Author Topic: So what's next in the libel trial saga?  (Read 313790 times)

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Offline Albertini

Re: So what's next in the libel trial saga?
« Reply #660 on: December 16, 2014, 01:11:06 PM »
it would be if they had actually said what you posted but they didn't...they did not mention libel...you did

Libel is part of a person's fundamental rights and is specifically mentioned in this bit (amongst others)

Quote
In the same way, concerning the applicants’ right to image and a good name: upon placing the case in the public square and giving it worldwide notoriety, the applicants opened all doors to all opinions, even those that are adversarial to them.

Offline Angelo222

Re: So what's next in the libel trial saga?
« Reply #661 on: December 16, 2014, 01:14:11 PM »

Spot on  8((()*/    That is for the judge to decide.

Which will in the final analysis require a judgement on the basis of Mr Amaral's claims which requires a judgement as to Maddie's disappearance. Thus we have gone full circle and without a determination in the criminal investigation the only possible decision must be case not proven.
« Last Edit: December 16, 2014, 01:17:50 PM by Angelo222 »
De troothe has the annoying habit of coming to the surface just when you least expect it!!

Je ne regrette rien!!

Offline Albertini

Re: So what's next in the libel trial saga?
« Reply #662 on: December 16, 2014, 01:16:46 PM »
Obfuscate all you like.  There is a Trial going on, so it must be about something.

Negative articles in UK had more or less ceased by then, for obvious reasons.  And it isn't just about The Book anyway.

With the greatest of respect the obfuscation stems from broad brush allegations such as damage to the search.

I have asked for detail, quantifiable proof to substantiate and support these allegations. Proof that a court would require to find in a plaintiff's favour.

None was forthcoming from any of the McCann's witnesses in PT nor it seems from anyone on here either.

So if negative articles had ceased in the UK then the book has done no "damage" then has it?

That's completely disregarding the rather large elephant in the room which is the previous judgement which fundamentally dismissed the issue of the offending of the McCann's rights in relation to the publication and distribution of the book.

ferryman

  • Guest
Re: So what's next in the libel trial saga?
« Reply #663 on: December 16, 2014, 01:28:01 PM »

Voila!  So there must be some doubt then about the veracity of the book.

Thanks, Ferryman.

Indeed.

Contrary to this quote from the Blacksmith Bureau of court proceedings:

It was the Lisbon judge who provided the strongest support for the Bureau's contention that the  libel trial has become a complete irrelevance to the  establishment of truth in the Madeleine McCann affair. As she said to Gerry McCann:

"The point isn't to establish whether things are true or not, this is not the issue."


Ooops ....

Judge Maria de Melo e Castro said the court will convene on January 21 to discuss which facts have been proved.

Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2868798/Former-Madeleine-McCann-police-chief-earned-hundreds-thousands-writing-distortions-conspiracy-theories-book-case.html#ixzz3M4FXLTPY
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« Last Edit: December 16, 2014, 01:34:27 PM by ferryman »

Offline Alice Purjorick

Re: So what's next in the libel trial saga?
« Reply #664 on: December 16, 2014, 01:44:47 PM »
Drs McCann appealed against the judgement by the Portuguese Appeal Court, the Portuguese Supreme Court did not uphold the appeal and ruled that Dr Amaral's book had not infringed the McCann's rights.
That judgement could have been appealed by Drs McCann in the European Court but was not for whatever reason.
So; if the highest court in the land has ruled that the McCanns rights had not been infringed what is the mechanism in Portuguese law whereby a lower court may overrule the decision of a higher court?
Does anyone know?
"Navigating the difference between weird but normal grief and truly suspicious behaviour is the key for any detective worth his salt.". ….Sarah Bailey

Offline John

Re: So what's next in the libel trial saga?
« Reply #665 on: December 16, 2014, 02:15:07 PM »
Drs McCann appealed against the judgement by the Portuguese Appeal Court, the Portuguese Supreme Court did not uphold the appeal and ruled that Dr Amaral's book had not infringed the McCann's rights.
That judgement could have been appealed by Drs McCann in the European Court but was not for whatever reason.
So; if the highest court in the land has ruled that the McCanns rights had not been infringed what is the mechanism in Portuguese law whereby a lower court may overrule the decision of a higher court?
Does anyone know?

Simple answer is it cannot.  As already pointed out, these proceedings are about seeking compensation for the damage alleged to have been done to the McCann family when Gonçalo Amaral published his book and DVD.  The witnesses brought to court by the McCann lawyers all gave evidence on this basis.
A malicious prosecution for a crime which never existed. An exposé of egregious malfeasance by public officials.
Indeed, the truth never changes with the passage of time.

stephen25000

  • Guest
Re: So what's next in the libel trial saga?
« Reply #666 on: December 16, 2014, 02:17:49 PM »
Indeed.

Contrary to this quote from the Blacksmith Bureau of court proceedings:

It was the Lisbon judge who provided the strongest support for the Bureau's contention that the  libel trial has become a complete irrelevance to the  establishment of truth in the Madeleine McCann affair. As she said to Gerry McCann:

"The point isn't to establish whether things are true or not, this is not the issue."


Ooops ....

Judge Maria de Melo e Castro said the court will convene on January 21 to discuss which facts have been proved.

Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2868798/Former-Madeleine-McCann-police-chief-earned-hundreds-thousands-writing-distortions-conspiracy-theories-book-case.html#ixzz3M4FXLTPY
Follow us: @MailOnline on Twitter | DailyMail on Facebook

So on that, the mccanns claim of 'abduction' is truly dead in the water.

As to psychological and emotional damage, they don't appear to have any legally qualified people to testify on their behalf, and a crisis management 'expert' really doesn't count, especially as they paid for his services.

ferryman

  • Guest
Re: So what's next in the libel trial saga?
« Reply #667 on: December 16, 2014, 02:43:59 PM »
Simple answer is it cannot.  As already pointed out, these proceedings are about seeking compensation for the damage alleged to have been done to the McCann family when Gonçalo Amaral published his book and DVD.  The witnesses brought to court by the McCann lawyers all gave evidence on this basis.

The libel trial is about assessing damage, both to the reputations of the McCanns and the search for Madeleine caused by a book and a video that both assert (contrary to truth) that Madeleine was established as dead by the shelved enquiry, that the McCanns know she is dead and covered up the fact of her death and that the McCanns launched a fraudulent "appeal" in their (dead) daughter's name.

I assume most would agree that Isabel Duarte knows a thing or two more about Portuguese law than anyone here, and she believes the McCanns have a very good chance of succeeding.

Damages sought are high by the standard that is usual in Portugal, I admit that.

But is there a (Portuguese) precedent for a book and a video published in several countries of one continent that peddles such falsehood on such a scale?

I bet there isn't.

Offline jassi

Re: So what's next in the libel trial saga?
« Reply #668 on: December 16, 2014, 02:50:53 PM »
The libel trial is about assessing damage, both to the reputations of the McCanns and the search for Madeleine caused by a book and a video that both assert (contrary to truth) that Madeleine was established as dead by the shelved enquiry, that the McCanns know she is dead and covered up the fact of her death and that the McCanns launched a fraudulent "appeal" in their (dead) daughter's name.

I assume most would agree that Isabel Duarte knows a thing or two more about Portuguese law than anyone here, and she believes the McCanns have a very good chance of succeeding.

Damages sought are high by the standard that is usual in Portugal, I admit that.

But is there a (Portuguese) precedent for a book and a video published in several countries of one continent that peddles such falsehood on such a scale?

I bet there isn't.

Of course she does, she's their lawyer and would say that.
I believe everything. And l believe nothing.
I suspect everyone. And l suspect no one.
I gather the facts, examine the clues... and before   you know it, the case is solved!"

Or maybe not -

OG have been pushed out by the Germans who have reserved all the deck chairs for the foreseeable future

ferryman

  • Guest
Re: So what's next in the libel trial saga?
« Reply #669 on: December 16, 2014, 02:53:48 PM »
Of course she does, she's their lawyer and would say that.

She would not have advised them on a course that was ill-starred ...

Offline jassi

Re: So what's next in the libel trial saga?
« Reply #670 on: December 16, 2014, 02:56:05 PM »
It might have seemed a good idea all those years ago.
I believe everything. And l believe nothing.
I suspect everyone. And l suspect no one.
I gather the facts, examine the clues... and before   you know it, the case is solved!"

Or maybe not -

OG have been pushed out by the Germans who have reserved all the deck chairs for the foreseeable future

ferryman

  • Guest
Re: So what's next in the libel trial saga?
« Reply #671 on: December 16, 2014, 03:02:14 PM »
It might have seemed a good idea all those years ago.

Lawyers do not generally act on impulse or a whim ...

stephen25000

  • Guest
Re: So what's next in the libel trial saga?
« Reply #672 on: December 16, 2014, 03:29:56 PM »
The libel trial is about assessing damage, both to the reputations of the McCanns and the search for Madeleine caused by a book and a video that both assert (contrary to truth) that Madeleine was established as dead by the shelved enquiry, that the McCanns know she is dead and covered up the fact of her death and that the McCanns launched a fraudulent "appeal" in their (dead) daughter's name.

I assume most would agree that Isabel Duarte knows a thing or two more about Portuguese law than anyone here, and she believes the McCanns have a very good chance of succeeding.

Damages sought are high by the standard that is usual in Portugal, I admit that.

But is there a (Portuguese) precedent for a book and a video published in several countries of one continent that peddles such falsehood on such a scale?

I bet there isn't.

Yet AGAIN ferryman.

The nature of Madeleine's disappearance, HAS NOT BEEN ESTABLISHED.

Offline jassi

Re: So what's next in the libel trial saga?
« Reply #673 on: December 16, 2014, 03:36:19 PM »
Lawyers do not generally act on impulse or a whim ...

Lawyers usually do them what their clients instruct them to do.
I believe everything. And l believe nothing.
I suspect everyone. And l suspect no one.
I gather the facts, examine the clues... and before   you know it, the case is solved!"

Or maybe not -

OG have been pushed out by the Germans who have reserved all the deck chairs for the foreseeable future

ferryman

  • Guest
Re: So what's next in the libel trial saga?
« Reply #674 on: December 16, 2014, 03:45:09 PM »
Lawyers usually do them what their clients instruct them to do.

Having first advised them of the pros and cons.