The Leonor Cipriano case reviewed... AGAIN!

[Carana]

Marcos Aragão Correia seems to be a somewhat controversial figure.

Has anyone translated E) A OPINIÃO CIENTÍFICA DO CRIMINOLOGISTA DR. BARRA DA COSTA
on that same site?


There seem to be quite a few potentially valid points.

[DCI]

Really ?? Thanks again for bringing it to the thread.

You are welcome!

Seems its all true about the torture, otherwise why want an internal investigation.

When opened an internal investigation by the PJ and in relation to torture of Joan, a team of two inspectors from Lisbon, in private meeting with her in prison, having tried to negotiate an allocation of fault between the PJ and the same prison in relation to aggressive Leonor. As a person of integrity, Dr. Ana Calado obviously refused pact on something that their establishment had no responsibility.

[Redblossom]

You are welcome!

Seems its all true about the torture, otherwise why want an internal investigation.

When opened an internal investigation by the PJ and in relation to torture of Joan, a team of two inspectors from Lisbon, in private meeting with her in prison, having tried to negotiate an allocation of fault between the PJ and the same prison in relation to aggressive Leonor. As a person of integrity, Dr. Ana Calado obviously refused pact on something that their establishment had no responsibility.

Whose Joan and when was she tortured? I thnk google translate is better than this  psychic lawyers ramblings....deary me

[Redblossom]

I think that Joan is João Cipriano.

Well, reading through the long text now, in no 2 it says Joan was one of Leonors  six children, in no 6 Joao is referred to by correct name..so torture of Joan makes no sense........doesnt matter, wouldnt trust that lawyer as far as I could  throw him.......

[DCI]

I think that Joan is João Cipriano.

You think? I doubt it, "I want my daughter Joan". Spelling error perhaps, missed the a off the end?

[Jazzy]

You think? I doubt it, "I want my daughter Joan". Spelling error perhaps, missed the a off the end?

So they did.

[Redblossom]

So they did.

So what does the relation to the torture of Joan mean then??? was he on the wackybacky when writing it maybe

[Carana]

From another thread:

Carana

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Re: Has there been any other abductions on the Algarve?
« Reply #33 on: Today at 11:51:38 AM »

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Quote from: Montclair on November 02, 2013, 04:16:35 PM

    Concerning the part of the article, which contains many falsehoods, about Michael Cook, it is incorrect when the author says that confessions are the most important part of evidence. During the dictatorship, they were but now, as I have already stated several times on this forum, only confessions made in front of the judge during the trial are considered valid. I don't believe that the man was taken to the court with soiled clothing, the judge would have noticed right away and his lawyer would have made a complaint. This man, IMO, is just another person who committed a crime and wants everyone to believe that he has been a victim of a miscarriage of justice.


According to this extract from Barra da Costa though, Leonor and João Cipriano didn't confess during the trial.



A PJ fez um vídeo, durante as investigações, para reconstituir o crime. Neste filme, João descreveu o crime com detalhes brutais. O vídeo foi exibido no último dia de julgamento. Mas as palavras de João não tinham qualquer valor, já que ele e Leonor tinham optado por não prestar declarações em julgamento.
http://www.asmeninasquevieramdasestrelas.com/juridica.html


I realise that the lawyer's site is controversial, but would Barra da Costa misrepresent the facts of the original trial?

[Mr Gray]

From another thread:

Carana

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Re: Has there been any other abductions on the Algarve?
« Reply #33 on: Today at 11:51:38 AM »

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Quote from: Montclair on November 02, 2013, 04:16:35 PM

    Concerning the part of the article, which contains many falsehoods, about Michael Cook, it is incorrect when the author says that confessions are the most important part of evidence. During the dictatorship, they were but now, as I have already stated several times on this forum, only confessions made in front of the judge during the trial are considered valid. I don't believe that the man was taken to the court with soiled clothing, the judge would have noticed right away and his lawyer would have made a complaint. This man, IMO, is just another person who committed a crime and wants everyone to believe that he has been a victim of a miscarriage of justice.


According to this extract from Barra da Costa though, Leonor and João Cipriano didn't confess during the trial.



A PJ fez um vídeo, durante as investigações, para reconstituir o crime. Neste filme, João descreveu o crime com detalhes brutais. O vídeo foi exibido no último dia de julgamento. Mas as palavras de João não tinham qualquer valor, já que ele e Leonor tinham optado por não prestar declarações em julgamento.
http://www.asmeninasquevieramdasestrelas.com/juridica.html


I realise that the lawyer's site is controversial, but would Barra da Costa misrepresent the facts of the original trial?

 It was also reported in the newspapers that neither confessed during the trial so Montclair is wrong. You need to take what some posters say with a pinch of salt as they are willing to say anything to prove their agenda

[Carana]

It was also reported in the newspapers that neither confessed during the trial so Montclair is wrong. You need to take what some posters say with a pinch of salt as they are willing to say anything to prove their agenda

What on earth happened to this child? I haven't found anything to prove that she even returned home that evening.

[Mr Gray]

What on earth happened to this child? I haven't found anything to prove that she even returned home that evening.

 Not one speck of her blood ever found despite what the PJ and the court claimed happened

[Redblossom]

What on earth happened to this child? I haven't found anything to prove that she even returned home that evening.

Like the shoes she was wearing were in the flat?
Sorry but if she was genuinely missing why would they both change their statement a zillion times, why would the brother change his story from I killed her to his sister sold her? Etc If you find nothong wrong in this case you  need to have a word with yourseldpf about many things....reread the whole supreme court judgement.....and tell me its all boll******

[Mr Gray]

Like the shoes she was wearing were in the flat?
Sorry but if she was genuinely missing why would they both change their statement a zillion times, why would the brother change his story from I killed her to his sister sold her? Etc If you find nothong wrong in this case you  need to have a word with yourseldpf about many things....reread the whole supreme court judgement.....and tell me its all boll******

yesterday you claimed there was blood everywhere...why was not one drop of Joannas blood found

[Redblossom]

yesterday you claimed there was blood everywhere...why was not one drop of Joannas blood found

If you are going to respond to any of my posts at least respond to the flipping post instead of changing the goalposts.......

[Mr Gray]

Like the shoes she was wearing were in the flat?
Sorry but if she was genuinely missing why would they both change their statement a zillion times, why would the brother change his story from I killed her to his sister sold her? Etc If you find nothong wrong in this case you  need to have a word with yourseldpf about many things....reread the whole supreme court judgement.....and tell me its all boll******

Why did they change their statements..because they were tortured...which has been proved
ive read the court judgement and a lot of it is bol*******

Now...about the blood



yesterday you claimed there was blood everywhere...why was not one drop of Joannas blood found