MADELEINE'S DNA - definitive study.

[Robittybob1]

Indeed it would, but I think you are in danger of drifting towards fantasy.

On the other hand, there was a good Maddie and then there was a bad Maddie according to Kate's mother (I think)

It is not impossible when we are dealing with IVF children and frozen embryos etc.  There could greater chance of identical 19 allele matches in IVF children.  Genetic probabilities are generally calculated using unrelated individuals.

[Robittybob1]

Indeed it would, but I think you are in danger of drifting towards fantasy.

On the other hand, there was a good Maddie and then there was a bad Maddie according to Kate's mother (I think)

Mood swings?

[Mr Gray]

From the position the samples were collected it would be very hard to explain a perfect unmixed evidence sample that matched Madeleine. (i.e. just the 19 alleles)  We would be thinking in terms of identical twins then.

no....dna transfer from clothes that belonged to maddie.....dont tell me you dont realise that just because maddies dna is in the car does not mean maddie was in the car

[Robittybob1]

no....dna transfer from clothes that belonged to maddie.....dont tell me you dont realise that just because maddies dna is in the car does not mean maddie was in the car

I don't think you understand that any upper surface will have DNA of the 30 or so people who used the car, that will just be the background noise in which no particular DNA can be isolated.  Now if you take a swab from under a mat that has hundreds of cells from just 1-3 persons that will be a different story. 

[Mr Gray]

I don't think you understand that any upper surface will have DNA of the 30 or so people who used the car, that will just be the background noise in which no particular DNA can be isolated.  Now if you take a swab from under a mat that will be a different story.

I understand a lot more than you think
The presence of a perfect LCN DNA match does not prove Maddie was ever in that car

[Robittybob1]

I understand a lot more than you think
The presence of a perfect LCN DNA match does not prove Maddie was ever in that car

Use the words "under the boot mat" in your sentence then please?

You might be right but it is an indication which begs an explanation when the test sample came from underneath the boot mat.

Ultimately it is a jury trial in Portugal and even if there was an innocent reason for the DNA the jury may side with the prosecution.
I get the feeling they would have charged Kate if there had been the 19 alleles similar to Madeleine's even in the mixed sample.
We don't know what other circumstantial evidence they had to build a case.

[slartibartfast]

I understand a lot more than you think
The presence of a perfect LCN DNA match does not prove Maddie was ever in that car

That's getting into the territory of "the suspect's blood stains in the murder weapon is no proof he was there or handled it".

[Robittybob1]

That's getting into the territory of "the suspect's blood stains in the murder weapon is no proof he was there or handled it".

That killed the discussion!

[Mr Gray]

That's getting into the territory of "the suspect's blood stains in the murder weapon is no proof he was there or handled it".

you obviously do not understand the significance of LCN DNA......rather a silly statement by you

[Mr Gray]

That killed the discussion!

its ignorance which kills discussion....you didnt even need to ask for a cite

Police have suspended the use of a controversial DNA technique following the Omagh bomb verdict.
Earlier, the Crown Prosecution Service said it would review live prosecutions in England and Wales using Low Copy Number (LCN) DNA testing.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/7156051.stm

[Robittybob1]

its ignorance which kills discussion....you didnt even need to ask for a cite

Police have suspended the use of a controversial DNA technique following the Omagh bomb verdict.
Earlier, the Crown Prosecution Service said it would review live prosecutions in England and Wales using Low Copy Number (LCN) DNA testing.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/7156051.stm

And what was the outcome?  Are they still suspended? 

[Mr Gray]

And what was the outcome?  Are they still suspended?

if i told you you wouldnt understand....but i will try
LCN DNA relates to a small number of cells being found for analysis....this amount of material can be easily transferred. If I shake hands with someone on his way to australia and he opens his hotel door with the same hand then my dna might be found on the door hadle in OZ...even thugh i am 12000 miles awy and have never been to taht hotel

[Robittybob1]

if i told you you wouldnt understand

Give me the cite and I'll try.

[jassi]

According to Wiki - In the United Kingdom use of the technique was suspended between 21 December 2007 and 14 January 2008 while the Crown Prosecution Service conducted a review into its use - this suspension has now been lifted.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Low_copy_number

[Mr Gray]

Give me the cite and I'll try.

#sorry...you are a nice chap really.