Author Topic: Are the Tapas Rogatory statements as released by Duarte Levy genuine?  (Read 31295 times)

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Offline peter claridge

Re: Are the Tapas Rogatory statements as released by Duarte Levy genuine?
« Reply #16 on: April 09, 2014, 10:10:49 PM »
Compare the first two timelines written by Russell O'Brien the partner of Jane Tanner, members will notice that he makes no mention of Jane's claimed second visit to her apartment on either, nor on the first does he recall his joint check with Mathew Oldfield which in the third timeline became incredibly detailed (for obvious reasons).

http://www.mccannfiles.com/id261.html#tap19

http://www.mccannfiles.com/id261.html#tap20

icabodcrane

  • Guest
Re: Are the Tapas Rogatory statements as released by Duarte Levy genuine?
« Reply #17 on: April 09, 2014, 11:05:54 PM »
So where did the rogs come from..does anyone know

From the published police files 

The ones that were available to the world's press and public alike

Your claim that some fellow called  Levy is  the 'only'  source of access to the rogatory interviews is utterly ridiculous

*edited to add*

Sorry Davel, it was not your ridiculous claim was it ?  ...  it was ferryman's 

My apologies
« Last Edit: April 09, 2014, 11:13:48 PM by icabodcrane »

Offline gilet

Re: Are the Tapas Rogatory statements as released by Duarte Levy genuine?
« Reply #18 on: April 10, 2014, 12:12:55 AM »
I'm confused too Cariad

It seems ferryman is suggesting the 'source'  of the rogatory interviews is not the police files,  but some fellow called  Levy

Most odd

The source of the Tapas Group Rogatory Interviews is categorically not the Police Files as contained in the DVD which Pamalam reproduces on her blog.

If you disagree with that statement. please show where in those files they are to be found.

I will even give you a link to the files to make your life easier.

This site contains the contents of the main DVD which the PT authorities released to journalists after the archival of the case. That DVD contains 1.07 GB of data which is reproduced on the site below.

http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/PAGE_ORDER.htm

This is the only time that the files of a case have been released in this way in Portugal. The normal system is that the files are released but only to be viewed by the journalists through an appointment system at the relevant police staion. The journalists are not normally allowed to copy directly information or to take away information from the office where they are allowed to see it. They can simply make notes and report on it. 

In this case there was such a demand for access to the files that the normal system could not cope. Therefore the journalists were issued with DVDs containing the files.  On being issued with the copies of the DVDs though, the assembled journalists were reminded that the rule relating to the copying wholesale of the material was forbidden. It could be quoted and reported upon but remained copyright and was not to be published as a complete file.

Clearly that rule has not been upheld since as two clear breaches are known.

First, the extremely "mysterious" journalist Duarte Levy broke the rule and released copies of the DVD with which he had been issued. This was the 1.07 GB version which Pamalam has produced which contained four files - Apensos, Cartos Rogatorias, Outros Apensos and Processo. The DVD was released to the world by Levy not in the press or on his own blog which was very active at the time but literally by hand to various chosen people who he had seen posting derogatory statements about the McCanns.

You might think that the Tapas group Rogatories were in that Cartos Rogatorias section of that DVD with the list of questions to be posed to them and the other witnesses. But you would be wrong. All the other witness statements are there but not theirs. That seems very odd. Why include the questions to be asked of them but forget to include the answers? All the other witness statements are there with the list of questions each was to be asked.

The document containing the list of questions for all the witnesses (Tapas Group and others) is there but the responses are only from the Non Tapas group members.

Something, as an aside, that not many people know is that only one other witness besides the Tapas group who was questioned at the Rogatories was videoed. The remainder were not.

Now, did Levy tamper with the original DVD and remove the Tapas rogatories to be released later or where they on a separate DVD which he then released later?

The Tapas group interviews were contained in video format on 26 separate DVDs.

The Tapas Rogatories were released by Levy at a later date. Again he chose someone who had been posting online about the McCanns, this time in a more bipartisan way but who nevertheless was associated with anti McCann feeling. Her online ID was Nicked and she came from Northern England. To this day it is only that copy of the Tapas Rogatories which exists in public. No other source more direct than Levy and this poster exists.

After they had been released in this bizarre way, they were posted on his own blog and backdated to May 2008.

