Author Topic: Could the Rettendon Two be a potential MoJ.  (Read 210547 times)

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Offline Myster

Re: Could the Rettendon Two be a potential MoJ.
« Reply #255 on: January 29, 2019, 04:34:54 PM »
Or liability!
Oh, I don't know... you're pretty good at loading an Anschutz magazine.
It's one of them cases, in'it... one of them f*ckin' cases.

Offline Holly Goodhead

Re: Could the Rettendon Two be a potential MoJ.
« Reply #256 on: January 29, 2019, 04:39:55 PM »
Oh, I don't know... you're pretty good at loading an Anschutz magazine.

Despite longish polished nails  8)-)))
Just my opinion of course but Jeremy Bamber is innocent and a couple from UK, unknown to T9, abducted Madeleine McCann - motive unknown.  Was J J murdered as a result of identifying as a goth?

Offline Myster

Re: Could the Rettendon Two be a potential MoJ.
« Reply #257 on: January 29, 2019, 04:44:36 PM »
Oooo that's clever, thanks. 
It doesn't make sense to me she's asking Tucker to call her on a landline straightaway but then says she's elsewhere and will be there for the next 15 mins  *%87 .
The more I listen to it, the more it sounds like - "I'm on the drive at the moment" - i.e. she's on her way to the other flat.

You can reduce the speed by clicking on the gear icon and adjusting it about .75.  Any less, such as .5, and it becomes too distorted to make out what she said.
It's one of them cases, in'it... one of them f*ckin' cases.

Offline Holly Goodhead

Re: Could the Rettendon Two be a potential MoJ.
« Reply #258 on: January 29, 2019, 04:45:32 PM »
From the CoA doc:

Each mobile telephone making or receiving a call does so by way of a radio signal, which is routed through one of many local transmitters, commonly called 'cell sites', which provide a general coverage throughout the country. Skilled interrogation and analysis of the computer records will show the cell site through which each outgoing and incoming call made from or to a mobile telephone was routed.  In order to make the information intelligible and relevant to the issues in the case, a selection of these calls, with this information, was incorporated into agreed schedules.We have in the course of our narrative already referred to many of these calls. However two specific calls require detailed examination and investigation. Both calls were made from Whomes' mobile to Nicholls' mobile on the evening of 6th Dec; both calls were made at 18.59. The first call was made at 18.59.21, the outgoing call was routed through the Ingatestone cell site, this call lasted one second. The second call was at 18.59.32, the outgoing call was routed through the Hockley 3 cell site, this call lasted 4 seconds.

It seems then other calls were viewed against masts? 

sika do you know anything about this?
Just my opinion of course but Jeremy Bamber is innocent and a couple from UK, unknown to T9, abducted Madeleine McCann - motive unknown.  Was J J murdered as a result of identifying as a goth?

Offline Myster

Re: Could the Rettendon Two be a potential MoJ.
« Reply #259 on: January 29, 2019, 05:22:16 PM »
The more I listen to it, the more it sounds like - "I'm on the drive at the moment" - i.e. she's on her way to the other flat.

You can reduce the speed by clicking on the gear icon and adjusting it about .75.  Any less, such as .5, and it becomes too distorted to make out what she said.
You're lucky I didn't recommend turning on auto-generated subtitles.  8(8-))
It's one of them cases, in'it... one of them f*ckin' cases.

Offline sika

Re: Could the Rettendon Two be a potential MoJ.
« Reply #260 on: January 29, 2019, 06:19:39 PM »
From the CoA doc:

Each mobile telephone making or receiving a call does so by way of a radio signal, which is routed through one of many local transmitters, commonly called 'cell sites', which provide a general coverage throughout the country. Skilled interrogation and analysis of the computer records will show the cell site through which each outgoing and incoming call made from or to a mobile telephone was routed.  In order to make the information intelligible and relevant to the issues in the case, a selection of these calls, with this information, was incorporated into agreed schedules.We have in the course of our narrative already referred to many of these calls. However two specific calls require detailed examination and investigation. Both calls were made from Whomes' mobile to Nicholls' mobile on the evening of 6th Dec; both calls were made at 18.59. The first call was made at 18.59.21, the outgoing call was routed through the Ingatestone cell site, this call lasted one second. The second call was at 18.59.32, the outgoing call was routed through the Hockley 3 cell site, this call lasted 4 seconds.

It seems then other calls were viewed against masts? 

sika do you know anything about this?
I have been trying to upload, very detailed call logs from Nicholls mobile.  I can't make head nor tail of it, to be honest!  If I copy and paste it, it ends up listing all the info, rather than showing it in a nice grid as per the original. 

It does demonstrate to me that all the call information from all the relevant phones was available at trial.

