Was 50 metres from the apartment 50 metres too far?

[pegasus]

From the book "Handy Hints for Image Managers"
Chapter 40: " How to shrink distances so they are shorter"
Rule 17: "Use flexible units - they are your friend - for example use BGL units (back garden lengths)"
Rule 18 "If the real back garden was only about 4 metres long - don't worry about that - substitute the back garden of some imaginary large mansion - to get the BGL unit you need"
Rule 99: "If after shrinking the distance, an important thing is still completely invisible, no problem, just find some irrelevant object like a door or wall and emphasise how visible that was - it will fool everyone"

[G-Unit]

15 minutes is more than ample time to abduct a child - I think Heri demonstrated that it would be possible to take the child and be out of PdL in less time.

I'd like to see him get a strange child to that window in the dark and lift it out. Pillows and children are not the same.

[Alfred R Jones]

I'd like to see him get a strange child to that window in the dark and lift it out. Pillows and children are not the same.

Madeleine was not strange, she was a normal, inquisitive, innocent child who, if awake and called to from the window by name, would more than likely go over to see who was calling her.  I honestly find it hard to believe that some people on this board have ever had children or know very much about how they may behave.  children of 4 are frighteningly naive and will believe pretty much anything you tell them, whoever you are. 

[G-Unit]

Madeleine was not strange, she was a normal, inquisitive, innocent child who, if awake and called to from the window by name, would more than likely go over to see who was calling her.  I honestly find it hard to believe that some people on this board have ever had children or know very much about how they may behave.  children of 4 are frighteningly naive and will believe pretty much anything you tell them, whoever you are.

Along comes Mr Abductor. He quietly raises the shutters from outside just in case the window is unlocked. Eureka! it is. First stroke of luck!

He opens the window and starts quietly calling....what? Does he know Madeleine's name? He has done his homework!

If he has done his homework he can guess there are three children in that room. Calling the name of one of them is very risky because all three might wake and scream, but never mind, he tries it anyway. Luckily he has opened the window of the one apartment in the resort which contains two children who won't wake no matter if he screams Madeleine's name at the top of his voice accompanied by a brass band.

More good luck. Only the targeted child wakes (luckily she sleeps a lot more lightly than her siblings), doesn't cry, and happily makes her way over to the window and allows herself to be lifted out. The shyness mentioned by many of the staff has miraculously disappeared - lucky, lucky, lucky.

The luckiest Mr Abductor in the world carries off his prize.

[Alfred R Jones]

Along comes Mr Abductor. He quietly raises the shutters from outside just in case the window is unlocked. Eureka! it is. First stroke of luck!

He opens the window and starts quietly calling....what? Does he know Madeleine's name? He has done his homework!

If he has done his homework he can guess there are three children in that room. Calling the name of one of them is very risky because all three might wake and scream, but never mind, he tries it anyway. Luckily he has opened the window of the one apartment in the resort which contains two children who won't wake no matter if he screams Madeleine's name at the top of his voice accompanied by a brass band.

More good luck. Only the targeted child wakes (luckily she sleeps a lot more lightly than her siblings), doesn't cry, and happily makes her way over to the window and allows herself to be lifted out. The shyness mentioned by many of the staff has miraculously disappeared - lucky, lucky, lucky.

The luckiest Mr Abductor in the world carries off his prize.

AS I have pointed out before abducting children is a high risk game, never more so than when taking a child from its secure environment.  I could write an equally cheap and facetious scenario about a young girl stolen from her bath by a strange man, or a young girl raped and murdered in her dorm while all her fellow students slept on around her, but I won't as it's not necessary - both actually happened and we have proof that they did. 

Also, what is it with this notion that calling into a child's bedroom, using her name will cause all its young inhabitants to start screaming?  Bizarre!

ETA: Heri's scenario (which may or may not be close to the truth who knows?) at least has the advantage of being lower risk than most other abductor scenarios in that if the child does not come to the window, and if all the inhabitants do (for some bizarre reason) start screaming their heads off, he can run away quickly and easily into the night.

[Benice]

That is a fairly nonsensical argument, no evidence exists. To insinuate that it is acceptable or useful to consider non existent evidence as proof of anything is mind boggling.

You might as well point out that if someone else had been in 5a they would have been an eye witness.

You have completely missed the point - which is that because no evidence was recovered doesn't mean it never existed  - as it could have been destroyed/contaminated by the large amount of traffic in 5A before the forensic bods arrived.

Isn't it a recurring criticsm by sceptics that the McCanns failed to morph into policemen and cordon off the scene in order to avoid destruction/ contamination of evidence?

[faithlilly]

AS I have pointed out before abducting children is a high risk game, never more so than when taking a child from its secure environment.  I could write an equally cheap and facetious scenario about a young girl stolen from her bath by a strange man, or a young girl raped and murdered in her dorm while all her fellow students slept on around her, but I won't as it's not necessary - both actually happened and we have proof that they did. 

