Author Topic: Scotland Yard about to commence digs in and around Praia da Luz.  (Read 116360 times)

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ferryman

  • Guest
Re: Scotland Yard about to commence digs in and around Praia da Luz.
« Reply #90 on: May 05, 2014, 05:42:48 PM »
20 squaure kilometres or something like 12 square miles.

That's a heck of a lot of digging.

Harrison's hedged view was that if death had occurred it was most likely Madeleine's remains had been deposited into the sea ...

Then again, Grime didn't listen to Harrison.

So why should anyone else?

Offline jassi

Re: Scotland Yard about to commence digs in and around Praia da Luz.
« Reply #91 on: May 05, 2014, 05:45:21 PM »
And it's taken them seven years to arrive at this point - why?

Most of that time the case had been inactive - archived.
I believe everything. And l believe nothing.
I suspect everyone. And l suspect no one.
I gather the facts, examine the clues... and before   you know it, the case is solved!"

Or maybe not -

OG have been pushed out by the Germans who have reserved all the deck chairs for the foreseeable future

Offline Mr Gray

Re: Scotland Yard about to commence digs in and around Praia da Luz.
« Reply #92 on: May 05, 2014, 05:51:29 PM »
Most of that time the case had been inactive - archived.

So the information used to reopen the case that has been in the files has been ignored

Offline pathfinder73

Re: Scotland Yard about to commence digs in and around Praia da Luz.
« Reply #93 on: May 05, 2014, 05:52:32 PM »
20 squaure kilometres or something like 12 square miles.

That's a heck of a lot of digging.

Harrison's hedged view was that if death had occurred it was most likely Madeleine's remains had been deposited into the sea ...

Then again, Grime didn't listen to Harrison.

So why should anyone else?

Unless prime suspect Smithman walked a further 100 metres into the sea where do you think they'll start searching?
« Last Edit: May 05, 2014, 05:54:30 PM by pathfinder73 »
Smithman carrying a child in his arms checked his watch after passing the Smith family and the time was 10:03. Both are still unidentified 10 years later.

Offline Carana

Re: Scotland Yard about to commence digs in and around Praia da Luz.
« Reply #94 on: May 05, 2014, 05:54:12 PM »
Before I attempt to read through this entire thread... is the Met on record concerning these supposed digs, or is it just more tabloid rumour that has spread like the usual Chinese whispers?

Offline jassi

Re: Scotland Yard about to commence digs in and around Praia da Luz.
« Reply #95 on: May 05, 2014, 05:57:07 PM »
So the information used to reopen the case that has been in the files has been ignored

You would have to address that question to the officers in charge at the time.
I believe everything. And l believe nothing.
I suspect everyone. And l suspect no one.
I gather the facts, examine the clues... and before   you know it, the case is solved!"

Or maybe not -

OG have been pushed out by the Germans who have reserved all the deck chairs for the foreseeable future

Offline sadie

Re: Scotland Yard about to commence digs in and around Praia da Luz.
« Reply #96 on: May 05, 2014, 05:57:51 PM »
Unless prime suspect Smithman walked a further 100 metres into the sea where do you think they'll start searching?

There has been speculation about the Murats driveway, so I think they will start there.   Seems Robert Murat is about to get a new drive !

'Twould be a good thing to get that out of the way, dont you think?

Alfred R Jones

  • Guest
Re: Scotland Yard about to commence digs in and around Praia da Luz.
« Reply #97 on: May 05, 2014, 06:08:19 PM »
Most of that time the case had been inactive - archived.
Well why didn't they conduct the searches while the case WAS active then?  Bit of a glaring oversight wasn't it?

Cornelius

  • Guest
Re: Scotland Yard about to commence digs in and around Praia da Luz.
« Reply #98 on: May 05, 2014, 06:10:37 PM »
Before I attempt to read through this entire thread... is the Met on record concerning these supposed digs, or is it just more tabloid rumour that has spread like the usual Chinese whispers?
Maybe it is true and they are trying to trick the dog?

Alfred R Jones

  • Guest
Re: Scotland Yard about to commence digs in and around Praia da Luz.
« Reply #99 on: May 05, 2014, 06:10:45 PM »
There has been speculation about the Murats driveway, so I think they will start there.   Seems Robert Murat is about to get a new drive !