The archival of the case did not take place till after this date and no journalist had access to any of the files till then (late June 2008).
It has always amused me that those who rely on the PJ Files as the fount of all knowledge, forget the route which that information took before they were allowed to clap eyes on it.  They talk of the files as though they are exactly as the PT Prosecutor released them into the hands of the journalists but they may well not be.

Levy, a great friend of Amaral, could possibly have released the material on these two occasions without the slightest alteration. That is true. But just as possible is the other option, that he tampered with that material. And before anyone asks why that might have been, don't forget that Levy was one of Amaral's greatest supporters. A motive could lie in that support especially as by the end of 2008 it was clear that the McCanns were not entirely happy with the work of Amaral on the case or the book he wrote and published just as the case was archived.


« Last Edit: April 10, 2014, 12:19:40 AM by gilet »

icabodcrane

  • Guest
Re: Are the Tapas Rogatory statements as released by Duarte Levy genuine?
« Reply #19 on: April 10, 2014, 12:17:59 AM »
The source of the Tapas Group Rogatory Interviews is categorically not the Police Files as contained in the DVD which Pamalam reproduces on her blog.

If you disagree with that statement. please show where in those files they are to be found.

I will even give you a link to the files to make your life easier.

This site contains the contents of the main DVD which the PT authorities released to journalists after the archival of the case. That DVD contains 1.07 GB of data which is reproduced on the site below.

http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/PAGE_ORDER.htm

This is the only time that the files of a case have been released in this way in Portugal. The normal system is that the files are released but only to be viewed by the journalists through an appointment system at the relevant police staion. The journalists are not normally allowed to copy directly information or to take away information from the office where they are allowed to see it. They can simply make notes and report on it. 

In this case there was such a demand for access to the files that the normal system could not cope. Therefore the journalists were issued with DVDs containing the files.  On being issued with the copies of the DVDs though, the assembled journalists were reminded that the rule relating to the copying wholesale of the material was forbidden. It could be quoted and reported upon but remained copyright and was not to be published as a complete file.

Clearly that rule has not been upheld since as two clear breaches are known.

First, the extremely "mysterious" journalist Duarte Levy broke the rule and released copies of the DVD with which he had been issued. This was the 1.07 GB version which Pamalam has produced which contained four files - Apensos, Cartos Rogatorias, Outros Apensos and Processo. The DVD was released to the world by Levy not in the press or on his own blog which was very active at the time but literally by hand to various chosen people who he had seen posting derogatory statements about the McCanns.

You might think that the Tapas group Rogatories were in that Cartos Rogatorias section of that DVD with the list of questions to be posed to them and the other witnesses. But you would be wrong. All the other witness statements are there but not theirs. That seems very odd. Why include the questions to be asked of them but forget to include the answers? All the other witness statements are there with the list of questions each was to be asked.

The document containing the list of questions for all the witnesses (Tapas Group and others) is there but the responses are only from the Non Tapas group members.

Something, as an aside, that not many people know is that only one other witness besides the Tapas group who was questioned at the Rogatories was videoed. The remainder were not.

Now, did Levy tamper with the original DVD and remove the Tapas rogatories to be released later or where they on a separate DVD which he then released later?

The Tapas group interviews were contained in video format on 26 separate DVDs.

It wasn't till December 2008 when the Tapas Rogatories were released by Levy. Again he chose someone who had been posting online about the McCanns, this time in a more bipartisan way but who nevertheless was associated with anti McCann feeling. Her online ID was Nicked and she came from Northern England. To this day it is only that copy of the Tapas Rogatories which exists in public. No other source more direct than Levy and this poster exists.

It has always amused me that those who rely on the PJ Files as the fount of all knowledge, forget the route which that information took before they were allowed to clap eyes on it.  They talk of the files as though they are exactly as the PT Prosecutor released them into the hands of the journalists but they may well not be.

Levy, a great friend of Amaral, could possibly have released the material on these two occasions without the slightest alteration. That is true. But just as possible is the other option, that he tampered with that material. And before anyone asks why that might have been, don't forget that Levy was one of Amaral's greatest supporters. A motive could lie in that support especially as by the end of 2008 it was clear that the McCanns were not entirely happy with the work of Amaral on the case or the book he wrote and published just as the case was archived.

I can't make head nor tail of that

Are you saying that the rogatory interviews are not in the police files released  publicly  ?   

