ShiningInLuz tours hits the mainstream Press.

[ShiningInLuz]

Speaking for myself, I am relieved that the search of the mound and other areas 'came up empty handed'.

However, Scotland Yard certainly managed to find voids worthy of inspection and considering the difficulties involved managed to do it in jig time.

Why is it you think a missing child can be found if no-one actually looks for her?

A local source said: ‘The discovery of the hole came as a surprise. Police are meant to be here for five to seven days but this may delay things.’

Elsewhere on the site, sewers are being analysed by British detectives using micro cameras and fibreoptic cables.

The complex system of unused piping was installed as part of failed plans to build a hotel on the land before Madeleine disappeared.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2648396/Police-hunting-Madeleine-McCann-resort-disappeared-search-sewers.html#ixzz4MQG3wm53

Re the bit in bold.

I don't.  I simply think that intelligent assessment should form a part of police work, not simple application of grunt and cash.

It would be interesting to know the total bill for that one jaunt.  Would they have needed to go back to the Home Office or would there still be plenty in the pot?

[Alice Purjorick]

Speaking for myself, I am relieved that the search of the mound and other areas 'came up empty handed'.

However, Scotland Yard certainly managed to find voids worthy of inspection and considering the difficulties involved managed to do it in jig time.

Why is it you think a missing child can be found if no-one actually looks for her?

A local source said: ‘The discovery of the hole came as a surprise. Police are meant to be here for five to seven days but this may delay things.’

Elsewhere on the site, sewers are being analysed by British detectives using micro cameras and fibreoptic cables.

The complex system of unused piping was installed as part of failed plans to build a hotel on the land before Madeleine disappeared.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2648396/Police-hunting-Madeleine-McCann-resort-disappeared-search-sewers.html#ixzz4MQG3wm53

I know it's not children but this might give an insight into "what's bin did and what's bin hid" and how you find what you weren't looking for and how what you were looking for turns up later.

"Veronique Mireille Marre"
Google it

[ShiningInLuz]

I think the search carried out by Redwood was nothing more than a last throw of the dice ahead of his retirement. I don't believe it was based on anything more than a hunch.

The Portuguese went along with it knowing full well that the area had been cleared previously and that SY were unlikely to find anything.  In the end that was in fact what happened, the PJ must have been wetting themselves in glee imho.

Since I am reputed to be the forum member sticking up for all things Portuguese, I have to say to my chagrin I think you have hit the nail on the head with the bit I have bolded.

I went down to visit the search a couple of times, and I got the distinct impression the Portuguese police were happy to have OG in the full glare of the media.

[Alfie]

I think the search carried out by Redwood was nothing more than a last throw of the dice ahead of his retirement. I don't believe it was based on anything more than a hunch.

The Portuguese went along with it knowing full well that the area had been cleared previously and that SY were unlikely to find anything.  In the end that was in fact what happened, the PJ must have been wetting themselves in glee imho.

What you believe and what is actually true may be two completely different things.  Fact is, you don't know and neither does SIL.

[Robittybob1]

When did SIL move to Praia da Luz?

[Brietta]

Since I am reputed to be the forum member sticking up for all things Portuguese, I have to say to my chagrin I think you have hit the nail on the head with the bit I have bolded.

I went down to visit the search a couple of times, and I got the distinct impression the Portuguese police were happy to have OG in the full glare of the media.

I am simply astounded at the opinion you and John have expressed about the attitude of the Portuguese police in the case of a missing child.

Are they really so uncaring and unprofessional?

[ShiningInLuz]

I am simply astounded at the opinion you and John have expressed about the attitude of the Portuguese police in the case of a missing child.

Are they really so uncaring and unprofessional?

I found them extremely professional and extremely diligent.  That does not mean they had to stand guard over a search site 24x7, or guard apartment 5A 24x7, and wonder at the supposed might that is SY.

They kept the search sights secure 24x7.  They kept apartment 5A secure, 24x7.  I would assume with the number of PJ and GNR deployed, they were pulling a lot of additional shifts, and no one from OG has complained about the standard of their work.

Trying to regulate their thoughts as they worked hard to give OG what it wanted is a bit OTT, is it not?

[Alfie]

The bit you have bolded says "Therefore I know certain things that neither you nor OG know."  You have done another of your sweeping generalisations to turn "certain things" into "everything".

It would be interesting to know if you actually know you are doing this, at the time you are doing it.  But I guess I'm not going to find out.

You are either speculating about someone coming forward or proposing a hypothetical situation.  We have not been given the 'intelligence' that led to the dig.  So this an instance where you don't know the prompt, I don't know the prompt, but OG does have that information.

However, had I known in advance of the plan to dig the mound, (and knowing what I know now from the PJ Files), I would have supplied OG with the names of 4 people, their relevant statements, hopefully their contact details, and suggest that these 4 should be asked a simple question.  "Can you confirm that you were up that hill on the night of 3rd/4th May 2007?"