'Twould be a good thing to get that out of the way, dont you think?
I very much doubt they will start with Murat's drive, the clear implication of such an activity would be that he was involved in her disappearance and unless they have some evidence that he is and have a warrant to search his property, I doubt he would give them permission. 
« Last Edit: May 05, 2014, 07:56:43 PM by Alfred R Jones »

Offline pathfinder73

Re: Scotland Yard about to commence digs in and around Praia da Luz.
« Reply #100 on: May 05, 2014, 06:54:39 PM »
There has been speculation about the Murats driveway, so I think they will start there.   Seems Robert Murat is about to get a new drive !

'Twould be a good thing to get that out of the way, dont you think?

No it wouldn't. She is not there   8-)(--)

PAT KENNY: It is 7 years since 3 year old Madeleine McCann disappeared in the Portuguese resort of Praia da Luz. If she is alive she is a very different looking 10 year old but it looks as though the British investigating Police do not believe in such a likelihood because it is reported in today’s Mirror that they will be launching extensive digs around the resort in the hopes of recovering her body. The Mirror’s Russell Myers joins me now from Praia da Luz. Russell, good morning.

RUSSELL MYERS: Good morning Pat.

PAT KENNY: Now, The English police, the British police are they acting on any specific information?

RUSSELL MYERS: Well it seems that the investigation carried out by the Met police, Operation Grange which is going over a lot of the evidence that the Portuguese police had been examining since 2007. This isn’t actually new evidence that has been uncovered with the new investigation but it’s certainly a new revisiting of the old facts in case files from the Portuguese police.

PAT KENNY: Now, at the time there were searches I suppose in the believe that Madeleine may be still alive or if she had been killed that an opportunistic killer would dispose of her body somewhere adjacent to the scene of the abduction. Why were those searches not as thorough and as extensive as it would appear were needed at the time?

RUSSELL MYERS: I think this is been a problem with the Portuguese investigation in terms of how the British have seen how the Portuguese investigation was carried out in the first instance and I think to entirely satisfy themselves they want to go over old ground and to look at these excavation sites or potential sites that were earmarked in the first instance but potentially not carried out, so by British Police applying to Portuguese police to come out here and start excavating certain sites in and around Praia da Luz and the beach and the area where Madeleine went missing I think that they will try and find their own answers to questions that should have, you know, been answered a long time ago.

PAT KENNY: Now how much waste ground, how much potential is there for digging in places that people would not be normally visiting for example in Portugal a lot of the time fields are covered in orange tree plants and they would be tended regularly by the farmers, so what sort of areas are there to be explored?

RUSSELL MYERS: I think specifically they’re looking at 3 areas and this is what we are hearing in today’s story, looking 3 areas which are planned for major excavation. Now these were 2 areas very close to the apartment at the Ocean Club where Madeleine and her parents had been staying in 2007. There’s also an area of beach that has been actually reworked since 2004. Also there is two main areas of grassland very nearby and a road that has been relayed in 2007 very very soon after Madeleine went missing. So these are the areas that they want to revisit and essentially the British police think that Portuguese Police authorities hadn’t paid enough attention to these areas and that is why they want to go back to them.

PAT KENNY: Now, it is 7 years since she disappeared, technology moves on. Is there any specific equipment that is new that will aid them in their investigations?

RUSSELL MYERS: Certainly, I think that, you know that Metropolitan Police will employ a world renowned forensic expert with this investigation. I think they will be using radar equipment. We heard that there is a certain magnetic imaging device that they will use within these excavation techniques that will allow them to ............... map the area and search for human bones if they are indeed buried underground.

PAT KENNY: Now, what about the McCann family, Gerry and Kate McCann, are they dismayed by this, because this would be, if you like, an indication that the Met believe that Madeleine is definitely dead or do they continue to hope?

RUSSELL MYERS: Well, indeed, I mean Kate and Gerry have never given up hope that Madeleine is still alive. They’ve had a tireless campaign now for 7 years, where they were seen at the weekend at their local church in Leicestershire and you know, privately they are saying that although they would always prepare themselves for the worst in these events they still haven’t given up hope of finding Madeleine alive.

