Who entered Apartment 5A and who didn't - a definitive study.

[Robittybob1]

What I notice is that there seems to be a reluctance to enter the apartment.  Yet Amaral says there had been 20 people in there contaminating the crime scene?  I can't see how he got to such a high number! 
We need to have a count up and list all those who entered the apartment after Kate's alarm.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Disappearance_of_Madeleine_McCann

It was widely acknowledged that mistakes were made, perhaps the most serious of which was that the crime scene was not secured. Around 20 people entered apartment 5A before it was closed off, according to Chief Inspector Olegário de Sousa of the Polícia Judiciária.[66] According to Madeleine's mother, an officer placed tape across the doorway of the children's bedroom, but left at 3 am without securing the apartment.[67]
.....
A similar situation arose outside the apartment. A crowd gathered by the front door of 5A, including next to the children's bedroom window through which an abductor may have entered or left, trampling on potentially important evidence.[69] An officer dusted the bedroom window's exterior shutter for fingerprints without wearing gloves or other protective clothing.[44]

It would be impossible to tell who gathered outside, so we'll concentrate on the inside only.

Since it is reported "Around 20 people entered apartment 5A before it was closed off, according to Chief Inspector Olegário de Sousa of the Polícia Judiciária.[66]" it maybe possible to find his list of people.

110

[ShiningInLuz]

What I notice is that there seems to be a reluctance to enter the apartment.  Yet Amaral says there had been 20 people in there contaminating the crime scene?  I can't see how he got to such a high number! 
We need to have a count up and list all those who entered the apartment after Kate's alarm.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Disappearance_of_Madeleine_McCann
It would be impossible to tell who gathered outside, so we'll concentrate on the inside only.

Since it is reported "Around 20 people entered apartment 5A before it was closed off, according to Chief Inspector Olegário de Sousa of the Polícia Judiciária.[66]" it maybe possible to find his list of people.

What is the time scale?  Until the apartment was sealed off, everyone and his dog was permitted to enter.

[Robittybob1]

What is the time scale?  Until the apartment was sealed off, everyone and his dog was permitted to enter.

Yes till it was sealed off as a crime scene. I have looked for a list on the web and nothing has came up other than repetitions of Sousa's claim that 20 people had entered the apartment till that time.

[Robittybob1]

There was the 5 in the McCann family Kate , Gerry, Madeleine, Sean and Amelie  OK I hadn't factored in Madeleine Sean and Amelie originally  - OK so we are a quarter of the way to 20 already.

I know of the three OC MW staff well known to have been in there Amy Tierney, Emma Knight, and Silvia Batista

I think we would have to include Matt Oldfield since he did the 9:30 check (this is whether or not it is later reported he didn't go in there.

I know there were the two GNR that Kate called Tweedle Dee and Tweedle Dumb  we should be able to get their names.  So we are up to 11 but can we find another 9? 

[ShiningInLuz]

There was the 5 in the McCann family Kate , Gerry, Madeleine, Sean and Amelie  OK I hadn't factored in Madeleine Sean and Amelie originally  - OK so we are a quarter of the way to 20 already.

I know of the three OC MW staff well known to have been in there Amy Tierney, Emma Knight, and Silvia Batista

I think we would have to include Matt Oldfield since he did the 9:30 check (this is whether or not it is later reported he didn't go in there.

I know there were the two GNR that Kate called Tweedle Dee and Tweedle Dumb  we should be able to get their names.  So we are up to 11 but can we find another 9?

What is the start time? Is it Kate's alarm, around 10pm, in which case we have to discount MBM?

Is it 5.30pm, when the kids were signed out of high tea?

Is it 6.30pm, when David Payne testified he saw all 3 kids alive?

Is it 8.35pm when the McCanns chatted to the Carpenters at Tapas?

If you mean who's DNA was in the apartment, then we have to chuck in the cleaners (x2) and the repair men (x2).

Where are the goalposts?

