Mrs Fenn and that crying child incident revisited.

[Lyall]

Don't know about spinning, just thinking aloud - 'processing' aloud, as the Americans say.

Liverpudlian tendency for outpouring.

Apologies to Liverpudlians for the stereotyped comment (if anyone cares what I say about Liverpudlians; I'm hardly the mayor of London).

I'm intrigued because when Madeleine's parents vowed to leave no stone unturned to find their daughter this presumably also means there is nothing they would not do if they believed it would help, and no tool they would not use. But you do not agree this could include listening to advice and managing the way the circumstances of the disappearance were described by the media?

[Sherlock Holmes]

I'm intrigued because when Madeleine's parents vowed to leave no stone unturned to find their daughter this presumably also means there is nothing they would not do if they believed it would help, and no tool they would not use. But you do not agree this could include listening to advice and managing the way the circumstances of the disappearance were described by the media?

Yes, I do agree actually, and as you know I am often critical of the way they have handled publicly certain aspects of the case.

The continued insistence, for example, that in dining away from the apartment they did nothing wrong, has clearly been extremely harmful to them. I don't know who ever advised them to say that, or if anyone at any point advised them  not to say that and they insisted on saying it anyway, but either way in my opinion it has been a mistake.

There is a distinction however between lapse in judgement, and obfuscation, and I think it is important to bear that distinction at the front of our minds when we try to analyse the McCanns' actions and words.

[Angelo222]

I have mentioned this before but I see no reason for not pointing it out again and that is that Kate McCann never once checked on the children the night Madeleine disappeared, she effectively left it to everyone else.  The McCanns left all three children and went for dinner at 8.30pm, it wasn't until 10pm and the end of the meal that Kate decided she should check on them.  The point I am making is that if she was so concerned about Madeleine's crying from the previous night she certainly didn't show it. 

[Lyall]

I have mentioned this before but I see no reason for not pointing it out again and that is that Kate McCann never once checked on the children the night Madeleine disappeared, she effectively left it to everyone else.  The McCanns left all three children and went for dinner at 8.30pm, it wasn't until 10pm and the end of the meal that Kate decided she should check on them.  The point I am making is that if she was so concerned about Madeleine's crying from the previous night she certainly didn't show it.

It certainly is a strange story, Angelo. And their book made us none the wiser. >@@(*&)

[Lyall]

Yes, I do agree actually, and as you know I am often critical of the way they have handled publicly certain aspects of the case.

The continued insistence, for example, that in dining away from the apartment they did nothing wrong, has clearly been extremely harmful to them. I don't know who ever advised them to say that, or if anyone at any point advised them  not to say that and they insisted on saying it anyway, but either way in my opinion it has been a mistake.

There is a distinction however between lapse in judgement, and obfuscation, and I think it is important to bear that distinction at the front of our minds when we try to analyse the McCanns' actions and words.

>@@(*&) Not sure you answered my question there, SH. I shall return to my probing (or not) questions later

[Sherlock Holmes]

>@@(*&) Not sure you answered my question there, SH. I shall return to my probing (or not) questions later

OK, Lyall! It is late over here as well so will sleep on it too...

[colombosstogey]

Youre so totally wrong


IF what happened hadnt happened, kate says, ie the abduction, which she didnt now know about till ten that night, then that comment from madeleine would never had passed her mind again..ONLY IT DID BEFORE she found out Madeleine was missing as she SPOKE Bout if BEFORE "IT" happened to all her mates...stop spinning benice.......its getting boring


... moderated out irrelevant ...

Well theres a thing I NEVER KNEW THAT.

So she mentioned what Maddy said to her at the dinner table THAT NIGHT.

Yikes that has given me pause for thought. Why?

You see for me, if it was THAT IMPORTANT this conversation by her daughter that SHE has to tell her friends THAT EVENING...then it must have been important enough in all the events of the day for her to remember it....this little conversation....

So IF it was THAT IMPORTANT, that she just had to tell all her friends about it, you would have thought it would have been QUITE TRAUMATIC for her daughter to have told her about it in the first place as obviously for the child to TALK about such a traumatic event in the morning one would think you would not want to let it happen again......BUT instead of staying at home and being their for your child, you just have to rush off to your friends and tell them all about it..........AND Mrs McCann was so worried about it, she never even got up to check on her daughter until 10pm....but let her friends do the checking for her.