Offline gilet

Re: Are the Tapas Rogatory statements as released by Duarte Levy genuine?
« Reply #20 on: April 10, 2014, 12:26:13 AM »
I am saying that the ONLY copy of the PJ Files which is in the public domain is that handed to a selected band of individuals by the journalist Duarte Levy.

In the initial DVD which he handed over to those people the Tapas Rogatory Interviews were nowhere to be found (although all the other Rogatory interviews were present).

The originald DVD which he handed over to those people is on the Pamalam site linked to above.

Not till later did the Tapas Group Rogatory interviews get released via Levy again, this time via another poster on a blog/forum.

All this happened, of course, after the archival of the case in June 2008 when Levy and other journalists received their copies of the DVD from the PT authorities.

Levy then backdated these particular rogatories to May 2008 on his own blog in some kind of pretence that he had the information back then.

The PJ FILES were never released to the public by the Portuguese Authorities.  It is not within the law there for them to do that. And no other journalist has broken the law in the way that Duarte Levy did by releasing the whole document.

There is absolutely no way that anyone can verify the content of the online version of the PJ Files unless they are an accredited journalist with their own copy of the files as released by the Portuguese.
« Last Edit: April 10, 2014, 12:28:10 AM by gilet »

icabodcrane

  • Guest
Re: Are the Tapas Rogatory statements as released by Duarte Levy genuine?
« Reply #21 on: April 10, 2014, 12:31:49 AM »
I am saying that the ONLY copy of the PJ Files which is in the public domain is that handed to a selected band of individuals by the journalist Duarte Levy.

In the initial DVD which he handed over to those people the Tapas Rogatory Interviews were nowhere to be found (although all the other Rogatory interviews were present).

The originald DVD which he handed over to those people is on the Pamalam site linked to above.

Not till later did the Tapas Group Rogatory interviews get released via Levy again, this time via another poster on a blog/forum.

All this happened, of course, after the archival of the case in June 2008 when Levy and other journalists received their copies of the DVD from the PT authorities.

Levy then backdated these particular rogatories to May 2008 on his own blog in some kind of pretence that he had the information back then.

The PJ FILES were never released to the public by the Portuguese Authorities.  It is not within the law there for them to do that. And no other journalist has broken the law in the way that Duarte Levy did by releasing the whole document.

So the rogatory interviews  ARE  in the police files  that were released to the public  ?     ( the  'press'  ARE  the public, by the way  )   

For heaven's sake then  ...   how can you possibly make a  'conspiracy'  out of that  ? 

Offline gilet

Re: Are the Tapas Rogatory statements as released by Duarte Levy genuine?
« Reply #22 on: April 10, 2014, 12:39:57 AM »
So the rogatory interviews  ARE  in the police files  that were released to the public  ?     ( the  'press'  ARE  the public, by the way  )   

For heaven's sake then  ...   how can you possibly make a  'conspiracy'  out of that  ?


Your understanding of the status of the press in Portuguese law is simply flawed. They were not put in the public domain by the Portuguese authorities. They were provided as a tool for research for journalists which were specifically not to be reproduced.

They were duplicated illegally by the journalist Levy.

And the ONLY available copy to you is that issued by Levy. There is nothing to show that it is the same as the copy issued by the Portuguese. It could have been altered by him at any time.

There is no way that anyone here can know if the content is as released by the Portuguese authorities.

Now when you show me a copy of the Files which can be proven to be as released by the Portuguese authorities I might start relying on these files more heavily. Till then they may or may not be the real thing.

If you want to believe with 100% faith in a mysterious journalist whose credentials don't stack up, whose history is unknown, who is attached to one side of the case, who has been proven to have lied in the past, and whose method of releasing those files was quite bizarre, then do carry on. I certainly won't be surprised by your decision.

And NO the Tapas Rogatories are not in the DVD which Levy released at first as the OFFICIAL PJ FILES and which Pamalam has reproduced.

They came later with no apparent sourcing or PJ numbering.
« Last Edit: April 10, 2014, 12:41:52 AM by gilet »

drummer

  • Guest
Re: Are the Tapas Rogatory statements as released by Duarte Levy genuine?
« Reply #23 on: April 10, 2014, 12:41:52 AM »
"In this post I will expose and prove how the so called journalist 'Duarte Levy' is nothing more than a con man, a swindler and a dangerous pathological liar". Joanna Morais.

