Was Mark Rowley wrong to claim that Madeleine McCann was abducted?

[Benice]

A very reasoned post G-Unit.  The original investigation was thwarted by the refusal of numerous individuals who were there that night to cooperate and take part in a reconstruction so my question is how can Rowley possibly state with a straight face that they took up where the Portuguese left off?  Have SY undertaken a full reconstruction?...I think not!

His comments about Maddie not being old enough to go off and start a new life was flippant and very unprofessional.  I wonder what her parents thought about that comment?

Quote from DCI Redwood:

"We have conducted a forensic analysis of the timeline and there is clearly opportunity there for Madeleine McCann to be removed from that apartment alive and it is our belief as experienced investigators on the evidence that um that, you know, that is a criminal act that has been undertaken by a stranger".
End quote

Even if it was possible - and IMO it most definitely isn't possible  - what would a recon have proved?  - and how was it supposed to be an opportunity for the McCanns to demonstrate their innocence?    Their innocence of what? 

AIMHO

[Mr Gray]

My opinion
Rowley is being ridiculed because he supports abduction

I don't see any contradictions in his statements..... If you do please cite them

[Lace]

I do not read the interview that way.

If you read the response and the question, as a whole, my interpretation of his response has always been that he did not dismiss woke and wandered.

The question refers to 'woke and wandered'.

His response is roughly however she left the apartment she did not leave to start a new life.

I.E. If she left the apartment voluntarily she did not leave to start a new life because she was only 4 years old, therefore there was third-party involvement.

He states abduction as third party involvement, but third party involvement also includes removal of a body after an accident IMO.

He also said that the McCann's were not being investigated,   he said that was dealt with by the Portuguese police and he wasn't going to open that again.

If you think there was an accident and the McCann's are guilty, why do you think that years down the line and millions of pounds later SY are still investigating?

[Lace]

You're way off kilter on that one davel.  You were given every opportunity to provide evidence and all I recall seeing was Maddie was gone and the window was open, neither of which relate solely to abduction.

Rowley might be right about one thing and that is she was abducted AFTER leaving the apartment of her own volition so in that respect he was not wrong to claim she was abducted... "however she left the apartment".

The thing is John,  SY have eliminated woke and wandered and an accident,  and so with the evidence of a missing child they say Madeleine was abducted.

[John]

The archiving report was dismissive of woke and wandered and it would be interesting to know exactly why
They must have had a reason
Once woke and wandered is ruled out then abduction is really the only scenario left

As already pointed out the original investigation was thwarted so any conclusions arrived at were provisional.

[Mr Gray]

The thing is John,  SY have eliminated woke and wandered and an accident,  and so with the evidence of a missing child they say Madeleine was abducted.

That is exactly what I have been saying
Abduction proven by deduction
On the balance of probability

[Mr Gray]

As already pointed out the original investigation was thwarted so any conclusions arrived at were provisional.

You seem to think that the lack of a reconstruction was the sole reason for shelving the case
I don't see how it would have made any difference
Surely it was the total lack of any direct evidence that stopped the case going forward

[John]

The thing is John,  SY have eliminated woke and wandered and an accident,  and so with the evidence of a missing child they say Madeleine was abducted.

No they haven't and furthermore it would be incompetent for them to do so. 

Rowley gave us two clues about this.  First one is his comment, namely, "However she left that apartment, she has been abducted" and "...we still don’t have definitive evidence about exactly what’s happened."

He stated that, "...she was not old enough to set off and start her own life" but this does not preclude leaving the confines of the apartment on her own.  Scotland Yard would be very silly to discount woke and wandered.


http://miscarriageofjustice.co/index.php?topic=8138.msg400450#msg400450

[Mr Gray]

No they haven't and furthermore it would be incompetent for them to do so. 

Rowley gave us two clues about this.  First one is his comment, namely, "However she left that apartment, she has been abducted" and "...we still don’t have definitive evidence about exactly what’s happened."

He stated that she wasn't old enough to have gone off on her own but this does not preclude leaving the confines of the apartment on her own.  Scotland Yard would be very silly to discount woke and wandered.


http://miscarriageofjustice.co/index.php?topic=8138.msg400450#msg400450

You are putting your own interpretation on his words
What would be interesting is to know why the archiving report said woke and wandered was highly unlikely
They must have had a reason

[John]

Just before 2 minutes in.
However she left the apartment she's been abducted

(Mark Rowley).

Nota bene, he didn't state she was abducted from the apartment. Sounds like that comment was picked well before it was shovelled.

[Mr Gray]

What is also interesting is SY are totally dismissing alerts to cadaver

[Robittybob1]

The thing is John,  SY have eliminated woke and wandered and an accident,  and so with the evidence of a missing child they say Madeleine was abducted.

How could they eliminate woke and wandered? 

[John]

I believe we jointly, regardless of our views, have actually thrown some light on SY's thinking.  They do favour abduction and I agree but it has to be accepted that the abduction could have occurred outside as well as inside. Furthermore, if Madeleine did meet with a fatal accident in the street then abduction is not the correct term.

There is very strong evidence in the form of the two tracker dogs which, a matter of hours after the disappearance, independently followed her scent on a route from the apartment terminating across the road from mini reception.  Did she get out and attempt to retrace her route to the kids club thinking her parents were there?  Did she fall foul of someone?

[Mr Gray]

I believe we jointly, regardless of our views, have actually thrown some light on SY's thinking.  They do favour abduction and I agree but it has to be accepted that the abduction could have occurred outside as well as inside. Furthermore, if Madeleine did meet with a fatal accident in the street then abduction is not the correct term.

There is very strong evidence in the form of the two tracker dogs which, a matter of hours after the disappearance, independently followed her scent on a route from the apartment terminating across the road from mini reception.  Did she get out and attempt to retrace her route to the kids club thinking her parents were there?  Did she fall foul of someone?

You say the evidence is very strong
Then why did the archiving report all but rule out Woke and wandered

[Mr Gray]

How could they eliminate woke and wandered?

They have all the info
We dont
It would be interesting to know