PAT KENNY: Now, there is a suspect who’s been named and he was a suspect in a number of attacks on people in the area from about 2004 on.

RUSSELL MYERS: Yes, this is a local guy called Euclides Monteiro and he was a former worker at the Ocean Club apartments where the McCanns had been staying. Now Euclides was actually killed in a tractor accident in 2009 but over the weekend it’s emerged that he was actually interviewed in 2008, a year before his death, relating to a spate of sex attacks on young British girls connected with a string of burglaries in the area. Portuguese police have always said, you know, recently that he is the main suspect, not only in the string of 18 sex attacks and burglaries across the Algarve but indeed that they believe that he is one of the main suspects in the Madeleine McCann investigation. From what we’re hearing I don’t think the Met Police really are going along with that line of enquiry. It seems that he may be a suspect connected to certain string of burglaries in the area but it still has yet to be seen whether he is actually the main suspect in Madeleine....

PAT KENNY: His widow has been spoken to by various journalists and her contention is that he was questioned yes, but there was never any DNA evidence to link him with any of these crimes, so in death I suppose you could say which you like you cannot libel the dead but the finger has been pointed at him, probably wrongly according to her.

RUSSELL MYERS: Well, essentially we will never know whether he was a, no one’s had a confession and it’s really his widow’s word against the police and until the police actually come out publicly and state that he is the main suspect in their investigation I think a lot is left to hearsay and of course his widow defends his name when he’s not here.

PAT KENNY: When will the British investigating team start their digging?

RUSSELL MYERS: Well I should think we’re looking at the next 2 weeks. Obviously, it’s a lengthy process in Portugal. The Met Police had to put in several letters asking to actually come over here. The problem with the Portuguese investigation is that they really wanted to be allowed to get on with their own ........ but obviously the McCanns have been very frustrated about the lack of movement within the investigation so I think best case scenario we’re looking at 2 weeks  for Met Police officers to be on the ground and start their excavation.

PAT KENNY: And the final question really relates to the Portuguese authorities in this regard. I mean they have the go ahead now to do it, but we’re coming into high season, holiday season, it’s probably the last thing that the Portuguese tourism authorities really want is British police scratching around looking for the body of a dead tourist child.

RUSSELL MYERS: Undoubtedly I think you’ll bring some unwanted attention back to the resort, it’s a  very picturesque, pretty resort at high season and I think the British police wanted to avoid that and that’s why several months ago they’ve been asking to carry out these digs and because the Portuguese authorities have really dragged their heels over it that they’re probably the ones to blame as to how long it’s actually taken.

PAT KENNY: Alright, well, Russell Myers of the Daily Mirror, thank you very much for joining us from Praia da Luz.
Smithman carrying a child in his arms checked his watch after passing the Smith family and the time was 10:03. Both are still unidentified 10 years later.

Offline sadie

Re: Scotland Yard about to commence digs in and around Praia da Luz.
« Reply #101 on: May 05, 2014, 07:07:55 PM »
No it wouldn't. She is not there   8-)(--)

PAT KENNY: It is 7 years since 3 year old Madeleine McCann disappeared in the Portuguese resort of Praia da Luz. If she is alive she is a very different looking 10 year old but it looks as though the British investigating Police do not believe in such a likelihood because it is reported in today’s Mirror that they will be launching extensive digs around the resort in the hopes of recovering her body. The Mirror’s Russell Myers joins me now from Praia da Luz. Russell, good morning.

RUSSELL MYERS: Good morning Pat.

PAT KENNY: Now, The English police, the British police are they acting on any specific information?

RUSSELL MYERS: Well it seems that the investigation carried out by the Met police, Operation Grange which is going over a lot of the evidence that the Portuguese police had been examining since 2007. This isn’t actually new evidence that has been uncovered with the new investigation but it’s certainly a new revisiting of the old facts in case files from the Portuguese police.

PAT KENNY: Now, at the time there were searches I suppose in the believe that Madeleine may be still alive or if she had been killed that an opportunistic killer would dispose of her body somewhere adjacent to the scene of the abduction. Why were those searches not as thorough and as extensive as it would appear were needed at the time?