Is this the same Levy person?


Offline gilet

Re: Are the Tapas Rogatory statements as released by Duarte Levy genuine?
« Reply #24 on: April 10, 2014, 12:46:18 AM »
"In this post I will expose and prove how the so called journalist 'Duarte Levy' is nothing more than a con man, a swindler and a dangerous pathological liar". Joanna Morais.

Is this the same Levy person?
Yes, this con man, swindler and dangerous pathological liar (in the words of Joana Morais who is not known for her pro Gerry and Kate feelings) is the only source of the PJ OFFICIAL FILES.  No other source has ever come forward to illegally distribute them as he did.

« Last Edit: April 10, 2014, 12:48:24 AM by gilet »

icabodcrane

  • Guest
Re: Are the Tapas Rogatory statements as released by Duarte Levy genuine?
« Reply #25 on: April 10, 2014, 12:52:46 AM »

"Your understanding of the status of the press in Portuguese law is simply flawed.

They were not put in the public domain by the Portuguese authorities.

They were provided as a tool for research for journalists which were specifically not to be reproduced"


What the hell is that supposed to  mean  ?   ...  provided as a tool for research for journalists !

You talk rubbish gilet 
   
You dress it up to  'sound'  impressive  ...   but you talk rubbish


« Last Edit: April 11, 2014, 05:29:44 AM by John »

drummer

  • Guest
Re: Are the Tapas Rogatory statements as released by Duarte Levy genuine?
« Reply #26 on: April 10, 2014, 01:00:39 AM »
This case gets more bizarre each day, if this Levy business is true it's shocking.

icabodcrane

  • Guest
Re: Are the Tapas Rogatory statements as released by Duarte Levy genuine?
« Reply #27 on: April 10, 2014, 01:09:20 AM »
This case gets more bizarre each day, if this Levy business is true it's shocking.

oh gawd  ...  another one with the vapours ! 

I don't even know who this  'Levy' character is,  but are we seriously  being asked to believe that  the anomolies in the tapas crew's statements don't really    'exist'   ...  and are  actually  (  and  'shockingly'  ) nothing more than  his  dastardly invention  ? 

Xrist  !   talk about a  conspiracy too far 

Offline gilet

Re: Are the Tapas Rogatory statements as released by Duarte Levy genuine?
« Reply #28 on: April 10, 2014, 01:16:37 AM »

"Your understanding of the status of the press in Portuguese law is simply flawed.

They were not put in the public domain by the Portuguese authorities.

They were provided as a tool for research for journalists which were specifically not to be reproduced"



What the hell is that supposed to  mean  ?   ...  provided as a tool for research for journalists !

You talk rubbish gilet 
   
You dress it up to  'sound'  impressive  ...   but you talk rubbish

Really?

Perhaps if you bothered to actually read the first post I made, instead of simply dismissing it and read it more than once if you need to to understand it, then you might realise what the normal practice is in Portugal and why this was an exceptional situation.

But to simplify if for you as you struggled with the long post earlier.

Journalists do NOT get a copy of the files released to them at the end of a case.

They get limited access by appointment to VIEW the files and they are allowed to make notes about those files. They are NOT allowed to make direct copies of those files.

They are allowed to use them only as a tool to assist their research into the case in question and its outcome.

« Last Edit: April 10, 2014, 01:22:31 AM by gilet »

Offline gilet

Re: Are the Tapas Rogatory statements as released by Duarte Levy genuine?
« Reply #29 on: April 10, 2014, 01:21:02 AM »
oh gawd  ...  another one with the vapours ! 

I don't even know who this  'Levy' character is,  but are we seriously  being asked to believe that  the anomolies in the tapas crew's statements don't really    'exist'   ...  and are  actually  (  and  'shockingly'  ) nothing more than  his  dastardly invention  ? 

Xrist  !   talk about a  conspiracy too far

No-one said the anomalies don't exist. You are not actually managing to read what is being posted properly.

Anomalies always exist between statements taken at different times and from different witnesses. Just go and ask a friendly policeman and he will explain it in simple terms.

What is being questioned is the wisdom (or otherwise) of placing 100% reliance on such a swindler and con man to deliver the truth when there is no record of him ever having done so before, indeed quite the opposite.