[Robittybob1]

http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/JOSE_ROQUE.htm
Jose Maria Batista Roque

The questioned made, the deponent states that the access to interior of the residence was accessed through a principal door- this is, a wood door which is placed facing north;
. Inside, the deponent encountered the mother and two siblings of the missing minor;
. The deponent stats that he is unable to specify if that entrance door was found open or closed when he reached the apartment during which he was taking in the facts with the witness

Nelson Filipe Pacheco da Costa  http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/NELSON-DA-COSTA-1.htm

. Following, this patrol went to the residence where the family of said minor was staying in the 'Ocean Garden' together with the father;
. At reaching the location, the two elements that made up the patrol , the current witness and his colleague, Jose Roque, proceeded into the interior of the apartment, with the goal of investigating the contours which eventually surrounded the disappearance of that minor;

So da Costa and Roque definitely say they entered but they are already in our count.

What is the start time? Is it Kate's alarm, around 10pm, in which case we have to discount MBM?

Is it 5.30pm, when the kids were signed out of high tea?

Is it 6.30pm, when David Payne testified he saw all 3 kids alive?

Is it 8.35pm when the McCanns chatted to the Carpenters at Tapas?

If you mean who's DNA was in the apartment, then we have to chuck in the cleaners (x2) and the repair men (x2).

Where are the goalposts?

Maybe I don't know.  So do you have the names of "the cleaners (x2) and the repair men (x2)"  We will include them.

15 if we include the cleaner and servicemen.

Surely the remaining 5 would be some of the Tapas group.

[ShiningInLuz]

http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/JOSE_ROQUE.htm
Jose Maria Batista Roque
Nelson Filipe Pacheco da Costa  http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/NELSON-DA-COSTA-1.htm
So da Costa and Roque definitely say they entered but they are already in our count.


Maybe I don't know.  So do you have the names of "the cleaners (x2) and the repair men (x2)"  We will include them.

15 if we include the cleaner and servicemen.

Surely the remaining 5 would be some of the Tapas group.

The point is the two cleaners cleaned 5A on the Saturday before the McCanns arrived.  With one cleaning on the Wednesday.

The repair men turned up on Monday, from memory.  A washing machine Kate could not operate.  A shutter Gerry had jammed.

So it is still timescale.  People through 5A after the alarm was raised?  Or when does the clock start?  Any clue?

[Robittybob1]

All I know is this statement "Around 20 people entered apartment 5A before it was closed off, according to Chief Inspector Olegário de Sousa of the Polícia Judiciária".  What time scale gets included I don't know, but if we find we can easily exceed the 20 maybe the Saturday cleaners, Wednesday cleaners  or the servicemen were not included by de Sousa.  We will just keep adding them up till we exhaust our supply of information, OK.
We still have to find another 5 before we need to eliminate some of these unlikely included ones.

[Robittybob1]

The point is the two cleaners cleaned 5A on the Saturday before the McCanns arrived.  With one cleaning on the Wednesday.

The repair men turned up on Monday, from memory.  A washing machine Kate could not operate.  A shutter Gerry had jammed.

So it is still timescale.  People through 5A after the alarm was raised?  Or when does the clock start?  Any clue?

Do you know their names?

[Robittybob1]

Looking at the Tapas 7
.... ...... states

Towards 10pm, Kate went to her apartment, and less than 5 minutes later, she came back to the restaurant, breaking down, reporting that Madeleine had disappeared. Then everybody went to the apartment occupied by Madeleine's family. He remembers comments concerning the fact that the window and the shutters were open, while they had remained closed throughout the week.

That the apartment occupied by Madeleine's family comprises two bedrooms, a small kitchen, a lounge and a bathroom. That the lounge has a door which gives outside access in the direction of the restaurant. He does not recall any more details of the apartment but he remembers that the bedroom occupied by the children has a window that looks onto the main road. That he never went into the said bedroom occupied by the children but he could see that there were two beds and two cots. The cots were placed in the middle of the bedroom. One of the beds was placed against the window and the other, the one occupied by Madeleine, was against the wall facing the one which has a window.

So he went into the apartment but not the kids bedroom.

Fiona Payne - plenty of people saw her there and she seems to admit it. 