RUSSELL MYERS: I think this is been a problem with the Portuguese investigation in terms of how the British have seen how the Portuguese investigation was carried out in the first instance and I think to entirely satisfy themselves they want to go over old ground and to look at these excavation sites or potential sites that were earmarked in the first instance but potentially not carried out, so by British Police applying to Portuguese police to come out here and start excavating certain sites in and around Praia da Luz and the beach and the area where Madeleine went missing I think that they will try and find their own answers to questions that should have, you know, been answered a long time ago.

PAT KENNY: Now how much waste ground, how much potential is there for digging in places that people would not be normally visiting for example in Portugal a lot of the time fields are covered in orange tree plants and they would be tended regularly by the farmers, so what sort of areas are there to be explored?

RUSSELL MYERS: I think specifically they’re looking at 3 areas and this is what we are hearing in today’s story, looking 3 areas which are planned for major excavation. Now these were 2 areas very close to the apartment at the Ocean Club where Madeleine and her parents had been staying in 2007. There’s also an area of beach that has been actually reworked since 2004. Also there is two main areas of grassland very nearby and a road that has been relayed in 2007 very very soon after Madeleine went missing. So these are the areas that they want to revisit and essentially the British police think that Portuguese Police authorities hadn’t paid enough attention to these areas and that is why they want to go back to them.

PAT KENNY: Now, it is 7 years since she disappeared, technology moves on. Is there any specific equipment that is new that will aid them in their investigations?

RUSSELL MYERS: Certainly, I think that, you know that Metropolitan Police will employ a world renowned forensic expert with this investigation. I think they will be using radar equipment. We heard that there is a certain magnetic imaging device that they will use within these excavation techniques that will allow them to ............... map the area and search for human bones if they are indeed buried underground.

PAT KENNY: Now, what about the McCann family, Gerry and Kate McCann, are they dismayed by this, because this would be, if you like, an indication that the Met believe that Madeleine is definitely dead or do they continue to hope?

RUSSELL MYERS: Well, indeed, I mean Kate and Gerry have never given up hope that Madeleine is still alive. They’ve had a tireless campaign now for 7 years, where they were seen at the weekend at their local church in Leicestershire and you know, privately they are saying that although they would always prepare themselves for the worst in these events they still haven’t given up hope of finding Madeleine alive.

PAT KENNY: Now, there is a suspect who’s been named and he was a suspect in a number of attacks on people in the area from about 2004 on.

RUSSELL MYERS: Yes, this is a local guy called Euclides Monteiro and he was a former worker at the Ocean Club apartments where the McCanns had been staying. Now Euclides was actually killed in a tractor accident in 2009 but over the weekend it’s emerged that he was actually interviewed in 2008, a year before his death, relating to a spate of sex attacks on young British girls connected with a string of burglaries in the area. Portuguese police have always said, you know, recently that he is the main suspect, not only in the string of 18 sex attacks and burglaries across the Algarve but indeed that they believe that he is one of the main suspects in the Madeleine McCann investigation. From what we’re hearing I don’t think the Met Police really are going along with that line of enquiry. It seems that he may be a suspect connected to certain string of burglaries in the area but it still has yet to be seen whether he is actually the main suspect in Madeleine....

PAT KENNY: His widow has been spoken to by various journalists and her contention is that he was questioned yes, but there was never any DNA evidence to link him with any of these crimes, so in death I suppose you could say which you like you cannot libel the dead but the finger has been pointed at him, probably wrongly according to her.

RUSSELL MYERS: Well, essentially we will never know whether he was a, no one’s had a confession and it’s really his widow’s word against the police and until the police actually come out publicly and state that he is the main suspect in their investigation I think a lot is left to hearsay and of course his widow defends his name when he’s not here.

PAT KENNY: When will the British investigating team start their digging?

RUSSELL MYERS: Well I should think we’re looking at the next 2 weeks. Obviously, it’s a lengthy process in Portugal. The Met Police had to put in several letters asking to actually come over here. The problem with the Portuguese investigation is that they really wanted to be allowed to get on with their own ........ but obviously the McCanns have been very frustrated about the lack of movement within the investigation so I think best case scenario we’re looking at 2 weeks  for Met Police officers to be on the ground and start their excavation.