Steele is no fool.  He would have created merry hell if this information was not available or was concealed.


Offline sika

Re: Could the Rettendon Two be a potential MoJ.
« Reply #261 on: January 29, 2019, 06:44:12 PM »
I recall reading about this elsewhere and it wasn't what it seems or was contested in some way.  Anyway lets assume he did purchase a battery from Ron Parkinson's shop how does this support Steele/Whomes carrying out the murders?  The shop was based in Marks Tey.  The murders Rettendon.  Distance between the two places is 24 miles/28 minutes.
I think I've got that wrong.  It turned out to be a light bulb that he purchased.

The relevance?  It supports his story and timings.

It is proving to be quite laborious, trying to post up all the information I have.  I'm struggling to post documents and am able only, to copy and paste.  There is of course a maximum character limit also.

I really want you to be able to read Steeles evidence and cross examination, as well as the evidence from his alibi witnesses.  His account, utterly unbelievable from the outset, was absolutely torn to shreds during cross examination. 



Offline Myster

Re: Could the Rettendon Two be a potential MoJ.
« Reply #262 on: January 29, 2019, 06:54:41 PM »

Same here.   Formatting text from elsewhere has gone to pot on this forum, as has uploading photos and attachments over a miniscule size.
Any chance of going back to the good old days of 2012?  (when we had the forum to ourselves 8(0(* )
It's one of them cases, in'it... one of them f*ckin' cases.

Offline Holly Goodhead

Re: Could the Rettendon Two be a potential MoJ.
« Reply #263 on: January 29, 2019, 08:23:53 PM »
The more I listen to it, the more it sounds like - "I'm on the drive at the moment" - i.e. she's on her way to the other flat.

You can reduce the speed by clicking on the gear icon and adjusting it about .75.  Any less, such as .5, and it becomes too distorted to make out what she said.

Tried it at .75 and .50.  No idea 'drive' or 'Joy'.
Just my opinion of course but Jeremy Bamber is innocent and a couple from UK, unknown to T9, abducted Madeleine McCann - motive unknown.  Was J J murdered as a result of identifying as a goth?

Offline Holly Goodhead

Re: Could the Rettendon Two be a potential MoJ.
« Reply #264 on: January 29, 2019, 08:39:35 PM »
I have been trying to upload, very detailed call logs from Nicholls mobile.  I can't make head nor tail of it, to be honest!  If I copy and paste it, it ends up listing all the info, rather than showing it in a nice grid as per the original. 

It does demonstrate to me that all the call information from all the relevant phones was available at trial.

Steele is no fool.  He would have created merry hell if this information was not available or was concealed.

That's what I thought re Steele ie he would be a rat up up a drainpipe with it, unless of course he thought best to stay away!?

If I was innocent of the murders I would want all the data ie every call made/received from all phones: self, Nicholls, Whomes, Rolfe, Tate, Tucker for 6th Dec.  Even if Nicholls, Steele, Whomes were in the area on drugs business only it would potentially show up anomalies with the call boxes, if for example Steele's mobile showed him making/receiving calls in locations away from the call boxes meaning it was impossible for him to have been in the two places at the same time.

If the info was made available how reliable was it?  Did the defence obtain direct from tele communication companies and relevant experts or did the police forward?  If the latter how reliable is it?  How can it be evidenced that the data is authentic and hasn't been manipulated in some way.  Hopefully the defence carried out checks.

I would be interested in looking at the info.  If it helps I can pm you my email?
Just my opinion of course but Jeremy Bamber is innocent and a couple from UK, unknown to T9, abducted Madeleine McCann - motive unknown.  Was J J murdered as a result of identifying as a goth?

Offline Holly Goodhead

Re: Could the Rettendon Two be a potential MoJ.
« Reply #265 on: January 30, 2019, 03:52:54 PM »
I think this case has long tentacles involving police corruption, probably at senior ranks as well as what is known about junior ranking officers, crime bosses, professionals and those prepared to launder ill-gotten gains through legitimate companies.

Rolfe's partner, Donna Jaggers, said on the day of the murders the trio met with a Peter Cuthbert at TGI Fridays Lakeside. 

Peter Cuthbert has held a number of directorships since the early 90's:

https://companycheck.co.uk/director/901864658/MR-PETER-GEORGE-CUTHBERT/companies

He featured in O'Mahoney's books on a couple of occassions

Providing details for Tucker to purchase the Range Rover:

https://books.google.co.uk/books?id=dfdB0IIeEvIC&pg=PT55&lpg=PT55&dq=peter+cuthbert+dorman+2000&source=bl&ots=6iYJuI23fy&sig=ACfU3U3-lQ1-8mfykp4h8DxW_QD28Py5Zg&hl=en&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwirrtLI5ZXgAhXdUBUIHSEqCqgQ6AEwCHoECAcQAQ#v=onepage&q=peter%20cuthbert%20dorman%202000&f=false

I thought the Range Rover was Rolfe's?

