accept that leaving her and going to dine x metres away was the most that could be demanded from her responsible parents? I expect she'll just shrug and 'move on'.

[Mr Gray]

I would say it's more cruel to see the abduction of a child as 'bad luck'. If Madeleine was abducted and is found one day in a 'hellish lair' I wonder what comfort it will be to be told it was just a case of bad luck that she ended up there? Perhaps she'll accept that leaving her and going to dine x metres away was the most that could be demanded from her responsible parents? I expect she'll just shrug and 'move on'.

what happened to maddie was extremely unlucky....but it's a good stick with which to beat the parents

[stephen25000]

what happened to maddie was extremely unlucky....but it's a good stick with which to beat the parents

It wasn't 'unlucky'.

They left their unattended and unsecured deliberately, 5 nights in a row.

[pegasus]

It was 90 metres walk from restaurant table to children's bedroom.

[Anna]

It was 90 metres walk from restaurant table to children's bedroom.

So a minute and a half or so, walk?
Do you think, that if there was an abductor/burglar....He would have taken this into account when planning his timing to commit the crime?

[pegasus]

A youtuber claimed he/she went there and personally timed the walk from that table to the garden gate = 20 seconds. That's about 4 paces a second - unbelievable - I've notified MoSW in Whitehall.

[Anna]

I believe they were fast walkers and tall(long legs), but don't think they could walk that distance in less than a minute.

[pegasus]

So a minute and a half or so, walk? ...(snip)

From restuarant table to children was 90 metres walk = about 50 seconds

[Anna]

From restuarant table to children was 90 metres walk = about 50 seconds

Thanks.

[Anna]

I think you are pretty much spot on, Pegasus. I was going by this...........

This is info for a normal walk and not a hurried one. The latter, I think would be the case from tapas to 5A….

To use this formula for short navigation legs, break it down to 1.2 minutes per 100 metres horizontal distance and 1 minute for every 10 metres of ascent. You can only travel at the speed of the slowest person and so you may need to use a slower formula such as 4 kph which is calculated at 1.5 minutes per 100 metres.

http://www.mcofs.org.uk/estimating-distance-travelled.asp

[pegasus]

Thanks.

From 5A balcony table to children was 8 metres and with excellent audibility.
A Tapas takeaway eaten on the balcony would have been a good idea.

[Alfred R Jones]

From 5A balcony table to children was 8 metres and with excellent audibility.
A Tapas takeaway eaten on the balcony would have been a good idea.

In theory it would have been perfectly possible for Madeleine to have been abducted from her room even if the McCanns had chosen to eat on the balcony instead.