PAT KENNY: And the final question really relates to the Portuguese authorities in this regard. I mean they have the go ahead now to do it, but we’re coming into high season, holiday season, it’s probably the last thing that the Portuguese tourism authorities really want is British police scratching around looking for the body of a dead tourist child.

RUSSELL MYERS: Undoubtedly I think you’ll bring some unwanted attention back to the resort, it’s a  very picturesque, pretty resort at high season and I think the British police wanted to avoid that and that’s why several months ago they’ve been asking to carry out these digs and because the Portuguese authorities have really dragged their heels over it that they’re probably the ones to blame as to how long it’s actually taken.

PAT KENNY: Alright, well, Russell Myers of the Daily Mirror, thank you very much for joining us from Praia da Luz.
Pathfinder, I made a very polite suggestion, why the rude  8-)(--) ? ... based, I might add, only on the words of a red top newspaper reporter ... and he suggested five places NOT three. 
Was there any need for such rudeness?



I take your point Alfred and think you probably are 8((()*/ right

But I still wish they would dig that damned drive up and stop all the speculation.

Offline Brietta

Re: Scotland Yard about to commence digs in and around Praia da Luz.
« Reply #102 on: May 05, 2014, 07:18:58 PM »
Like with most things, we need to wait and see what develops.
From what is being reported, forensic scientists are involved and they are not likely to be using  mechanical diggers.  The Portuguese authorities may be be quite happy with this, particularly if SY are seen to be  there in an advisory capacity, rather than openly directing operations.

If nothing is found, it will be another area of investigation eliminated and if remains of Madeleine  are unearthed, then the reinvestigation will have achieved at least part of its objective.


Unless there is very reliable intelligence that Madeleine may be buried in a particular location my opinion remains that this is smoke and mirrors. 

I have already made the comparison with the fruitless dig for Mr Hoffa’s remains.   

To me this would be the concluding part of an investigation, not the first step, and I reiterate that the Portuguese authorities do not yet appear to have allowed NSY to carry out the preliminary interviews and investigations for elimination purposes which could be expected to lead us to this point. 

“If nothing is found, it will be another area of investigation eliminated and if remains of Madeleine are unearthed, then the reinvestigation will have achieved at least part of its objective.” and that would make me highly suspicious of why now and not seven years ago
"All I'm going to say is that we've conducted a very serious investigation and there's no indication that Madeleine McCann's parents are connected to her disappearance. On the other hand, we have a lot of evidence pointing out that Christian killed her," Wolter told the "Friday at 9"....

Offline pathfinder73

Re: Scotland Yard about to commence digs in and around Praia da Luz.
« Reply #103 on: May 05, 2014, 07:21:37 PM »
Pathfinder, I made a very polite suggestion, why the rude  8-)(--) ? ... based, I might add, only on the words of a red top newspaper reporter ... and he suggested five places NOT three. 
Was there any need for such rudeness?



I take your point Alfred and think you probably are 8((()*/ right

But I still wish they would dig that damned drive up and stop all the speculation.

Because you keep banging on about it. Grime and the dogs searched Murat's. Why don't you tell me why you think she is there and it should be searched. Because Birch says so?
Smithman carrying a child in his arms checked his watch after passing the Smith family and the time was 10:03. Both are still unidentified 10 years later.

Offline sadie

Re: Scotland Yard about to commence digs in and around Praia da Luz.
« Reply #104 on: May 05, 2014, 07:32:08 PM »
Because you keep banging on about it. Grime and the dogs searched Murat's. Why don't you tell me why you think she is there and it should be searched. Because Birch says so?

What is all the agression about?

I have made no mention of the dogs nor of Grime for weeks now, apart from pointing out that Amaral did not understand what their alerts meant and did not mean.. 

Are you still feeling sore that I proved that Grime was mistaken about CCat being in that cupboard.  He made a mistake and to be fair to him he did not have the benefit of a video to show him where his mistake was, as we did..



To answer your question.  I very very much doubt that Birch is right, but with all the speculation, I feel as others do, it would be better to get the minor job of searching under Murats drive and the speculation over, one way or another

I have just read that Birch is being sued.