Immediately, they organised search groups, either in the apartment thinking that she could be hidden, or outside, which resulted in nothing, even with the help of the employees.
Due to Kate's highly anxious state, she decided to stay with her, giving her all support she needed.

Russell O'Brien  - I take it well known he went inside to make up the timelines. 

states that he went to the apartment of the McCann couple once but does not remember if he was asked to go or went of his own accord. He furthers that he did not know if the glass sliding doors were locked or not but that probably Gerry told him on this night to enter his apartment to check on the children. The deponent explains that for him and his spouse, this system was secure and effective and each couple would check on their children every 15/30 minutes. For his part, he guarantees that all the doors and windows were closed and locked, explaining that the windows and the glass sliding doors can only be open and closed via the interior of the apartment.

Jane Tanner - Not in 5A initially but later goes in to tell Gerry of seeing TannerMan. So ultimately Yes.

Rachel Oldfield - Not in 5A

I didnt go into the apartment, standing at the bottom of the steps by the patio doors

Dianne Webster -

They immediately organised search parties, in the apartment,

Dave .... ......, FP, MO, ROB, DW - JT - all entered the apartment, but not all in the bedroom.

So that adds up to 21 and we have not included the rest of the GNR and PJ when they arrive, do any of them enter the apartment?

[Robittybob1]

Looking at the PJ 

PHOTOS TAKEN BY JOAO  BARREIRAS  PJ OFFICER   - so we can safely say he was there.
In his statement he knows about others there too. http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/JOAO_BARREIRAS.htm

As far as he knows, after the first examination, other members from the finger print detection service and also officers from the LPC Crime Scene arrived at the scene.

Also:

When they arrived at the scene, which they immediately identified due to the presence of GNR officers, as well as quite a lot of people who were walking around the street searching for the child, they immediately went to the apartment in question, where they found several people, including some GNR officers, as well as the head of the Lagos GNR station.

Also

At that moment one of the GNR officers told the witness that they had already searched for the girl in the wardrobes and other places in the apartment without having taken any care as to leaving their own traces or for destroying or adulterating any traces that might be of interest to the investigation.

also

After the arrival of the witness and his colleague Vitor Martins

I have a feeling these two [Vitor Martins and Barreiras were not included as they took some precautions.
Intercalary Report by Inspector Joao Carlos 31-01-2008  - Just a summary.

[Robittybob1]

Manuel Joaquim Pessoa de Lencastre Queiroz  Desk based.  But the following two are said to go to the apartment.

Almost half an hour later, Inspector Martins accompanied by Assistant Specialist J. Barreiras left for the scene to carry out any inquiries that were necessary, including a Judicial Inspection of the scene..

I have a feeling these two [Vitor Martins and Barreiras were not included as they took some precautions so they are not included in a total.

[G-Unit]

Gerry, Kate, Dave, Fiona, Dianne, Russell all say they were in there after the alarm was raised.
Nelson da Costa, Duarte and Roque (GNR) and Silvia (OC).
Amy and Emma. (OC)

[Robittybob1]

Gerry, Kate, Dave, Fiona, Dianne, Russell all say they were in there after the alarm was raised.
Nelson da Costa, Duarte and Roque (GNR) and Silvia (OC).
Amy and Emma. (OC)

I think you are wrong about Duarte http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/ANTONIO_DUARTE.htm

As regards the searches, he say that he did not enter the apartment, as it had already been searched, but instead remained outside. Upon arriving and finding out about the situation with his Chief Roque, he carried out a search in a GNR car of all the places the child could be, specifically in commercial establishments, swimming pools and open spaces.

He sounds really tired and seemed to do all his searching from the driver's seat of his car.

[Robittybob1]

" Around 20 people entered apartment 5A before it was closed off, according to Chief Inspector Olegário de Sousa of the Polícia Judiciária."  We would never know whether he included the Mccann family who had every right to be there.  The cleaners and maintenance men should not be blamed.  Neither Matt if the only time he was in the apartment was during the check.  So that wipes 10 off our count but who knows, unless we can find another 10 to take their place to get up to 20 again.