Author Topic: Scene Of Crime Reconstruction  (Read 16150 times)

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Offline Holly Goodhead

Scene Of Crime Reconstruction
« on: April 13, 2017, 05:07:27 PM »
Samson intended to start up the above but seems to have disappeared so hopefully he will not mind if I steal his thunder!

The following are excerpts from CAL's book and all fully referenced:

Police

The official police account of how Jeremy Bamber killed his family is contained in the report to the Director of Public Prosecutions in November 1985, written with a view to having him committed for trial.

Acknowledging that the order of death could not be determined with certainty, the report contends that:

...there were probably ten shots fired in the first fusillade [four into Nevill, one into Sheila and five into June] and the remaining three - two into June's head, one into Sheila's head- were inflicted after Ralph Nevill was killed in the kitchen.  Eight shots were fired into the boys - eight cases were recovered in their bedroom.  Four shots were fired into Ralph Nevill in the kitchen - namely, the two in his temple area and the two in the top of his head.  Three cartridge cases were recovered in the kitchen.  It is therefore reasonable to assume that the fourth cartridge case was carried on the feet of the killer, or possibly a police officer, and deposited on the stairway.

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« Last Edit: May 20, 2017, 03:53:52 AM by John »
Setting the pussy among the pigeons!

Offline Holly Goodhead

Re: Scene Of Crime Reconstruction
« Reply #1 on: April 13, 2017, 05:08:17 PM »
Senior Scientific Officer - Malcolm Fletcher

Ballistics expert Malcolm Fletcher believes that Jeremy fired eight shots into his parents first, and that Nevill escaped to try and raise the alarm using the telephone downstairs, while Jeremy forced Sheila into the master bedroom, where he shot her once; after killing Nevill, her returned to fire the fatal shots at June, and another at Sheila before expending the remaining bullets on Nicholas and Daniel. 
Setting the pussy among the pigeons!

Offline Holly Goodhead

Re: Scene Of Crime Reconstruction
« Reply #2 on: April 13, 2017, 05:09:06 PM »
Pathologist - Dr Peter Vanezis

However, pathologist Peter Vanezis is of the opinion that the twins may have been the first to die.
Setting the pussy among the pigeons!

Offline Holly Goodhead

Re: Scene Of Crime Reconstruction
« Reply #3 on: April 13, 2017, 05:10:17 PM »
Author - Carol Ann Lee

Climbing the stairs, he steeled himself to kill the greatest threats first: his parents.  A thin film of moonlight glimmered through the curtains in the master bedroom, where his parents lay sleeping.  He stood in the doorway, lifted the rifle, and fired.

The first two shots pierced the right side of June's chest, embedding themselves in the pillow.  Another shot hit her in the arm and a third travelled up inside her leg, lodging in her knee.  The terrible impact woke Nevill, who lurched out of bed.  Jeremy turned the gun on his father, firing four shots that caught him on his left side: two bullets penetrated his forearm and shoulder, and two tore into his lip and jaw.

Jeremy left the room, heading down the first flight of stairs and through the corridor to the twins' bedroom, firing one shot into each slumbering child.  With all ten cartridges expended, he made his way down to the kitchen to reload.

He managed to slot four cartridges into the magazine before his father stumbled into the room.  A fierce fight for possession of the weapon ensued: they fell against the table, knocking it into the dresser and sending crockery to the floor.  The rifle struck the overhead lampshade, shattering it.  Jeremy used the gun to beat his father about the arms, head and face; Nevill's watch broke and skittered across the lino.  The struggle came to a brutal end near the Aga, where the rifle damaged the underside of the mantel.  As Nevill collapsed over a chair, landing at an impossible angle with his pyjamas tangling around his feet, Jeremy brought the gun down on his skull, then fired four shots into his head.

The last produced a stovepipe jam, trapping the empty cartridge case in the ejection port.  Jeremy removed the magazine and loaded it to its full capacity, then inserted it into the magazine well.  Climbing the stairs again, he cleared the jammed cartridge by working the bolt.  It fell out, rolling towards the skirting board on the first landing.