Also, what is it with this notion that calling into a child's bedroom, using her name will cause all its young inhabitants to start screaming?  Bizarre!

ETA: Heri's scenario (which may or may not be close to the truth who knows?) at least has the advantage of being lower risk than most other abductor scenarios in that if the child does not come to the window, and if all the inhabitants do (for some bizarre reason) start screaming their heads off, he can run away quickly and easily into the night.

I believe the child abducted from the bath did scream it's head off and the girl that was raped and murdered in a dormonitory was considerably older than Madeleine and therefore would be much more aware of her predicament and susceptible to threats to keep quiet.

[stephen25000]

You have completely missed the point - which is that because no evidence was recovered doesn't mean it never existed  - as it could have been destroyed/contaminated by the large amount of traffic in 5A before the forensic bods arrived.

Isn't it a recurring criticsm by sceptics that the McCanns failed to morph into policemen and cordon off the scene in order to avoid destruction/ contamination of evidence?

Try to remember benice that applies to the other scenarios, which I know you won't accept.

[Benice]

Try to remember Venice that applies to the other scenarios, which I know you won't accept.

You are quite wrong Stephen.    Yes I do believe Madeleine was abducted,  but that doesn't mean that I have completely closed my mind to any other possible scenario  - and neither do I feel the need to abuse anyone for having a different opinion to mine.        In fact I welcome other 'theories' and if I thought one was credible I would be the first to say that it was.   However, In 8 years I have never heard another 'theory' which doesn't crash and burn under scrutiny imo.

I hope that is clear enough for you.


(p.s  I remember Venice well - I was there a few years ago.  It was a fantastic place. :-)

must go out now.


 

[pathfinder73]

Thursday, 10 May 2007

Madeleine's uncle, John McCann, from Glasgow, countered criticism from those who say the couple were wrong to leave their children alone in their apartment while they ate dinner at a nearby restaurant.

"If you look at the layout of that place, it was entirely safe. The issue at stake here was, that the flat was broken into, and wee Madeleine was abducted," he told BBC Radio Five Live.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/6644615.stm

[Alice Purjorick]

The first two law officers on the scene were officers Roque and da Costa both of whom were of the opinion it was not abduction, there was no sign of a break in and the child possibly left by her own means.
The latest comment from PJ appears to be:
"However in the case of Madeleine McCann, we are yet to come up with a satisfactory explanation as to what happened to her”.
Bearing in mind of course this statement is against the backdrop of having the assistance of The MPS.

[Angelo222]

The first two law officers on the scene were officers Roque and da Costa both of whom were of the opinion it was not abduction, there was no sign of a break in and the child possibly left by her own means.
The latest comment from PJ appears to be:
"However in the case of Madeleine McCann, we are yet to come up with a satisfactory explanation as to what happened to her”.
Bearing in mind of course this statement is against the backdrop of having the assistance of The MPS.

Since there were no previous confirmed cases of child abduction the police were right to be sceptical. 

As there hasn't been a repeat case in the area in the eight years following Maddie's disappearance an accident of some sort is beginning to look all the more possible.

[Brietta]

The first two law officers on the scene were officers Roque and da Costa both of whom were of the opinion it was not abduction, there was no sign of a break in and the child possibly left by her own means.
The latest comment from PJ appears to be:
"However in the case of Madeleine McCann, we are yet to come up with a satisfactory explanation as to what happened to her”.
Bearing in mind of course this statement is against the backdrop of having the assistance of The MPS.

Bearing in mind that the belief that Madeleine woke and wandered considerably delayed investigating whether or not she had been abducted.

**Snip
One of the Guarda Nacional Republicana agents who was first to arrive at the resort in Praia da Luz and at the McCann couple’s apartment is suspected of having received over 120 thousand euros of “live” money, a short time after Maddie’s disappearance. This GNR officer is essential to the entire investigation, given the fact that he was among the first to arrive at the location where the little girl disappeared, and also one of the first people to get into contact with the parents.

TVI has established that the case of the sudden 120 thousand euros in the GNR officer’s hands is being investigated by the Polícia Judiciária (PJ).
http://joana-morais.blogspot.com/2009/06/maddie-case-gnr-suspect-of-receiveing.html

Did the PJ ever get a satisfactory answer to their inquiries?

[Alfred R Jones]

I believe the child abducted from the bath did scream it's head off and the girl that was raped and murdered in a dormonitory was considerably older than Madeleine and therefore would be much more aware of her predicament and susceptible to threats to keep quiet.

So - the fact that a child was capable of screaming her head off didn't give the abductor pause for thought before breaking and entering, or taking her despite the fact that her mother was in the house?  I see.   I think this proves what insane risks child abductors are prepared to take, don't you?

[Mr Gray]

Since there were no previous confirmed cases of child abduction the police were right to be sceptical. 

As there hasn't been a repeat case in the area in the eight years following Maddie's disappearance an accident of some sort is beginning to look all the more possible.

no it isn't