Also IF the child had been crying the night before you would think when the parents came back in and they went to calm her down, it would have been THEN she would have said this...sob sob sob "why did you not come to us when we were crying"""""NOT IN THE MORNING.

Its like setting the scene....isnt it.

Sadly this one thing makes me have evil thoughts with regards to the McCanns...how could they leave her again...this is one of the reasons I cant jump down off the fence....

[jassi]

Well theres a thing I NEVER KNEW THAT.

So she mentioned what Maddy said to her at the dinner table THAT NIGHT.

Yikes that has given me pause for thought. Why?

You see for me, if it was THAT IMPORTANT this conversation by her daughter that SHE has to tell her friends THAT EVENING...then it must have been important enough in all the events of the day for her to remember it....this little conversation....

So IF it was THAT IMPORTANT, that she just had to tell all her friends about it, you would have thought it would have been QUITE TRAUMATIC for her daughter to have told her about it in the first place as obviously for the child to TALK about such a traumatic event in the morning one would think you would not want to let it happen again......BUT instead of staying at home and being their for your child, you just have to rush off to your friends and tell them all about it..........AND Mrs McCann was so worried about it, she never even got up to check on her daughter until 10pm....but let her friends do the checking for her.

Also IF the child had been crying the night before you would think when the parents came back in and they went to calm her down, it would have been THEN she would have said this...sob sob sob "why did you not come to us when we were crying"""""NOT IN THE MORNING.

Its like setting the scene....isnt it.

Sadly this one thing makes me have evil thoughts with regards to the McCanns...how could they leave her again...this is one of the reasons I cant jump down off the fence....

Yes indeed, which in turn would lead one to think that whatever happened to Madeleine happened before they went to the Tapas.

[pathfinder73]

The bottom line is that Madeleine was overheard to cry on two consecutive nights.  Why was it that Sean and Amelie never roused for the entire night even when transferred to another apartment?  Had someone as Kate herself suggested, slipped something into the children's food or drink earlier that day?

Rachael stayed in on the 2nd and she was in the apartment next door to 5A. Don't you think she would've heard Madeleine and Sean crying? She didn't hear anything. Everything that has been said about the night implies an abductor possibly being in the apartment i.e. night before and before Gerry's check with the half-open door and an open window that nobody passed through.

[colombosstogey]

Rachael stayed in on the 2nd and she was in the apartment next door to 5A. Don't you think she would've heard Madeleine and Sean crying? She didn't hear anything. Everything that has been said about the night implies an abductor possibly being in the apartment i.e. night before and before Gerry's check with the half-open door and an open window that nobody passed through.

BUT would she say something if she had?

[pathfinder73]

BUT would she say something if she had?

Well I certainly think she would have done something about it if it had happened. She wouldn't ignore it if she could hear them wailing for ages. The crying incident happened on the 1st and was changed to the 2nd to promote an abductor being in the apartment the night before she disappeared.

[Redblossom]

Well I certainly think she would have done something about it if it had happened. She wouldn't ignore it if she could hear them wailing for ages. No the crying incident happened on the 1st and was changed to the 2nd to promote an abductor being in the apartment the night before she disappeared.

For a "dry run" !!

and possibly drugging the kids too!

Seen this in films over bank heists or escape from colditz, never in a child abduction case, KM has a very fertive imagnation



 >@@(*&)

[jassi]

BUT would she say something if she had?

And when might she have had the opportunity ? If I recall rightly, she didn't come into contact with the McCanns on the 3rd until evening time.

[colombosstogey]

Well I certainly think she would have done something about it if it had happened. She wouldn't ignore it if she could hear them wailing for ages. The crying incident happened on the 1st and was changed to the 2nd to promote an abductor being in the apartment the night before she disappeared.

Yes perhaps Racheal texted Mrs McCann to tell her the children were awake....

[Redblossom]

Yes perhaps Racheal texted Mrs McCann to tell her the children were awake....

Dont think so....otherwise k and G wouldnt be wonderiing when it was they cried, at bath time, bedtime, etc