I would further provide them with details of the traffic system in Luz, to demonstrate why the dig area was an unlikely site.

I would further provide them with details of premises nearby that were likely to be open late on 3 May 2007, explain the likely traffic this would have generated, hopefully provided contact details, and suggested they might like to make enquiries.

I happen to know the guy who lived in 2007 at the north end of the dig.  For him, I had a contact number.  He appeared under a thin disguise in UK media at the time of the dig.  He was quoted as saying the mound was searched extensively in the days after Madeleine disappeared.  What 'extensively' means, I do not know.  I lost interest in the mound for while, given that OG found nothing of interest, before I realised it had other significance.

Of course, this is hypothetical as OG is not going run its plans past me in advance.

It prefers to load up the troops, get them shiny new digging implements, seal off central Luz, get the PJ and GNR to participate, bring in the dogs, throw in a helicopter chase and put on a real show for the media.

You are ignorant of Luz, just as OG was.  I have a decent knowledge of the incident scene.

Hence I have certain advantages over both you and OG.

Before you write any response, just think to yourself of one simple question.  If the challenge was "who can best build local knowledge into a crime occurring in your neck of the woods?, and I took on every single member of this forum, I have no doubt I would lose every single time the issue was their neck of the woods.  That's their turf.  On your turf, you would win.

Luz is my turf, which is why I would 'beat' any and all members of this forum, if the debate is about my turf.

This is most nonsensical argument I've ever read.  You "win" every debate about this case because you live in PdL?  Well we may as well all go home then.  You win.   *&*%£

[Robittybob1]

This is most nonsensical argument I've ever read.  You "win" every debate about this case because you live in PdL?  Well we may as well all go home then.  You win.   *&*%£

It would have some advantage.

[Alfie]

It would have some advantage.

SIL claims that the searches carried out by Operation Grange in PdL were nothing more than a publicity stunt, (one obviously sanctioned by the Portuguese authorities).  This opinion is based on his/her own interpretation of incomplete files and an incomplete / non-existent understanding of what intelligence Op Grange may have received which prompted the searches in the first place.  Saying that we must accept his/her opinion on this matter simply because he/she lives in PdL (but wasn't living there at the time of the disappearance incidentally) is a non-starter in my book.  Now you may be happy to defer to his/her supposedly superior knowledge of this case but I'm not.  I hope that's OK.

[John]

What you believe and what is actually true may be two completely different things.  Fact is, you don't know and neither does SIL.

Fact is you don't know what I know or who I speak with.

[Robittybob1]

SIL claims that the searches carried out by Operation Grange in PdL were nothing more than a publicity stunt, (one obviously sanctioned by the Portuguese authorities).  This opinion is based on his/her own interpretation of incomplete files and an incomplete / non-existent understanding of what intelligence Op Grange may have received which prompted the searches in the first place.  Saying that we must accept his/her opinion on this matter simply because he/she lives in PdL (but wasn't living there at the time of the disappearance incidentally) is a non-starter in my book.  Now you may be happy to defer to his/her supposedly superior knowledge of this case but I'm not.  I hope that's OK.

Thanks for answering (IYO) my previous question "(but wasn't living there at the time of the disappearance incidentally)". 
If you were there at the time and have a strong interest in the case you could end up like Robert Murat and becoming a person of interest.
I have no idea whether his/her knowledge is of any value.  I have found myself slightly burned out on the case in the last couple of weeks, and I'm not quite in the right frame of mind to read through SIL's blog or SIL's post to find out but it will be on the to do list.

[John]

I am simply astounded at the opinion you and John have expressed about the attitude of the Portuguese police in the case of a missing child.

Are they really so uncaring and unprofessional?

It's the real world Brie.  Do you honestly think for a nano second that the Portuguese cops actually welcomed SY and their diggers onto their patch?  Of course they wanted them to fail because success would have made the PJ look like a right bunch of Charlies.

[misty]

It's the real world Brie.  Do you honestly think for a nano second that the Portuguese cops actually welcomed SY and their diggers onto their patch?  Of course they wanted them to fail because success would have made the PJ look like a right bunch of Charlies.

That just about sums it all up - never mind Madeleine, just make sure Portugal's reputation is not tarnished.

[John]

Thanks for answering (IYO) my previous question "(but wasn't living there at the time of the disappearance incidentally)". 
If you were there at the time and have a strong interest in the case you could end up like Robert Murat and becoming a person of interest.
I have no idea whether his/her knowledge is of any value.  I have found myself slightly burned out on the case in the last couple of weeks, and I'm not quite in the right frame of mind to read through SIL's blog or SIL's post to find out but it will be on the to do list.

You should take a break Robbie after all your hard work.