While father and son were fighting in the kitchen, June had managed to force herself up from bed.  The commotion had also woken Sheila, who crossed the landing to her parents' bedroom, drowsy and confused.  At the sight of her mother bleeding profusely as she steadied herself on the edge of the bed, Sheila rushed to the other side of the room, where the door to the box room was the quickest route to the twins.  June staggered round the bed after her, but before she could reach Sheila, Jeremy returned with the gun.

Sheila froze.  June started towards her son, who fired three more shots into her neck, head and finally between the eyes.  June hit her shoulder against the door as she slumped to the floor.

Jeremy then forced Sheila down beside the bed and shot her once in the throat.  With six cartridges left in the rifle, he headed back down the corridor where he fired two further shots into Nicholas and four into Daniel, emptying the magazine.  The element of 'overkill' would help his story that Sheila, in the grip of psychosis, was the guilty party.

He then retraced his footsteps to the master bedroom, intending to finish setting the scene.  To his shock he  found his sister incapacitated but still alive.  Quickly, he returned to the kitchen, loading a single cartridge into the magazine.  Upstairs once more, he crouched down and took aim.  The bullet went into Sheila's brain, killing her instantly.
Setting the pussy among the pigeons!

Offline Holly Goodhead

Re: Scene Of Crime Reconstruction
« Reply #4 on: April 13, 2017, 06:08:01 PM »
Jeremy Bamber

The following is an excerpt from correspondence received from JB:

"I've done a huge piece of work on bullets and bullet cases.  Those charts you sent are actual case ones (main bedroom).  But they were not actually true - the police made them up.  DC Hammersly the DRH accronym was not at the scene that morning 07.08.85.  The fourth SOC officer was DC Henderson.  He collected all the exhibits, dad was not shot or wounded upstairs at all".
Setting the pussy among the pigeons!

Offline Myster

Re: Scene Of Crime Reconstruction
« Reply #5 on: April 13, 2017, 07:00:21 PM »
Jeremy Bamber

The following is an excerpt from correspondence received from JB:

"I've done a huge piece of work on bullets and bullet cases.  Those charts you sent are actual case ones (main bedroom).  But they were not actually true - the police made them up.  DC Hammersly the DRH accronym was not at the scene that morning 07.08.85.  The fourth SOC officer was DC Henderson.  He collected all the exhibits, dad was not shot or wounded upstairs at all".
So Nevill was shot in the kitchen and the cases were planted in the bedroom after all... LOL!

I thought you didn't believe a word Jeremy Bamber said?

Offline Myster

Re: Scene Of Crime Reconstruction
« Reply #6 on: April 13, 2017, 07:03:16 PM »
When are you off to Kiwi land to give Samson a short, back and slap?

Offline Myster

Re: Scene Of Crime Reconstruction
« Reply #7 on: April 13, 2017, 07:29:45 PM »
Jeremy Bamber

The following is an excerpt from correspondence received from JB:

"I've done a huge piece of work on bullets and bullet cases.  Those charts you sent are actual case ones (main bedroom).  But they were not actually true - the police made them up.  DC Hammersly the DRH accronym was not at the scene that morning 07.08.85. The fourth SOC officer was DC Henderson.  He collected all the exhibits, dad was not shot or wounded upstairs at all".
DC Hammersley's trial testimony says otherwise...



Offline adam

Re: Scene Of Crime Reconstruction
« Reply #8 on: April 14, 2017, 09:58:59 AM »
Senior Scientific Officer - Malcolm Fletcher

Ballistics expert Malcolm Fletcher believes that Jeremy fired eight shots into his parents first, and that Nevill escaped to try and raise the alarm using the telephone downstairs, while Jeremy forced Sheila into the master bedroom, where he shot her once; after killing Nevill, her returned to fire the fatal shots at June, and another at Sheila before expending the remaining bullets on Nicholas and Daniel.

That is an interesting theory.

Bamber may have intially fired 8 bullets in the main bedroom. June was on the bed not moving & Nevill had fallen onto the floor.

Bamber felt he had done enough & went to get Sheila. Nevill saw his chance to get downstairs & arm himself or try to escape to the Flokes's. Bamber heard Nevill & followed him downstairs.
« Last Edit: April 14, 2017, 10:10:42 AM by adam »

Offline adam

Re: Scene Of Crime Reconstruction
« Reply #9 on: April 14, 2017, 10:07:55 AM »
I don't believe Nevill ran downstairs to phone the police. It was too late.