And here it seems he tries to act as a restraint on Tucker:

https://books.google.co.uk/books?id=dfdB0IIeEvIC&pg=PT55&lpg=PT55&dq=peter+cuthbert+dorman+2000&source=bl&ots=6iYJuI23fy&sig=ACfU3U3-lQ1-8mfykp4h8DxW_QD28Py5Zg&hl=en&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwirrtLI5ZXgAhXdUBUIHSEqCqgQ6AEwCHoECAcQAQ#v=onepage&q=peter%20cuthbert%20dorman%202000&f=false

And here:

https://books.google.co.uk/books?id=dfdB0IIeEvIC&pg=PT55&lpg=PT55&dq=peter+cuthbert+dorman+2000&source=bl&ots=6iYJuI23fy&sig=ACfU3U3-lQ1-8mfykp4h8DxW_QD28Py5Zg&hl=en&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwirrtLI5ZXgAhXdUBUIHSEqCqgQ6AEwCHoECAcQAQ#v=onepage&q=peter%20cuthbert%20dorman%202000&f=false

O'Mahoney recounts the same story in two different books except in one book he was the victim of Tucker's violent outburst and in the other book he claims it was Nipper Ellis.

So although Tate, Tucker and Rolfe were by all accounts violent thugs with drug addled brains it seems they associated with some who provided them with a semblance of respectability:

- Barry Dorman - Former MET police officer and used car salesman

- Peter Cuthbert - Director of what appear to be legitimate property companies

Is there any truth in Noye financing some of the drug deals?  It appears he met Tate when they were serving time at Swalesdale prison?

Just my opinion of course but Jeremy Bamber is innocent and a couple from UK, unknown to T9, abducted Madeleine McCann - motive unknown.  Was J J murdered as a result of identifying as a goth?

Offline Myster

Re: Could the Rettendon Two be a potential MoJ.
« Reply #266 on: January 30, 2019, 05:45:22 PM »
Have you watched this recently uploaded O'Mahoney video, Holly?   https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UDIR-dbxUmI
It's one of them cases, in'it... one of them f*ckin' cases.

Offline sika

Re: Could the Rettendon Two be a potential MoJ.
« Reply #267 on: January 30, 2019, 10:21:45 PM »
Have you watched this recently uploaded O'Mahoney video, Holly?   https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UDIR-dbxUmI
This is Mr O'Mahoney's most recent attempt to cash in on the story.  It climaxes with his effort to elicit some sort of confession out of John Whomes.

The film is basically his own interpretation of events, rather than being evidence driven.  That is fair enough.  However, it is worth bearing in mind, that his version of events changes from one project to the next.  In this one, he champions Steele's story that Nicholls was the mastermind behind the importations.  Says it all really!




Offline sika

Re: Could the Rettendon Two be a potential MoJ.
« Reply #268 on: January 30, 2019, 10:32:10 PM »
I think this case has long tentacles involving police corruption, probably at senior ranks as well as what is known about junior ranking officers, crime bosses, professionals and those prepared to launder ill-gotten gains through legitimate companies.

Rolfe's partner, Donna Jaggers, said on the day of the murders the trio met with a Peter Cuthbert at TGI Fridays Lakeside. 

Peter Cuthbert has held a number of directorships since the early 90's:

https://companycheck.co.uk/director/901864658/MR-PETER-GEORGE-CUTHBERT/companies

He featured in O'Mahoney's books on a couple of occassions

Providing details for Tucker to purchase the Range Rover:

https://books.google.co.uk/books?id=dfdB0IIeEvIC&pg=PT55&lpg=PT55&dq=peter+cuthbert+dorman+2000&source=bl&ots=6iYJuI23fy&sig=ACfU3U3-lQ1-8mfykp4h8DxW_QD28Py5Zg&hl=en&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwirrtLI5ZXgAhXdUBUIHSEqCqgQ6AEwCHoECAcQAQ#v=onepage&q=peter%20cuthbert%20dorman%202000&f=false

I thought the Range Rover was Rolfe's?

