It is never too late to change ones mind.

[adam]

Mike and Lookout are the hardcore long term supporters that post every day. Jane J posts every day but is a guilter.

A few other posters say they don't believe Bamber would risk going up against five people, or could act so calm afterwards etc. These posters post less often and seem to be on the fence.

[Holly Goodhead]

Mike and Lookout are the hardcore long term supporters that post every day. Jane J posts every day but is a guilter.

A few other posters say they don't believe Bamber would risk going up against five people, or could act so calm afterwards etc. These posters post less often and seem to be on the fence.

Most of what emanates from the Blue forum, for or against, is utter drivel. 

[Myster]

Most of what emanates from the Blue forum, for or against, is utter drivel.

[Myster]

If accurate measurments of WHF do not exist (I doubt they do) hopefully the Eatons will oblige by allowing an appropriately qualified person to enter WHF with a laser distance measuring tools to enable a crime scene reconstruction. 

The most accurate plan is probably the unfinished one (attachment 1) from which I drew the completed plan (attachment 2). This might have been drawn up by the police or someone they employed using on-site measurements or other scaled plans which the family owned; or from any stored in the local planning department. The conversion of the rear part to a lower and upper office, store room, scullery and rear hall would have needed accurate ones drawn to scale for Building Regulation approval and for the builder to follow.

Other than that, the later redrawn plans with plastic covers in the official case files might be just as accurate.

BUT...

If I was a member of the Eaton family and received a letter from any Bamber supporter, Official Site members or their lawyers, polite or otherwise asking for access to WHF, I'd tell 'em to stick their request where the sun don't shine... and no doubt that's what they'd also say to any other interfering busybody!

[david1819]

The most accurate plan is probably the unfinished one (attachment 1) from which I drew the completed plan (attachment 2). This might have been drawn up by the police or someone they employed using on-site measurements or other scaled plans which the family owned; or from any stored in the local planning department. The conversion of the rear part to a lower and upper office, store room, scullery and rear hall would have needed accurate ones drawn to scale for Building Regulation approval and for the builder to follow.

Other than that, the later redrawn plans with plastic covers in the official case files might be just as accurate.

BUT...

If I was a member of the Eaton family and received a letter from any Bamber supporter, Official Site members or their lawyers, polite or otherwise asking for access to WHF, I'd tell 'em to stick their request where the sun don't shine... and no doubt that's what they'd also say to any other interfering busybody!

Putting guilt or innocence aside, Apparently Eatons has kept the house exactly how it was in 1985. In 2003 ITN(itv) film producers were guided round the house they were shown dried blood stains on a lampshade and also the kitchen light was still broken from the night of the murders. (According to ITN).

That is just creepy

[Holly Goodhead]

The most accurate plan is probably the unfinished one (attachment 1) from which I drew the completed plan (attachment 2). This might have been drawn up by the police or someone they employed using on-site measurements or other scaled plans which the family owned; or from any stored in the local planning department. The conversion of the rear part to a lower and upper office, store room, scullery and rear hall would have needed accurate ones drawn to scale for Building Regulation approval and for the builder to follow.

Other than that, the later redrawn plans with plastic covers in the official case files might be just as accurate.

BUT...

If I was a member of the Eaton family and received a letter from any Bamber supporter, Official Site members or their lawyers, polite or otherwise asking for access to WHF, I'd tell 'em to stick their request where the sun don't shine... and no doubt that's what they'd also say to any other interfering busybody!

CCRC have the powers to override.

[Myster]

Putting guilt or innocence aside, Apparently Eatons has kept the house exactly how it was in 1985. In 2003 ITN(itv) film producers were guided round the house they were shown dried blood stains on a lampshade and also the kitchen light was still broken from the night of the murders. (According to ITN).

That is just creepy

The broken lampshade story was probably apocryphal. There's a photo in the pg.186 photo section of Wilkes' book showing the kitchen as it was c.1993/4? with an intact smoked glass lampshade, and there's a video I've seen somewhere online looking through the kitchen window from outside showing the same. The once red AGA surround in the photo has also been repainted to white or cream, with an additional long wooden rack above it to hang knickknacks. And a different table. So not exactly the same.

Maybe they kept the bloodstains just in case police wanted or might still want samples for blood-typing/DNA analysis in future... which I believe  they did.

[Myster]

CCRC have the powers to override.

Says who?  You?  I believe that as much as I do your notoriously inaccurate predictions of Bamber's imminent release!

[Holly Goodhead]

Says who?  You?  I believe that as much as I do your notoriously inaccurate predictions of Bamber's imminent release!

Says CCRC:

https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/249340/Ch35.pdf

Powers.
2.  The CCRC has powers to refer cases to the appropriate court for an appeal
to be heard. The CCRC does not consider innocenc
e or guilt, but whether there is new
evidence or argument that may cast doubt on
the safety of a decision. The CCRC has wide-
ranging investigative powers and can obtain and preserve documentation held by any public
body (including the Services). The CCRC will also investigate and report to the Court Martial
Appeal Court (CMAC) on any matter referred to them by the Court. 

Have I ever predicted "Bamber's imminent release!"?  Thought it was more the case turning?

[Myster]

Doesn't that refer to obtaining and investigating documents only?  Nothing to do with gaining access to measure up someone's private property, but only concerned with getting hold of existing plans from say, the local planning dept.
Case drawings filed from 1985/86 might be sufficiently accurate if needed anyway.

But even so, Bamber won't have another shot at the Court of Appeal for at least another ten years, if ever, by which time the Eatons might have retired to live elsewhere, with the trustees/new tenants carrying out a major refurbishment to change WHF internally beyond recognition.

[Holly Goodhead]

Doesn't that refer to obtaining and investigating documents only?  Nothing to do with gaining access to measure up someone's private property, but only concerned with getting hold of existing plans from say, the local planning dept.
Case drawings filed from 1985/86 might be sufficiently accurate if needed anyway.

But even so, Bamber won't have another shot at the Court of Appeal for at least another ten years, if ever, by which time the Eatons might have retired to live elsewhere, with the trustees/new tenants carrying out a major refurbishment to change WHF internally beyond recognition.

I think the def of  "wide-ranging investigative powers" is as it says wide-ranging and I don't believe anything is off-limits. 

Precise measurements might exist anyway.  The building is grade 2 listed so restrictions will apply re alterations.  Plus as far as I'm aware the property is still owned by the Henry Smith charity so tenants will need the approval of the trustees to make alterations.

What makes you think JB's case has a 10 year wait for CoA?

Scipio will be along later to put us all right 

[Myster]

Because of the backlog of other cases which the CCRC are investigating and giving priority over Jeremy Bamber's.

[Holly Goodhead]

Because of the backlog of other cases which the CCRC are investigating and giving priority over Jeremy Bamber's.

About 2 years I believe:

http://jeremybamberforum.co.uk/index.php/topic,2599.msg81472.html#msg81472

[Myster]

About 2 years I believe:

http://jeremybamberforum.co.uk/index.php/topic,2599.msg81472.html#msg81472

That 3½ years wasted... only another 6½ to go. 


hoots! trumps!

[Myster]

that's*... damn this sticky keyboard!