He either ran as it was the natural thing to do when someone is shooting you & downstairs was the only place to run to. Or he went downstairs to escape outside or arm himself while Bamber had gone into Sheila's room.
« Last Edit: April 14, 2017, 12:34:05 PM by adam »

Offline adam

Re: Scene Of Crime Reconstruction
« Reply #10 on: April 14, 2017, 12:46:56 PM »
If Bamber was trying to get the massacre compete without any reloads, then 7/8 bullets fired in the main bedroom would have meant 3 bullets were left for Sheila & the twins. Dependent on whether the rifle had 10 or 11 bullets inside.

However Nevill getting downstairs, June moving out of bed & Sheila still being alive after one shot meant a reload was needed. Once he reloads once he might as well do it twice to make sure everyone is dead & make it look like a crazy attack.

I suspect Bamber was attempting to get the massacre complete without reloading. As people would ask if Sheila could reload.  However he was aware that there was a possibility this may not be achieved.

Offline Holly Goodhead

Re: Scene Of Crime Reconstruction
« Reply #11 on: April 14, 2017, 01:00:18 PM »
So Nevill was shot in the kitchen and the cases were planted in the bedroom after all... LOL!

LOL indeed! NB was shot upstairs x 4 and in the kitchen x 4 as per the evidence: blood, casings and pathological.  Evidence collected by DC Hammersley and photographed by DC Bird. 


I thought you didn't believe a word Jeremy Bamber said?

I don't on the basis he has a poor understanding of his case.  After the above I curtailed contact as it was clear he was unable to assist.  I wrote to him requesting soc photos of the casings in the main bedroom and he responded as above. 

The above seems to emante from Mike who has been an unmitigated disaster for JB.  I will retrieve Mike's old posts later. 
Setting the pussy among the pigeons!

Offline Holly Goodhead

Re: Scene Of Crime Reconstruction
« Reply #12 on: April 14, 2017, 01:15:37 PM »
When are you off to Kiwi land to give Samson a short, back and slap?

Samson has been very helpful in providing relevant info re Oz and NZ.  We'll be off soon but can't bear to leave the "dafferdowndillies" in bloom!   8)-)))

Samson (and NNZ on your best behaviour) please return  8((()*/
« Last Edit: April 14, 2017, 01:21:24 PM by Holly Goodhead »
Setting the pussy among the pigeons!

Offline Holly Goodhead

Re: Scene Of Crime Reconstruction
« Reply #13 on: April 14, 2017, 01:28:50 PM »
That is an interesting theory.

Bamber may have intially fired 8 bullets in the main bedroom. June was on the bed not moving & Nevill had fallen onto the floor.

Bamber felt he had done enough & went to get Sheila. Nevill saw his chance to get downstairs & arm himself or try to escape to the Flokes's. Bamber heard Nevill & followed him downstairs.

Hello Adam  8**8:/:

Yes very interesting!  In the US such a shooting incidence yields indisuputable forensic evidence not theories!  Do you have any info re Malcolm Fletcher's professional qualifications and experience in cases involving shootings? 
Setting the pussy among the pigeons!

Offline Holly Goodhead

Re: Scene Of Crime Reconstruction
« Reply #14 on: April 14, 2017, 01:40:45 PM »
I don't believe Nevill ran downstairs to phone the police. It was too late.

He either ran as it was the natural thing to do when someone is shooting you & downstairs was the only place to run to. Or he went downstairs to escape outside or arm himself while Bamber had gone into Sheila's room.

The pathological evidence makes clear NB was incapable of purposeful speech after the gsw's to his lip and jaw which were clearly sustained upstairs so no tel calls having been shot upstairs.

I guess if one is being shot at it's instinctive to move away from gunfire.  Imo NB fled downstairs with the perp behind, but why not exit the main door (at bottom of main stairs)?  Instead NB fled to kitchen.  Maybe an attempt to resume tel contact with JB hence bloody fingerprints on the kitchen worktop?   
« Last Edit: April 14, 2017, 01:50:08 PM by Holly Goodhead »
Setting the pussy among the pigeons!