And here it seems he tries to act as a restraint on Tucker:

https://books.google.co.uk/books?id=dfdB0IIeEvIC&pg=PT55&lpg=PT55&dq=peter+cuthbert+dorman+2000&source=bl&ots=6iYJuI23fy&sig=ACfU3U3-lQ1-8mfykp4h8DxW_QD28Py5Zg&hl=en&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwirrtLI5ZXgAhXdUBUIHSEqCqgQ6AEwCHoECAcQAQ#v=onepage&q=peter%20cuthbert%20dorman%202000&f=false

And here:

https://books.google.co.uk/books?id=dfdB0IIeEvIC&pg=PT55&lpg=PT55&dq=peter+cuthbert+dorman+2000&source=bl&ots=6iYJuI23fy&sig=ACfU3U3-lQ1-8mfykp4h8DxW_QD28Py5Zg&hl=en&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwirrtLI5ZXgAhXdUBUIHSEqCqgQ6AEwCHoECAcQAQ#v=onepage&q=peter%20cuthbert%20dorman%202000&f=false

O'Mahoney recounts the same story in two different books except in one book he was the victim of Tucker's violent outburst and in the other book he claims it was Nipper Ellis.

So although Tate, Tucker and Rolfe were by all accounts violent thugs with drug addled brains it seems they associated with some who provided them with a semblance of respectability:

- Barry Dorman - Former MET police officer and used car salesman

- Peter Cuthbert - Director of what appear to be legitimate property companies

Is there any truth in Noye financing some of the drug deals?  It appears he met Tate when they were serving time at Swalesdale prison?
The Range Rover was registered in Rolfes name.

Former MET Policeman, used car salesman = respectable?   You do surprise me, Holly!

There is certainly a suggestion that Noye met Tate.  Whether he was financing any of the deals?  I guess we'll never know.  My hunch would be no.  Why would Noye, with his connections and means, entrust a loose cannon like Tate with tens of thousands? 

I can see why some would find O'Mahoneys books quite entertaining, but I would keep a large amount of salt nearby whilst reading. 

Offline sika

Re: Could the Rettendon Two be a potential MoJ.
« Reply #269 on: January 30, 2019, 10:42:28 PM »
Essexboys - Documents
PETER GEORGE CUTHBERT Statement

STATION NAME: PETER GEORGE CUTHBERT
AGE / DATE OF BIRTH: 42
10021953

Who states:- This statement consisting of 006 pages, each signed by me, is true to the best of my knowledge and belief and I make it knowing that if it is tendered in evidence I shall be liable to prosecution if I have wilfully stated in it anything which I know to be false or do not believe to be true.

DATED: 121295
P G CUTHBERT (SIGNED)

I am a self employed suspended ceiling contractor and I am the owner of a company called M and A Suspended Ceiling which I run from my home address. I am the owner of a Mitsubishi Shogun motor vehicle index K2CUF. I have lived the majority of my life in the South Essex area mainly in the Basildon area and after I got married I moved to the Hadleigh area. I have lived at my current address for the past 3 years with my wife and 2 children. When I lived in Basildon I got to know a man called Pat TATE who also lived in the Basildon area. This would have been approximately 12 years ago. I did not consider Pat a friend at this stage he was just somebody who I knew from Basildon who I could say hello to.

I saw Pat very irregularly and never socialised with him. All of my adult life I have been involved in body building training and have trained in a number of gyms in and around the Basildon and Hadleigh area. About 2 years whilst I was training at the Academy Gym, London Road, Westcliff I met two men who also trained in there Tony TUCKER and Craig ROLFE. I had never met either of these men previously but I was aware of Tony TUCKER because I had heard of him in conjunction with running the bouncers at night clubs in the Southend and Basildon areas. The reasons we started to get to know each other was because Tony was intending to buy a gym and he was asking if I was interested in doing work on the ceilings.

This work never took place. But after this I started to see both Tony and Craig on a social basis which included going to clubs with them in the Basildon or Southend area. This was not an occurance that happened every week but on the odd occasion. I think it would have been in 000394, Pat TATE came out of prison and he started seeing Tony and Craig and it appeared to me that Pat and Tony were quite close. Even when Pat came out I was still training with them and also seeing them socially. During the summer this year I did some work for Tony at his new house in Fobbing where I put a suspended ceiling into gym for him. I know that during 000095 Pat TATE when back into prison for firearms offences. I can't remember exactly when it was but I think it would have been in either 000900 or 001095 Pat was released from prison.

On the night he was released a big party was arranged for him at the Dagenham Snooker Club which I attended. Also at this party was both Tony and Craig. I can't remember anything out of the ofdinary happening at this party and I believe I left about 0200 - 0300 hours. This would have been the last time I saw any of the three socially. On the 151195 I went with Tony TUCKER to Eastern Garage Car Sales, London Rd, A13, Corringham which is actually situated at The Five Bells Roundabout. I was going to buy on HP a Range Rover motor vehicle Vogue index F424NPE. Although this was my vehicle and I signed for responsibility of paying the HP it was going to be lent by me to Tony and Craig for there use. In there a General Guarantee for Finance HP form was completed by a member of staff.

This form included my details and the details of the vehicle and showing a total purchase price of ten thousand nine hundred and nin